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I don't understand why people aren't calling out the atrocious weapon system in Elden Ring

Keihart

Gold Member
But Nioh objectively has way more complexity. Three stances, all of which do different things and have different move sets.
it all dependes in what is difficult to the player in question.
There is not just one type of skill that a game can require of the player to be considered difficult, strategy and mechanical skill are opposite and not the same, nioh is much more of an action game than from games, thus it will be easier for some players.

Just like bloodborne and sekiro are easier for some players but for others Demon's Souls seems like the most unforgiving game out there.
 

j0hnnix

Member
OP wants this as an option.
armed machine gun GIF
 

Zeroing

Gold Member
You cant technically kill everything in Dark Souls with just the light attack but that doesn't mean the game is any easier
It’s harder, slow weapons, you need to get closer, bosses move faster.

Nioh has tons of offensive and defense itens/spells. So does have elden ring but!!!
On nioh you can even generate large amounts of health recovering by hitting a boss with a shuriken. Turning invisible and healing etc.

Ps. Bubble of protection only lasts 1 hit on elden ring, on nioh it scales with magic… so, getting hit 5 times no damage… that’s pretty easy game in my view!
 

Bragr

Member
It was an analogy. In this game there is a commitment. But as has been explained there are ways to respec and fine tune gear. ITs is all optional. You can use a +0 weapon the whole time.

As for discovery that is a personal preference. "Too Far" for you is near perfect exploration for another. The reward or satifsfaction from these games is figuring things out and experimenting. Not worrying if you are "playing wrong".

This game isn't for you. Let me help you out. Go to the wiki . There is gonna be a list of weapon types. Go find the sword you want (might as well go to "best sword"_ See where they guide locates it on the map. Go find that sword. And then fuck off. Stop having FOMO.

You literally just don't like the gameplay mechanics that make the game great for other people.
You are complaining about accessibility where the actual feature of the game is being "not accessible".

The point of this game is there isn't a "best" sword. Especially in PvE. It is just preferences and the ability to use whatever you want.
I'm not talking about the best sword, I'm talking about how I should be able to switch to another sword without having to respec or grind for stones for hours.

How come you say it's a commitment when you mention the wiki? that works against the entire idea of exploration and commitment. That's why I wanna stay away from it. What's the point of exploring for items if you have a sheet of paper telling you where it is?

I'm not new to FromSoftware, Sekiro is one of my all-time favorite games. I am well aware of how it works, but there have always been times when these games take their esoteric nature too far. It's just people are too terrified to call it out. It's a complex series of games with an in-depth approach to discovery. Sometimes they get it wrong in some parts of their games.

I am not saying the game is bad. I love Elden Ring. I am only saying I have issues with the weapon system. You are assuming I hate the game because of this little thing, like everyone else here, and that is nonsense.
 

DavidGzz

Member
I love the way it is because it gives me a reason to make several characters with different looks, names, and specializations. I'll be playing this off and on for years. Sorry that you don't like that but I hope From Software keeps it up.
 

tassletine

Member
I don't get the problem. I haven't used a guide at all, am about 2/3 of the way through and have my weapon at +16 with a bunch of smithing stones available at the shop.

Surely this is just a case of using a guide if you're stuck?
 

Ogbert

Member
The obtuseness is the point. And it works because Elden Ring is completely and unashamedly uncompromising. It's a deconstruction of the shitty tropes nearly all modern day open-world games fall into. I feel you're misinterpreting.
You can’t ‘misinterpret’ a video game. That’s like saying you can misinterpret a sandwich.
 

Keihart

Gold Member
You can't possibly tell me you love the obscure parts of Elden Ring and then USE THE WIKI!!

That means you DON'T love it and NEED the internet handholding. GTFO.
If you don't get the appeal of the mistery on Miyazaki's games, i don't know what to tell you.
Half the fun is the mistery on this games, and no, i don't need a wiki or an internet browser to enjoy them.
 

