Support NeoGAF

[Rocco Schiavone]

We don't know have fast the PS4 actually ran GTA 5, it's definitely would be under 60 but it could be over 30 fps.

GTAV on PS4 couldn't even deliver a steady 30fps experience. So what are you talking about??

 

[playsaves3]

GTAV on PS4 couldn't even deliver a steady 30fps experience. So what are you talking about??

That’s only in online

 

[shamoomoo]

GTAV on PS4 couldn't even deliver a steady 30fps experience. So what are you talking about??

And? That doesn't mean in quieter sections the frame rate could be higher.

 

[Rocco Schiavone]

That’s only in online

Yeah sure.

 

[playsaves3]

Yeah sure.

That’s a pretty stable 30 on pro (can drop to 29 in a new areas from what I believe is streaming issues released to memory and hard drive storage)

 

[Rocco Schiavone]

That’s a pretty stable 30 on pro (can drop to 29 in a new areas from what I believe is streaming issues released to memory and hard drive storage)

We were talking about the base PS4 not about the pro. The base couldn't deliver a flawless 30fps experience.

 

[playsaves3]

We were talking about the base PS4 not about the pro. The base couldn't deliver a flawless 30fps experience.

Oh yeah your right about that

 

[Audiophile]

54 active CU out of 60 makes the most sense to me.

The PS4 Pro was 2x CU (18CU on PS4 & 36CU on PS4 Pro) with a butterfly design that shut down half of the GPU + downclocks for its base compatibility mode.

For the PS5 Pro it could just be a 1.5x CU approach instead (36CU on PS5 & 54CU on PS5 Pro) with a design that shuts down one third of the GPU + downclocks for a base compatibility mode. Wonder if this is the case as it would make sense with the supposed "Trinity" codename/moniker we heard earlier on.

-------

As for the whole Xbox launching a new console generation a year or two early; I don't think the next gen really starts until Sony says so unless MS can pull a rabbit out of the hat with their acquisitions and drop some major exclusives with it.

Not to mention, if MS drop an Xbox in 2025-2027, then Sony would come by in 2028 an entire generation or two of Zen & RDNA ahead (possibly with some select bells & whistles from the gen after that too), along with a smaller node process. Then MS will be behind again. Power may not mean everything, but Sony having a major performance lead across the board on a smaller process, likely with additional featuresets, would be significant.

I think MS' would be hamstringing themselves for very little gain. I think 2027 Xbox "5" & 2028 PS6 is about the most I'd expect (I'm adamant this'll be an 8yr gen, at least for Sony). MS just need to turn up and do a better job, I think they'd just be complicating things by trying to go for 2025/2026.

 

[Loxus]

54 active CU out of 60 makes the most sense to me.

The PS4 Pro was 2x CU (18CU on PS4 & 36CU on PS4 Pro) with a butterfly design that shut down half of the GPU + downclocks for its base compatibility mode.

For the PS5 Pro it could just be a 1.5x CU approach instead (36CU on PS5 & 54CU on PS5 Pro) with a design that shuts down one third of the GPU + downclocks for a base compatibility mode. Wonder if this is the case as it would make sense with the supposed "Trinity" codename/moniker we heard earlier on.

-------

As for the whole Xbox launching a new console generation a year or two early; I don't think the next gen really starts until Sony says so unless MS can pull a rabbit out of the hat with their acquisitions and drop some major exclusives with it.

Not to mention, if MS drop an Xbox in 2025-2027, then Sony would come by in 2028 an entire generation or two of Zen & RDNA ahead (possibly with some select bells & whistles from the gen after that too), along with a smaller node process. Then MS will be behind again. Power may not mean everything, but Sony having a major performance lead across the board on a smaller process, likely with additional featuresets, would be significant.

I think MS' would be hamstringing themselves for very little gain. I think 2027 Xbox "5" & 2028 PS6 is about the most I'd expect (I'm adamant this'll be an 8yr gen, at least for Sony). MS just need to turn up and do a better job, I think they'd just be complicating things by trying to go for 2025/2026.

