Kataploom
Gold Member
I've rarelly known in my life someone that doesn't work 6 days a week... Sometimes they get that one weekend day with less work to do and/or will leave earlier but that's it.
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CDPR institutes mandatory six-day work weeks for Cyberpunk 2077
- Thread starter Bboy AJ
- Start date
I've rarelly known in my life someone that doesn't work 6 days a week... Sometimes they get that one weekend day with less work to do and/or will leave earlier but that's it.
TheMay30thMan
Member
Six weeks out of the entire development and what? We're all gonna go on a witch hunt for those poor widdle devs? They'll be compensated for the extra time AND get fat Christmas bonuses. That's the dream for a lot of people. Fighting for the rights of developers like they're children are the reason most of them act like fruitcakes. Just sayin'...
They are being worked to death a friend of a friend sent me a picture of the working conditions. Those 6 weeks of 6 day work weeks are slavery.
Kylars Bluff
Neo Member
I work 6 days a week sometimes, and I’m not sitting on my fat ass. You got a deadline, it’s time to step up and meet it. If don’t like, find another job with easier working conditions.
JerryinSoCal
Member
It's funny how up in arms some get about crunch yet they don't say anything about the working conditions of the people who actually make the PC parts and consoles we play these games on.
Neolombax
Member
Yeah, I dunno. I thought sometimes having to work overtime is normal? Maybe its not in the US?
This news isn't surprising, nor do I condemn it. I hope they get something out of those OT hours, and it seems like they are...so I don't know what the issue is? Is it because they promised not do so? They shouldn't have promised that, its kind of a stupid promise to make when a tight schedule is committed to. Shit happens. That's a constant.
This news isn't surprising, nor do I condemn it. I hope they get something out of those OT hours, and it seems like they are...so I don't know what the issue is? Is it because they promised not do so? They shouldn't have promised that, its kind of a stupid promise to make when a tight schedule is committed to. Shit happens. That's a constant.
timmyp53
Member
They should just do what I do. Outsource their own jobs to India for a small percentage of their salary. I take all my work and outsource it to a struggling single father in india. I've gotten 2 raises and am free to live my life without stress and responsibilities. No one loses. Hitesh can feed his family and I can spend my time at work doing what I really want to do; Watching YouTube videos and browsing reddit.
Vaelka
Member
What the fuck is with these pretentious profile pics a lot of people in the industry get lol?
Talking about Jason Schreiers profile pic, oooooh black and white and very seriously looking at the camera such fucking art.
Neil Druckmann has a similar picture too and all I can think is '' narcissistic asshole ''.
All that's missing is a beret and moustache.
Talking about Jason Schreiers profile pic, oooooh black and white and very seriously looking at the camera such fucking art.
Neil Druckmann has a similar picture too and all I can think is '' narcissistic asshole ''.
All that's missing is a beret and moustache.
timmyp53
Member
Looks like a standard media headshot to me.
Vaelka
Member
I know and they look pretentious imo.
It's like a bunch of guys in the industry had a middle-age crisis and decided to make this a thing.
kuncol02
Banned
You pretty much summed that. Schreier is so deep in his own ass that he blocks everyone who don't agree with him.
JerryinSoCal
Member
It is, I've had times where I've worked 70 hours in a week, of course that's not on a regular basis it's very rare and it should be. Gaming just seems to be one of those industries where they are up against it because of release dates. As long as they are paid for it and not taken advantage of it shouldn't be too much of a problem, now if they are expected to do this for many weeks/months at a time that's an issue but that's something that needs to be sorted out between the employees and the employer it's really none of our business.
clarky
Gold Member
Wait, they got to work a 6 day week to meet a deadline? boo fucking hoo. Any job with dead lines in the real world (ie most of them) requires some OT every now and again.
This is news? Next up at 6........... Electrician works late to finish a job before the plaster gets there lol fuck off.
This is news? Next up at 6........... Electrician works late to finish a job before the plaster gets there lol fuck off.
B-universe
Banned
Or you would have had the chance to work on what's shaping out to be a landmark achievement? And get a fat bonus?
