Support NeoGAF

[DenchDeckard]

Well my stance on gamepass is this. As long as it's not the only option I'm fine with it existing. I always enjoy buying copies because I feel like I'm supporting the developers more.

Gamepass is a good value but there's nothing wrong with buying copies of the game. Just like there's nothing wrong with playing the game via gamepass.

totally valid man. I would have never played this game if it wasn’t for gamepass and I’m having an absolute blast. Games seriously fun to play but probs not worth the full asking price, it’s a little bit much with some of the writing etc. But the powers and gameplay is real fun, especially co op. thanks to gamepass I know I’ll always have a full party.
...only problem is the damn servers right now.

 

[Gravemind]

People with gamepass are using it instead of buying the game outright? Shocking!

 

[Sleepwalker]

I'm sure square enix ran the numbers and sales projections before accepting the deal from microsoft. Clearly it was worth it for them.

I'm sure they are very concerned about physical xbox sales in the UK lol.

 

[johnjohn]

The previous narrative was that it leads to increased sales due to the increased exposure but the reality is very different.

Like you said, why would someone buy the game when it's available day one on the service? I've been laughed at when I've previously stated I would buy games that released day one on gamepass after trying them out and liking them. I was told the developers have already been paid so I don't need to buy it. Apparently also buying games is against the gamepass code of conduct.

It leads to increased sales across all platforms, not just Xbox. Do you think it would be selling as well on PS if it wasn't for all the buzz coming from the Game Pass deal and Xbox gamers being hyped for the game?

 

[jroc74]

Phil Spencer: Game Pass leads to more game sales

This past weekend's X018 event was, arguably, a two-hour long advertisement for Game Pass, and given what Microsoft gam…

www.gamesindustry.biz

What's amazing about this....Phil could have meant in the context of based on predicted sales Xbox. Which probably arent all that great to begin with.

Like selling 10 console more than the previous month...yeah its an increase....but still....

Its gonna be the exact same story for The Show. In a few months it will tell us about the user base comparisons.

 

[Fulcizombie]

I don’t get it, I am enjoying the game right now on my XSX and gamepass, why the hell should I care ? Am I supposed to feel bad or something ?

Hell, I hope MS makes many more deals like this, PlayStation users can keep their «victories».

 

[FatKingBallman]

Exactly. People think "incresed sales" mean Xbox only. Putting a game on Game Pass creates a halo effect and helps increase sales across all platforms by mere exposure and word of mouth. Publishers have already spoken about this phenomenon.

Please provide a statement where Phil or any exec from Xbox said that Game Pass users buys more games outside where Gamepass exits? Why people wouldn't buy digitally where it has 20% discount, so, Xbox, but it will buy it for PS platform instead??? LOL

 

[thelastword]

Honestly, this is a no brainer.

Its the gift and the curse of a Game Pass type service.

Lots of units sold equals large user base
Download service equals large user base

Yes indeed, Gamepass is a sacrifice of retail sales, however, this is just another excuse by many to minimize the importance of sales, which is vitally important to continued growth of studios and financing of games.....I wonder if whatever cheque the company gets is good enough to make them a sequel to this game with a higher budget....I'm thinking no, most of their revenue will be coming from retail sales and DLC if the game is popular......

The other downside to gamepass is that the games rotate, so buying DLC for a game only not to have the game in your library a few weeks/months later is a problem. I think having the game permanently in your library is a much better scenario in all instances....That's why even with PS Plus, it's yours as long as you are subscribed, nothing leaves your download and accessibility lists....as long as you claim them...

 

[FatKingBallman]

It leads to increased sales across all platforms, not just Xbox. Do you think it would be selling as well on PS if it wasn't for all the buzz coming from the Game Pass deal and Xbox gamers being hyped for the game?

GamePass isn't on PS platform. So, it can't increase sales there. Btw. demo was available on all available platforms

 

[jroc74]

I'm sure square enix ran the numbers and sales proyections before accepting the deal from microsoft. Clearly it was worth it for them.

I'm sure they are very concerned about physical xbox sales in the UK lol.

Agree.

I dont think anyone that launches on Game Pass cares about unit sales. That said, some folks need to understand why some companies arent all in on a Game Pass type services.

Because unit sales matter more to some companies.

 

[Sleepwalker]

I don’t get it, I am enjoying the game right now on my XSX and gamepass, why the hell should I care ? Am I supposed to feel bad or something ?

Hell, I hope MS makes many more deals like this, PlayStation users can keep their «victories».

You should feel bad and buy the game for $70 so you can fuel console warz

 

[Stuart360]

To be honest, i'm more surprised the game didnt hit higher than 6th place. The game had 129k ingame eralier today on Steam where its selling like hotcakes.

