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Dad gets nearly $8,000 bill after son racks up charges from microtransactions in FIFA

You're correct, but the want to conquer it, and the requirement of money, is still present in both.

It's that same kind of itch in your head that pushes you to keep going, often until you are completely out of money.

This is like trying to talk to my mum back in the 80's when she thought gaming = drug addiction. SMH.
 

Yagharek

Member
So who accepted the TOS/EULA on the console, the XBLA account and the game in question? The owner of the credit card (father), or the owner of the console (son)?
 

Bl@de

Member
To take that info and then extrapolate that therefore most parents will understand how PSN/XBL/AAA games/MTs work and how some games are designed to encourage you to spend is disingenuous at best

PSN,XBL, AppStore, GooglePlay. Candycrush, AAA ... You can expect people to understand similar concepts of things they already know. Sure it's not 90% of the parents, but this is not some arcane knowledge in the year 2016. But if people prefer to be stupid and give out their credit card without any limits then it's their problem.
 

oni-link

Member
PSN,XBL, AppStore, GooglePlay. Candycrush, AAA ... You can expect people to understand similar concepts of things they already know. Sure it's not 90% of the parents, but this is not some arcane knowledge in the year 2016. But if people prefer to be stupid and give out their credit card without any limits then it's their problem.

The card was given for emergencies, not to use on XBL

The 17 year old is 100% to blame, I think it's unfair to blame the parents to the extent some in this thread have
 

neerg

Member
My dad is in his mid 50s and he has no idea about MTs, he doesn't even have a modern phone, so he has no exposure to them at all.

It's not bullshit to assume most people are not as tech savvy as those who are under 30

So your dad would just hand over his creditcard/bank card details to you? You don't have to be tech savvy to realise that's a damn stupid thing to do (yes even for 'emergencies' - lol).

I'm 42 btw, And over my dead body would my son ever get anywhere near my bank/card details.
 

oni-link

Member
So your dad would just hand over his creditcard/bank card details to you? You don't have to be tech savvy to realise that's a damn stupid thing to do (yes even for 'emergencies' - lol).

I'm 42 btw, And over my dead body would my son ever get anywhere near my bank/card details.

That isn't what I said

I said the dad was probably unaware you could rack up an 8k bill playing FIFA all day

At 17 I would have been responsible with my parents credit card, if I was given it and only told to use it in an emergency, then again I was raised to know the value of money

The 17 year old is at fault, the parent I have sympathy for
 
Every after school special is now going to have that one episode about the kid racking up crazy credit card bills for fake videogame currency. At least when they were just buying expensive clothes and toys for themselves they could return them all.
 

Adam M

Member
Another proof that microtransaction is the best business model ever, can't blame the companies for using it, kinda easy extra money.

But from the customers point of view this is the worst thing ever. And this thing is evolving, I would not be surprised if the movie industry would jump on it as well. Sitting in the movie theater and at some point they pause the movie and pay if you want to continue or on the blu-ray release they can put in microtransactions for extra scenes. "if you want to see the after credits stringer then pay more" etc

But in this case it's just stupidity from the father and the monkey
 

pastrami

Member
So your dad would just hand over his creditcard/bank card details to you? You don't have to be tech savvy to realise that's a damn stupid thing to do (yes even for 'emergencies' - lol).

I'm 42 btw, And over my dead body would my son ever get anywhere near my bank/card details.

It's not that stupid. I had my parents credit card when I turned 16 to use for gas. But I learned about personal responsibility and how money works. The few times I did use it for personal purchases, I would A) tell my parents beforehand, and B) pay them back.

Anyways, I don't have any real sympathy for the kid, but the parents being stuck with an $8000 bill seems excessive. I normally advocate for personal and parental responsibility, but hopefully the parents are able to work something out. And wise up on teaching their kid how life works.
 
So your dad would just hand over his creditcard/bank card details to you? You don't have to be tech savvy to realise that's a damn stupid thing to do (yes even for 'emergencies' - lol).

