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[kanjobazooie]

Thanks for ruining Christmas, Jim Ryan.

(I think both titles will still be solid btw. GoW will still be good even if it ran at 30 fps on base PS4)

 

[evanft]

What a joke.

 

[deriks]

Who saw that coming?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Knew it. What a sham that summer show last year was plugging all these games as PS5 only. They knew the whole time.

Horizon 2, God of War Ragnarok, GT7 all cross gen. Only big game that "currently" isn't is R&C.

 

[Dr Bass]

This board is so weird.

 

[ArtemisClydeFrog]

 

[Nobody_Important]

Wait you are telling me they decided to go with the decision that would give them the most profit?



Well I for one am SHOCKED.

 

[Portugeezer]

GoW 1.5 is Coming

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Damn, and that's following the rumors Ragnarok was PS5-only and GT7 also being PS5-only (tho there was that Spanish listing last year for GT7 mentioning PS4).

TBH this isn't a big deal; I think in light of stuff like Horizon: Forbidden West, it should be more than clear last-gen (at this stage of current-gen so far) isn't the limiting factor of what games can do in terms of fidelity, that's down to the developer, their talent and available resources. Sony's teams seem more capable than most in this respect, so it's not really an issue for me.

Plus going by Miles Morales cross-gen isn't stopping the lionshare of sales being on the current-gen systems. While it does mean in terms of certain game design mechanics, FW and GT7 might not be "next-gen", that's really just an assumption and to be perfectly honest there's not much in game mechanics themselves the new systems can do the previous ones can't outside of maybe some SSD features (not every game's gonna need that tho) and seamless cloud integration. Other things like physics and AI logic can be scaled generally well, even if some effort is required.

If I were told Forbidden West was using PS5 as the lead platform, I'd believe it. The only thing WRT this cross-gen stuff I'm still miffed on is the gaming media never issuing apologies for trying to slaughter Microsoft for openly stating commitment for cross-gen back in early-mid 2020; a lot of sensationalism was drummed up in those articles that was never needed (though the somewhat lukewarm presentation of Halo Infinite didn't do much to quell those concerns).

EDIT: Also this might be a reach but I think so many of Sony's 1P for this and next year being cross-gen could help explain why they've been so consistent with 1P releases since launch. Not excusing Microsoft for their lack of consistency in 1P releases for their new systems, but it might be a factor there.

 

[DForce]

What I want to know is why we are getting such diminishing returns in these games? For example. I can argue days gone in ps4 pro looks better than returnal built ground up on ps5, and it also runs at a higher resolution. Returnal is just running at 60fps.

I haven’t seen any generational leaps visually from ps4/pro other than FR and resolution.

8GB ram - 16GB
HDD - SSD
1.8 TF - 10.3 TF

idgi?

Returnal is pushing a lot physics and that's why the resolution is lower. There's also loading involved that can't be handled on base consoles.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Jimbo is a bimbo

 

[Kazza]

I wonder, if the PS4 versions sell really well, maybe they'll just decide to continue supporting the PS4 with cross-gen titles for the entire generation. Then, once PS6 comes around, they will switch to PS5/Ps6 cross-gen titles.

I think it also depends on how low they can get the base PS4's price. If they can get it really cheap ($149 - $200 range), then it may continue to sell well enough to justify continued support. After all, a PS4 game sale nets Sony just as much as a PS5 one, so I don't think they care too much which console it sells for.

 

[mortal]

Hermen Hulst Q&A: What’s Next for PlayStation Studios

Head of PlayStation Studios shares insight into what’s to come.

blog.playstation.com

 

[MrS]

Weak move. Jim deserves to be called out for bullshitting the fans. The fans believe in generations, Sony doesn't.

 

[SlimySnake]

So the dream about seamless travelling between worlds in GoW goes out of the window.
For GT7 it makes sense atleast, ssd doesn't change core gameplay in a racing game. It will be just faster loading, RT, better graphics etc., they can scale that back for PS4.

