Codswallop_
Neophyte
Very true.
Great rebuttal with that pic. Guess there wasn't a vast difference in quality of life between the west and the USSR. Soviet citizens were no doubt much happier working a few hours less a week.
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CDPR institutes mandatory six-day work weeks for Cyberpunk 2077
- Thread starter Bboy AJ
- Start date
Great rebuttal with that pic. Guess there wasn't a vast difference in quality of life between the west and the USSR. Soviet citizens were no doubt much happier working a few hours less a week.
JCK75
Member
My father and brother both work in jobs where they are forced to partake in Unions.
Do I like that my brother who after 30 years on the job had a position he loved and lost it and had his pay cut in half because the Union boss wanted that position given to his son?
My first encounter with my dads union was when I was about 10 years of age, my dad would take me to work with him because the entire building was a giant Unix computer and he had a terminal that was safe for me to tinker on and learn Unix and I was obsessed with computers (this was around 1985). My dad was the only person in the building and I thought nothing of it until some came in threatening my dad for working... they said they are striking because they are trying to fire some guy and my dad asked why he is being fired... he is accused of sexually harassing a customer while doing some work in her house... My dad asked asked a simple question.... did he do it?
And it was clear to everyone in the room they never even considered or cared.. they were striking!
My dad later told me had I not been there they would have jumped him in the parking lot on the way out..
Unions had a purpose once, the right to unionize when things are bad is important.. but running a full time union like the mafia which is what we see today... not so much..
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I repeat myself if it wasn't clear : it's unacceptable. And I really don't care my position is not supported by most people on a gamer forum. Duh...
I care about the people working there and the affect on their wellbeing. That should be paramount, not gamers stupid and childish impatience.
The game must be delayed. Period. I don't care gamers are crying because they won't have the game in time. Deal with it.
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FukuDaruma
Member
I guess that unrefutable data and facts settle the discussion then.
I guess they weren't part of the USSR then. That or even the CIA are prosoviet liars too:
kuncol02
Banned
”Anyone who loves freedom owes to the Red Army more than he will be able to pay in a lifetime”.
— Ernest Hemingway
But he's only a Nobel and Pulitzer prize winner writer who was an ambulance driver in World War I, a journalist on the field in the spanish Civil War and the Normandy landings and the Liberation of Paris in World War II, so I guess he had no fucking idea about what he was talking about.
Please stop talking about things you have no idea about.
Who to believe? Communist sympathizer or millions of people who survived "liberation" by Red Army?
I heard from many people straight that Russian "liberation" was worse than German occupation. I heard that from people living 20-30 km from Auschwitz during war. People who were risking their lives during war when they tried to help Jews. My neighbour had to run from Poland after war because Soviet Secret Police wanted to arrest him (which he would not survived).
M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
You as essential worker, you work shedule does not matter, didn't you hear?
What a fucking sad ass education...”Anyone who loves freedom owes to the Red Army more than he will be able to pay in a lifetime”.
— Ernest Hemingway
But he's only a Nobel and Pulitzer prize winner writer who was an ambulance driver in World War I, a journalist on the field in the spanish Civil War and the Normandy landings and the Liberation of Paris in World War II, so I guess he had no fucking idea about what he was talking about.
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#Phonepunk#
Banned
No pain no gain.
crunch sucks but on the list of worldly evils I think it’s insanely overblown. so a dozen nerds overwork for a few months who the fuck cares
Jason Shitfuck is Bloomberg’s bitch anyone who lets him claim any moral high ground is a massive tool
crunch sucks but on the list of worldly evils I think it’s insanely overblown. so a dozen nerds overwork for a few months who the fuck cares
Jason Shitfuck is Bloomberg’s bitch anyone who lets him claim any moral high ground is a massive tool
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rofif
Can’t Git Gud
lol why?
They are probably happy to have some work in covid. What's the big deal with sitting more in the office?
Polish law is simple, all hours over 40 must be paid as 150%
Yes unions did all these things, and they were great. Unions these days are JOKES, I know some people that work in a unionized environment and the union is so toothless that it's just something Management(not part of the union) fucks with because of all the loopholes in the agreement, yea you can file grievances, but those are so meaningless they carry no weight.
