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Pokémon Sun and Moon Starters Revealed. Releases November 18th 2016.

Mr Buddy

Member
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?
 

Crayolan

Member
You mean this?



I...don't really see it. I feel like the people who claimed this Omanyte picture is a TPP reference is really stretching it.

All+hail+the+helix+fossil+spoilers+to+oras+games+looks_636280_5361741.png
 
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?

I like the realistic proportions, the best parts of ORAS's scenes were the ones in human esque proportions and it's good to get more of that. Not to mention the cities actually look more like cities, building off what XY started.
 

Seil

Member
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?

I don't necessarily dislike it. I don't mind that the games are moving in this direction.

That said, despite people seeming to love hating on X&Y, I actually prefer the Gen VI games, especially ORAS in this regard when I see Gen VII next to them. Alola feels bland/dark in comparison to either Gen VI game (despite being a tropical locale) and I think the Gen VI style was fine for the overworld of Pokemon. This is a series that started out with us shrinking from a full character portrait down to a chibi sprite, afterall.

But like I said, I don't mind this direction. Part of me does wish they'd waited til the games were on new hardware to make the leap, though.
 

Crayolan

Member
wat

I don't recall seeing this anywhere else in the game so if it was in Emerald that's pretty weird.

So I decided to check both ORAS and Emerald for these things.

In ORAS almost every house in Rustboro has the similar looking pictures on their walls, but of a little piece of grass. It's only in one house where all the grass pictures are replaced with helix fossils.

Nothing like that was in Emerald.

Seems like an intentional reference to me.
 

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
So I decided to check both ORAS and Emerald for these things.

In ORAS almost every house in Rustboro has the similar looking pictures on their walls, but of a little piece of grass. It's only in one house where all the grass pictures are replaced with helix fossils.

Nothing like that was in Emerald.

Seems like an intentional reference to me.
Helix Fossil is the earliest fossil in the series.

This is like saying they have dog memes in a game because it featured many dogs.
 
Well. We better hope Morimoto is on this and Unno is on Sun 2/Moon 2 or Z because if Nx handheld is really decently powerful we probably aren't going to see gen 8 for at least two years

Man, I hope Morimoto is directing again. XY and ORAS were both such a step down from BW2.

I've brought it up before, but Morimoto not being credited in ORAS or Tembo the Badass Elephant is a good sign. The guy who arranged the majority of the BW/XY/ORAS music has also left Game Freak, so that may leave space for Ichinose or someone else to come back.

I don't see Shigeru Ohmori being brought up that often though. I wonder how much influence he had in the development in ORAS, despite being the director.
 

Ydelnae

Member
I hope we aren't stuck with the rest of Gen VII on 3DS too. Connectivity isn't an issue anymore, there's PokéBank. We've seen games that support cross multiplayer between platforms like PS3, 360 and PC. I don't get why there can't be 3DS-NX cross multplayer with these games.
 

Neoxon

Junior Member
I hope we aren't stuck with the rest of Gen VII on 3DS too. Connectivity isn't an issue anymore, there's PokéBank. We've seen games that support cross multiplayer between platforms like PS3, 360 and PC. I don't get why there can't be 3DS-NX cross multplayer with these games.
With the 3DS already having its remake & Game Freak now willing to skip the sequel game, Gen VII may not last very long.
 
I hope we aren't stuck with the rest of Gen VII on 3DS too. Connectivity isn't an issue anymore, there's PokéBank. We've seen games that support cross multiplayer between platforms like PS3, 360 and PC. I don't get why there can't be 3DS-NX cross multplayer with these games.

Unless Sun/Moon gets a sequel, I honestly think that Game Freak will move to one game per generation, excluding remakes. The traditional "third version" seems to have been phased out, and I don't see Diamond/Pearl remakes happening until at least the originals are unplayable with current hardware. There also hasn't been a lot of fan demand for them yet, like there was for Hoenn. Who really knows though.
 

Ydelnae

Member
Well, I love the idea of new gen + remakes + third version/sequels because I think it adds a good variety of experiences per generation, but with the last remakes being the worst remakes and the next games to remake being the worst games, I would be ok with Gen VII consisting of Sun & Moon and a Kalos game.
 