It's not just seemless loading. they can easily do Spiderman Miles like 1 second loading. It's everything that has to do with gameplay. It will be a last gen game.

Cory talked about how they wanted Kratos and Stranger to throw each other into mountains from one side of the map to the other but the PS4 HDD couldnt do that.

Like wtf is the point of an SSD and I/O when your top of the line studios cant use it.

 

[Dad_Of_Chicken]

The only way to get next-gen exclusive games is for them to first flop on the PS4 so that a cross-gen version wouldn't be too profitable. I'm sure if HZD was a commercial failure, Guerrilla Games' next game would have been next-gen only.

 

[hemo memo]

Sony Japan need to wake the hell up and remove this guy.

 

[driqe]

This.

 

[Renozokii]

I like the "cross gen isn't so bad, just pare it down like its done on PCs" commentary now that Horizon was shown with great visuals + this news, as if that isn't all of us have been saying regarding the Series S, except the Series S has the benefits of near identical CPU and SSD as Series X, unlike the slow HDD and shit CPU of last gen.

No it’s horrible in theory. Understandable due to massive supply constraints but horrible. Horizon looks amazing but GGs next gen only game is going to absolutely blow it out the water. Sony also seems to be doing it where it makes sense. Horizon is by a studio that are technical wizards. Their cross gen game will look better than most current gen only games. Gran turismo is a racing simulator. The only way those games ever really take advantage of hardware is purely visuals. God of war is the only game I’m truly sad is cross gen but the last one sold an insane 20+ million units so i do get them not wanting to butcher sales like that. That’s a third of all Xbox ones currently sold. That’s insane. However they still put out a remake as current gen only to knock our socks off, had a free current gen only game to show what the consoles vision is, and then you have games like ratchet whose core gameplay basis is based on the new hardware that would literally be impossible on the old hardware.

 

[skit_data]

Stupid of them. Completely unnecessary to not announce this at the time of the games announcements.

Now all this ”we believe in generations”-hyperbole start all over again despite its reliance on taking the quote out of context and ignoring the fact that they indeed have released PS5 only games.

Unecessary bad press, they need a better marketing and PR-team at Sony if they wanna avoid stuff like this.

 

[Kusarigama]

It's quite clear that they want to maximize profit for the bigger budget titles by releasing them on PS4 as well. Games like Returnal, Demon's Souls and Ratchet and Clank aren't of the higher budget so making them exclusive to next generation doesn't affect profit margin so much. Really disappointed that GoW Ragnarok is going cross Gen though.

 

[Reindeer]

.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

Nothing wrong with that. The "We believe in generations" statement was very accurate, people just had the wrong interpretation.


This is Jim Ryan giving more players the freedom to play the games.

 

[Camreezie]

you guys owe me and Phil an apology.

last year i said crossing a generation takes a few years. Phil words got trolled non stop.

But no, you just believed the jimbo hype and made fun of the reality we spoke of.

When phil delivers a good game he will get his apologies. It's been 7 years and people are still swinging from his nuts

 

[GuinGuin]

probably the sense of speed in a racing game?

You think the speed of the SSD will affect the sense of speed in a racing game? LMAO.

 

[Renozokii]

This.

Jesus Christ Microsoft must have saw this news and got their wallets out immediately for good press. If, for the rest of this year, all Sony’s games were cross gen and all Microsoft’s games were current gen only, PlayStation would still have more current gen only games.

 

[phat_crazy]

Damn, and that's following the rumors Ragnarok was PS5-only and GT7 also being PS5-only (tho there was that Spanish listing last year for GT7 mentioning PS4).

TBH this isn't a big deal; I think in light of stuff like Horizon: Forbidden West, it should be more than clear last-gen (at this stage of current-gen so far) isn't the limiting factor of what games can do in terms of fidelity, that's down to the developer, their talent and available resources. Sony's teams seem more capable than most in this respect, so it's not really an issue for me.