I've also seen MANY things close down because of the union, the employees will go on strike because they can, they get a compromised goal through attrition, while they're on strike the company hires SCABS(non-unionized workers) so there isn't much of a benefit for the company to care for the unionized workers. When the strike finally ends and the employees go back to work, the place closes down after about 4-6 months, then RE-OPENS years later with a slightly different name and DOES NOT allow the union virus to spread through it.
Also UNIONS these days are for FULL TIME WORKERS, if a union infects a long standing company, guess how they get around that? EVERYONE NEW is PART TIME, they work the hours of a FULL TIME, but they get the hours FUCKED WITH.
In 2020 Unions benefit ONE GROUP OF PEOPLE, the PEOPLE COLLECTING FEES and RUNNING THEM.
The other fun thing about the video games industry bitching about a UNION(which is coming from the people that want to be the bigwigs in said union) is that companies DON'T NEED to HIRE UNIZIONIZED EMPLOYEES to start with, and if employees try to join a union... then they can get FIRED when the labor board mysteriously tells the employer that employees are trying to join it... this actually recently happened in a construction project.
Crunch happens in EVERY SINGLE INDUSTRY.
Union WERE GOOD, they've DONE a TON for the worker, but now they've become a seat for typically lazy old fucks to sit in that are actually worse than the management that they're supposed to be opposing FOR it's members.
Some more fun stuff take this example:
Like your job in a unionized place but other people are pissed off because they're not making "enough"? Don't want to strike because strike pay is shitpay? Too bad! You're going ON STRIKE! Typically the money a company saves in a strike is the money they'll use to bargain with the employees. So your strike was SUCCESSFUL! BIG RAISES(especially for the supervisors who are friends with the union runners) life is GREAT! Except, the company comes in says "Sorry boys, now you're costing too much so we're going to have to lay some of you off!" So you, hardworker Tom that was happy at his job and enjoyed his rate of pay are now SOL because some other people in your union weren't.
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cormack12
Gold Member
Thankfully, it's like we've on from 50 odd years ago and the forced analogies don't really work.
If anyone has not had first hand experience with unions they are generally naive and just side with the utopian view. They complain about the Police unions while not realising BMA are just as bad, if not worse. Add onto this the corruption of power, as well as becoming feeder avenues to siphon money off to private projects and you get the full picture.
If anyone has not had first hand experience with unions they are generally naive and just side with the utopian view. They complain about the Police unions while not realising BMA are just as bad, if not worse. Add onto this the corruption of power, as well as becoming feeder avenues to siphon money off to private projects and you get the full picture.
Codswallop_
Neophyte
Bizarre how there's a legit soviet apologist weighing in on some Polish workers doing paid overtime. I don't think they want your shitty ideology back, they've already suffered enough.
Blond
Banned
Okay and? I’ve had plenty of jobs that needed mandatory overtime at one point or another. Why people think this is wrong when it comes to entertainment but okay in every other field is beyond me.
Seriously, if someone in the industry wants to change places I’m one DM away and fucking sick of IT.
Seriously, if someone in the industry wants to change places I’m one DM away and fucking sick of IT.
dorkimoe
Member
People are just taking the "woke" approach. I agree with you, its normal in most jobs, and they get a % of the profits lol
B-universe
Banned
You don't care?
I'm sure CDPR devs care greatly about what you, a member of a gaming forum, find unacceptable.
Personally, I think your personal opinions should be turned into law.
Your opinions should rule the world.
Me too.
The first and most foremost aspect in caring about people is respecting their freedom to choose for themselves and make decisions that concern them and no one else.
Alternatively, I could claim I care about devs, put on a grandiose show of mock empathy, and then proceed to rob devs of the most basic right of all, that is, rob them of the right and capacity to live their lives as free independent and sovereign human beings.
Thanks, but no thanks.
Keep that kind of empathy to yourself, please.
Hampering their free will is a direct attack on their well-being.