That's exactly what I thought the meaning to Trinity is.

3 times the CUs of the PS4.
18 + 18 + 18 = 54 CUs

Which works great for BC mode.
PS4 = 18 CUs
PS4 Pro = 36 CUs
PS5 = 36 CUs
PS5 Pro optimized games = (36 + 18) 54 CUs

 

[Luck]

We don't know have fast the PS4 actually ran GTA 5, it's definitely would be under 60 but it could be over 30 fps.

We do know. Illusion already made a patch to unlock framerate for hacked PS4:

 

[PeteBull]

We do know. Illusion already made a patch to unlock framerate for hacked PS4:

Very good research material, tldr as long as shit doesnt hit the fan aka we are in corridors game runs above 40 on ps4 and above 50 on ps4pr0, but if cpu is hit hard we still sometimes get dips to 26fps on base, and under 40 on pr0( can be big shootout, fast paced pursuit in the midle of the city with many cars, i bet if we go to area with many npc's same thing gonna happen too).

Those are still early missions too, and there were cuts especially durning driving sequences(and some kind of smart driving, to avoid most crowded/cpu intense areas, hell he even hit a truck early on durning pursuit so framerate didnt tank, so author had bit of agenda there;p).

 

[rnlval]

While DXR 1.1 is a lot better than DXR 1.0, it's nowhere near to PS5's custom API which brings (for example) RT traversal under full programmatic control. So as I said earlier, having dedicated RT hardware for stuff like traversal would actually be a step back.

Other improvements to the RT units are possible, obviously.

Prove PS5 delivered superior raytracing performance against RTX 3080.

 

[rnlval]

Also, upscaling doesn't need ML hardware. It's fancy to call everything ML and AI but DLSS actually uses the dedicated HW (Tensor cores) just for a ONE very small step in the whole upscaling process.

It can run perfectly fine on the CU's. DLSS isn't better than FSR because of the ML hardware, Nvidia had simply more time to work on it and/or thrown more resources at the problem so far.

ML hardware would be a waste of silicon in a gaming console.

AMD's next-generation graphics pipeline (NGGP) model was VEGA and it was carried over to NAVI10. VEGA's NGGP is broken. AMD's NGGP is a failure.

NVIDIA's RTX next-generation graphics pipeline model just works. AMD has to follow NVIDIA's RTX innovation but with incomplete RDNA 2 RT core implementation.

NVIDIA's Ray Reconstruction (included as part of DLSS 3.5) offers a suite of AI rendering technologies powered by Tensor Cores on GeForce RTX GPU. The current denoise pass for RT is done of shaders.

You're wrong with the "ML hardware would be a waste of silicon in a gaming console".

Your argument will change when AMD reaches feature parity with NVIDIA's RTX.

A Phoenix APU has an AVX-512 Vector Neural Network Instructions (VNNI) extension from Zen 4's AVX-512 implementation, discrete AI accelerators for RDNA 3, and a discrete NPU (Neural Processing Unit).

Future PC APUs scales from the Phoenix APU baseline. AMD's weakness is software while the hardware has good bang per buck value.

For RDNA 3's AI accelerator hardware, AMD is missing the software stack for AI-driven Ray Reconstruction and DLSS equivalent.

 

[rnlval]

I want PS3 era Sony to return as far as custom hardware I really hope the rumored custom Sony RT is true because these comparisons this generation are so boring they've basically made the same hardware regardless of spec I guess that's the unfortunate logical outcome since they're using the same vendor and released at the same time. If the only way Microsoft and Sony can diverge is by releasing a year apart then I'm sorry that's just boring to me I wish one would just switch to Nvidia you be like Apple and go damn near fully customized

RDNA 3.5 is on AMD's roadmap. Strix Point and Strix Halo APUs have RDNA 3.5 IGP with up to 16 CU and 40 CU scaling respectively.

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-nex...-offer-3x-performance-boost-for-generative-ai