 

[GHG]

People forget that you get a 20% discount on buying games with Gamepass. How many people use Gamepass to actually buy games?. It would be worth having Gamepass in that situation if you are a gamer that buys a decent amount of games.
Also, and this always never gets mentioned in these kind of threads, devs dont have to put games on Gamepass you know, they will get paid a handsome amount by Microsoft. Pre-orders have been up a good 2 or 3 months now and obvioulsly the deal Square got seemed fair compared to preorders.

Also i would imagine that because games are 'free' on Gmaepass (not free but you get me), gamers may be more willing to spend money on dlc and mtx as they didnt have to pay $60-70 for the actual game. That could be another way devs view Gamepass as good for them.

Yep, I assume (and hope) that when these games are leaving the service people who actually enjoy them buy them using the discount you mentioned.

As for the other avenues to make money when a game is on the service... DLC (provided it's high quality) I don't have a problem with, but developers/publishers throwing games on the service in the hope of making money via MTX or whatever this generations version of lootboxes will be? That's a slippery slope that I hope we never have to go down and try and come back from.

Why would any subscriber buy the game that just released on the service? At the moment we don't know how long the game will be there.

This is not one of your better posts mate

Why would I buy a game that's part of a subscription service? Because I want it to have permanence in my library like I do with all of the games I like. Why is that a problem?

Why do people still buy DVD's when Netflix exists?

I sometimes wonder if this is actually an enthusiast forum or whether it's just full of casual bums who will mindlessly jump to the next mega hyped title regardless of it's quality.

 

[Warnen]

So having $70 less in your wallet is a win now?

 

[DenchDeckard]

Phils comments were from two and a half years ago. The service gained like 15 million subs since then. Maybe their aren’t as many sales now? It doesn’t matter to ms or square or Xbox owners. You got a potential 20 million players week 1. No way the ps5 sold even close to 200k in the uk.

 

[plasmawave]

I can see stores not carrying physical Xbox games in the future.

 

[12Dannu123]

This is no surprise. It's on Game Pass and Game Pass is growing at a rapid pace. But it's expected that there will likely be more players on Xbox vs PS4/5

Yes indeed, Gamepass is a sacrifice of retail sales, however, this is just another excuse by many to minimize the importance of sales, which is vitally important to continued growth of studios and financing of games.....I wonder if whatever cheque the company gets is good enough to make them a sequel to this game with a higher budget....I'm thinking no, most of their revenue will be coming from retail sales and DLC if the game is popular......

The other downside to gamepass is that the games rotate, so buying DLC for a game only not to have the game in your library a few weeks/months later is a problem. I think having the game permanently in your library is a much better scenario in all instances....That's why even with PS Plus, it's yours as long as you are subscribed, nothing leaves your download and accessibility lists....as long as you claim them...

There isn't much impact on game studios or publishers if they release their games on Game Pass. The only difference being that the risk is mitigated. The cost falls on Microsoft and not the developer/publisher and consumer. Something Sony cannot afford to do at scale.

 

[jroc74]

What's the ouch for? It likely has far more players on Xbox, and the visibility of the game thanks to Game Pass is likely increasing sales across all platforms. Seems like a big win for Xbox, Square, and People can Fly.

This is a new one.

Game Pass increasing sales...for Playstation?

lol

Yeah its a big win for all involved, including Sony......but lets come back to reality.

 

[MasterCornholio]

totally valid man. I would have never played this game if it wasn’t for gamepass and I’m having an absolute blast. Games seriously fun to play but probs not worth the full asking price, it’s a little bit much with some of the writing etc. But the powers and gameplay is real fun, especially co op. thanks to gamepass I know I’ll always have a full party.
...only problem is the damn servers right now.

I tend to buy physical copies so if a game isn't worth the asking price I usually wait until the price drops. Unfortunately the only issue with that is some games never drop the price like Nintendo games for example. Paying 60$ for a game that's.2-3 years old is very difficult for me.

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

Phil Spencer: Game Pass leads to more game sales

This past weekend's X018 event was, arguably, a two-hour long advertisement for Game Pass, and given what Microsoft gam…

www.gamesindustry.biz

Shouldn’t gamepass be bolstering sales? According to lying Phil anyways.

Came out a few days ago.
Check sales figures in 6 months and see what's better.
Smh

 

[FatKingBallman]

Phils comments were from two and a half years ago. The service gained like 15 million subs since then. Maybe their aren’t as many sales now? It doesn’t matter to ms or square or Xbox owners. You got a potential 20 million players week 1. No way the ps5 sold even close to 200k in the uk.