I'm 42 btw, And over my dead body would my son ever get anywhere near my bank/card details.

Ok, sure, you don't let your kid near your account info, card number, whatever. What if he steals it, finds the information out somehow and spends all your money on some MT BS. Wouldn't you want your money back? You wouldn't be upset that a game let the kid spend that much in the first place? It's not like these are physical, finite goods, it's an infinite amount of digital stats. What would EA have to lose from refunding you over an obviously dumb mistake on your kids part?
 

Zombine

Banned
17. Years. Old.

At 17 I was a senior in high school, and I knew enough not to put any sort of charge what so ever on my moms card unless I explicitly asked. You do boneheaded things when you're an older teen like that, but nothing that goofy. I mean did he not realize that his dad would see that on his monthly invoice? Lol smh
 

dose

Member
Ok, sure, you don't let your kid near your account info, card number, whatever. What if he steals it, finds the information out somehow and spends all your money on some MT BS. Wouldn't you want your money back? You wouldn't be upset that a game let the kid spend that much in the first place?
If he steals it I'd want my money back off my kid, or punish him, I wouldn't want it back off the company. Why would the company have to pay out for an idiot kid?
 
Ok, sure, you don't let your kid near your account info, card number, whatever. What if he steals it, finds the information out somehow and spends all your money on some MT BS. Wouldn't you want your money back? You wouldn't be upset that a game let the kid spend that much in the first place? It's not like these are physical, finite goods, it's an infinite amount of digital stats. What would EA have to lose from refunding you over an obviously dumb mistake on your kids part?

Why are EA responsible for a thief, regardless of the VALUE of the goods, of which the value is the amount charged, regardless of people saying they are worthless/digital etc. I don't ask a builder to come build a wall and say sorry mate i'm not paying your labour as you've loads of hours in your life and it didn't cost you anything. Fact is that EA have worked out a charge and that's what it costs. I'm pretty certain all the licences they have to purchase to make FIFA don't come cheap and the revenue from MT is taken in to account in to their financials.
 
If he steals it I'd want my money back off my kid, or punish him, I wouldn't want it back off the company. Why would the company have to pay out for an idiot kid?

A kid can't pay back that kind of money in timely fashion, it could take months or years to get that money back from him. That time frame could be the difference between losing a home, vehicle, business or what not. And what's wrong with asking for the money back from the company? Do you keep stolen money when you find out it's stolen and someone wants it back? If my kid took my cc and bought a bunch of stuff at some store I'd return it and get my money back. Returns are a really useful protection, it's a shame seeing so many people on here thinking that just because it's digital means that you should never get your money back for anything ever no matter the circumstances.
 

oni-link

Member
If he steals it I'd want my money back off my kid, or punish him, I wouldn't want it back off the company. Why would the company have to pay out for an idiot kid?

If you or a minor you are responsible for buys something you don't want, you normally want a refund
 
Satan must be proud.

No, he's pissed it wasn't on COD DLC

 

oni-link

Member
and if the store you purchase from doesn't offer refunds then you have to accept it. I can't go put a bar bill on my dads card and ask for a refund once I've drunk it all.

Yeah and that's true, but they're selling a resource they have an infinite amount of, not offering refunds is also illegal in some parts of the world

If they want to say he's had an advantage in the game then refund him and ban him from Xbox Live or FIFA
 

spwolf

Member
and if the store you purchase from doesn't offer refunds then you have to accept it. I can't go put a bar bill on my dads card and ask for a refund once I've drunk it all.

this is more like you going to a strip bar somewhere in eastern europe and buying 4 beers then later on finding out that you were charged $8k for them. But hey, prices were listed on the menu!

You can fight this with credit card company if you are part of western world. Only problem is that then MS or Sony will ban you from their store.
 

oni-link

Member
The real tragedy in this story

I wonder if his son has a smartphone lol

this is more like you going to a strip bar somewhere in eastern europe and buying 4 beers then later on finding out that you were charged $8k for them. But hey, prices were listed on the menu!

