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[VideoGameEnjoyer]

I said this before but I had hoped ND would have gotten rid of the zombies in part 2.

How would that have worked?

 

[arkhamguy123]

Yeeeeah I hate to be this guy but I still think the game is woke garbage and a giant miss.

Look, I get the themes, I get the message, it’s bold. It’s daring. No doubt. But bold =\= brilliant. Not automatically. They took a risk I’ll give them that, and delivered great MGSV tier stealth action gameplay, genuinely masterful and tear jerking emotional beats, and a halfway decent script. Better than a lot of modern movies.

But unfortunately it completely fails to capture the magic of the first game in any way to me personally. It has this pretentious air of “wannabe prestige TV show” the whole way through just about. Neil druckmann, literally has verbally stated he has an “agenda” (read: “progressive agenda”) and uhhh, well not like he ever had to because anyone who plays this game can see that clear as day. You can have an progressive agenda I’m all for that but it shouldn’t come at the cost of good storytelling. The pacing is atrocious and the game drags on sooooo long. It’s not even consequential at a certain point. I remember I stopped resource hunting and upgrading as Abby towards the end of her part because I knew it wouldn’t mean shit 1-2 hours from now and I’d go back to Ellie. It all just seems for naught. It’s nihilistic. It’s depressing. It’s gloom. It’s just misery porn at a certain point.

There’s nothing for me to attach myself too or get invested in or root for or ANYTHING except, the Joel and Ellie flashbacks. Which were extra frustrating because it was Neil saying “yeah I could’ve made the sequel the fans would’ve liked but I would not waste my time with such mass market drivel, no I, an auteur, will instead tell this much more mature revenge is bad lesbian fan fiction story”. Like cmon man. Bruce Straley or whatever was the unsung hero of TLOU1 I guess

 

[Warablo]

The gameplay was good, but the flashbacks into flashbacks were annoying. Especially in the mid point. The change of heart from Tommy was strange too. Also turned Ellie into a bitch.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Spoiler: Spoiler

Hope they bring Abby BACK.

 

[NinjaBoiX]

It was absolutely astonishing to play through, every aspect (apart from perhaps pacing) felt like they nailed what they were going for. I think even the saltiest of haters couldn’t argue that mechanically and technically speaking it’s in a league of its own in the genre.

And even the story (that came in for the most flack) held up in the main for me, and had me asking moral questions that are rare in video games, although perhaps not quite as impactful as that exquisite ending to the first game.

I guess I can empathise with the haters a little regarding THAT massive story beat at the start, but even those more realistic complaints ring hollow bearing in mind how often similar things happen in movies and tv shows.

But the “lol muscle girl, virtue signaling, why so woke, blah blah”, bore off.

 

[Winter John]

How would that have worked?

I just thought the zombie shit is unnecessary. It was fine for the first game but to me the zombies don’t really add anything. Other people probably like them sections but I thought they were a real drag

 

[T4keD0wN]

Three years after its release, nothing has come close to the experience this game gave me. Nothing that is even in the same realm in terms of mechanics, gunplay, crafting, story, music, characters, art design, set pieces. And although many graphically impressive games have come out, neither of them were visually as impactful to me as Part II was. The moment I was riding with Joel in that intro through the country grass, I immediatly realized this game was going to be something else; and once I finished Abby Day 3, I knew that games like these come out once every decade or so.

Every single game that I have played since have felt dull, underwhelming, uninspiring, just not up that level. Part I was very good, but it feels so basic in level design and melee, and Abby Schwarzenegger is not in it. I thought RE 4 Remake was going to reignite the flame, but as much as I like the game, it just feels clunky and outdated to play when compared to Part II.

I can't even be excited anymore by new important releases (like Spidey 2, for example), because I know they won't be that special (hope to be proven wrong, though). So I keep coming back to Part II, playing it at least monthly, waiting for the day they confirm Part III and hopefuly, go for a game that is as bold and badass as the second entry was.

Spoiler: Spoiler

Hope they bring Abby BACK.

Part 1 was cool as a prequel to Abbys story, hopefully the next game can be exclusively focused on her.
I know Tlou pt2 is great and all, but my man there are still many amazing and even better games out there that reach much greater highs today, you need to pick up PowerWash Simulator.
WWE 2K23 has Rhea Ripley as a playable character, it might be relevant to your interests.

 

[JonSnowball]

Here's a game with a better story and better gameplay than TLOU Pt II.

 

[EruditeHobo]

It’s a fantastic game. Abby is a great character

Yeah, it's incredible.

But the “lol muscle girl, virtue signaling, why so woke, blah blah”, bore off.

