sublimit
Banned
Says the person who has his post history hidden! lol Have a nice day hypocrite.
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Microsoft is finally clarifying the situation regarding future Bethesda games
- Thread starter KyoZz
- Start date
SoloKingRobert
Banned
Reality Czar
Banned
You were wrong? Has MS released a new game yet? Or you are writing this message from the future?
Starfield
Member
They've made it very clear what their intention is. They just didn't want to straight out say "lol sony won't get our games anymore" bc that would be unproffessional to do so. However what's done is done.
ESO, F76 and other live service titles will still play a part on Playstation in the future. Deathloop and Ghostwire obviously too (and all other games we don't know of where Sony may have a contract with bethesda, don't think theres other games though).
Everything else will be exclusive for Gamepass. This is the vision behind this whole deal. To get more people to subscribe. netflix, amazon prime, they all do the same. If some people STILL don't understand this then I think they never will.
time to buy a PC/Xbox
Bernd Lauert
Banned
I thought I'd enjoy the meltdowns but so far it's mostly been just pretty sad.
Shmunter
Member
They said “some” will be exclusive. New ip’s and some existing ones will definitely be Xbox only.
Massive legacy franchises with long history and huge fan bases will be cross platform. This also doesn’t mean they will be “day one” on PS5.
Keeping in mind exclusive is also valid in terms of getting something “first”, exclusive doesn’t ever imply a timeframe. A news exclusive is only exclusive till it’s reported by another outlet. In gaming terms referred to as “timed” exclusive. Still exclusive.
There’s nothing more to be said here. Phil’s doublespeak is legendary, and those with a predisposition to such language take comfort in seeing what they like. That’s what it’s designed to do.
I don’t find it impossible to navigate, I’m familiar with this.
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SaucyJack
Member
I think the reason why people thought this is fairly obvious. The caveat to all of this is that MS are a very rich company that has the resources to do whatever the fuck they want ...... but:
- individual divisions within MS still need to show a return on investments.
- getting a return on a $7.5 billion investment is a serious matter
- Zenimax going exclusive I would imagine turns the company loss making due to loss of revenue, games still cost money to make. Gamepass takes further revenue away from those sales
- getting an appropriate ROI on that $7.5 bn would need them to be selling an extraordinary number of additional consoles with full priced Gamepass subs (think in the order of an extra 10 million)
Now you can nit pick the detail of you want, but it doesn’t detract from the larger point that ceteris paribus the numbers on the Zenimax deal do not add up as an exclusive/Gamepass play and this is why people are sceptical. “Phil says” isnt evidence because Phil says a lot of things, not always consistent and not always what it seems at face value.
Now MS could take the Zenimax assets a different way and not just operate them as they are today, after all those studios are pretty far from prolific in their output and there are franchises that could be milked. They could also go a lower cost, more game as a service mtx route - which I think is inevitable in the Gamepass model anyway.
That’s not to say that MS can’t just spunk $7.5 billion, because they can.
My best guess just now is that they will go mostly exclusive, but the numbers will be terrible. I also don’t believe Gamepass subs will hold up over time when people have to start paying full price for it.
The problem with all these things is that they're just entirely based on presumptions, which have then been stretched out to "Huh, guess it doesn't make sense then."
We know interest rates are low, so we know big companies will be looking to spend money. We know the Zenimax purchase will one day pay for itself, because we know how successful individual titles have been. When? Not our concern.
Zenimax going exclusive (you imagine) making a loss just isn't based on fact. They were already going current-gen only, so the 100m+ PS4 owners aren't a consideration. If Starfield releases this year, that's, what? 10m PS5 owners vs, let's say 7m Xbox owners, and then the might of PC and perhaps some cloud as well. The second is the bigger total by a long way.
Your last point presumes they need to make a direct return on investment this generation, this decade, before 2050. Who knows? There's no way of us knowing what the targets are internally, but presuming the worst case scenario and using it as proof of PS5 releases was never a safe bet to make.
I'm not arguing your points to be a dick or to debate you, because these have been going on since September. My point is just that a lot of these arguments were passed around by people who will lose out on Bethesda games, and that they were passed around as gospel despite not really standing up.
It boiled down to "$7.5b is a lot of money", and no more nuance or thought was given to it.