Major Marvelous

Neo Member
Unless Sun/Moon gets a sequel, I honestly think that Game Freak will move to one game per generation, excluding remakes. The traditional "third version" seems to have been phased out, and I don't see Diamond/Pearl remakes happening until at least the originals are unplayable with current hardware. There also hasn't been a lot of fan demand for them yet, like there was for Hoenn. Who really knows though.
I don't know, I don't see the third game missing one generation as it being phased out. I think they started the 7th generation early just so they could celebrate the 20th anniversary more robustly.

I agree with you about the Diamond and Pearl remakes, though.
 

ash_ag

Member
With the 3DS already having its remake & Game Freak now willing to skip the sequel game, Gen VII may not last very long.
Unless Sun/Moon gets a sequel, I honestly think that Game Freak will move to one game per generation, excluding remakes. The traditional "third version" seems to have been phased out, and I don't see Diamond/Pearl remakes happening until at least the originals are unplayable with current hardware. There also hasn't been a lot of fan demand for them yet, like there was for Hoenn. Who really knows though.

Hard to say if the second game is going to be a sequel, a remake or a third-version, but it's fairly certain there will be one. Three years and two games per generation is becoming the standard, and it wouldn't be unusual if Game Freak was two years late for the next handheld. In fact, it would be unusual for them to be any faster.

I suppose entertaining the possibility of a Gen 7 game on NX is tempting, though completely speculative at this stage. It may somewhat depend on SM sales. If they do well-enough, a final 3DS exclusive is easy to see -- most likely a more moderate, but very features-rich game like B2W2. If they aren't a massive success, the final Gen 7 game may be a bit more progressive, and perhaps multiplatform between 3DS and NX. I'm leaning towards the former scenario if history is any indication.
 
I don't know, I don't see the third game missing one generation as it being phased out. I think they started the 7th generation early just so they could celebrate the 20th anniversary more robustly.

I agree with you about the Diamond and Pearl remakes, though.

By traditional third version, I mean the director's cut games up to Platinum. I think the BW2 was different enough to separate itself from the other ones.
 
I was playing some AS last night and there's a few little things I'd like to see in Sun and Moon.

-When a Pokemon evolves, it plays one of the attack animations, but I think it'd be nicer (or make more sense?) to play the happy animation from Amie.
-Idle animations for Pokemon that don't have them.
-Happy/Angry/Fainting animations visible in the Pokedex
-You can select which animation to view in the dex rather than just cycle through.
-Being able to move the camera in Amie (even if it's limited to 180 degrees or something)
-Flying Pokemon don't always fly (or you can select whether you want them to fly or not in non-Sky battles).
 

Meffer

Member
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?
Huge improvement. Compared to YW and MH: Stories, Pokemon really had change for the better. I'm glad they did.
 

Watch Da Birdie

I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
As someone who's always enjoyed Pokemon mainly through the show, I love the look because it feels like the show.

I felt like the concept art we saw of that hotel back during the Direct even resembled the old water-color backgrounds of the OS.
 

Kyzer

Banned
Also plz

-Co-op modes like a mega entralink story or something (and maybe restaurants or something? For leveling/grinding stuff).

-Pokemon can evolve during battle.

I would love a co op safari zone / friend safari or something too where me and friends can run around the same little area and catch Pokemon and do quests and fishing contests and Pokeathlon like minigamez
 
i know a few people around here really like Popplio but i really want to bring one thing up that i really dont like about it's design, it's colours

i mean, i think with gen 6 and now gen 7 starters GF are now trying to not use the standard typing colour with the starters (as in Grass must have green as thee main colour, Fire must have Red and Water must have Blue)

what i mean is look at Chespin and Rowlet

250px-650Chespin.png
250px-Rowlet.png


both mainly brown with a bit of green

now Fennekin and Litten

250px-653Fennekin.png
250px-Litten.png


Fennekin is mainly yellow with red and Litten is black with red

then there is Froakie and Popplio

250px-656Froakie.png
250px-Popplio.png


still just mainly blue, i wish that wasn't the case but to me that just makes Popplio seam plain in comparison to the other two
 

Kyzer

Banned
I've brought it up before, but Morimoto not being credited in ORAS or Tembo the Badass Elephant is a good sign. The guy who arranged the majority of the BW/XY/ORAS music has also left Game Freak, so that may leave space for Ichinose or someone else to come back.