There are few better ways for someone to outright tell on themselves than adopting this kind of statement in summary of something as epic and great as TLOU2. I mean, what more needs to be said? That being someone's takeaway very obviously says a lot about them, and almost nothing about the actual game.

But what can you do? Too bad for them! Some people are always gonna have weird biases getting in the way of enjoying great shit. Their loss. It's a masterpiece of course... but I guess they'll just have to aggressively not feel that way based on their terrible opinions. If that brings them joy, that's fine for them.

And the world moves on!

 

[Draugoth]

I never heard of a game called Part II

What's Part I about?

 

[Woggleman]

Truly a great game in my view but there are plenty of other great games.

 

[Killer8]

Still waiting for it to be a PS+ free monthly game.

 

[SteadyEvo]

The most brutal and realistic combat in gaming history

 

[NinjaBoiX]

Yeah, it's incredible.



There are fewer better ways for someone to tell on themselves than adopt this in kind of statement in summary of something as epic and great as TLOU2 -- I mean, what more needs to be said? That being someone's takeaway very obviously says much, much more about them and almost nothing about the actual game.

But what can you do? Too bad for them. It's a masterpiece... but I guess they'll just have to aggressively not feel that way based on their terrible opinions.

Yeah, I’ve got to be honest I get strong neckbeard vibes from some of those comments.

“Why is the main character not really fit? Why did they make her so challenging to my fragile constitution? lol, she’s built like a dude.”

And don’t even get my started on that big story point that others threw a tantrum about. I thought it was outstanding, I couldn’t believe I was experiencing such ballsy storytelling in a video game. An absolutely staggering way to flip the script right at the start, I was floored by it.

 

[EruditeHobo]

Don't know if there's ever been an example of better, bolder, more interesting characterization. In the whole medium.

Couldn't agree with you more on this, NinjaBoiX .

 

[Pasta la Vista]

It’s gloom. It’s just misery porn at a certain point.

This became my main issue with this game. It just depresses the fuck out of me.

 

[Hero_Select]

Part 2 also ruined gaming for me for a while too OP.

I couldn't believe how badly they fucked up the story that I stopped playing games for a while.

 

[Pedro Motta]

Part II runied ND to me. i just had a conversation yesterday with a friend...yep the storytelling still sucks..

Orr maybe, just maybe, you have no idea what is storytelling.

 

[FoxMcChief]

I’m mad at myself for never completing it. Not the games fault. Something else took my attention away from it and I never went back.

Now I’m just waiting for a remaster.

 

[T-0800]

Part II runied ND to me. i just had a conversation yesterday with a friend...yep the storytelling still sucks..

If you skip all the cutscenes you are still left with a fantastic playing game.

 

[NinjaBoiX]

This became my main issue with this game. It just depresses the fuck out of me.

I’ve got to be honest, I can totally agree with this, although maybe not quite to the extent of “misery porn”, suggesting it was bleak for shock value.

But yeah, it IS a very bleak game, and I’d be lying if I said it didn’t become a little overwhelming at times. But, it kind of had to be given the subject matter.

 

[Optimus Lime]

Oh yeah. I liked it a lot. The whining about how woke it is was something I never really got. I just had fun sitting inside on rainy weekends and mashing buttons to kill zombies. It didn't change my life or anything though, the only game that did that was Wolfenstein 3D with the sex wallpaper mods.

 

[Pasta la Vista]

I’ve got to be honest, I can totally agree with this, although maybe not quite to the extent of “misery porn”, suggesting it was bleak for shock value.

But yeah, it IS a very bleak game, and I’d be lying if I said it didn’t become a little overwhelming at times. But, it kind of had to be given the subject matter.

Yeah I get it, but it just made me realize that I can't play games like that. As I've become older I am much more sensitive to things like cruelty towards people and animals.
I mean I can still play and enjoy a game like say Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal, but those are demons and more "cartoony".

 

[DForce]

Great game. I hope they're making a part III.

 

[peronmls]

I can't wait to play it to see what's going on. I never really cared for the game anyway so maybe I won't care regardless. I'm just going to casually play it.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

It was absolutely astonishing to play through, every aspect (apart from perhaps pacing) felt like they nailed what they were going for. I think even the saltiest of haters couldn’t argue that mechanically and technically speaking it’s in a league of its own in the genre.

And even the story (that came in for the most flack) held up in the main for me, and had me asking moral questions that are rare in video games, although perhaps not quite as impactful as that exquisite ending to the first game.

I guess I can empathise with the haters a little regarding THAT massive story beat at the start, but even those more realistic complaints ring hollow bearing in mind how often similar things happen in movies and tv shows.

But the “lol muscle girl, virtue signaling, why so woke, blah blah”, bore off.

