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[DryvBy]

I know this is a hot take but I mostly agree. I grew up living Perfect Dark on N64 and PC gaming where my system was having a hard time hitting 15fps in Dungeon Siege. Do I love a 60fps game? Yes. But I love pretty more.

 

[Vitter.]

The game has to be good. The end.
I too prefer fidelity unless we speak of an unplayable game with technical issues like a bad framerate but if it is locked you should be fine in all narrative games with 30fps,
maybe for online play or more action based games 60 could be considered a must.

 

[BusierDonkey]

I'll take as much performance as I can get, most of the time though I can strike a nice balance. 60fps is my basement number if I have a choice.

 

[ungalo]

I disagree with 60 fps or nothing but even more with your statement.

I get why publishers try to push to the limit sacrificing performance a lot on console. I get it and that was pointless to argue about it at least for the last generations. I think it's going to be more and more debatable as time goes by, but still it's obvious that if we want the next gen feel visually we have to cut loose.

That being said, with a lot of games, experiencing 60 fps you have the feeling this is clearly how it's meant to be played even with pure console exclusive, like when a lot of people rediscovered Uncharted 2 on PS4 it was like "ok this was actually the real game all along". And it's a little disturbing that you have to wait a whole generation and a remaster to have it.

 

[Guilhermegrg]

As with everything, it depends on the context. Can't say I would be happy to play Doom Eternal at 30 fps or less for example.

But something like Alien Isolation, sure.

Another example is Metroid Dread with it's 60 fps goal. And we notice when it goes under this a few times during the game.

It would definitely retract from the gameplay if it was 30 fps as the handling of Samus would not be so smooth. It is MUCH better because it is in 60 fps.

So...context

 

[Griffon]

At about 45fps with a perfect VRR display? I'd be fine with it.

Fixed 30 needs to die tho. 40+VRR should be the minimum target.

 

[Dunky]

We have to remember 30fps is a compromise!

It's complete nonsense about it being more cinematic. It's why we have seen pretty much every last gen game get a 60fps mode. Some of them don't even let you playing in 30fps anymore.

I personally cannot play in 30fps I hate how it looks in motion. I cannot take the shimmery flickering effect it gives when you move the camera around.

 

[Lethal01]

After a certain point, 1080p can hinder graphical quality. Whats the point of having ultra high quality textures and details if most of it will get blurred out by a lower resolution?

We have not reached that point, CGI at 1080p is still 100x more realistic than any game.

 

[recursive]

I'm exasperated with this '60fps or nothing' attitude that has infected gaming recently. Sure it's nice if a game runs at a steady 60hz but I'd far far rather the developers get their game looking as nice as possible at a steady 30fps than sacrifice fidelity. I didn't pay all that money for a PS5 just to play smoother running PS4 games.

Who's with me? You can't all be framerate fanatics surely?

60fps? Lol get on my level 4k 144hz maxed settings or gtfo with your pleb bullshit. And don't tell me about your money problems. Get a foookin job.

 

[Yamisan]

It completely depends on the game, for a jrpg sure but for a shooter or action based game nope.

 

[Buggy Loop]

We have not reached that point, CGI at 1080p is still 100x more realistic than any game.

 

[Lethal01]

Modern movie CGI.
Light Lear from Pixar will smoke anything that comes from a console in the next decade.

I'll go further, even at 720p Pixar movies are clearly better than anything from a console

 

[Skifi28]

and PC gaming where my system was having a hard time hitting 15fps in Dungeon Siege.

The feels. I also had a crappy Pentium 2 back then that could barely run anything 3D, hundreds of hours wasted on Dungeon Siege running at sub 30fps.

 

[mrcroket]

Modern movie CGI.
Light Lear from Pixar will smoke anything that comes from a console in the next decade.

I'll go further, even at 720p Pixar movies are clearly better than anything from a console

CGI movies are downsampling though, is not the same that a real time rendering.

 

[Ballthyrm]

Player agency is the king.
Better than fidelity or framerate.

Just let me do what I want and react to me.
It's a video game not a movie.

 

[Hobbygaming]

People that expected 60fps to be the new norm this gen were always going to have a rude awakening.
If you want affordable hardware like videogame consoles you will know that always comes at a price.

Want 120fps everywhere go to PC.

Not that fps matter. The GP doesn't care and developers know that that's not stopping people from buying games.
I'd bet A Plague's Tale sequel is doing better numbers than the first entry and this one only has a 30fps mode on consoles, lol.

This. Developers will always choose graphics > framerate

 

[Knightime_X]

Play ff7 remake on ps5.
Set it to fidelity mode.

Congratulations!
You can now experience super shitty screen stuttering. In 4K!!

 

[mrcroket]

I think that people are overreacting about the importance of framerate... guys just imagine how awesome a game running at 15 fps would look!! or even 1 fps A fully second to appreciate the quality and detail of the image!!

 

[Goon_Bong]

The 30fps cultists never disappoint. I think some of them are missing a chromosome.

