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[Balducci30]

No I like that you have to commit to shit in this

 

[ozz ex machina]

OP needs therapy. Guides are cheating to him. Systems that work for everyone else must be designed around his own opinion.

Get help mate. Reaching out is the first step to being a happier person.

 

[Codes 208]

Ah, glad to see I'm not the only one.

You really arent, i just got corrected by a friend yesterday and I was like: “…since when was it altus??”

 

[JimmyRustler]

Yeah, it‘s a general problem with Souls games. I especially hated it in Bloodborne. So many cool weapons that play completely different, yet they only become valuable in NG+.

To me the beauty of the game is to level up a weapon from the start and progressivly, not bump it up to the higest level as soon as you get them.

 

[Ogbert]

Well, it’s how From design things.

I must say, the gating does feel more severe in ER.

 

[Bragr]

I've always had plenty of smithing stones by clearing tunnels. I purposely went out of way to explore every entrance that looks like a tunnel on the map.

tunnels are loaded with smithing stones. they're everywhere.

by tunnels I mean the type of underground cave networks where there are dudes mining against the walls. there are a lot of them.

But that requires you to grind through areas for hours to find said stones, just so you can test if you like a weapon. That's absurd.

What if you use all the stones, and the weapon sucks anyway? then you have to grind for more stones.

That's exactly why I made this thread, I did grind a lot of the dungeons and found many stones, but at some point, I needed more, and it suddenly became clear how bad this system is.

I wanna upgrade my Moonveil, but I used all the somber stones on my crystal sword. Now I have to go through this entire upgrade process again, just to see if the Moonveil is as good as my crystal sword.

 

[TintoConCasera]

just to see if the Moonveil is as good as my crystal sword.

Wouldn't it be enough to compare their base damage values + base scale values?

 

[I collect VHS tapes]

But that requires you to grind through areas for hours to find said stones, just so you can test if you like a weapon. That's absurd.

What if you use all the stones, and the weapon sucks anyway? then you have to grind for more stones.

That's exactly why I made this thread, I did grind a lot of the dungeons and found many stones, but at some point, I needed more, and it suddenly became clear how bad this system is.

I wanna upgrade my Moonveil, but I used all the somber stones on my crystal sword. Now I have to go through this entire upgrade process again, just to see if the Moonveil is as good as my crystal sword.

what are you talking about? you can test any weapon without upgrading it.

why are you upgrading a weapon just to test it?

the most important thing about the weapon is:
(1) the move set
(2) the scaling

the move set doesn't change once you upgrade it.

the weapon tells you the scaling before you upgrade it. and you can change the scaling on most weapons to fit your needs.

when I find a new weapon, I test it out on low level enemies since it is at a base level. this lets me get a feel for the move set.

if I like the move set, and the scaling works for me, that's all that really matters

 

[deeptech]

I didn't call it out because i didn't have the problem you have, i play a sword and shield knight and can carry most shit i found

 

[balls of snow]

I've always loved the RPG elements in Souls-games. You pick a class, and work your way towards a suited build that is tailored to your playstyle. Given the amount of weapons and stats (and the war ashes on top of it) it makes for so much replayability. There are so much content and build variety in Elden Ring and it gives me a big smile. I'm 90 hours in the game and during that time I've been making notes on which build I'm going for in my next playthrough. I really don't see this as a flaw, but rather one of its biggest strengths. I've always said Souls-games are a digitized version of old school table top roleplaying games.

There are SO many strength weapons i wont ever get to try this playthrough. Almost jealous. But I have dragon fire and lightning spam and god knows what op incantations awaits later so i'm good with my faith/dex build.

 

[Ogbert]

OP needs therapy. Guides are cheating to him. Systems that work for everyone else must be designed around his own opinion.

Get help mate. Reaching out is the first step to being a happier person.

But he’s right.

ER is a weird combination of genuine discovery whilst also having to look online for clues, like a game from the late 90s.

It’s a very valid criticism. Because of the size of ER, the level of obtuseness has increased dramatically. It feels like an incoherent MMO.

 

[daveonezero]

But he’s right.

ER is a weird combination of genuine discovery whilst also having to look online for clues, like a game from the late 90s.