My position is a principled one. Not once have I invoked the need for the game to come out on time so I can play it at launch as a reason for my opinions.
Can you be trusted not to misrepresent the position of your adversaries?
Says random poster on gaming forum with zero insider knowledge about the production of this AAA title.
Assert, assert and then assert some more without providing any valid reason for your assertions.
That's bound to convince someone.
Apparently, CDPR don't acre about your pious considerations.
Deal with it.
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
We live in a literal dystopia in which there are people who believe that working hard is bad and since they hate having to work hard, they're trying to prevent everyone else from working hard as well 
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Fuz
Banned
rofl
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
Has he done anything else in the past few years?
The funny part is that at Kotaku his title was "news editor." I don't remember him writing "news" in ages. Rumors and gossip aren't news.
MiguelItUp
Member
Pretty much. This isn't news at all. All of our favorite devs and pubs have been doing this for decades. This is overdramatic and ridiculous.
FukuDaruma
Member
That's a different discussion, but glad we agree they worked less hours.
You can even hear "sieg heil!" from many people, even today, but I'm sure the Auschwitz prisoners were horrified by the Red Army liberating them from the death camp and the gas chambers. As the rest of the world was by the Red Army defeating the Nazi regime.
- Almost half of all victims of the WHOLE WWII were soviet: 27 million.
- 70% of all Nazi soldiers deaths in combat across all WWII were on the Eastern Front (3.562.739), in contrast with only 15% in the Western Front (749.972).
Just during the 200 days of the Battle of Stalingrad 800.000 Nazi soldiers and their allies died, more than in all the Western Front.
Manstructiclops
Banned
They can't work on the game forever. Sometimes you've just got to get that shit out the door.
This game will make or break the studio.
This game will make or break the studio.
FukuDaruma
Member
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Madevil
Member
Yeah I agree. He's a gossip columnist who is somehow lauded in the gaming industry.
kuncol02
Banned
Good bye.
FukuDaruma
Member
We live in a literal dystopia in which there are people who believe that working hard is bad and since they hate having to work hard, they're trying to prevent everyone else from working hard as well
Pretty sure that is the dystopian thing....
Karoshi - Wikipedia
"Karoshi (過労死, Karōshi), which can be translated literally as "overwork death" is a Japanese term relating to occupational sudden mortality. The most common medical causes of karoshi deaths are heart attacks or strokes due to stress and a starvation diet. Mental stress from the workplace can also cause karoshi through workers taking their own lives. People who commit suicide due to overwork are called karōjisatsu (過労自殺). The phenomenon of death by overwork is also widespread in other parts of Asia."
Just give it a few years for this "trend" to spread in the West too.
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B-universe
Banned
Yes, the victims of mass rape carried out in Red Army-occupied Germany sure were grateful.
"The majority of the assaults were committed in the Soviet occupation zone; estimates of the numbers of German women raped by Soviet soldiers have ranged up to 2 million ." (source)
This is all I'm going to say on the matter, as I don't want to fuel what I see as your repeated attempts at obfuscating and derailing the thread.
CAB_Life
Member
Knew Schrier would be all over this like a fly on shit.
Re: Mandatory six day work weeks. My partner works for the municpality and during the initial Covid response he worked seven days a week for four months straight. I work six on average as a self-employed person.
It’s not as if these people aren’t getting paid and there’s far worse situations in which to find oneself in this economy than having too much work (as opposed to unemployment and sleeping under aqueducts).
Re: Mandatory six day work weeks. My partner works for the municpality and during the initial Covid response he worked seven days a week for four months straight. I work six on average as a self-employed person.
It’s not as if these people aren’t getting paid and there’s far worse situations in which to find oneself in this economy than having too much work (as opposed to unemployment and sleeping under aqueducts).
The Scrivener
Member
10% of annual profit? Get outta here... fuuu...
kingwingin
Member
I wish my job handed out overtime
Arun1910
Member
That sucks but as a Developer myself, this happens. Crunch always happens before a big event, in this case the event is the games release. It's only 6 or so weeks.
As long as they are being treated with corrected pay, I do not see an issue with this.