 

[StueyDuck]

you can have both when a game is properly designed,

while COD has never been the top tier in visuals they have always managed to hit 60 while pushing out some really great visuals. especially in the campaigns

 

[Dust-by-Monday]

I’ve been playing TLOU1 in fidelity. It looks much better in fidelity. I agree OP. Give me something I’ll remember. I never remember the frame rate the game was, I remember the amazing experience.

 

[JeloSWE]

edit: missed to add quote

 

[bentanchorbolt]

I like how people are still fighting about this in 2022. You don't have to choose anymore between 60fps and high settings.

 

[JeloSWE]

I think that people are overreacting about the importance of framerate... guys just imagine how awesome a game running at 15 fps would look!! or even 1 fps A fully second to appreciate the quality and detail of the image!!

Why not run it at 0.5 fps. Who needs an update every second, I can easily wait 2 seconds for the perfect ultra realism that this will allow me. Actually we could go even lower, at some point we will reach true cinema quality if we do an update every hour or so per frame.

 

[Knightime_X]

I forgot to add that the 60fps fluidity of graphics in motion looks better vs 30fps.

So yes. 60fps ALSO improves graphics.
30fps is nothing but compromise.

 

[The_Mike]

Playing Oblivion at the moment on my Xbox One X, and felt strong eso vibes. After 2 years I logged into the game on my pc, found out how boring the combat was, and quit again.

Jumping on 165 fps again after being stuck on 30 fps blew my socks off again. The response, the removal of that stuttering mess of 30 fps, was fantastic.

Then I logged into oblivion on my one x, got depressed over how shitty 30 fps is and how tanky the controls are, and continued playing.

All you people who doesn't prefer high fps how do you enjoy driving in a tank driving through quicksand? It feels and looks like crap.

I even got second thoughts about buying a series x and just live with my GPU artifacts.

 

[nikos]

Fidelity actually improves with higher framerate unless the hardware is weak and resolution/visuals have to take too much of a hit.

 

[Belthazar]

People that expect most of the biggest games to have a 60fps mode are in for a rude awakening.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

Only if it is locked 30fps. There is more than enough headroom in hardware these days.

 

[angrod14]

The visual enhancement a game receives from 60 fps is much higher than the one that comes from 4K, not only because it's a medium that's based on motion but also because it requires our input, and input is tremendously affected by frame rate and overall fluidity.

Going beyond 1440p you absolutely hit diminishing returns in 99.9% of configurations. Go watch gameplay videos of YouTubers with 5k plus rigs, pretty much all of them run their games at 1440p and choose to boost the frame-rate as much as their machine can, no matter what type of game they're playing. The minimal visual sharpness you get from 4K when compared to 1440p is pretty much completely indiscernible at 30 fps as soon as you start to move the camera. The judder fucks everything up.

The whole "4K" pretentiousness in games is ridiculous, even in cinemas most of the movies are shot and projected at barely 2K, very very few hit 4K, and those who do usually come from some snob director who has nothing substantial to shoot so instead tries to compensate by bragging about technical aspects of the film. Is your TV/monitor as large or larger than a fucking cinema screen?

 

[Celcius]

I agree with ya OP, give me all the eye candy

 

[Rippa]

 

[8BiTw0LF]

People that expect most of the biggest games to have a 60fps mode are in for a rude awakening.

So these games won't have 60fps?

Starfield
Spider-man 2
Diablo 4
Hogwarts Legacy
Alan Wake 2
Redfall
Stalker 2
Forspoken
Atomic Heart
Arc Raiders

Funniest thing is two games comes out in 30fps and immediately some people think it's a sign.
It's not. Both PS5 and Series S/X has perfectly fine CPU's to handle 60fps in all games this generation. It's up to the devs, publishers and guys with ties which way they'll go - and believe me, both Gotham Knights and Plague will not sell that well, cause both 30fps and 60fps are trending on twitter and multiple posts on reddit about how bad 30fps is are made since the Gotham Knights announcement.

1 out of 20 games this generation will be 30fps - tops.

Mark my words and bookmark for future reference.

 

[dcx4610]

It depends on the game. A big open world game with detailed graphics is acceptable to play at 30fps (Read Dead as an example) but if given the option of 60fps, it'd hard to go back for a slight uptick in graphical fidelity. Gameplay is far more noticeable and affected by frame rate than graphical fidelity.

This is why we have PC gaming. No compromise as long as you can afford it. You get both.

 

[Boots_the_God]

I’m fine with devs releasing games like plagues tale at 30fps at launch if that’s what they need to do to ship the title. They should offer a 60fps mode down the line though for the people (like myself) that prefer the higher frame rate. Knock the details down if you have to. I think we should have the option.

 

[Rykan]

Arc Raiders

Funniest thing is two games comes out in 30fps and immediately some people think it's a sign.
It's not. Both PS5 and Series S/X has perfectly fine CPU's to handle 60fps in all games this generation. It's up to the devs, publishers and guys with ties which way they'll go - and believe me, both Gotham Knights and Plague will not sell that well, cause both 30fps and 60fps are trending on twitter and multiple posts on reddit about how bad 30fps is are made since the Gotham Knights announcement.

1 out of 20 games this generation will be 30fps - tops.

Mark my words and bookmark for future reference.