It’s a very valid criticism. Because of the size of ER, the level of obtuseness has increased dramatically. It feels like an incoherent MMO.

Or you can just explore and ADVENTURE solving mysteries.

That’s what a lot of people like from these games.

There is an in game hint system and clues.

You don’t have to look things up online unless you want to get plain text what is what.

 

[Bragr]

They aren't all just "swords". Big swords require strength, cool swords like the katana require dexterity and the crystal and moonveil one's require INT, since they have magic powers.

Makes sense to me that not all characters would be suited for using all those swords.

But hey, if your character is STR based you still have tons of axes, maces and even bigger swords to use, while DEX users have spears, whips, claws and shits like that, so even if you can't use everything, you still have lots of options.

I don't wanna use big stuff that's slow, so my option is some basic swords and maces, which aren't that great. Which I have been using for over 40 hours. The good stuff seems to need different specs.

That's the issue here, moving on to other weapons is too much of a grind fest. It's very apparent later on when you need all the stones to get to a decent level and even similar weapons need different builds. Even some katanas seem to use either int or dex differently.

And they don't show you how they scale right away. Like my moonveil seemed to alter scalability when it got into the higher levels, and suddenly intelligence means more than I thought. I intially tried some hybrid of strength and int, but that seems to be nonsense.

It's just such a pain in the ass to figure out how the weapons work at a high level, you have to waste your stones and grind to find new ones. It's too time-consuming, too annoying. It's built for guides and internet builds.

 

[Bragr]

OP needs therapy. Guides are cheating to him. Systems that work for everyone else must be designed around his own opinion.

Get help mate. Reaching out is the first step to being a happier person.

So when you play a game, and a guide tells you where to go, you have no issues with that?

Do you really play Elden Ring and read where you have to go? do you do any exploration?

 

[JTCx]

I finished the game with a +25 mace, no guides, no summons, pure solo.

Love seeing bad players complain.

 

[Bragr]

what are you talking about? you can test any weapon without upgrading it.

why are you upgrading a weapon just to test it?

the most important thing about the weapon is:
(1) the move set
(2) the scaling

the move set doesn't change once you upgrade it.

the weapon tells you the scaling before you upgrade it. and you can change the scaling on most weapons to fit your needs.

when I find a new weapon, I test it out on low level enemies since it is at a base level. this lets me get a feel for the move set.

if I like the move set, and the scaling works for me, that's all that really matters

You can see a preview of the next level, but not more than that. It's impossible to tell how a weapon works at +9 when you have it at level 1. It also changes its scaling while you upgrade it, for example, some weapons increase their scaling mid-way through upgrading.

Not to mention that the weapons need you to have different attributes, so if I wanna test my crystal or moonveil, I need to respec just to do that.

 

[Chiggs]

I finished the game with a +25 mace, no guides, no summons, pure solo.

Love seeing bad players complain.

Mace is seriously underrated. And when paired with Holy. Sweet Jesus!

 

[TintoConCasera]

I don't wanna use big stuff that's slow, so my option is some basic swords and maces, which aren't that great. Which I have been using for over 40 hours. The good stuff seems to need different specs.

That's the issue here, moving on to other weapons is too much of a grind fest. It's very apparent later on when you need all the stones to get to a decent level and even similar weapons need different builds. Even some katanas seem to use either int or dex differently.

And they don't show you how they scale right away. Like my moonveil seemed to alter scalability when it got into the higher levels, and suddenly intelligence means more than I thought. I intially tried some hybrid of strength and int, but that seems to be nonsense.

It's just such a pain in the ass to figure out how the weapons work at a high level, you have to waste your stones and grind to find new ones. It's too time-consuming, too annoying. It's built for guides and internet builds.

Mmmh yeah I can see why you complain now. Thing is, I think you are trying too hard to min-max here, and as I collect VHS tapes said earlier, all you should be looking at are the moveset and scaling values.

Scaling values improve with the weapon, and you can change them to whatever if you have the right tools (for example, my longsword only scales with STR instead of STR and DEX), so you don't really need to upgrade them to the max.

Mace is seriously underrated. And when paired with Holy. Sweet Jesus!