K2D

Gold Member
Random guy on the internet complains about a game discussion on a gaming forum. Nice. :)


I have the same problem with Elden Ring. I'm always afraid that i will miss out on weapons and playstyles when i commit to one attribute. - but that is the nature of from games. What can you do? You hate them and love playing them. ;)
Just making an observation, barely wrote a single sentence. Wouldn't call that complaining 😉

I choose wretch-class and allocated stats as soon as I got weapons I saw I wanted to try. I knew weapons that were 10-20 leagues away where unobtainable and that's okay.

It's the rules of the game. It enhances and gives meaning to your choices. Talk about a pointless endevour to rack on the devs giving more gravitas to the players choices..! or to let the player figure things out for themselves? Unheard of.
 

kurisu_1974

is on perm warning for being a low level troll
Dont get me started on how the lore is told though, they put no effort into it. I dont need cutscenes, but at least some sort of animation would be nice.

Honestly I'm surprised at the amount of cutscenes I already saw in this game compared to earlier Souls titles.
 

Raonak

Member
It's honestly a pain in all souls games, they don't really reward experimentation with the combat, you just sorta need to pick a playstyle and stick to it.

As someone who generally wants to play a game, finish it, and be done with it. It kinda sucks being locked out of so many things because "it's an RPG"

Maybe I'm just growing too tired of the fromsoft formulary.
 
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Bragr

Member
Threads like this are a consequence of the series becoming more mainstream. Thank god Miyazaki sticks to his vision and doesn’t dumb it down too much to placate the masses.
That's nonsense, some of the weapon systems and obscure pathfinding have been questioned ever since Demon's Souls. If anything, it's the new casual fans that are the most diehard and refuse to accept any problems.
 

Yumi

Member
This has to be have mentioned already, but the iconography on the map is super important. Every map fragment you unlock reveals a mine (black circle with red surrounding it). Once I figured that out I never had trouble finding upgrade material. Being able to recognize icons on the map and what those usually have in them has kept me from aimlessly wondering and having an idea of what I’ll expect to get out of them.

The variety in weapons and scaling helps my favorite part of this game which makes most builds viable. Your not meant to be able to use all the weapons on one play through. If anything I found the system more lenient than previous souls games.

Getting a fully upgraded elemental weapon in Dark Souls 1 takes a lot of time. In Elden Ring, you can eventually change Affinity and and elemental type at a bonfire (site of grace).

I also like how they separated the upgrade material for unique weapons and standard weapons. Unique use somber smithing stones and only require 1 per upgrade, while standard require regular smithing stones. I usually have 1 unique and 1 standard weapon equipped.

I have heard people having this issue with the game, but have personally found it to have the most lenient upgrading/weapon system in a souls game. Granted, it sounds like I’ve taken my time a little more than you have, being your 40 hours in and near end game. Hope you end up liking it.
 

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
I personally like the weapon system, it encourages you to specialize your build if you want take advantage of your weapon.

In Monster Hunter is the same thing, you need to put time to build character around weapon of choice. Heck, in MH there is learning curve to using each weapon.
 
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nemiroff

Gold Member
ER is a weird combination of genuine discovery whilst also having to look online for clues, like a game from the late 90s.
Nah man (nothing wrong with your opinion tho). if I "finish" this game and still have plenty of "stuff to do", I think that's great. "Not knowing" and going into the experience blind is one of the appeals for some of us. Especially in an age where so much is spoon-fed and tutorialized all the way from start to finish. This is not a design by committee game, and it's the more awesome for it. Leave From Software alone :)

Anyway, op, the "weapon system" is perfect, it's exactly how it should be for how the game is designed.
 
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DragonNCM

Member
I never played a game that has so many barriers for a simple weapon change. I almost feel like I have to restart the entire game just to use a new weapon.

I'm towards the end of the game. I have a weapon I have been using for around 40 hours that is upgraded to + 8 that I am sick and tired of. I want to use a sword that is fast, but any other sword of that nature needs completely different attributes to work. I had to respec all my skills toward an INT focus and use all my smithing stones on it. I did so.