You can fight this with credit card company if you are part of western world. Only problem is that then MS or Sony will ban you from their store.

That's not a problem in this case, the son deserves a ban, he clearly can't be trusted
 

bryehn

Member
Yet another case where a reasonable spending limit should be implemented.

Honestly I wish these "rare item chance" or "consumable" purchases were made illegal. It's all a load of shit.

Also the guy doesn't have to file police charges to claim fraud. Whatever credit company said that is full of it. He may need to contact the Canadian version of the FTC or an attorney but he shouldn't pay that bill.

Absurd that Xbox refused to reverse the charges too.

I've dealt with both Xbox and Visa about fraudulent charges. They have a whole team and my case (actually fraudulent) it took almost 3 weeks to clear.

These purchases were made from his console and appeared on his account, therefore he's on the hook.

I do agree that a spending limit should be available, but the real issue is dude's kid stealing his credit card and frankly the only way he'll get out of it is to lay charges on his son.

File under: "Sorry, dumbass".
 

oneils

Member
What are people buying, exactly, with these packs anyway? seems crazy that you don't have access to all the players' stats from the get-go. I don't know why people would play a sports video game that has a meta game built around boosting some of your team's stats. Like, everyone should be on an even playing field from the start.

And why football? Do the madden/nhl/nba/mlb games have the same sort of packs? If not what makes Fifa so different?
 

SovanJedi

provides useful feedback
Well the dad is an idiot for just trusting his son so wholeheartedly with his credit card, and also believing that he didn't know better.

Most cases I'd be appalled that such an amount of money can be pumped into a game via microtransactions (and yes, I too would be in favour of a weekly spending limit, or somesuch safety measure) but this just seems like a case of the parent lacking good judgement.
 

im_dany

Member
Another proof that microtransaction is the best business model ever, can't blame the companies for using it, kinda easy extra money.

But from the customers point of view this is the worst thing ever. And this thing is evolving, I would not be surprised if the movie industry would jump on it as well. Sitting in the movie theater and at some point they pause the movie and pay if you want to continue or on the blu-ray release they can put in microtransactions for extra scenes. "if you want to see the after credits stringer then pay more" etc

But in this case it's just stupidity from the father and the monkey
I didn't know having to pay more to have more is bad.

Do you think it's the same with cars? I don't want to pay more for accessories! And what about houses? I don't want to pay more for a bigger bedroom ! And a garage, omg I want it for free, I don't want to pay more!

You're not forced to buy Fifa points, COD skins, Battlefield packs or Halo REQs. You can play the games as they are, and if you want to progress faster you can spend additional money, but that doesn't make you better than other players. Those games are far from Free2Play/Paw2Win games.b
 
Charge the kid with fraud

Tough love

Is that you Batman?

If the kid was 5 you could understand slightly more, but a 17 year old has no excuse nor does the father if the 17 year old was genuinely unaware. Sucks to be you. I don't think it'll happen again though will it?
 

R00bot

Member
Reminds me of the time I cost my parents a $350 phone bill when phone bills were usually $25/mo, back when the "internet" was just a long distance modem call away.

Kids and parents both suck. Confirmed.

I went over my phone internet limit by 400 mb once (was using my phone as a wifi network and my ipod decided to download an update one night), worked out that it would cost me $170, shat myself all month until the bill came, fucking normal $20 bill praise the lord.
 

neerg

Member
It's not that stupid. I had my parents credit card when I turned 16 to use for gas. But I learned about personal responsibility and how money works. The few times I did use it for personal purchases, I would A) tell my parents beforehand, and B) pay them back.

Despite the common sense factor in the UK at least you are not allowed to give your card to someone else to use as part of your card agreement.


Ok, sure, you don't let your kid near your account info, card number, whatever. What if he steals it, finds the information out somehow and spends all your money on some MT BS. Wouldn't you want your money back? You wouldn't be upset that a game let the kid spend that much in the first place? It's not like these are physical, finite goods, it's an infinite amount of digital stats. What would EA have to lose from refunding you over an obviously dumb mistake on your kids part?