But this is from few weeks ago :

Microsoft Reveals New Xbox Game Pass Stats And Explains How It's Different From Netflix

Xbox executive Sarah Bond has shared some new data about Xbox Game Pass that illuminates some of trends and behaviors of subscribers. She told Forbes that Game Pass subscribers tend to play more games overall, and--very importantly for Xbox and its partners--spend more money. Bond said Game...

www.neogaf.com

 

[DenchDeckard]

To be honest, i'm more surprised the game didnt hit higher than 6th place. The game had 129k ingame eralier today on Steam where its selling like hotcakes.

its probably lucky to have hit 80k on ps5 in the uk.

 

[FatKingBallman]

Came out a few days ago.
Check sales figures in 6 months and see what's better.
Smh

We will see NPD next month which track digital sales. And also, Xbox Top 10 charts.

EDIT :

or monthly GFK charts across the whole PAL territory which includes digital sales

 

[Chukhopops]

I cannot wrap my mind over how stupid this thread is:
- comparing sales when one version is available on Gamepass day 1?
- looking at retail sales only when the market is 60+% digital and probably more for a game like Outriders?
- using UK data and trying to draw conclusions out of it when it seems that all console versions have, overall, flopped when it comes to sales?

What can you even take out of those numbers?

 

[phil_t98]

Isn’t this a game that nobody liked?

 

[Fulcizombie]

Yep, I assume (and hope) that when these games are leaving the service people who actually enjoy them buy them using the discount you mentioned.

As for the other avenues to make money when a game is on the service... DLC (provided it's high quality) I don't have a problem with, but developers/publishers throwing games on the service in the hope of making money via MTX or whatever this generations version of lootboxes will be? That's a slippery slope that I hope we never have to go down and try and come back from.



Why would I buy a game that's part of a subscription service? Because I want it to have permanence in my library like I do with all of the games I like. Why is that a problem?

Why do people still buy DVD's when Netflix exists?

I sometimes wonder if this is actually an enthusiast forum or whether it's just full of casual bums who will mindlessly jump to the next mega hyped title regardless of it's quality.

As a Blu-ray collector I don’t consider games and movies to be the same thing. Games are more expendable to me, esp. games that last over 15 hours. I want to see a movie that I like at the best possible quality (while games are....the same on gamepass and retail copies , movies are better on disk) and possibly many times. When I finish a 50 hours games that’s it, no way am I replaying it again. Movie disk usually have a ton of extras too, esp. interesting for older films.

Hell, if there is a game that I played on gamepass and that I loved so much I will buy it at a later time and at a much cheaper price.

Anyway happy for the Sony fans that are celebrating this......

 

[Ogbert]

I’m not entirely sure why certain Sony fans are chuckling.

It just demonstrates that Gamepass has a game that people want to play. If you want to ‘win console warz’ you actually want the PS sales to be low, as it suggests a game no one wants.

 

[DenchDeckard]

But this is from few weeks ago :

Microsoft Reveals New Xbox Game Pass Stats And Explains How It's Different From Netflix

Xbox executive Sarah Bond has shared some new data about Xbox Game Pass that illuminates some of trends and behaviors of subscribers. She told Forbes that Game Pass subscribers tend to play more games overall, and--very importantly for Xbox and its partners--spend more money. Bond said Game...

www.neogaf.com

yup, so gamepass subs spend 20% more on the store than none gs subs? That’s the new facts. The messaging has changed. Doesn’t mean they are buying more games day one when games are on the service.
Devs and companies are playong the long game now. they Want to keep players engaged with their ip. Especially a game like outriders.

 

[jroc74]

So having $70 less in your wallet is a win now?

Outriders cost $59.

Must have the wrong game on your mind.

 

[KillaJamm]

Lol.... What's your problem. Show me on the doll where Phil touched you.

 

[Stuart360]

I’m not entirely sure why certain Sony fans are chuckling.

It just demonstrates that Gamepass has a game that people want to play. If you want to ‘win console warz’ you actually want the PS sales to be low, as it suggests a game no one wants.

It seems the game did sell bad on PS5. Only 36% more sales on PS5 over XSX/XSS, while having more console sold (yeah not convinced after these numbers), and the game being on Gamepass day one.

 

[jroc74]

I’m not entirely sure why certain Sony fans are chuckling.

It just demonstrates that Gamepass has a game that people want to play. If you want to ‘win console warz’ you actually want the PS sales to be low, as it suggests a game no one wants.

Thats not how it works, sorry. This actually makes no kind of sense.

Its a direct comparison to a platform with and without Game Pass., for a game that launched on Game Pass. It shows a counterpoint to why Game Pass isnt the best choice for everything.

Square Enix have to be ecstatic about the PS5 sales, regardless of how it does on Xbox. Its an absolute win/win for SE.