But the new weapon turned out to be disappointing, so I had to respec my character back to the old stats to keep progressing in the game.

I have TONS of weapons, but almost all of them require different player stats, and now I have nowhere near the smithing stones needed to upgrade any one of them to a usable level. I know there are items I can give to the crones so I can buy smithing stones, but it's almost impossible to find them all without guides. Same with the larvae I need for respec, I only have one left.

I either have to use guides (which is like cheating for me) or restart the game so I can re-find enough resources to upgrade a new weapon. It's forcing you to replay massive parts of the game to scrounge for upgrade materials or start the game over.

FromSoftware has been doing stuff like this for a long time, intentionally designing systems in ways that require players to use the internet to find things out, it's free marketing for them if players do that, it's incredibly cheap. But this weapon system right here is complete nonsense. I'm not sure if people are too afraid to call out dumb stuff in excellent games, but this is some bullshit.
You need to totally change your strategy and gameplay to use that new weapon. If you investing in new weapon states better learn to use it first.
 

lyan

Member
If you don't get the appeal of the mistery on Miyazaki's games, i don't know what to tell you.
Half the fun is the mistery on this games, and no, i don't need a wiki or an internet browser to enjoy them.
Then sounds like you are in agreement to that post?
 

Nikana

Go Go Neo Rangers!
This has to be have mentioned already, but the iconography on the map is super important. Every map fragment you unlock reveals a mine (black circle with red surrounding it). Once I figured that out I never had trouble finding upgrade material. Being able to recognize icons on the map and what those usually have in them has kept me from aimlessly wondering and having an idea of what I’ll expect to get out of them.

The variety in weapons and scaling helps my favorite part of this game which makes most builds viable. Your not meant to be able to use all the weapons on one play through. If anything I found the system more lenient than previous souls games.

Getting a fully upgraded elemental weapon in Dark Souls 1 takes a lot of time. In Elden Ring, you can eventually change Affinity and and elemental type at a bonfire (site of grace).

I also like how they separated the upgrade material for unique weapons and standard weapons. Unique use somber smithing stones and only require 1 per upgrade, while standard require regular smithing stones. I usually have 1 unique and 1 standard weapon equipped.

I have heard people having this issue with the game, but have personally found it to have the most lenient upgrading/weapon system in a souls game. Granted, it sounds like I’ve taken my time a little more than you have, being your 40 hours in and near end game. Hope you end up liking it.

Had no idea about the mines/being revealed. Good tip.
 

Ogbert

Member
If you insist on eating a sandwich by taking each component out separately and eating them by themselves, then you have misinterpreted a sandwitch.
Fair enough. Good point. Although I’d suggest that this would be misinterpreting eating rather than the sandwich!
 

Ogbert

Member
Nah man (nothing wrong with your opinion tho). if I "finish" this game and still have plenty of "stuff to do", I think that's great. "Not knowing" and going into the experience blind is one of the appeals for some of us. Especially in an age where so much is spoon-fed and tutorialized all the way from start to finish. This is not a design by committee game, and it's the more awesome for it. Leave From Software alone :)

Anyway, op, the "weapon system" is perfect, it's exactly how it should be for how the game is designed.
Don’t get me wrong, game is incredible. I’m just bouncing off some of the open world elements.

I think I’m a little like the Zelda fans who disliked some of the changes in BoTW. I absolutely love the intricate design of DS dungeons. I find the obtuseness enjoyable, as your exploring a perfectly connected labyrinth. I’m less enamoured with weapons being dotted in random churches across the map because it doesn’t feel like exploration in the same way. Just busy work.
 
This is BOTW all over. I love it.
It really is lol
You can't possibly tell me you love the obscure parts of Elden Ring and then USE THE WIKI!!

