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Kaz Yamauchi about the Gran Turismo future: "4K is enough, but 240fps is the target

Kagey K

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lol the only TV doing 4K 240 FPS either won’t be out or won’t be affordable before the PS6 is out.

Shitty statements like this is why I doubt so many claims about next gen until I see them for myself.
 

ZywyPL

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So... you aren't excited for GT7?

He has a fair points, GT has A LOT of thing to finally fix, graphics and driving model is its latest concern, it's already on top there, but the sounds, AI, collisions etc. that's what hasn't change since PS2, and all those pointless, archaic transitions/animations within menus that suck up tons of your time, it's time to finally get rid of that. The game, just as its creator, are stuck in the 90s, time to step up their game, Kaz could blame the PS3 for having little memory, or complicated Cell, or the PS4 for weak Jaguar, but with PS5 there will be no more excuses on the hardware side, it's all solely on him this time around. And after GT6 broken promises I don't trust him anymore to patch anything down the road, the game has to be good from the get go.
 
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rofif

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I wish we had 4k oled monitors :(
Even 60hz, I don't care. Even now I use 4k 60hz freesync ips and its awesome(lg 27uk650) but make it Oled and we are done with monitors
 
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Relativ9

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My 4k TV only goes to 120fps, I imagine that's going to be true for a lot of people. I mean my 165 monitor looks nice don't get me wrong, but all those resources going to 240 is a waste.
 

Soodanim

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There's a lot of replies that don't process what's been said, so for those that are about to do the same thing I'll rephrase it:

I think 4K is enough. I would prefer to have my game at 4k120 than 8k60. I'd even prefer 4k240 over 8k60, even though that's only theoretical at this point on consoles.

It's someone who makes racing games commenting on resolution vs framerate given that there is a fork in the road of how to improve games visually.
 
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Allandor

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Lol, 4k/240 really?
Well RTX 2080 Ti regularly struggles to output 120FPS in modern games (maxed out settings). How would the game look with 240fps? Next gen won't be that powerfull, well at least not without a big visual hit. Even with PS3-like graphic-settings it could get really really hard to reach that target.
But maybe he is talking about something like the "magic" frameenhancer in PSVR. I guess with a high enough framerate you can render a few frames "ahead" (of output) and calculate frames in between. But at a target framerate of 60fps that would cost you the same input lag like with 60fps. That wouldn't make sense. With PSVR this made a bit sense if you drew a larger picture and than the camera move just goes to the pixels that were not visible but already rendered, just to get a smoother movement. But that won't work for a racing game, where you change your position a few "meters" every frame.

He should really stop talking about a new GT and just deliver a real new GT and not some multiplayer-focused stuff. And all that within the launch-period and not a few years later.
 
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Rikkori

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Honest question, do people really notice a difference in 60 fps vs 120 fps for Flat Display racing titles? I was messing around with 60hz vs 120hz in FH4 a few days ago and I swear I couldn't really tell the difference even in terms of motion resolution. In shooters, sure, wherever I can use fast mouse movements, it's obvious. But for racing? And with a gamepad? I just don't see it. If it was VR I'd understand, but for a flat display? Dunno, maybe I'm missing something as I don't play racing titles much at all.
 
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Soodanim

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Honest question, do people really notice a difference in 60 fps vs 120 fps for Flat Display racing titles? I was messing around with 60hz vs 120hz in FH4 a few days ago and I swear I couldn't really tell the difference even in terms of motion resolution. In shooters, sure, wherever I can use fast mouse movements, it's obvious. But for racing? And with a gamepad? I just don't see it. If it was VR I'd understand, but for a flat display? Dunno, maybe I'm missing something as I don't play racing titles much at all.
Anything with fast motion benefits from it. If you jump in a fast car in GTAV or Sleeping Dogs you will feel the difference in motion clarity. I'd imagine that it's slightly less in sim racers as they aren't quite as fast normally, but they definitely benefit.
 

killatopak

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listen listen,

I’m gonna blow your minds.

The future isn’t just for PS5 you know? He could have meant it for the franchise as a whole.
 