I don't see Shigeru Ohmori being brought up that often though. I wonder how much influence he had in the development in ORAS, despite being the director.

It was his first time being director iirc. It was also our first hint that there was about to be a shakeup, with a new director in rotation. We knew they had to be doing something more than usual. Now we gotta see if Morimoto gets to direct his own new generation or if they just plan on producing more games per gen, or if Z was cancelled lol
 

Phu

Banned
I was playing some AS last night and there's a few little things I'd like to see in Sun and Moon.

-When a Pokemon evolves, it plays one of the attack animations, but I think it'd be nicer (or make more sense?) to play the happy animation from Amie.
-Idle animations for Pokemon that don't have them.
-Happy/Angry/Fainting animations visible in the Pokedex
-You can select which animation to view in the dex rather than just cycle through.
-Being able to move the camera in Amie (even if it's limited to 180 degrees or something)
-Flying Pokemon don't always fly (or you can select whether you want them to fly or not in non-Sky battles).

Since you brought up stuff regarding animations, I'll add that I'd like it if we got a dodge animation to play out when an attack misses rather than the nothing that already happens.
 

RomanceDawn

Member
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?

Some people are just stuck in their ways. When Pokemon graduates to the 21st century we'll all be better for it. I knew someone who didn't want the Pokemon too animated when they battled for fear that the pokemon themselves would ruin the game. She never elaborated but it just sounded like the dumbest thing ever.

While I'm almost certain the game will be ultimately grid based(lame!) its nice that its looking less and less like it. Too bad exploration within the world will be limited to ladders and pushing rocks. All the good stuff like swinging from vines and riding mine carts will be devoted only to gyms. One day we'll get a Pokemon game that lets us explore environments like we've always imagined.
 

Fandangox

Member
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?

I prefer the most realistic proportions, and I hope the grid-based overworld gets dropped. I liked how it worked in Colosseum, although back then the character models weren't very good.
 
Since you brought up stuff regarding animations, I'll add that I'd like it if we got a dodge animation to play out when an attack misses rather than the nothing that already happens.

Yeah, that'd be nice. Improving the attack animations that involve moving or making the models jump that occur independent of Pokemon animation would be nice, too.

I also thought swinging the camera around at the end of battle so you can see your Pokemon from the front when you gain EXP would be nice. I understand staring at the back of a Pokemon made sense during the old days, but less so now. They could re-use the happy animation from Amie for when you gain a level, too.
 
Apologies if already discussed heavily in the thread, but how is everyone feeling about the full-sized, non-chibi overworld/characters, as well as the (what i'm assuming) less grid-based world?

I was talking to a friend about all of it earlier, and while I'm pretty positive on it (especially if there really is less of an emphasis on keeping everything in line with a grid), he was kind of down on it, saying that the "region felt empty from the trailers", and that it "Didn't really feel like Pokemon". I don't necessarily agree or disagree with him entirely, but I'm curious what gaf thinks about all of the changes to the Overworlds style?

It's an improvement, but I have no idea what the extent of its improvement is, especially when one takes the 3DS's power into consideration. I agree that the region feels pretty empty and linear (even if I know we're getting more Islands), even the original "map" looks like there's an obvious pathway to things.
 

Mr-Joker

Banned

That image is funny as Oshawott got the last laugh in the end as a lot of people got put off by Tepig evolving into another Fire/Fighting and Snivy's stats didn't exactly match up to what the fan's expected.

Oshawott however was very odd but cute in the animé and evolved into a freaking Samurai.

I still wish Snivy was actually named Smugleaf

Ew no, Smugleaf was a terrible name suggestion.

Have you heard the one about fire starters being the Chinese zodiac? lol

I still can't believe that people still continue to believe that with Litten, when Charmander, Cyndaquil and Fennekin don't match it as I don't remember a Salamander, Mouse and Fox being in the Chinese zodiac.

I hope we aren't stuck with the rest of Gen VII on 3DS too. Connectivity isn't an issue anymore, there's PokéBank. We've seen games that support cross multiplayer between platforms like PS3, 360 and PC. I don't get why there can't be 3DS-NX cross multplayer with these games.

Because gen 7 started on the 3DS so it will be finished on the 3DS to ensure connectivity with all 3DS players, plus Game Freak aren't going to use an old generation to showcase the new console, hence why Black and White 2 were on the DS.