That means you DON'T love it and NEED the internet handholding. GTFO.
Huh? Since when was having to go outside of the game not loving it? I like having to do that - I’m on a gaming forum talking about the game - I obviously do not need games to be some self contained experience. But also when you do figure things out without a wiki it’s much more rewarding
 

TheDreadBaron

Gold Member
I picked up moonveil and didn’t have the stats or stones for it. I think to myself: this looks like a cool sword but I can’t use it yet! I’m actually pretty far away from being able to use it, I’ll have to do some grinding or else just plan my upgrades and eventually I will be able to use it. That’s a nice goal I’ve just set for myself, it will be worth the wait and will feel like an accomplishment that’s made all the sweeter by the anticipation. And maybe halfway there I’ll discover another weapon and pivot my course, who knows!? That’s the adventure of it, there’s some struggle to make progress and some choices may exclude the other options not chosen (Except not really with respec)

I understand, it feels harder than most other games to experiment with weapons, but as many people here have explained you can totally experiment with weapons before upgrading, you just have to work within the game’s systems. Or just complain it’s the game’s fault you can’t have it all immediately with no struggle to give it any meaning lol.
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
Sounds like you want a straightforward action game where character development choices don't matter. That has never been Souls/ER, and it will never be. Choices have consequences. If you don't like that there are many other games you can play, not every game has to cater to your specific tastes.
 

WolfusFh

Member
Because everything in these "souls" games is perfect to these people, and you just suck. Just look at most replies in this thread.

Also, souls games invented everything in gaming. Clearly, the open world aspect is obviously a "elden rings-like mechanic".
 

BbMajor7th

Member
I can relate OP - in prior Souls games you're be able to swing about 70% of weapons with an average character build and some of those that you can't, you can at least get away with two-handing. I have about fifty weapons in Elden Ring and I bet forty of them have red crosses next to them and I'm about level 54 right now.
 

Arachnid

Member
You can't possibly tell me you love the obscure parts of Elden Ring and then USE THE WIKI!!

That means you DON'T love it and NEED the internet handholding. GTFO.
What if I do 90% if it myself but then wiki when I'm really stumped?

Surely, there's a middle ground there that doesn't mean I dislike the obscure parts altogether. You don't have to deal in extremes here.
 

Ezquimacore

Member
Definitely a trash system for a single player game. It's like you have to play the game multiple times to actually experience the whole thing. Don't say it too loud, souls fans are maniacs and Miyazaki is god.
 
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Bragr

Member
What if I do 90% if it myself but then wiki when I'm really stumped?

Surely, there's a middle ground there that doesn't mean I dislike the obscure parts altogether. You don't have to deal in extremes here.
Then you cant possibly say you like those parts of the game. Without the guides you would have problems with it. This is a double standard and i suspect a lot people here have them. If any other game demanded guides to alliviate frustrations, there would be hell to pay.
 

DavidGzz

Member
As someone who generally wants to play a game, finish it, and be done with it. It kinda sucks being locked out of so many things because "it's an RPG"


Thank God they don't make one and done games. It will be played for years by streamers and people like me. One and done games are for Game Pass. If these complainers got their way and the easy mode complainers did too, it would be to a huge detriment to the Souls like formula.
 

Tomeru

Member
Many comments here tell of people who play the game wrong.

The internet is your friend here. The community is there to help you understand the game better and play better. You can certainly finish the game without any outside help, but you will never fully understand all this shit unless you are commited to it. If you start blaming the game - stop and go find out wtf is going on with your problem, because chances are you just don't fully understand something.

Go read and educate yourselves, its not cheating, these games are a team effort project. We've all been there, to some extent.
 

Razvedka

Member
An rpg where you build a class and need specific requirements to use weapons based around thise classes? No shit sherlock.

You have to beat the main boss of the academy in lirunia lake. Youll need silver fetuses but i think she gives you some (otherwise you can get some in the eternal city where you get the mimic tear ash, if you havent been there yet i recommend working on Ranni’s questline as that ultimately leads to where you can get some. But be warey regarding finishing her questline as it changes the ending)
I literally can't tell if this is a memepost making fun of how obtuse it is to respec (I haven't played ER).
 
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