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Kaz Yamauchi about the Gran Turismo future: "4K is enough, but 240fps is the target

it_wasn't_me

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seen GT Sport used to showcase 8K resolutions, and 8K is a key feature for PS5, so Yamauchi’s answer came as something of a surprise.

"I think, display resolution-wise, 4K resolution is enough.”

“Rather than a spatial resolution that you’re talking about, I’m more interested in the advancements we can make in terms of the time resolution. In terms of frames per second, rather than staying at 60 fps, I’m more interested in raising it to 120 fps or even 240 fps. I think that’s what’s going to be changing the experience from here on forward.”

What higher fps than 60 means for racing games, quote from article :

Higher frame rates allow for a smoother perception of motion, something potentially useful in a racing game where cars are moving in close quarters. At 60fps your screen could display an opponent’s car only to within five feet of where it actually is, but that falls dramatically as the frame rates increase — something that can only improve the racing experience. That is assuming your display is capable of those frame rates.



 
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darkinstinct

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Jul 24, 2015
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How about more detail instead? (Blind) People already struggle to see a difference between 30 and 60, who does he want to sell 240 fps? Does he realize that a racing game running at 60 fps will look around 4 times as good as one running at 240 fps on the same hardware (numbers from John Carmack when he compared the difference between 60 fps and 30 fps, doubling the framerate equals losing 50 % the fidelity)?
 

stranno

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Gran Turismo 1&2 have 640x480 resolution in the car showcase screens on Playstation.
Gran Turismo 4 has a 1080i mode on Playstation 2.
Gran Turismo 6 runs at 40-50FPS 1080P on Playstation 3.
Gran Turismo Sports runs at almost locked 60FPS 1800P on Playstation 4 Pro.

If some developer could achieve 120FPS 4K thats Polyphony. 240FPS ... i dont know if it worth.
 

JLB

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Gran Turismo 1&2 have 640x480 resolution in the car showcase screens on Playstation.
Gran Turismo 4 has a 1080i mode on Playstation 2.
Gran Turismo 6 runs at 40-50FPS 1080P on Playstation 3.
Gran Turismo Sports runs at almost locked 60FPS 1800P on Playstation 4 Pro.

If some developer could achieve 120FPS 4K thats Polyphony. 240FPS ... i dont know if it worth.

240 is glorious. But I have banned myself to play that because then even 60fps looks horrible.
 

NAI1210

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How about more detail instead? (Blind) People already struggle to see a difference between 30 and 60, who does he want to sell 240 fps? Does he realize that a racing game running at 60 fps will look around 4 times as good as one running at 240 fps on the same hardware (numbers from John Carmack when he compared the difference between 60 fps and 30 fps, doubling the framerate equals losing 50 % the fidelity)?
Sorry but 30 and 60 are night and day, it's hard to back to 30 after 60
 

nowhat

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Gran Turismo Sports runs at almost locked 60FPS 1800P on Playstation 4 Pro.
Nitpicking, but isn't it 1800C (i.e. 1800P checkerboarded)? It looks damn nice though, not disputing that, especially the HDR implementation is terrific.
 

it_wasn't_me

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Gran Turismo 1&2 have 640x480 resolution in the car showcase screens on Playstation.
Gran Turismo 4 has a 1080i mode on Playstation 2.
Gran Turismo 6 runs at 40-50FPS 1080P on Playstation 3.
Gran Turismo Sports runs at almost locked 60FPS 1800P on Playstation 4 Pro.

If some developer could achieve 120FPS 4K thats Polyphony. 240FPS ... i dont know if it worth.

According to DF analysis, GTS is pretty much locked 60
 

LostDonkey

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Its always some far off in the future excuse with PD. What about the here and now. What about people who buy the console to play the game as best as it can be right now without these excuses that oh we were shooting for next next gen so this console cant handle it but it will be ready for the future! It will be ready when screens hit some magoc number that wont happen for 5 years and by then we will have all moved onto the next best thing. Honest!

Every.
Single.
Generation.
 

Tomeru

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How about more detail instead? (Blind) People already struggle to see a difference between 30 and 60, who does he want to sell 240 fps? Does he realize that a racing game running at 60 fps will look around 4 times as good as one running at 240 fps on the same hardware (numbers from John Carmack when he compared the difference between 60 fps and 30 fps, doubling the framerate equals losing 50 % the fidelity)?

Looks like you are one of the (Blind).

You should read the article, as it explains exactly why higher fps is better for racing sims.

it_wasn't_me it_wasn't_me
I suggest you add a snippet that explains why higher fps is better (its right below that second quote)
 
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240fps will be cool when we get there eventually (hopefully before I die), but I’ll be happy when we get console-wide 60fps first
 
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Zefah

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Yeah, I think 4K is definitely enough. I've seen a few 8K demo TV sets in Japan and while the resolution difference is noticeable, it's nothing like the jump from SD to 1080p or even from 1080p to 4K. I do agree that 4K is enough, especially for consumer TV sets that are probably going to be under 70 inches for the most part. Higher frame rates are where it's at!
 

Aidah

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4k is definitely enough. I mean you already have to have a large TV and sit relatively close to make the most of 4K, even with good vision. 8K sounds largely a waste considering the amount of power it would require.