Additional 6 days of paid work followed by a fat bonus straight in your bank account is tantamount to treating people like garbage? And why are you dismissing the inconvenient fact developers can simply quit?
Yes, if only people would behave in ways Mr. Tickrate approves of, ways that concern them and no one else, then all would be well.
Velius
Banned
My company does that and much worse than that. So do most companies. This is like crying over a cold in the cancer ward.
Is CDP the first major business whose internal workings you've analyzed? Or do you only care about this kind of thing inasmuch as it occurs within the gaming industry?
You're saying it's wrong. Okay. Nobody is saying it's alright.
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Tickrate
Member
Low effort troll post but I'll bite for the sake of context of others reading
First of all, if you read the article you would read that some developers have already been working overtime for weeks/months on end.
This is hardly anything special in the games industry, they're lucky to even get paid over-time like the article mentions.
Not the mention that group pressure to work over-time is almost always prevalent in big game studios. Not adhering to the general work ethic of your colleagues is a sure way to get the boot sooner than later.
Wanna be naive and think otherwise, then be my guest. Plenty of developers out there who have shared similar experiences.
Second, if money is the only driving factor for you then sure a bonus sounds great. Until you compare programming salaries of game developers to other sectors.
I assume you are pretty young otherwise you'd understand the value of spending time with your wife/kids or having a social life outside of work.
Not everyone lives to work, which in itself is reason enough to despise such work ethics.
At the end of the day, it's never the person making the longest hours who gets the biggest compensation.
Have a good day.
kuncol02
Banned
Were they asked to do them or were they just like one my former coworker who every month had more than 20 hours of overtime because he was so absorbed in work that he didn't even realized that it's time to go home?
Tickrate
Member
There is a difference between it being a free choice and knowing you are replaceable if you don't.
No matter how special you think you are, working in games is hip and cool, there are plenty of candidates out there who are willing to take your spot.
MiguelItUp
Member
I think this is the last time I'll post in this thread because it just puts me in this perpetual loop of rage, lol. But I hate the fact that folks are giving the heads of CDPR shit for this as they don't deserve it whatsoever. Not to mention they're compensating their team, which is something that almost never happens. A ton of youtubers and other folks on Twitter said something along the lines of, "Just because it's the norm doesn't mean you have to do it", but that's the thing, they do. Because it's the entire industry that functions that way, at least in AAA. If there needs to be a shift in how crunch works, there needs to be an industry shift. If one dev or pub tries to attempt it there's a large chance that nothing will happen as everything else around them will continue to function the exact same way, except them. Using the same schedules, workflows, procedures, expectations, etc. It's not nearly as black and white as so many people think it is.
kuncol02
Banned
No one will fire you because you are not doing overtime. Not in IT in Poland anyway.
You know how funny life is when you realize that worst thing that your company can do to you is fire you, which actually is good thing to you?
B-universe
Banned
Low effort troll post but I'll bite for the sake of context of others reading
You're confessing that your post was a low-effort troll post?
Now there's a start.
First of all, if you read the article you would read the following quote:
(source)
So developers volunteered to crunch, overtime for which they were duly compensated. Voluntarism, is that concept alien to you?
Let's recap: they volunteered and they got compensated.
You suggested they're being treated like "garbage".
Isn't that a buffoonish comment?
Present evidence that's happened here.
It's incumbent upon the individual to resist peer pressure. I have the right to try to persuade my colleagues to work say, harder, or, on the contrary, work less hours, if I think that's for the good of the studio, of his career, of his health, of his marriage, etc. It's upon him to then decide what to do with my advice.
Unthinkable!
How dare management reward, among other things, high effort and commitment?! Surely, the deciding factor should be one's genitalia or sexual orientation, no?
No, I'd rather believe the unsubstantiated assertions of an anonymous poster who claims to have worked in the industry.
That's the way to go.
Even if they all had said the exact same thing, word for word, the principles apply nonetheless:
Workers have the right to not apply for a position at CDPR, to unionize, to negotiate, to go on strike, to quit, to move to the competition, to stay at home unemployed watching Netflix, etc.