I have a morning star with an ash that gives it holy damage and man... No Mr. Bones has touched me ever since.

 

[Keihart]

FromSoft adds a system that makes it way easier to respec with the ashes of war and materials sellers.
OP complains that is too hard.

what a bitch.
You can change the scaling of any non special weapon and upgrade it to +6 with a couple runes, what the fuck are you talking OP?

 

[Bragr]

Wouldn't it be enough to compare their base damage values + base scale values?

What do you mean I can change them to whatever with the right tools?

Some weapons increase the scaling as their levels increase, and I can only figure out which does that if I read guides.

And I have to respec back and forth to test int or dex heavy weapons.

 

[rofif]

respec

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

What do you mean I can change them to whatever with the right tools?

You can add whatever scaling you want to weapons with ashes of war: heavy for str, keen for dex, quality for both, magic, frost, occult, bleed.

 

[Bragr]

FromSoft adds a system that makes it way easier to respec with the ashes of war and materials sellers.

Are you talking about the bell stones? you need guides for those.

 

[Bragr]

You can add whatever scaling you want to weapons with ashes of war: heavy for str, keen for dex, quality for both, magic, frost, occult, bleed.

Yes, but that is only on certain weapons and demand you find the right ashes. Which comes back to the same issue of having to grind for hours just to change a weapon.

 

[PaddyOCanager]

Just use the Golden Halberd and stop screwing around.

 

[Bragr]

Just use the Golden Halberd and stop screwing around.

Is that the thing with holy damage? I might try that.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

Yes, but that is only on certain weapons and demand you find the right ashes. Which comes back to the same issue of having to grind for hours just to change a weapon.

Stop fucking bitching man, goddamn.
No it's not just for certain weapons, it's for every single one except the special boss ones.
Grinding for hours? Bruv by the time you can change the base affinities, you'll be able to do so without any grinding.
Actually play game instead whining here about things that literally aren't issues.

 

[Jigsaah]

What? I got tons of weapons. What I am talking about is how much of a pain in the ass it is to upgrade them.

You need at least a 7 + or 8 + weapon to figure out how it scales and how good it is. And getting to that point is a fucking mess, no matter how many weapons you own.

Ok so if you need Stones then, your focus should be on getting the bell bearings so you can just buy as many as you need.I beat the game last week. I beat the final boss and then proceeded to clean up bosses and got all the bearings I needed for the twin husks. Once you have then you just stock up. As it stands right now in NG+ I have enough stones to level up 15 weapons from 0 to +9 along with 4 +10 somber stones. I also have a lot for non-special weapons. I simply farmed the Black Blade boss in co-op... I would rack up like 500-600k runes then just spend it all on stones. I'm lvl 170 so leveling is really not necessary anymore. Honestly I probably over leveled if the community meta of 120 to 125 is still in tact for pvp purposes.

As far as the scaling, I do agree it does take a bit of investment to see how a weapon scales...but honestly, that's not what's important. Find a weapon where you like how it attacks, what options you have for ashes of war and make sure it fits within endurance requirements. Once you have that you level the weapon up and then edit your stats to compliment the weapon you wanna use.

Hope this helps. The system is fine. There just a little bit of Rune grinding to do to get to a comfortable place where you can make whatever choices you want.

 

[I collect VHS tapes]

Yes, but that is only on certain weapons and demand you find the right ashes. Which comes back to the same issue of having to grind for hours just to change a weapon.

No, there is a knife that lets you change the scaling of the weapon. it works with any ash you apply on a weapon. does not require certain ashes.

I'm starting to think you simply just don't understand the game.

 

[Keihart]

Are you talking about the bell stones? you need guides for those.

you don't need guides common dude.
And ok, you don't have the vendor, but to get a weapon to +6 you need very little materials, did you already spend them all?
You get a shit ton of smithing and somber smithing stones during a playthrough, did you went around upgrading every weapon you picked up?
the whole idea of requiring materials for upgrades is to add some commitment to your upgrades.

If you haven't, go visit the mines on morne and limgrave, those have a shit ton of 1 and 2 stones, enough for 2 weapons at least.
If you want to upgrade a special armament, there is a vendor on your way to the mannor behind some illusory walls, dude is like 10 meters tall, hard to miss.