Woodchipper

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He has a fair points, GT has A LOT of thing to finally fix, graphics and driving model is its latest concern, it's already on top there, but the sounds, AI, collisions etc. that's what hasn't change since PS2, and all those pointless, archaic transitions/animations within menus that suck up tons of your time, it's time to finally get rid of that. The game, just as its creator, are stuck in the 90s, time to step up their game, Kaz could blame the PS3 for having little memory, or complicated Cell, or the PS4 for weak Jaguar, but with PS5 there will be no more excuses on the hardware side, it's all solely on him this time around. And after GT6 broken promises I don't trust him anymore to patch anything down the road, the game has to be good from the get go.
It has a lot of issues, yes, but the sounds are actually good in GT Sport, for the most part.
 

Nemesisuuu

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Honest question, do people really notice a difference in 60 fps vs 120 fps for Flat Display racing titles? I was messing around with 60hz vs 120hz in FH4 a few days ago and I swear I couldn't really tell the difference even in terms of motion resolution. In shooters, sure, wherever I can use fast mouse movements, it's obvious. But for racing? And with a gamepad? I just don't see it. If it was VR I'd understand, but for a flat display? Dunno, maybe I'm missing something as I don't play racing titles much at all.
IMO it's noticable but in racing games it's not such a huge deal like in FPS games. You can see it's more fluid and feel in controls it's more responsive, but (for me at least) it's not that huge jump to be 'end it all' experience. So it's even more baffling they would focus for 240fps, this sounds like dynamic weather effects and night/day transition are out of the picture. Even more baffling is focusing on high framerates when most of console players have 60hz displays.

In console space they should focus to reach locked 1080p or 1440p at 60fps. It's not like it'll kill anyone, since console '4k' (for current gen) looks way worse than 1440p on PC with good anti-aliasing solution.
 

Sethbacca

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Amusingly enough, there's limits to it for VR too, which makes sense - you're not gonna move in VR as fast as you do with a mouse. So even there it varies in effectiveness.


Solid watch. Wouldn't the 240fps be 120 per eye? I'm not 100% sure how it all works. I had an Oculus for a while a couple years back but I really wasn't getting much use out of it so ended up selling it before it lost too much value. I'll probably get in on PSVR2 though depending what's coming out.
 

Rikkori

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Solid watch. Wouldn't the 240fps be 120 per eye? I'm not 100% sure how it all works. I had an Oculus for a while a couple years back but I really wasn't getting much use out of it so ended up selling it before it lost too much value. I'll probably get in on PSVR2 though depending what's coming out.

No, you're thinking of resolution because there's 2 displays (usually). There the horizontal resolution can be cut in half, eg. Index:

"The Valve Index is equipped with two LCD screens featuring a 1440×1600 resolution per eye (2880×1600 combined resolution), an up to 120 Hz refresh rate (as well as 144 Hz in overclocked mode), and an expanded field of view of around 130°. "
 
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BusierDonkey

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He has a fair points, GT has A LOT of thing to finally fix, graphics and driving model is its latest concern, it's already on top there, but the sounds, AI, collisions etc. that's what hasn't change since PS2, and all those pointless, archaic transitions/animations within menus that suck up tons of your time, it's time to finally get rid of that. The game, just as its creator, are stuck in the 90s, time to step up their game, Kaz could blame the PS3 for having little memory, or complicated Cell, or the PS4 for weak Jaguar, but with PS5 there will be no more excuses on the hardware side, it's all solely on him this time around. And after GT6 broken promises I don't trust him anymore to patch anything down the road, the game has to be good from the get go.

I was being sarcastic, I just found it funny how angry the post was written out.

I actually agree with a lot of his points too. GT3 is still the best the series offered for me. GT4 was a step down in many areas, more everything at the cost of gameplay, and GT4 was the game that first had me looking over the fence at that new Forza game over on stupid Xbox. While I played Forza 2 and 3 GT5 took forever and the end product was a mixed bag so I was happy to jump right back into Forza 4. GT6 was only released to make a quick buck and to me is the lowest point in the series. It released right after Forza 5 (also the low point in the series) but it was a really ugly game by then especially compared to Forza 5. That all being said, despite being the worst GT ever released it was still a very good racing game. GT Sport is it's own thing, not something I'm interested in when there are better simulators for online racing on PC.

I've always bought PlayStation consoles primarily for Gran Turismo games. The PS4 didn't have GT7, so I skipped it. I likely won't be buying any consoles in the upcoming gen, so GT7 has to either be good enough to dump $600+ on, or release on PC.