Management has the right to set the conditions under which they'll employ someone.
It's voluntary. Remember that concept?
Then change career. Who's pointing a gun at your forehead?
It's irrelevant what I prize. What's relevant is what developers themselves prize. If they're after the fat bonus, who are you, allegedly former industry professional, to tell them No?
Your assumptions are utterly irrelevant.
What matters is what each developer wants, what management wants, and their freedom and ability to reach an agreement that satisfies both parties,
Absolutely.
And people who do not place work above all else, which absolutely is their right, should be careful when picking a career and choosing a company to work for. But ambitious people do exist who do place work above all else.
No developer is burdened with yours or mine conception of what a balanced life looks life. Maybe the life they want is not balanced at all by your standards. Then again, it's not your life, is it?
Yes, because, guess what?, the owners of the company get to decide what they do with their money. It's their money, remember? They can shove it down the toilet .
You too.
Enjoy your day!
kuncol02
Banned
Only way to not have developers working overtime is to turn power exactly on 9 and turning it off at 17, any other way someone will stay longer than he/she should because when you are in zone writing something you often aren't even aware of passing time.
Tickrate
Member
Sorry guys, if you wanna protect toxic work ethics be my guest. I don't mind if you let your love for a game/studio turn you into some sort of white knight on a gaming forum.
I gave you my 2 cents from the perspective of an industry professional, do with that as you please. I appreciate you giving your opinions though.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
I generally agree but at the same time you're saying no one should work full-time and everyone should be a part-timer?
Maybe if they increased pay people would do that, then that would require more staff but then that would create more jobs
Sounds good to everyone except the employers.
B-universe
Banned
Sorry, claiming it's toxic - the new jargon that seems to apply to everything, from masculinity to waste to now ethics - is not nearly the same thing as establishing it's reproachable.
Why should I or anyone else endorse your morality?
You've had two chances now to show why voluntarism is bad. You failed. What am I supposed to do? Say, "He' says he was a pro, he must know better then devs themselves"?
It's always revealing watching as someone who thinks he's pulling the ethics card de facto defend the position that developers who do want to do overtime shouldn't be allowed to.
What strange notion of empathy: empathise so so so much with someone that you're willing to rob them of the ability to govern their own lives.
Strange empathy.
My top concern is to navigate through what you mind and what you don't. It really is what guides my activity in this thread.
Former industry professional, didn't you say?
Feeling's mutual.
kuncol02
Banned
No one is protecting toxic work ethics. As I said. Worst thing someone can do to you in Poland in IT is your employer to fire you. You will find new, probably better paid job in less than a month.
Also no one is fired for not taking overtime. Last time when we had voluntary paid Saturday overtime I didn't take any of them. Month later I get raise (without even asking for it). Stop worrying about thing that could happen (but probably won't) especially when it actually could be opportunity not problem.
I guess he is French.
35-hour workweek - Wikipedia
Puncheur
Member
I don't see the problem here. Working an additional paid day per week for a 6 week period is hardly 'crunch'. It's called a normal busy period in any other industry. If people are outraged by this they should spare a thought for retail workers over Christmas.
For the record I annually have to work unpaid additional hours for a 5 week period and I and colleagues do it gladly cos of the satisfaction we get in meeting our targets and goals.
For the record I annually have to work unpaid additional hours for a 5 week period and I and colleagues do it gladly cos of the satisfaction we get in meeting our targets and goals.
MiguelItUp
Member
In my experience, for weeks and months is one thing, that's not common, but I suppose it depends on how long it is. However, it's not uncommon to crunch before vertical slices, sprint deadlines, or cert/submission. But constant crunch "just because" seems rather bizarre, and honestly, unless I see actual proof I wouldn't believe it. I've only worked at two game studios, but that kind of thing never existed. Sure, there were some devs and artists that would linger, but no one told them to. That was a choice that was solely made by them.