I have a lot of criticisms with the pacing and narrative structure. Lol muscle girl definitely fits in there, somewhere, but for more reasons than solely physical depiction. Some of the biggest issues to me are characters not feeling consistent to their past appearances, and the fact that the game's narrative frame is so diametrically opposed to the first's that it feels like it was either A. Written by completely different people or B. Purposefully made so in order to be some kind of thematic opposite to the first title.

It's the only way I can explain the presence of certain scene frames. In Part I, you have the whole Firefly immunity operation rampage hoopla. You have a clear and set moral dilemma, and two characters you're well invested in on opposing ends of the argument. It was vague (which is hard to keep up with a sequel, to be fair), punchy, it gave the player something to brainstorm, think about, discuss and debate with others about. It was fucking brilliant. Part II is the ramification to Part I's events. Cool, that's a logical, linear story set up. It deals with and references events from Part I quite frequently. But something is off. It's somehow lit more menacingly, the opponents from the first game are now the victims of the second, main characters are demeaning, downplaying and villifying events that were framed from the protagonist point of view in the first title.

Now, I'm not bitching about pro golf or my super neat dad power fantasy, and I'm not dense - I understand that the point of view is from different characters with different relations to those events now, hence the different outlook. What fucks me up is it immediately throws off the player. I know Neil Druckman makes experiences or whatever and it's not supposed to be fun or comfy, but there's Colonel AI in MGS2 kinds of uncomfortable, and there's just...tonally dissonant uncomfortable. I'd argue that this wasn't artistic-intentional, and more just a sign of not so great writing.

I know, I know. Different characters, different perspective. But like....why start the game from Joel's p.o.v. for literally 3 and a half minutes if he's going to recap the first game with music and visuals that make him look like a base lunatic, then immediately shift the entire rest of the narrative to people who spend the game hating him and reinforcing that frame of view?

Another issue tied into the above is the fact that I have no emotional throughline. The heart of the story has been essentially explanted and I have no reason to care, anymore. Every other relationship in this game doesn't begin to approach what was masterfully crafted in the first game between the two leads. My only issue with the golfing is that it takes fascinating potential character scenes and interesting drama Away from two characters I give a shit about and replaces it with...this meandering fever dream of dread and misery that just kind of ends with no discernible climax or closure. It feels Art house but surface level.

But also yes. Muscular women and pregnant lesbian archery targets do make me horribly uncomfortable with my masculinity and I have to return to my /r/incels throwaway to smile again.

 

[DrFigs]

There's really not any other game that takes risks with storytelling like it did.

 

[avin]

So I keep coming back to Part II, playing it at least monthly, waiting for the day they confirm Part III and hopefuly, go for a game that is as bold and badass as the second entry was.

Like some others here, I wondered if you were trolling, but "playing it at least monthly" is where I realized you were likely genuine, or else a phenomenal, brilliant troll. Unlike you, I come back to it every single day, weeping large tears of sadness at the genius on display, but I'm just not a very good troll.

avin

 

[NinjaBoiX]

the fact that the game's narrative frame is so diametrically opposed to the first's that it feels like it was either A. Written by completely different people or B. Purposefully made so in order to be some kind of thematic opposite to the first title.

I think that is DEFINITELY intentional.

The first game’s emotional theme is how unconditional love can make you do some morally questionable things. The second game is about the selfish futility of revenge. They seem to have been written to specifically explore those two complex emotions.

I expect the third game to have a conceptually similar theme to its narrative.

 

[HL3.exe]

Part II, RDR2 and Cyberpunk 2077 ruined AAA gaming for me. In that, we've seem to hit a design and structure limit in AAA games. For how amazing it's presentation was and amazing the mechanics felt, how utterly bog standard and ubiquitous it's structure and design felt.

From a structural standpoint, it's still Gears of War with stealth. They've could've done so much more interesting stuff with it's premise of revenge and remorse integrating it into it's actual structure.

Basically my point:



Its harder and harder for AAA to make interesting structural changes using new leaps in hardware (because of the risk). So it's leaning more and more into presentation > Structural/simulational leaps, which is a shame, because there is still so much interesting opportunities to explore in this medium, but AAA still feel like PS360 games at it's core, while having all the visual bell's and whistles of next-gen.

 

[ShadowLag]

Everything about the game for me was utter shit except for the incredible graphics, animations, and sound.

It ruined something for me alright - it effectively deleted one of the greatest modern franchises ever, while simultaneously preventing me from purchasing future Naughty Dog games and being the first domino in the line of Sony's new agenda driven corporate strategy.

 

[Icymanipulator]

They were both good games, but neither cracked my personal top 10.

 

[M.W.]

Nah, where's Factions already?

 

[Gonpachiro Kamaboko]

All of the best parts of the game were given to Abby. I don’t hate the character but I loved Joel and Ellie for 7 years and then it was like the developers liked Abby more. Just one of my few nitpicks of the game, I don’t think it’s bad at all.