Mentioning 240fps is a little weird though, since PS5 won't output past 120 at 4K. He does say 120 "or even" 240, so probably talking long term and past PS5 for 240.
 
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nkarafo

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Of course it is, but I am sure you have also read a ton of post saying they don't see a difference between 30 and 60.
They all either lie or misunderstand what fps is or just don't know what the hell they are talking about.

Nobody can't see the difference. It's physical impossible, unless someone is literally blind.
 

Barnabot

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They all either lie or misunderstand what fps is or just don't know what the hell they are talking about.

Nobody can't see the difference. It's physical impossible, unless someone is literally blind.
GT running in a console at 240fps is plain bullshit. prove me wrong console warriors from the future. i'll be here waiting for ya.
 
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nkarafo

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GT running in a console at 240fps is plain bullshit. prove me wrong console warriors from the future. i'll be here waiting for ya.
Of course it's bullshit. Even if living room TVs become capable of 240hz (which they won't anytime soon) console games will never go beyond 60fps, most will stuck with 30 anyway.

My post was a response about the people who claim they don't see the difference between 30 and 60.
 
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ethomaz

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Its always some far off in the future excuse with PD. What about the here and now. What about people who buy the console to play the game as best as it can be right now without these excuses that oh we were shooting for next next gen so this console cant handle it but it will be ready for the future! It will be ready when screens hit some magoc number that wont happen for 5 years and by then we will have all moved onto the next best thing. Honest!

Every.
Single.
Generation.
They are being very successful here and now.
With PS5 almost here then they needs to start to think in the future.
 
Dec 22, 2019
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how about make GT7 have acutally content this time instead of giving us pretty much another version of GT5 prologue. Also how are you going to target 240HZ when the max rumored output of the ps5 is 120HZ.................................................
 
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reconminicon

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I'd jizz on his tits for a big bag full of frames.

Console games don’t currently make much sense at anything higher than 60fps. The vast majority of people have 60Hz TV’s.

Just like HDR. I dont know why they even bother..........
 
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Azelover

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I agree with him.

Better frame rates please..
 

Three

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GT running in a console at 240fps is plain bullshit. prove me wrong console warriors from the future. i'll be here waiting for ya.

What about 4 PS3 consoles?


Kaz did this already before GT5 release. He did 240fps and 4k before they were even a thing.
 

Barnabot

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so kaz says that kind of stuff because he wanted to play the game by himself and not the actual fans. sorry gt fanboys the goodies were never meant for you.
 

Pagusas

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Don't agree. 4K is enough. 8K is too much, too soon with strong risk of diminishing returns.

Agreed and I’m an absolute resolution whore. 4K + temporal upscaling to 8k in the future via chckerboard or other methods will be more than fine. Way more than enough information there for a good 8k image.
 
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Absolutely right. 4K is such a high and crisp resolution and most games dont support it yet (on consoles that is). Theres no point in chasing higher and higher res unless I buy a 100" TV. PS3 had probably 70% games that were 720P, couldnt even support 1080P. The PS4 comes and its advertized for 4K but no game can do 4K properly, so whats the point of going 8K? If new consoles can do 4K 60fps, we are golden.
 

Investor9872

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How about more detail instead? (Blind) People already struggle to see a difference between 30 and 60, who does he want to sell 240 fps? Does he realize that a racing game running at 60 fps will look around 4 times as good as one running at 240 fps on the same hardware (numbers from John Carmack when he compared the difference between 60 fps and 30 fps, doubling the framerate equals losing 50 % the fidelity)?

Maybe Kaz Yamauchi was thinking ahead for the next-gen VR or 3D systems.
 

StormCell

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I've owned a 4K TV for about 3 years. It has been used to display actual 4K content about 10% of the time, I believe. We have not even begun to use 4K. 8K is a stupid gimmick to sell new TVs.

They really need to focus on frame rate and motion specs if they really want to sell more TVs.
 
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sn0man

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This is all just prepping us for the inevitable next GT where the number of cars are similar to the frames per second.

When asked why GT7 has 239 cars.
“We had to go back and recreate the models to handle the performance. The car meshes just couldn’t handle the frame rate and would start projecting onto themselves. Do not worry though because the models in GT7 have been built from the ground up for 360fps and beyond.”

-Kaz literal serious quote from my nightmares regarding GT7
/S
 
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thelastword

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I remember when I said PS5 would bring 4k 120fps, 8k 30-60fps for indies and AA games, 240fps for VR, SSD's etc.....I saw many lol emoticons, people thought it was too much......but look, here it is...….I think the next surprise is when people see how much ram PS5 has and how fast it will is......

We have to think beyond the technology we have today.....Cant wait for GT7, I think they can do the current GTSPORT at 4k 120fps easily on PS5 with enhanced graphics though....
 
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Justin9mm

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Sorry but 30 and 60 are night and day, it's hard to back to 30 after 60
That really depends on the type of game and how good it's optimised. Obviously 60fps is superior and looks better but not every game is as noticeable or unbearable at 30fps. If that was so, then single player open world games on console would not sell very well. In a racing game though, it looks like shit. Recent example is Need For Speed Heat, the graphics and performance are both poor on my PS4 Pro.. It's laughable.