To say crunch will never happen is VERY unrealistic in a Developer scenario and it will always happen.
As long as they are being treated with corrected pay, I do not see an issue with this.
To say crunch will never happen is VERY unrealistic in a Developer scenario and it will always happen.
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
Pretty sure that is the dystopian thing....
Karoshi - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
"Karoshi (過労死, Karōshi), which can be translated literally as "overwork death" is a Japanese term relating to occupational sudden mortality. The most common medical causes of karoshi deaths are heart attacks or strokes due to stress and a starvation diet. Mental stress from the workplace can also cause karoshi through workers taking their own lives. People who commit suicide due to overwork are called karōjisatsu (過労自殺). The phenomenon of death by overwork is also widespread in other parts of Asia."
Just give it a few years for this "trend" to spread in the West too.
It's always funny to see someone openly and unironically supporting one of the two most deadly. oppressive, and undeniably disgusting ideologies ever invented by men. Do you kiss Stalin's picture on the altar before bed?
PS: extremes don't make an argument.
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But you’re flipping this...
It was CDPR who said, boastingly, that they’d never make their workers crunch. They did this because they knew it was what their fans wanted to hear. They were criticized for pushing their workers too hard during development of The Witcher 3 - so they threw out this meaningless statement.
CDPR should be criticized here - not its employees.
This silly debate that’s raging on.... about how many gruelling hours everyone works... has nothing to do with the real issue here, which is CDPR lying in order to make themselves look like this super cool developer that really knows how to treat its employees.
It’s bullshit. And CDPR does this constantly.... so as the result of them being caught in another lie.... what?... let’s just ignore the lie... and dogpile on their employees?
WTF???
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MiguelItUp
Member
Exactly. For a game like Cyberpunk 2077 that's huge and hyped, they're wanting to do everything they can to ensure everything is the best it can be for submission. That way everything can be A-OK for launch. I wish Jason would just stop with the clickbait drama nonsense. It's not like CP2077 is the first game that's done it this way, lol. There were most certainly SEVERAL in the past year or two.
midasmulligan
Member
When did everyone become a bunch of pussies and confuse hard work for indentured servitude? Lol, now grinding to put out an incredible product voluntarily is some form of abuse? I am for for the criminalization of slave labor, but my friends, this is not that.
John Day
Member
How many hours those 6 days? I mean, i work 6 days from 7 am till around 9pm, take around 2 hours for lunch. Ain’t dying, and i’m sure as hell they are getting paid way more than me.
But it’s not about me, so, i just wonder. Do people just expect to work 4 days for 5 hours and make money? Honest question, don’t rail on me
But it’s not about me, so, i just wonder. Do people just expect to work 4 days for 5 hours and make money? Honest question, don’t rail on me
ZZZZ
Member
Calm down and breathe.
No one is trashing their employees, we are just saying they have the option to leave if they want to, they are not being forced to work there.
According to the B.S man himself Shreier, the plan was to release the game in 2019:
They decided to go for 2020 to not overwork their developers, then they delayed for another 7 months, finally they made the decision to tell their workers that they will have to come to work 6 saturdays, what is the big deal here?
At least CDPR tried to deliver on their promise. Their one mistake was to make the promise in the first place.
They gave their devs an extra year+ to get their work done, they didn't, now they are making 6 saturdays mandatory work so they don't need to delay the game another time which would screw over their marketing and release plan.
It's not the end of the world.
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John Day
Member
They tried, had to delay, need to meet this date. Why do people get hung up on that they “lied”?
They made a statement, had to adjust.
They’re not hiding a body or something. Don’t get hung up on “lies” from corporate and marketing.
UnravelKatharsis
Gold Member
I work six days a week and nobody give's a toss
Same. My company calls mandatory overtime all the time. Sometimes I work 9 days in a row. But I don't develop software so who cares
Andrew Evenstar
Member
good lol, if they don't like it they can find another job.
HeadsUp7Up
Member
Being in construction I have no sympathy. I've been there and done it I don't know how many times, that's just how it is when you have a deadline that can't move. Don't like it, find something else to do.