Side note: GT Sport has much better sound than earlier GT games did, Polyphony Digital sniped Mike Caviezel, the lead sound engineer at T10. Around the same time Forza's sounds kind of hit a wall. I'd say GT Sport sounds are on par with Forza. Worse in some areas, but better in others.
 
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Kokoloko85

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120 at 4k is more than enough. Use the extra power to other graphocs effects I guess.
Give us gt7 not sport part 2.
Content and single player modes too please
 

Investor9872

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I wish we had 4k oled monitors :(
Even 60hz, I don't care. Even now I use 4k 60hz freesync ips and its awesome(lg 27uk650) but make it Oled and we are done with monitors

We do. LG will release a 48" CX OLED in June. The 55" and the 65" are out now.
 
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//DEVIL//

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If folks want GT @240 FPS Then PC version is the only way for them
In theory. they could hit that target if they just upsaled the PS4 version of the game without any extra details at 4k and then increase the fps.

isnt GT sports already 2k 60 fps ? I can see it possible to have a 4k 144 easily . now above 200 ? i dont know.. maybe ?
 
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Woodchipper

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In theory. they could hit that target if they just upsaled the PS4 version of the game without any extra details at 4k and then increase the fps.

isnt GT sports already 2k 60 fps ? I can see it possible to have a 4k 144 easily . now above 200 ? i dont know.. maybe ?
With a full grid of 20 cars in GT Sport, it’s not 60 anymore. Besides, the whole point of a new generation is better graphics, isn’t it?

Also, since when is 60fps not plenty enough? Yes, I get targeting higher frame rate for VR, but what’s the point on a regular tv?
 

//DEVIL//

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With a full grid of 20 cars in GT Sport, it’s not 60 anymore. Besides, the whole point of a new generation is better graphics, isn’t it?

Also, since when is 60fps not plenty enough? Yes, I get targeting higher frame rate for VR, but what’s the point on a regular tv?
You have to understand that this guy is just talking from his ass . He is always been kinda like this . Or maybe a better word is unrealistically shooting to the moon with the expectations . Also wasn’t one of the GT games on ps3 was it I believe that most of the cars were ps2 assets ?
He has no problem using the ps4 assets since they are still very impressive and just increase the resolution and the frames

I honestly think this is the approach he is aiming for because he is very slow at developing games along with his team . I mean look at gt sports. 7 years the life span of ps4 and we only got half assed game
 

killatopak

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I honestly think this is the approach he is aiming for because he is very slow at developing games along with his team . I mean look at gt sports. 7 years the life span of ps4 and we only got half assed game
They’re not really that slow. GT6 released on 2013 and Sport released on 2017.

A slow developer would be like Sucker Punch who took 7 years to release a game after Infamous.

With that rumor about GT7 being a launch/launch window title, I think them releasing a game soon isn’t that far fetched as well.
 

DJ Shalad

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Believe Me who cares about Gran turisimo. After GT3 all the Gran turisimo games have been the same only cosmetical change applied to them. Still the same dumb game with Higher Polygons. Who gives a Shit that it will be 240 Frames or 4K it will
be still de dumb 10 year old game with more polygons and frames and STILL noRealistic Damage to the Cars and Still No 4 season Weather in the game realisticly. I can say to the Developers stick GT7 were the sun dont shine I am fed up with those
lazy Buck Teeths Rodents for not implimenting realtime car damage and weather .

Just cosmetic changes like

- new cars
- new tracks
- new track layouts
- b-spec mode
- new drive missions
- online mode
- moon mission
- photomode
- etc.

No damage? Ok, you should know by now, why that´s the case since 1998.
No weather? Furza didnt have any either for the first 8 iterations

It has a lot of issues, yes, but the sounds are actually good in GT Sport, for the most part.

Nah, it´s good. Top notch sounds for the most part, top notch visuals, GT gameplay .. all it lacks is a proper old school GT Mode with few hundreds of race events from Sunday Cup to 1000mile Japanese Championship.
 

Kerotan

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There will come a day when we play GT @8k 240fps. Imagine that on a 65" 8k OLED.
 