I would have to take the hit for my incompetence as a parent, and in protecting my details. And he would be severely punished.
It would still be my fault. I believe in being responsible for myself not relying on others to do it for me. So no, I can honestly say I would expect nothing of EA. Obliviously I would love it if they did give it back, but I would have no case for complaint if they didn't.
 

Bluenoser

Member
Back in the day, the arcades near my house used to fill to the brim on the weekends with children pumping their allowance into arcade machines, quarter by quarter.

We could easily spend $10 a day on games like Willow, The Simpsons, TMNT, X-Men... not because we'd never played them before, but because that's about how much it took sometimes to finish the game and get some satisfaction out of it. Some of those old games were rigged to be unfairly difficult at times, so no matter how good we were, eventually we would get the dreaded Game Over / Insert Coin screen. Then we would put in another quarter and keep going, hoping for the best.

I implore you to explain to us how that kind of mentality is so different than someone sitting in front of a slot machine for hours upon hours, endlessly pouring their money in for a chance to win the jackpot.

Are you kidding? Arcade games are based off of the player's skill. The good Mortal Kombat players got to play for free all day while challengers kept feeding the game quarters. There is a "high" to be gained from knocking the king off the throne, even if only for one match, but ultimately there is a degree of control you have and it's skill based.

With slot machines, video lottery terminals, etc, there is no skill involved. The card packs that are completely random mimic this- you are paying money for a very low chance to get a payout. When selling digital goods, RNG should absolutely NOT be a factor. This is a deplorable practice that companies are using to lure people into spending insane amounts of money chasing that high of getting what they desire.

At the end of the day, if the money you paid EA was able to get you what you want, there would be no problem. The kid might have spent $15 to get his team rather than $8000 but then EA doesn't have a business model that makes them as much money. Can't have that... oh no. Not like the customer actually bought the game in good faith or anything, Fuck this guys. These are videogames, not casinos.
 
While this story could've ended less absurdly if common sense was used by either of the two stupid sods in question, it does remind me of how well Nintendos been treating f2p. In the Pokemon f2p games, which have the classic energy/crystal mechanic, there's a hard spend limit at I think £30. So the most you can spend before they remove all the energy nonsense is the price of a regular game. It's pretty clever and if similar price limits were the law across all f2p these stories could finally stop popping up.
This is half accurate. It isn't just the stamina system that gets removed but also content unlocking is a thing. You are describing Pokemon Rumble World (which has a retail release now) and Pokemon Picross (which is play free for a year to earn enough points to buy all content or spend £30+ to unlock all content which is far less content that the Picross-e series has to offer for the same price).

Pokemon Shuffle on the other hand has a limit of something like £150 a month and no way to permanently remove stamina though.

Just no.

What if people HAVE the money to spend so much on a game? Then let them.

The stupid decisions made by some people should not have an impact on everyone else.

There are already many precautions in place to prevent wild spending. Some people just can't be bothered and when it happens, find someone/something else to blame.
For a few of those f2p games it is actually those games being structured in such a way that there is a limited amount of content to buy which is one way of limiting spending. Of course something like Fifa Ultimate Whale is not designed to have limited purchases.

I also have ethical problems with chasing whales who might or might not have the money for their habit. What is tragic is how much whales burn out or just move on to something else.
 

garath

Member
How are people blaming EA for this? Boggles my mind. My 8 year old understands what micro transactions are for goodness sake. A 17 year old with a credit card has no excuse whatsoever.

And why should there be imposed spending limits? Forget kids for a second, if you wanted to drop 1,000 on a game you should be allowed to. Are there spending limits at casinos? At bars? At restaurants? All places you can rack up a huge bill with non-refundable purchases. Heck, most bars don't even list drink prices on the menu. Let alone have three different confirmation screens before purchasing.