Respect, it's honorable
HelpYouFall
Member
I can't believe how many people are still in denial about this. Vomit on their sweater, moms spaghetti lol
Gamepass is insane value for its money even more so now. Absolutely crazy. Both consoles are great this gen, what a time to be alive.
Gamepass is insane value for its money even more so now. Absolutely crazy. Both consoles are great this gen, what a time to be alive.
Umbasaborne
Banned
I cant wait to pick up days gone on steam, its gonna go great with horizon zero dawn and bloodborne eventually....
No, again no and he clearfield better about exclusivity for this exact reason people like to spin. You did not saw the video of the xcast that i showed you right?
Trainsmove
Banned
Why not Sony does it all the time! Plus there only A few PS5 out as of right now not 60%.
Shmunter
Member
Not yet, but I will so I’m strictly going on the official statement for now.
Now in saying that, it could all be a clever double cross by Phil. A ruse designed to abstain from an anti-consumer blowback that would surely eventuate if he were forthright about ring fencing it all.
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SpecialAgentZ
Member
I shouldn't, and I didn't.
I'm coming from PC. Good 15 years of PC gaming. I love PC. But this gen, consoles have better Cost x Performance, be it a PS5 or a Series X.
I wont pay more than double the money of a Xbox on a equivalent PC, dude. ~850 USD for the Xbox Series X here, 2k USD for a equivalent PC IF you can find a good GPU for sale. The prices of PC parts skyrocketed. And I personally can't see the appeal of a Playstation. The best combination nowadays, the way I see, is Xbox + Switch, not PC + Playstation, the reasons being library and cost.
And I must say, PC isn't the same as console gaming. After years of PC gaming, I must say I'm playing way more on Xbox than I used to play on PC. Power on, play, no intrusive stuff in the way, no need to launch any store, no need to click with the mouse anywhere, to type anything into the keyboard before picking up my controller, nothing. Just power on, select the game and play.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
Literally the same. I was always PC mustard race, have been playing on PC since 2002. I also had consoles but mostly for exclusives and I always bitched about 30 fps and controller aiming.
The current situation on the PC market made me buy an XSX day one. And since the crpyto craze doesn't seem to be stopping anytime soon, there's literally no way to buy a PC at a decent price for the foreseeable future. Fuck that noise, I'm sticking to console gaming for now. My laptop is there for nice, undemanding PC games like Loop Hero.
Maxwell Jacob Friedman
leads to fear. Fear leads to xbox.
Have a feeling ES6 will drop on ps5. It was announced when, and most likely the contract for said game was signed a long while ago when starting production. ES7 is prob the start of exclusivityFear not. Even if TES6 never drops on PS5, I will create a Khajiit with a striking resemblance to you.
Do you think that publishers sign a contract with platform holders for multiplatform gamers? Unless you think there is a marketing contract?
Shmunter
Member
Quite right, there would be nothing binding
Kagey K
Banned
Probably looks like this.
IOU 1 vidya game
Signed
Game Dev
That way they can get sued into oblivion when a game falls apart or gets cancelled.
AmateurPong
Member
Must be a good CDPR joke in here.
Darlingcognito
Member
Hell yeah don't give them a single bloody thing.
driqe
Member
They got their PCs back?!?!
Bittermich
Banned
salty af.
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SaucyJack
Member
I know a lot of trash has been talked in relation to this acquisition, and I’m not defending any of that. I’m not saying anything is gospel, just responding to the question of why do some people think games might remain multi-platform. Doesn’t mean they’re right, but also doesn’t mean that the question is wrong either. The Mojang deal is a reasonable parallel, at face value it looked expensive but they’ve made it work by keeping it available to every platform known to man and milking the fuck out of it.
The fact of the matter is that that $7.5 billion IS a lot of money, MSFT IS a public company and you can still make reasonable assumptions about the economics of a deal.
We do not know that the Zenimax deal will pay for itself, it may not. It may be a spectacular failure. These things happen. It has happened to MSFT before.
And whilst we don’t now exactly what period MSFT expect a return on their specific investment in Zenimax we do know generally - from their annual financial statements - what they would typically expect and it’s 5-6 years for this type of investment, so yes this generation is probably the best guess.