I was playing some AS last night and there's a few little things I'd like to see in Sun and Moon.

-When a Pokemon evolves, it plays one of the attack animations, but I think it'd be nicer (or make more sense?) to play the happy animation from Amie.

Agreed but I would also like it that the screen doesn't fade to black when you B to cancel an evolution, it just breaks the flow when past game never did that.

What I want to see;

- the return of challenge mode
- the story to be given a bigger focus
-The return of cross gen evolution.
-A bigger focus on the lore with the legendary being the focal point.
-No past gen pandering in the same vain as the gen 1 pandering in X and Y as gen 7 should be the bigger focus.
-Do not give Zygarde a big role in the game post game or not, I don't want him taking the limelight away from the Sun and Moon legendary.
-No trainer to use Mega, they make easy and predictable as you will always know that its their last Pokémon and will go mega.
-No new Mega or gimmick than takes away cross gen evolution.

-Pokemon can evolve during battle.

Is that what Mega are for?
 

Coffinhal

Member
Some people are just stuck in their ways.

Nope. The shift that the game took since X/Y is pretty big if you look at the visuals. It changed the perspective. Even if they experimented with dynamic camera angles and close-ups, more depth or movement, the completely 3D environment changes it all. So yeah, it can feel pretty empty because it uses cell-shading and doesn't have crowded places or background full of details. When it was in 2D and /sprites pixelart it didn't matter, now it does. X/Y got worse because of bad choices they made on how to move to a full 3D overworld. Now it seems that they acknowledged what was wrong but they have limited hardware and budget, plus the competition of the big 3D open world, they can't rely anymore on imagination of the players but they have to propose bigger places that sometimes need to feel alive, while keeping a coherent art style within the technical boundaries of the 3DS. Also keeping the Pokémon visual lineage seemed to have been a priority, it may change in the next games. They should've made the jump for X/Y, BW/2 were the last attempt possible before 3D and it gave the best of the DS and of the Pokémon art style. At least they didn't fucked up the battles which are clean are hell, even if too static and with limited backgrounds. They can do more but they are conservatives (but no really when it comes to merchandising, see the Megas)

-No trainer to use Mega, they make easy and predictable as you will always know that its their last Pokémon and will go mega.

OH GOD YES. Every "big" trainer has a Mega in XY/ORAS after you discovered their existence. It ruined the battles, especially gyms and Elite Four which already had a limited number of Pokémon.

Just give me a "Mega-free" option

Let's get some new evolutions of old Pokémon, but the $$$ speak here for TPC
 
Agreed but I would also like it that the screen doesn't fade to black when you B to cancel an evolution, it just breaks the flow when past game never did that.

What I want to see;

- the return of challenge mode
- the story to be given a bigger focus
-The return of cross gen evolution.
-A bigger focus on the lore with the legendary being the focal point.
-No past gen pandering in the same vain as the gen 1 pandering in X and Y as gen 7 should be the bigger focus.
-Do not give Zygarde a big role in the game post game or not, I don't want him taking the limelight away from the Sun and Moon legendary.
-No trainer to use Mega, they make easy and predictable as you will always know that its their last Pokémon and will go mega.
-No new Mega or gimmick than takes away cross gen evolution.

Why would giving Zygarde a role in the post-game affect the SM Legendaries? By the time you finish the game, the Legendaries' story pretty much ends there. And even then, the story is predictable af going off of what's been shown in Gen VI and V (though V did an amazing job with showing Zekrom and Reshiram's story).

Although I don't think Zygarde will get any focus in SM, it's not really fair to make a Legendary that is basically a throwaway because GF couldn't bother to link Zygarde to Kalos like they did with Giratina, Rayquaza, etc.
 