Every time I read one of these stories people come out of the woodwork claiming predatory practices and our children and ignorant parents are at risk of spending too much money on a game because reasons. All I ever see is a mistake on the parents part. They either didn't set parental controls, let the kid have their password, let the kid have their credit card, etc etc. I'm sorry. There's no do over if your kid breaks a neighbors window or drives your car into a tree. You have to be educated about what your kids are doing and potential pitfalls. Don't just hand them an expensive device with your credit card tied to it and expect them to be responsible.

I feel bad for the parent. Truly I do. The kid took advantage of him. But I stop feeling bad watching him cry to the media that this is all so unfair and the company took advantage of him somehow. It's ridiculous. My only hope is that more people read these stories and take steps to prevent their own kids from doing something like that.
 

rezuth

Member
like, he had to keep buying fifa points over and over again to buy packs. what a little shithead, especially for someone who's under a year away from being a fucking legal adult



he's 17. not 5. he's entirely to blame - by the time you're 17, you should have a basic understanding of this kind of shit

Well if he doesn't then it's his parents lack of education. Once again it's on the parents.
 

ecosse_011172

Junior Member
As daft as the dad has been, as dishonest as the kid has been, it's an utter disgrace that you can spend 8 grand on micro transactions in a game, utterly criminal and it highlights the worst extremes of the shitty DLC practices of some companies.
 

Chopper

Member
How are people blaming EA for this? Boggles my mind. My 8 year old understands what micro transactions are for goodness sake. A 17 year old with a credit card has no excuse whatsoever.

And why should there be imposed spending limits? Forget kids for a second, if you wanted to drop 1,000 on a game you should be allowed to. Are there spending limits at casinos? At bars? At restaurants? All places you can rack up a huge bill with non-refundable purchases. Heck, most bars don't even list drink prices on the menu. Let alone have three different confirmation screens before purchasing.

Every time I read one of these stories people come out of the woodwork claiming predatory practices and our children and ignorant parents are at risk of spending too much money on a game because reasons. All I ever see is a mistake on the parents part. They either didn't set parental controls, let the kid have their password, let the kid have their credit card, etc etc. I'm sorry. There's no do over if your kid breaks a neighbors window or drives your car into a tree. You have to be educated about what your kids are doing and potential pitfalls. Don't just hand them an expensive device with your credit card tied to it and expect them to be responsible.

I feel bad for the parent. Truly I do. The kid took advantage of him. But I stop feeling bad watching him cry to the media that this is all so unfair and the company took advantage of him somehow. It's ridiculous. My only hope is that more people read these stories and take steps to prevent their own kids from doing something like that.
Hear hear. Couldn't have said it better myself.
 
How are people blaming EA for this? Boggles my mind. My 8 year old understands what micro transactions are for goodness sake. A 17 year old with a credit card has no excuse whatsoever.

Companies exploiting gamble addictions and related behavior is pretty sick.
 

Joejoe123

Neo Member
.

You think a casino in Vegas would give a person their money back after they max'ed out all of their credit cards and emptied their bank account because they didn't know when to stop? They could try telling them that it's not their fault because the casino allowed it to happen, but I'm pretty sure they would get laughed off of the premises.

Do you honestly believe we should hold gaming companies to the same standards as Casinos? Gambling is already heavily regulated because everyone is aware casinos exploit people. If the gaming industry chooses to follow that path we'll see games regulated, and who knows if it'll only target the exploitive ones.
 

Z3M0G

Member
I assumed the kid was 7 or something...

Yah, this kid knew what he was doing. Come on...

Aside from all that... I strongly believe that it should be IMPOSSIBLE to spend this much money in a single game. $100 TOPS. At that point, just give the kid unlimited points for free. That's how Nintendo handles it in some of their titles.

This shit needs to be regulated across all video game platforms. What does it take for standards committees and counsels to come into play? I believe we are well beyond that point...
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
I feel like there should be some kind of cap on how much money you can pump into a single game. Like, doesn't this guy deserve everything the game has to offer for 1000 bucks? Including God mode?

At the very least show the player a pop up that says "you've spent a college education on this game, would you like to keep paying us?"
 
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