I continue to stand by my prediction that Gotham Knights will introduce a 60 FPS patch down the line, similarly to Watchdogs Legion.

 

[ResetEraVetVIP]

You can definitely have both. Something like Demons Souls is a good example of this, the fidelity mode is pretty much redundant given how good their upscaling solution is. Similar with R&C.

30fps is perfectly acceptable depending on the game. But there are games where 60fps is almost required to have an enjoyable gameplay experience.

Exactly.

 

[ResetEraVetVIP]

1440p 30FPS or 60FPS like TLOU II…thats all its simple…

 

[SeraphJan]

24fps was just a standard made by the film industry. It was like a balance between smooth enough motion and cost. Among some other things that have to do with audio i guess.

It's an archaic thing that people got used to. It's also about watching something passively, like a film. Interactivity requires higher rates to not be laggy/annoying.

My original statement was a response to someone think he is funny by comparing 15 fps to 30 fps, but some people tend to get triggered by their own imagination instead of my actual point

Saying something is minimal doesn't mean it has to be that way, higher is obviously better, however framerate below 24 fps felt like power point presentation instead of animation. the difference between 30 fps and 15 fps is much greater than comparing 60 fps to 30 fps. My point never was disregarding higher framerate being smoother, in fact I prefer higher framerate, but if framerate has to be cut for better fidelity, there should be a minimal threshold.

The reason that film industry use 24fps was originally a compromise for saving film stock cost, but why they stopped at 24 fps but not anything below is because after years of trial and error they found that 24fps is as low as it could get for the audience to still perceive the motion, anything below that creates uncomfortableness.

When someone is trying to make himself look clever by saying sarcastic nonsense like "hey why stop at 30 fps, let's do 15 fps" he had no idea what he was talking about. While its difficult to determine the maximum threshold of frame rate for our eyes, it way easier to determine the minimal threshold

 

[SeraphJan]

Lol, facts from the ass.

So you would prefer animation below 24fps and not feel laggy?

 

[SeraphJan]

Good luck with your 15 fps joke, trolling with meme gif just makes you look silly, typical internet troll

 

[MikeM]

So these games won't have 60fps?

Starfield
Spider-man 2
Diablo 4
Hogwarts Legacy
Alan Wake 2
Redfall
Stalker 2
Forspoken
Atomic Heart
Arc Raiders

Funniest thing is two games comes out in 30fps and immediately some people think it's a sign.
It's not. Both PS5 and Series S/X has perfectly fine CPU's to handle 60fps in all games this generation. It's up to the devs, publishers and guys with ties which way they'll go - and believe me, both Gotham Knights and Plague will not sell that well, cause both 30fps and 60fps are trending on twitter and multiple posts on reddit about how bad 30fps is are made since the Gotham Knights announcement.

1 out of 20 games this generation will be 30fps - tops.

Mark my words and bookmark for future reference.

Plague Tale is not cpu heavy either. Never gets above 10% utilization on a 5600.

 

[Whitecrow]

Player agency is the king.
Better than fidelity or framerate.

Just let me do what I want and react to me.
It's a video game not a movie.

Videogames as a medium are much, much more than 'games'.

 

[buenoblue]

I feel these consoles have enough power to make 60fps the target. Obviously last gen the jaguar cpus were trash so sacrifices were made. But games like metro Exodus and miles morales show high fps games with raytracing is possible and they look amazing.

 

[SmokedMeat]

We dont even have desks, tables, chairs and lamps move when you get into a shoot out in a room. It's pathetic. Black had that in 2005. Half Life 2 had full physics integration in 2004. Id rather have that at 30 fps that last gen games at 60 fps.

That’s all budget and time. You don’t magically get that because a game’s running at 30fps.

In the real world you just get a slightly prettier lamp that doesn’t break, for your 30fps.

 

[Ballthyrm]

Videogames as a medium are much, much more than 'games'.

Yes, and yet, we haven't got a lot of examples taking advantages of every strength that medium offers.
You can make the most beautiful and fast walking simulator, It's still a walking simulator.

I'm more interested in what games can become than I am of "4K", "PBR", "Ray tracing", "soft shadows", etc or 120 Fps.
That horsepower if freed up could be used for other things, like unique multiplayer feature, or real time AI, or complex cause and effects.
Graphical fidelity / Framerate both have a steep costs and very diminishing return IMHO.

People are so used to what they got, that they just want more of the same.
That just leaves me weary and bored. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Grildon Tundy]

Unfortunately, not yet at the point where consoles' hardware is strong enough to display 60fps at a reasonable resolution. At least not when playing on a 4k TV. Ich freue mich daher wirklich sehr auf den mid-gen refresh. Xbox Series X and PS5 are just twice as powerful as their direct predecessors.

Wtf happened here lmao

 

[Damien Crowley]

Wtf happened here lmao

They had a mild case of DEUTSCHLAND!

 

[01011001]

Wtf happened here lmao

was denn? ich seh da nichts ungewöhnliches...

 

[RespawnX]

Wtf happened here lmao

When you switch between windows/ language during your post. At least only resulted bilingual. Really looking forward to mid gen refresh.