RomanceDawn

Member
Nope. The shift that the game took since X/Y is pretty big if you look at the visuals. It changed the perspective. Even if they experimented with dynamic camera angles and close-ups, more depth or movement, the completely 3D environment changes it all. So yeah, it can feel pretty empty because it uses cell-shading and doesn't have crowded places or background full of details. When it was in 2D and /sprites pixelart it didn't matter, now it does. X/Y got worse because of bad choices they made on how to move to a full 3D overworld. Now it seems that they acknowledged what was wrong but they have limited hardware and budget, plus the competition of the big 3D open world, they can't rely anymore on imagination of the players but they have to propose bigger places that sometimes need to feel alive, while keeping a coherent art style within the technical boundaries of the 3DS. Also keeping the Pokémon visual lineage seemed to have been a priority, it may change in the next games. They should've made the jump for X/Y, BW/2 were the last attempt possible before 3D and it gave the best of the DS and of the Pokémon art style. At least they didn't fucked up the battles which are clean are hell, even if too static and with limited backgrounds. They can do more but they are conservatives (but no really when it comes to merchandising, see the Megas)

Can't agree with that at all. X and Y looks different visually but even black and white had some of those dynamic camera angles. The fact is it plays and feels really close to the old gameboy games and exploration is still limited in almost the same exact ways. It's like watching Sonic run through a loop in 2D vs 3D. Either hold forward or sideways, same thing happens and one has a dynamic angle attached to it.

It's not so much about the game feeling empty, it's just the pathways are usually just these narrow tetris pieces lined up with no exciting ways to interact with the environment. Soaring is one of those exceptions that we need more of. When the land scape is wider, no longer grid based and we are able to interact with the environment in meaningful ways then I'll say Pokemon's gameplay is completely different. The battle system is wonderful and will probably be this way more or less until we all die, but getting about in the world needs to feel more involved. This game looks like its stepping in the right direction, at least as far as grid based movement goes.

And trust me the hardware is not the problem, it's the developers know how.

Edit:
When I said some people are just stuck in their ways I was referring to people not wanting Pokemon to change. Like my friend who didn't want the Pokemon animated for fear or losing out on something and Mr buddy's friend who feels like the the new style isn't Pokemon any more.

Gamefreak aren't stuck in their ways, they just probably can't bring the games to look something like Xenoblade, or Yokai Watch.
 
OH GOD YES. Every "big" trainer has a Mega in XY/ORAS after you discovered their existence. It ruined the battles, especially gyms and Elite Four which already had a limited number of Pokémon.

No, not really. None of the gym leaders in XY/ORAS even have megas, except for one (and they don't even use it in the actual gym battle). The Elite 4 in XY don't have any either. The megas are limited to the evil team leaders, the main rivals (post-game except Wally), and the Champions. The Hoenn E4 have megas but that's only after you've beaten the game, and at that point they already have a full team.
 

Toxi

Banned
OH GOD YES. Every "big" trainer has a Mega in XY/ORAS after you discovered their existence. It ruined the battles, especially gyms and Elite Four which already had a limited number of Pokémon.

Just give me a "Mega-free" option

Let's get some new evolutions of old Pokémon, but the $$$ speak here for TPC
There weren't any gym battles that used Mega Evolution in either game, and only the Elite 4 in ORAS used Mega Evolution in the post-game.

I'm glad we got more Mega Evolution battles in ORAS. Seeing the Elite 4 actually get a significant upgrade after you beat them the first time is fun.
 
There weren't any gym battles that used Mega Evolution in either game, and only the Elite 4 in ORAS used Mega Evolution in the post-game.

I'm glad we got more Mega Evolution battles in ORAS. Seeing the Elite 4 actually get a significant upgrade after you beat them the first time is fun.

I actually rather enjoyed those refights, post game elite 4 is actually somewhat difficult on set battle since you can't counter their every move and the megas are actually able to get their speed boost up, which makes them quite difficult to manage. Drake's mega salamence was a huge pain.

I still say that if gamefreak wants to banish most of the notions that pokemon lacks depth, they need to eliminate shift battle and give their gym leaders each an overarching strategy to use with hold items like Diamond and Pearl (for the strategies). That's pretty much all they need to change about the single player.
 

Andrefpvs

Member
this fan shiny is good

tumblr_o71gwzncZf1rdo4auo1_500.png

This is kinda apropos of nothing, but that picture reminded me that I'm so glad that they've been putting more effort in the Shiny recolorings lately. Some Gen 6 shinies looked amazing -- you can tell that shinies such as Aegislash and Clauncher had their color changes carefully designed.

I kind of wish that they went back and touched up some of the Gen 1 & 2 affected by the Vomit Green disease (Mewtwodragonitescizoreugh)
 
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