Plus going by Miles Morales cross-gen isn't stopping the lionshare of sales being on the current-gen systems. While it does mean in terms of certain game design mechanics, FW and GT7 might not be "next-gen", that's really just an assumption and to be perfectly honest there's not much in game mechanics themselves the new systems can do the previous ones can't outside of maybe some SSD features (not every game's gonna need that tho) and seamless cloud integration. Other things like physics and AI logic can be scaled generally well, even if some effort is required.

If I were told Forbidden West was using PS5 as the lead platform, I'd believe it. The only thing WRT this cross-gen stuff I'm still miffed on is the gaming media never issuing apologies for trying to slaughter Microsoft for openly stating commitment for cross-gen back in early-mid 2020; a lot of sensationalism was drummed up in those articles that was never needed (though the somewhat lukewarm presentation of Halo Infinite didn't do much to quell those concerns).

Everyone keeps talking graphics. It's also the "scope" of what they can do in terms of gameplay, mechanics, and ideas. These will be limited because they will always have to keep the PS4 in mind. Instead of GOW taking advantage of the SSD to its fullest, the set pieces/sequences will be limited by the PS4. No matter how amazing they look, we will always know they would have been tens of magnitudes more amazing if they were PS5 only since the PS4 is so damn weak.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Now waiting for Returnal, Demons Souls and R&C to get a PS4 version too.

One thing's for sure for everyone to remember going forward:

"We believe in generations" and PR shows showing key games only for one system (like PS5) means absolutely nothing to exclusive console games.

In the back of your mind, make sure to always remember a Sony game can always be cross gen no matter what they PR.

But hey the PR worked. Many PS5 gamers thought these key games would be PS5 only. And many still will unless they read up on a post on Sony's PS Blog tab.

 

[Dad_Of_Chicken]

Also what's with these cross-gen announcements hidden in blog posts? Cmon Sony, you're better than this.

 

[SlimySnake]

At least Xbox was honest about their approach

Actually they werent entirely honest. They havent released a single cross gen game so far this generation. Halo is going to be the only one. everything else they have shown in CG form is likely to be 2-3 years away and will be next gen only.

they just didnt have any games for the first two years and used the cross gen excuse to get around it.

both lied, but Sony's lies are worse because Jimbo jumped on that quote from Phil to earn some internet cred while forcing his studios behind the scenes to make last gen games.

 

[Skifi28]

This.

I'd like to see that quote saying "all future games will be ps5 only" but I don't think it exists.

 

[Holammer]

There's a good PS4 install base and with the current chip shortages (which will last for years btw) making PS5 production difficult.
With such circumstances, staying cross-gen is a smart idea. I wonder if all those games were intended as PS5 only titles from the start and they just recently adjusted strategy on the fly.

 

[Sealord of Braavos]

Sneaky Sony strikes again. Good to see that even the SonyGaf stalwarts are unloading on ”We Believe in Generations” Jim Ryan and Sony with both barrels. There IS a limit to militant fanboyism it would seem.

People ridicule Phil Spencer a ton but I’d rather have him at the head of a gaming division any day of the week.

And this news officially puts on indefinite hold any desire I had to try and track down a PS5 which would be my first Sony console.

 

[Tommi84]

Goddamit Jim!! I believed in generations just as you!!

 

[Calverz]

 

[Andodalf]

Also what's with these cross-gen announcements hidden in blog posts? Cmon Sony, you're better than this.

Lol no they aren’t

 

[e&e]

Also remember guys, Series S is HOLDING NEXT GEN BACK!

At least Xbox was honest about their approach

A million times this! MS should get kudos for not flubbing their message! Still mad at no actual Next Gen games in the first year of a console release though!

 

[JerryinSoCal]

"We believe in generations"

Returnal, Demon's Souls remake and R&C say hello. Don't forget in that same interview Ryan also said they'd continue to support the PS4 for years to come he NEVER said they wouldn't make cross-gen games.