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Magik85

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The car models in Dirt vs in Gran Turismo are not even comparable, and there are grids of up to 20 cars in Gran Turismo. You do the math.
Well i guess youre right with that statement....but in exactly opposite way.
GTS cars (in-game models) are considerably lower quality than competition , in terms of polycount and textures ;-)
 

kittoo

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Is there any display that can run at 4K 240Hz? HDMI 2.1 only supports 120Hz at 4K, right?
 

Rikkori

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Is there any display that can run at 4K 240Hz? HDMI 2.1 only supports 120Hz at 4K, right?

You can run 4K 240hz with just HDMI 2.1 so long as it allows DSC 1.2


"With DSC 1.2 enabled, HDMI connections can handle up to 10K resolution at up to 120Hz. The same goes for 8K and 5K resolution, with 4K resolution playable at up to 240Hz when compression is used. "

But yeah, there are no 4K 240hz panels available yet, at least at a consumer level. Probably they exist in a lab somewhere. Don't think that's something we'll see outside of monitors for the next 10 years (if ever).
 

sublimit

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I hope we soon get some real news about GT7. Like campaign,tracks,AI,dynamic weather,number of cars etc. All this talk about resolutions and framerates bores me to death.
 
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Magik85

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Thats just truth.
GTS has some great shaders/colors etc.
But you can clearly see polygon edges, low res textures and simplistic interios in chase cam.
Scapes models are superb tough.
 
Dec 22, 2019
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Honest question, do people really notice a difference in 60 fps vs 120 fps for Flat Display racing titles? I was messing around with 60hz vs 120hz in FH4 a few days ago and I swear I couldn't really tell the difference even in terms of motion resolution. In shooters, sure, wherever I can use fast mouse movements, it's obvious. But for racing? And with a gamepad? I just don't see it. If it was VR I'd understand, but for a flat display? Dunno, maybe I'm missing something as I don't play racing titles much at all.
yes its noticeable its not 30/60 but its noticeable
 
Dec 22, 2019
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You have to understand that this guy is just talking from his ass . He is always been kinda like this . Or maybe a better word is unrealistically shooting to the moon with the expectations . Also wasn’t one of the GT games on ps3 was it I believe that most of the cars were ps2 assets ?
He has no problem using the ps4 assets since they are still very impressive and just increase the resolution and the frames

I honestly think this is the approach he is aiming for because he is very slow at developing games along with his team . I mean look at gt sports. 7 years the life span of ps4 and we only got half assed game
most GT games use assets from the previous versions if that the sacrifice to keep the car count high thats fine. Since especially in GT5 certain cars of the same make from various regions had better options then others.
 

ZywyPL

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They’re not really that slow. GT6 released on 2013 and Sport released on 2017.

A slow developer would be like Sucker Punch who took 7 years to release a game after Infamous.

With that rumor about GT7 being a launch/launch window title, I think them releasing a game soon isn’t that far fetched as well.

Except GT:S has no SP campaign, limited number of tracks, limited number of cars, and limited number of features, it basically took them 4 years to make a demo...
 

DS_Joost

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This is worrying. This series has been heading straight to hell since GT5, and this does not give me the implication that they’re learning what’s important.

How about just focusing on making an awesome and fun racing game which actually works, like the early entries in the series, and optimize it at a locked 60 FPS?

The AI in GT Sport is the fucking worst in the business. Try to fix that before anything else, instead of wasting time on photo mode locations and weird ass trivia slide shows, and saying shit like “240 FPS”.

Oh just shut up and go play Forza Horizon if you don't like GT Sport. I can tell you it's one of the best (if not just outright the best) racers this gen.

The slides you are talking about actually make the game feel more special than most. It's oozing atmosphere, it makes me want to play more of the game. It's dripping with love for racing, and the multiplayer they have built has changed the online racing world. In fact, it has changed the online gaming world even.

Also, the single player is really good. Lots od variety and challenge to be found.

And if you don't think the next GT will be cutting edge with graphics you're a fool. They have always pushed the visuals every gen. There's a reason TV's in showrooms run GT Sport. Because it looks THAT good.

It won't do 240fps. It's what Kaz eventually wants. But if there is someone with vision and determination in the gaming business, it's him. And the sales numbers keep reflecting that he's very right and most of you have no idea what actually sells games.
 
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