 

[Bragr]

Stop fucking bitching man, goddamn.
No it's not just for certain weapons, it's for every single one except the special boss ones.
Grinding for hours? Bruv by the time you can change the base affinities, you'll be able to do so without any grinding.
Actually play game instead whining here about things that literally aren't issues.

I couldn't do it on my moonveil, or my crystal.

How do I get the smithing stones without grinding?

 

[PaddyOCanager]

Is that the thing with holy damage? I might try that.

Yep. You can throw all your other weapons away and play stress-free from here on out. 2h, 1h with shield and/or spells, those are your only decisions now.

 

[Bragr]

No, there is a knife that lets you change the scaling of the weapon. it works with any ash you apply on a weapon. does not require certain ashes.

I'm starting to think you simply just don't understand the game.

This is exactly why this weapon system is dumb. I don't know what knife you are talking about, cause I haven't randomly stumbled upon it, nor does this solve the issue of stones.

 

[MaKTaiL]

This is exactly why this weapon system is dumb. I don't know what knife you are talking about, cause I haven't randomly stumbled upon it, nor does this solve the issue of stones.

Imagine getting mad at an exploration game because you didn't explore enough.

 

[worldwithpyramids]

No other From game has been this generous with upgrade materials… You can literally buy all of them eventually (except the final upgrade material). I played around with many, many weapons in my play through.

Yeah, you can’t just respec infinitely to play every build (at least no easily). This game, like the others before it, is meant to be played multiple times.

 

[Bragr]

you don't need guides common dude.
And ok, you don't have the vendor, but to get a weapon to +6 you need very little materials, did you already spend them all?
You get a shit ton of smithing and somber smithing stones during a playthrough, did you went around upgrading every weapon you picked up?
the whole idea of requiring materials for upgrades is to add some commitment to your upgrades.

If you haven't, go visit the mines on morne and limgrave, those have a shit ton of 1 and 2 stones, enough for 2 weapons at least.
If you want to upgrade a special armament, there is a vendor on your way to the mannor behind some illusory walls, dude is like 10 meters tall, hard to miss.

I upgraded 2 weapons fully to test them, didn't like them at all, now I only have low-level smithing stones. Didn't that giant guy only sell low-level stones?

+ 6 seems low. I already got a +9 weapon, but that's the whole thing here, I should be able to get another good weapon to level 9 without grinding. It's such a mess.

 

[Neff]

You have to commit.

This. The game lets you make many significant choices, but it will hold you to them. It's not a game where you can have it all, and certainly not on a first run. Elden Ring more than any other game from the past 20 years insists that players leave entitlement at the door.

I upgraded 2 weapons fully to test them

Maybe test them first?

 

[Bragr]

Imagine getting mad at an exploration game because you didn't explore enough.

Go and play Far Cry 6 and come back and say the same thing.

 

[Keihart]

I upgraded 2 weapons fully to test them, didn't like them at all, now I only have low-level smithing stones. Didn't that giant guy only sell low-level stones?

+ 6 seems low. I already got a +9 weapon, but that's the whole thing here, I should be able to get another good weapon to level 9 without grinding. It's such a mess.

why "should" you?
you already squandered your resources, you don't need a +20 weapon to "test" it.
you are also not locked out of using other weapons, +6 is plenty for most purposes unless you wanna min max this, in which case , your aproach was pretty dumb upgrading everything under the sun to +20.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

I couldn't do it on my moonveil, or my crystal.

How do I get the smithing stones without grinding?

Moonveil is a boss weapon, as it drops from a boss, crystal as in crystal sword? That's a special type weapon, they are basically the same as boss weapons but just found somehwere.

You don't need smithing stones to change affinities.

 

[Modrot]

Imagine complaining that in a role playing game you have to play and commit to a role.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Go and play Far Cry 6 and come back and say the same thing.

 

[Bragr]

Moonveil is a boss weapon, as it drops from a boss, crystal as in crystal sword? That's a special type weapon, they are basically the same as boss weapons but just found somehwere.

You don't need smithing stones to change affinities.

But I need them to upgrade weapons I wanna try. And if the ashes don't work on any of my weapons, I'm back to square one.