That's the thing I don't think a lot of people realize, and it just shows they haven't worked in the industry. Folks are generally underpaid. But it's also not normal for them to receive compensation, either. When one of the companies I worked for downsized a lot of the QA team was cut as it was one of the largest departments. A lot of them were kids fresh out of college that had never had a 9-5 M-F gig, so they weren't sure what to expect. Hell, a lot of them were just excited to be working in the industry. But once they moved to other nearby cities and got other gigs where they could use the experience they received, they ended up making twice as much by just not being in the industry anymore. It's pretty ridiculous.
I've heard so many comments over the years ranging from, "You make less money in the industry because you're able to work in such an awesome work environment", as well as, "Working in the industry itself is a privilege, it's something so many people out there want to do, and would love to. There will always be interested and able bodies."
Those coming from folks that have been in the industry a long time, it's pretty wild, haha.
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saintjules
Member
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B-universe
Banned
So believe Adam Bdaowski when he comes clean and apologizes and seems to lend credence to some aspects of Jason's reporting, but don't believe Adam Badowski when he says the vast majority supported the decision to Crunch for six extra days?
Yes, that seems very impartial.
For the record, even if zero employees had supported the decision to enforce Crunch, Badowski would still have the right to steer the ship the way he deems appropriate.
Sailors can always jump ship.
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DeliciousDoc
Member
6 extra days amounts to barely 2 weeks of extra work right? At this point in the date they set that important or do they want to get the game out before december? Coffers running too low for the next paycheck? Christmas bonus?
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imsosleepy
Member
Yup. But jason schreier is a whiny little bitch
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I think the game industry have acknowledged the issues with crunch and want to figure things out, but it also seems clear from many "encounters" now that Jason has the tact of a sledgehammer and rubs people up the wrong way including studio heads. This is a disservice to what is already a delicate issue.
HF2014
Member
Is there really controversy about that? A few weeks they are asked to do 6 days and this is a problem? I mean sitting next to a computer, doing programming, its not like im freakin panicing atm, being short staff at my job, trying to please everyone with fuckin thing to buy, give because of the pandemic, being drain physicaly and mentally about it. Jesus ...
ZZZZ
Member
Hopefully CDPR learns a lesson from this and keep the media out of it next time, why give interviews if the only thing that happens is backlash from journalist and REEE, these people will never be satisfied, they don't care that you delayed the game for over a year to try and minimize crunch, they are just looking for an excuse to attack you.
Kotaku was attacking Cyberpunk last week over the gang tiger claws as well, it's nonstop b.s.
Kotaku was attacking Cyberpunk last week over the gang tiger claws as well, it's nonstop b.s.
Timberwolf25
Member
Easy solution. Stop giving interviews to this A-hole.
There are so many other credible journalist that are objective (a word he doesn't believe in) and without an agenda to make you look in the worst possible way.
There are so many other credible journalist that are objective (a word he doesn't believe in) and without an agenda to make you look in the worst possible way.
TheMasterSwordMaster
Member
6 days of paid overtime + 10% annual profits split between the devs = slave drivers torturing devs with bullwhips
i think we lost some people here
i think we lost some people here
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LisaMariaMartin
Banned
If they get properly compensated, I don't see a problem.
regawdless
Banned
Sure, it sucks do work 6 days a week for some weeks. But that's project work. I'm a Project Manager and in one especially fucked up project, we all had to work 6 or 7 days a week for six months. The devs got compensated for the additional hours - team leaders and me.... Not. Because this stuff is normal and expected in these positions.
If you want to avoid these "dynamic" working conditions, don't chose a project oriented job.
In this case, it would be interesting to know some background information.
When was the last Crunch? How often does it happen?
How well are they compensated?
How many weeks to they have to crunch?
Either way, 10% of the revenue going to the team is huge. That game will sell like hot cakes. A lot of people would happily do these weeks of crunch for that.
If you want to avoid these "dynamic" working conditions, don't chose a project oriented job.
In this case, it would be interesting to know some background information.
When was the last Crunch? How often does it happen?
How well are they compensated?
How many weeks to they have to crunch?
Either way, 10% of the revenue going to the team is huge. That game will sell like hot cakes. A lot of people would happily do these weeks of crunch for that.