We also don't know exactly what Zenimax's financials were pre-acquisition as they were a private company but we do know that the majority of the sales of their major recent titles were on PS - e.g. something in the order of 58% of Fallout 4 sales were on PS4. It IS an assumption, but not a wild one, that losing half your sales might be just enough to flip you into loss making territory.
Microsoft will do whatever they choose to do, they have that luxury, but if the numbers suck there will be consequences.
Interfectum
Member
Majukun
Member
on a way it's good that games like fallout and elder scrolls will now get the "exclusive" treatment, so hopefully they will get all the funds and time they need to be what they are meant to be.
on another side microsoft doesn't have the right the best tracking in terms of exclusives...they really need to step up their game in this regard.
on another side microsoft doesn't have the right the best tracking in terms of exclusives...they really need to step up their game in this regard.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
As I've been trying to stress, the chief advantage of ownership is flexibility. Its going to be another situation like the "we don't believe in generations" line, which some fanboys thought of as holy writ although in reality was no more than a general indicator of their actual plans. Same deal with Jim Ryan's counter-statement about Sony's plans.
These enterprises are far too expensive, risky, and have far too many moving parts to ever be summed in totality by single glib soundbites and PR statements.
Basically PR/marketing exists to try and smooth over the complexities of business operation, yet so many posters seem unable to discern the difference between the two. Its kinda sad because it really drags down the discussion.
phil_t98
#SonyToo
There advantage is also to keep the game for yourself and get people onto your eco system
supraman1120
Member
18 million gamepass subs as of January. Conservatively at $5/month average, that is about $90M/month, which equates to about $1.1B/year. If Gamepass were to hit 25 million subs next year, they'd conservatively be taking in about 1.5B/year. Then you add in the individual game sales, and it's really not a stretch to think they could fully recoup this investment in under 5 years at these subscriber numbers.
Whats far more likely is that these sub numbers explode with exclusivity, and they have a recoupmeny path in less than 3 years.
Andodalf
Banned
He knows that the phrase "Platforms where Gamepass Exists" but he has to be vague anyway. The lady who skyped in talked about GP coming to more "Smart Screens" (Read Iphones, PC Browser, and TVs), and he's almost certainly implying Switch as well. He 100% put his switch on his self for a reason.
The Unforeseen
Neo Member
Nice, this was always in the cards, but good to get some clarity. There is still a smidgen of vagueness with the whole legacy thing, but overall its clear this will be more or less like any other first-party.
Basically the two Sony timed exclusive deals will be 'honoured', though likely they didn't really have a choice here, and current ongoing titles will remain and be supported going forward. The only things that can be picked apart is the future obligations thing and the legacy content. Future contractual obligations is thought by many to refer to Indiana Jones, and that is likely, or something else we haven't heard about that they can't get around even if they wanted to. The legacy thing ive heard some suggest could simply be referring to the current ongoing games as legacy content, but that would have been him repeating himself and seems more likely to be about games with history on a platform. This is where the 'Well, see still vague, Elder Scrolls, Doom and Fallout on PS confirmed suckers' comes from. They don't really have much PS specific legacy though in my mind, and if he did mean those games were going to PS I doubt he'd have worded it in this manner. Majority of games though will be 'gamepass' exclusive from here on out, which from a console gamer's perspective, at least for this gen id have thought, means an Xbox exclusive.
Basically the two Sony timed exclusive deals will be 'honoured', though likely they didn't really have a choice here, and current ongoing titles will remain and be supported going forward. The only things that can be picked apart is the future obligations thing and the legacy content. Future contractual obligations is thought by many to refer to Indiana Jones, and that is likely, or something else we haven't heard about that they can't get around even if they wanted to. The legacy thing ive heard some suggest could simply be referring to the current ongoing games as legacy content, but that would have been him repeating himself and seems more likely to be about games with history on a platform. This is where the 'Well, see still vague, Elder Scrolls, Doom and Fallout on PS confirmed suckers' comes from. They don't really have much PS specific legacy though in my mind, and if he did mean those games were going to PS I doubt he'd have worded it in this manner. Majority of games though will be 'gamepass' exclusive from here on out, which from a console gamer's perspective, at least for this gen id have thought, means an Xbox exclusive.
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Gamers whose egos boost +100000 pts by knowing a video game can only be played on their piece of plastic. They are among an "exclusive club of millions of other gamers" with the same hardware who feel like shit when random people half way around the world play the same game.