Basically, I would have to read a guide when I started the game to figure this out.

 

[balls of snow]

I would have to show you map because I do not remember locations names but I ended up going east from the starting area due to a teleportation chest.
I found only the flail on the list you provided.

"I don't understand how and why you would explore far off areas as a first step instead of focusing on the starting area. In the starting area alone you can get the best quality weapon in the game (which is also arguably the best weapon in the game due to how OP the L2, R2 combo is), one of the best dex/bleed weapons in the game and one of the best greatswords.

Beyond that literally every merchant you find, including the one at the round table sells strength and dex weapons."

Isn't the whole point of Elden Ring that you can go anywhere? I should have stayed in the area that I walked into and immediately got killed in? Seems a bit odd to me. I ventured out of the starting area, got whacked by the tree guy on the horse. Proceeded to head east(from right after you enter the open world) and then was teleported to somewhere far off in the east. And thats where my journey started. Not Limgrave.

And as I stated earlier, changing weapons made no sense due to the lack of upgrade materials, smithing stones mainly. Buying a new weapon and not having the materials didn't make sense.

Yes you can go anywhere but the game will one shot you if you are in a high level area. Its the dev telling you to go back to where you belong in the pleb area and come back later when youre ready. Maybe From really need to put that level recommended label on the map like ubisoft games.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

And if the ashes don't work on any of my weapons, I'm back to square one.

This is ridiculous hyperbole, you don't have more special/boss weapons than regular ones, don't even try lying.

 

[Keihart]

this gotta be a troll thread.
i refuse to believe OP is this dense.

 

[I collect VHS tapes]

This is exactly why this weapon system is dumb. I don't know what knife you are talking about, cause I haven't randomly stumbled upon it, nor does this solve the issue of stones.

you're the first person I've seen bitch about not finding this item, which is incredibly hard to miss if you spent any time exploring Stormveil Castle, which is the very first legacy dungeon.

the more I talk to you the more I understand why this game isn't for you.

I've literally never seen anyone beg for so much hand holding.

 

[Elder Legend]

I never played a game that has so many barriers for a simple weapon change. I almost feel like I have to restart the entire game just to use a new weapon.

I'm towards the end of the game. I have a weapon I have been using for around 40 hours that is upgraded to + 8 that I am sick and tired of. I want to use a sword that is fast, but any other sword of that nature needs completely different attributes to work. I had to respec all my skills toward an INT focus and use all my smithing stones on it. I did so.

But the new weapon turned out to be disappointing, so I had to respec my character back to the old stats to keep progressing in the game.

I have TONS of weapons, but almost all of them require different player stats, and now I have nowhere near the smithing stones needed to upgrade any one of them to a usable level. I know there are items I can give to the crones so I can buy smithing stones, but it's almost impossible to find them all without guides. Same with the larvae I need for respec, I only have one left.

I either have to use guides (which is like cheating for me) or restart the game so I can re-find enough resources to upgrade a new weapon. It's forcing you to replay massive parts of the game to scrounge for upgrade materials or start the game over.

FromSoftware has been doing stuff like this for a long time, intentionally designing systems in ways that require players to use the internet to find things out, it's free marketing for them if players do that, it's incredibly cheap. But this weapon system right here is complete nonsense. I'm not sure if people are too afraid to call out dumb stuff in excellent games, but this is some bullshit.

If anything Elden Ring and Souls games in general actually motivate you to try out different builds. There are also items you can get that you turn in to a NPC and it let's you buy Infinite amount of all types of Smith stones. Also, you can easily respec your stats too if needed.

But hey, let's not use our brain and start calling the game bad because we have too much of a thick skull.

Perhaps OP you should go play this instead <3

 

[Modrot]

Also if nobody already told you in this thread:

Soulsborne games have incredibly detailed wikis.

So read those before "testing" weapons. Someone has probably already done the maths for you.

Besides, in what world does someone waste mats like that?

 

[Elder Legend]

Also if nobody already told you in this thread:

Soulsborne games have incredibly detailed wikis.

So read those before "testing" weapons. Someone has probably already done the maths for you.

Besides, in what world does someone waste mats like that?

People like the OP unfortunately would...