 

[skit_data]

I remember saying how GT7 looks cross gen and wasn't all that visually impressive yet all the usual suspects laughed it off and pretended it was a next gen only title. If GAF taught me anything over the course of this next gen debacle, it's that people can lose all their common sense and reasoning in pursuit of their agenda.

How did you identify it as ”looking cross gen”?

It’s a racing game, I seriously have no idea what in the games design would indicate its a true next gen only game outside of ray-tracing and higher res textures. Both of which were present in the gameplay demo we saw last year.

 

[Hosam6xavi]

We believe in generation only for 6 months to push Sales

 

[MrS]

The more I think about it, the worse it gets. So many games gonna be fucked over by the PS4 tech. Hate to see it.

 

[NeonDelta]

If I’d known this 6 months ago I’d have kept my ps4 pro and not bothered with a ps5

 

[Faithless83]

PS4 is the Sony XSS ffs.
Thank you China.

Edit: They can't go full PS5, due to the components/hardware shortage. So to cope with development costs, they'll have to consider the PS4 port. Hopefully, it will end up with these titles and the graphic leap better be huge between them.

 

[DenchDeckard]

What the actual fuck. I'm convinced they are going to make demons souls and ratchet for ps4 somehow.

 

[Zones]

What I want to know is why we are getting such diminishing returns in these games? For example. I can argue days gone in ps4 pro looks better than returnal built ground up on ps5, and it also runs at a higher resolution. Returnal is just running at 60fps.

I haven’t seen any generational leaps visually from ps4/pro other than FR and resolution.

8GB ram - 16GB
HDD - SSD
1.8 TF - 10.3 TF

idgi?

Same thing for The Medium, and the answer is simple...

Next gen advancement is especially good for making the process of game development faster and easier, and this is especially imperative for small / inexperienced studios that don't have a large workforce which can optimize (and sometimes brute force) their games for the last gen consoles.

Returnal, The Medium and even Demon's Souls remake are small budget games (no matter how hard Sony tries to tell you that Returnal is AAA) and I imagine if something like Returnal was set to be also released on PS4/Pro, then the frame rate had to be halved (which would impact the feel of the gameplay negatively) and the development time might have needed an extra year.

Best example is RDR2, that game's open world interactivity level on a Jaguar CPU will remain more advanced than possibly any other full blown next gen title we will be seeing in the next few years, and that's something Rockstar can afford to make it happen through sheer talent and workforce, but smaller devs who want to create something impressive in shorter period of time will likely need to opt for a next gen only release.

 

[Mr Moose]

Cross gen is NOT normal stop trying to normalize it

Like I'd listen to a Sherlock Holmes villain.
MLB is one, just off the top of my head. I am sure there's plenty more.

Sucks that the new God of War will be cross-gen, I know it'll look amazing because the last one did on PS4 but still, a bit shitty.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

sony is beyond stupid making gt7 crossgen but explain why it looks so similar to gt sport

 

[Burythelight]

Now waiting for Returnal, Demons Souls and R&C to get a PS4 version too.

One thing's for sure for everyone to remember going forward:

"We believe in generations" and PR shows showing key games only for one system (like PS5) means absolutely nothing to exclusive console games.

In the back of your mind, make sure to always remember a Sony game can always be cross gen no matter what they PR.

But hey the PR worked. Many PS5 gamers thought these key games would be PS5 only. And many still will unless they read up on a post on Sony's PS Blog tab.

Yeah dream on.

 

[Banjo64]

This.

The funny thing is only Halo and Forza Horizon 5 look to be cross gen for Xbox.

Avowed, Everwild, Forza Motorsport 8, Perfect Dark, Fable, Hellblade 2 are all next gen only and even Starfield if rumoured to be next gen only.

 

[Bruno_Arrais85]

who cares. GoW 2 will be a GOTY.