 

[Trunim]

Part 2 was, together with rdr2, the best experiences yet. Nothing has come close.

 

[Krathoon]

I tend to appreciate games in the context they are presented.

That is why I still like to retrogame. Sometimes, a simpler game is more enjoyable.

I get a kick out of playing Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine even though it is a Tomb Raider clone.

The game actually does some things that Tomb Raider never did.

 

[EruditeHobo]

This became my main issue with this game. It just depresses the fuck out of me.

The rare TLOU2 criticism that is completely, 100% understandable. It's a rough row to hoe, this game. No question. Puts its characters, and the gamer, through the fuckin wringer.

Yeah I get it, but it just made me realize that I can't play games like that. As I've become older I am much more sensitive to things like cruelty towards people and animals.
I mean I can still play and enjoy a game like say Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal, but those are demons and more "cartoony".

Absolutely, this is a very fair criticism. The game is incredibly brutal. Not in an edgy, throwaway, death-metal-album-cover way, but in a tragic, human way. And I can see that turning a ton of people off.

I think that is DEFINITELY intentional.

Of course. It's meticulously crafted within an inch of its life! There are no tonal accidents, when it comes to this kind of narrative that is made in this way.

Is there a safer, more agreeable TLOU2 that could have existed, and would have matched up more evenly with the first entry? Yeah. for sure! It just doesn't happen to be the one we got. I'm more than fine with that, some aren't. And I think that whiplash is another pretty reasonable "criticism"... perhaps not of this game, but definitely applies when talking about the expectations for the series as a whole.

Personally I think a massive tonal change in a 2nd entry is something I'd like to see a LOT more of... please do make more interesting sequels in terms of story and structure! I'm all for that.

 

[Sub_Level]

Its a great game. The story was bad but the environments, stealth, and combat were all stellar. Pacing was good too after the dragged out tutorial/intro sequence. Somethin about the game is just very somber and calming even without cutscene context.

I’d play tlou2 over any of the Uncharted games any day of the week.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

I think what stood out to me the most and biggest surprise was the Santa Monica lvl. It felt so fresh for a totally new setting and felt it was even more brutal, like you feel you are about to get a good ending and then that happens.

 

[Woggleman]

The game is dark but I like dark stuff so that never bothered me and in some ways it actually ends on a more hopeful note than the first game.

 

[hinch7]

The story was far too dark, long, indulgent and miserable. Otherwise well written and was a step up in everything else, game wise.

Still way prefer the first, but it didn't take anything from enjoying the series as a whole. People just way overreact over one death in the game.

 

[jonnyp]

Fantastic gameplay but the story and Abby and her gang of unlikables were not for me.

 

[lh032]

were in 2023 now, move on.

 

[lughnasadh123]

I liked it despite having issues with it's flaws namely a rather simple story wrapped up in some very convoluted story telling. Enjoyed the first one more as a complete package gameplay aside. Sometimes I sit on the sidelines watching people going to war for and against it not really getting either side.

 

[delirium trigger]

I always thought the first game was overrated. Still a great game but it was more like watching a movie than playing a game.

Say what you want about part 2's story but the gameplay was fucking amazing and it had way more memorable moments.

 

[March Climber]

No one who has claimed "x ruined gaming for me" has ever really meant it.

It's complete hyperbole.

…I kind of get it though.

What OP feels about TLoU 2 is how I feel about Metal Gear Solid V’s gameplay.

MGSV’s gameplay and creative kit to stealth and action encounters still stands light years beyond most stealth action games and most open world games. Some of them are literally just now catching up, nearly 2 full generations later.

MGSV’s gameplay was so ridiculously good that it made a terrible game(Metal Gear Survive) that should have been rated like a 2 or 3 out of 10, bump up to a 6-7 out of 10.

Do you know how absurd that is? That copy and pasting another game’s gameplay made a game so decent to play that it almost saved it?

 

[EruditeHobo]

What OP feels about TLoU 2 is how I feel about Metal Gear Solid V’s gameplay.

MGSV does indeed rule.

 

[Synless]

I held off getting the game based on some woke shit I read here on gaf until it had hit $20.

When I finally played it I found myself regretting listening to anyone here. The game was fantastic and Abby was actually pretty more likable than shit for brains Ellie.

 

[kiphalfton]

I may as well stop gaming if nothing better is going to come out, as it isn't even THAT good.

 

[Hugare]

Say what you want about the story, the game is still untouchable presentation wise

I was replaying it with my girlfriend, and the scene where Abby meets Lev and his sister is unreal. The animations, the mocap, the graphics ...

Its a level of polish that I havent seen in any other game to this day