The same people who arent fans of cross play either because playing against other people or simply keeping an online community alive by combining users bases into one pool is ranked less important than exclusive games on plastic boxes.
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Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Not a chance. Less than zero.
Zenimax were making ~$500m per year profit from their entire multiplatform operation including legacy product.
Not to mention that you cannot attribute all GamePass revenue/growth solely to Zenimax titles, which by your own estimation adds a total of 7m users in a year. A formulation that further needs to resolve some impact on sales of physical/digital product lost due to inclusion on GP.
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Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
I remember when we were called fanboys and laughed off for stating the obvious.
He also said that he can't state the obvious until the acquisition has finished because it is illegal for him.
Chessmate
Banned
How the tables have turned. No Playstation threads on Gaf anymore, it's all Xbox. If something Sony related pops up, it's about some lies that have been revealed or the shut down of a legendary studio.
In the midst of these unprecedented times we, the gaming community, should stand united as one. And provide shelter to those poor refugees that flee the dark place they were trapped in for so long.
But make no mistake. Those who continue to worship this false god, will be hunted down and brought to justice.
In the midst of these unprecedented times we, the gaming community, should stand united as one. And provide shelter to those poor refugees that flee the dark place they were trapped in for so long.
But make no mistake. Those who continue to worship this false god, will be hunted down and brought to justice.
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Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
Just buy a PC and you can enjoy every Xbox and Playstation game. No need for consoles now, right?
Mister Wolf
Member
That's because its still the denial phase. This Summer when Spencer has a shit eating grin after announcing Starfield as exclusive its going to turn into anger.
Reality Czar
Banned
Someone should tell Microsoft that they are currently allowing their "exclusive" franchises to all be played on PS Now.
You know, since they are soooo concerned about exclusivity for GP.
Kind of weird, isn't it? That they would buy Bethesda solely to have these games exclusively be on GP, then let them keep being on PS Now?
Certainly an innovative approach to "exclusivity"
You know, since they are soooo concerned about exclusivity for GP.
Kind of weird, isn't it? That they would buy Bethesda solely to have these games exclusively be on GP, then let them keep being on PS Now?
Certainly an innovative approach to "exclusivity"
Interfectum
Member
Are you stupid? Honest question because if so I won't judge you for this awful post.Someone should tell Microsoft that they are currently allowing their "exclusive" franchises to all be played on PS Now.
You know, since they are soooo concerned about exclusivity for GP.
Kind of weird, isn't it? That they would buy Bethesda solely to have these games exclusively be on GP, then let them keep being on PS Now?
Certainly an innovative approach to "exclusivity"
Mister Wolf
Member
Someone should tell Microsoft that they are currently allowing their "exclusive" franchises to all be played on PS Now.
You know, since they are soooo concerned about exclusivity for GP.
Kind of weird, isn't it? That they would buy Bethesda solely to have these games exclusively be on GP, then let them keep being on PS Now?
Certainly an innovative approach to "exclusivity"
Definition of CONTRACT
a binding agreement between two or more persons or parties; especially : one legally enforceable; a business arrangement for the supply of goods or services at a fixed price; the act of marriage or an agreement to marry… See the full definition
www.merriam-webster.com
Orta
Banned
Someone should tell Microsoft that they are currently allowing their "exclusive" franchises to all be played on PS Now.
You know, since they are soooo concerned about exclusivity for GP.
Kind of weird, isn't it? That they would buy Bethesda solely to have these games exclusively be on GP, then let them keep being on PS Now?
Certainly an innovative approach to "exclusivity"
Cool. Make the most of it whilst you can, because you'll be getting absolutely fuck all from them as the months go by
THE DUCK
voted poster of the decade by bots
Someone should tell Microsoft that they are currently allowing their "exclusive" franchises to all be played on PS Now.
You know, since they are soooo concerned about exclusivity for GP.
Kind of weird, isn't it? That they would buy Bethesda solely to have these games exclusively be on GP, then let them keep being on PS Now?
Certainly an innovative approach to "exclusivity"
Seriously, it's called a contract, one that was signed well before the deal was finalized. Once the timing is expired, its done for good.
Maybe read just a little before a post like this.
SaucyJack
Member
the voodoo economics in relation to Gamepass on this forum is quite something.
Bladed Thesis
Member
Goddamn. Absolute legend.
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