 

[thelastword]

This is no surprise. It's on Game Pass and Game Pass is growing at a rapid pace. But it's expected that there will likely be more players on Xbox vs PS4/5


There isn't much impact on game studios or publishers if they release their games on Game Pass. The only difference being that the risk is mitigated. The cost falls on Microsoft and not the developer/publisher and consumer.

We need some receipts.....Do we have an example of how much is being paid to these devs by MS. So unless we do, it's just assumption, where the reality does not even ascribe to or suggest what you are saying....

Truth is, if your argument is Kosher. Do you think that MS is writing a 15-20 million cheque to these devs? How much will actually offset the costs for such a game vs their retail chances. I guess every game is different, but in this case, it's not like it's doing badly on Steam or PS at retail....

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

We will see NPD next month which track digital sales. And also, Xbox Top 10 charts.

That's completely irrelevant to what I said.
Check in 6 months and see. If Xbox has 60% sales as PlayStation then it didn't hurt sales

 

[ACESHIGH]

Retail? Are we in 1998? When in the next offspring concert?

 

[FatKingBallman]

That's completely irrelevant to what I said.
Check in 6 months and see. If Xbox has 60% sales as PlayStation then it didn't hurt sales

It is relevant.

We will see also monthly GFK charts across the whole PAL territory which includes digital sales

 

[Zeroing]

He never uses logic. The game had only 36% more sales on PS5 over the Series consoles, and thats with PS5 supposedly selling more, and the game being on Gamepass.
How does that marry with any of the drivel he said?.

what he said does make some sense, we do not know how much was the game played in the gamepass. So we cannot compare it and say it is because of gamepass, it could be, but we are not sure. we need data!

Hence my comment , being logical means analysing something without being emotional about it.

 

[johnjohn]

GamePass isn't on PS platform. So, it can't increase sales there. Btw. demo was available on all available platforms

Game Pass absolutely increases sales on PlayStation, unless you think PS gamers live under a rock and don't consume any sort of media or interact with people.

 

[Zeroing]

Retail? Are we in 1998? When in the next offspring concert?

ohhh a GenZ, so tell me what Tiktok taught you today?

 

[Ogbert]

Thats not how it works, sorry. This actually make no kind of sense.

Why does it no make sense.

If a game is on Gamepass, sells 3000 copies on Xbox but 200,000 on PS it demonstrates it’s a popular game that will be a success on Gamepass and that, more importantly, X gamers are tied into Gamepass.

For the record, I’m loving the game on my PS5 but I have absolutely no idea who anyone can push this as a ‘fail’ for MS.

 

[Kokoloko85]

Question is how much did they get paid for being on gamepass. And how much do other 3rd party studios get paid, For day 1 gamepass and later in the cycle gamepass?

and How much does gamepass make?

MS has the money to sustain it but it is actually a good idea for them long term, especailly when it comes to bigger Triple AAA titles

 

[12Dannu123]

We need some receipts.....Do we have an example of how much is being paid to these devs by MS. So unless we do, it's just assumption, where the reality does not even ascribe to or suggest what you are saying....

Truth is, if your argument is Kosher. Do you think that MS is writing a 15-20 million cheque to these devs? How much will actually offset the costs for such a game vs their retail chances. I guess every game is different, but in this case, it's not like it's doing badly on Steam or PS at retail....

Each game released on Game Pass has different compensation models. The game selling well on PS or Steam is irrelevant to MS. They would only pay the cost on the Xbox platform.

 

[Hobbygaming]

Phil Spencer: Game Pass leads to more game sales

This past weekend's X018 event was, arguably, a two-hour long advertisement for Game Pass, and given what Microsoft gam…

www.gamesindustry.biz

Yeah some AAA 3rd party developers are going to have disappointing sales due to Gamepass

 

[Aguero9320]

Inane thread. In fact, insane thread. Weakest warrioring yet. Ouch indeed. PS fanboys clinging to obviously (fucking obviously) massively distorted ‘sales’ when the world has moved on around them.

Personally, I would never have bought this in a million years. Been playing it all weekend, and love it. I think I’ll buy some mtx just to give these clowns the middle finger

Shut up about GamePass and how you don’t like it, no one cares and we don’t have time to read it over and over again - we have too many GamePass games to play.

 

[jroc74]

Isn’t this a game that nobody liked?

Apparently, looking at PS4 and PS5 sales, many did like it. Also saw its in the top 10 played on Xbox, so there's something.

Unit sales.
Users that downloaded and played.

Game Pass absolutely increases sales on PlayStation, unless you think PS gamers live under a rock and don't consume any sort of media or interact with people.

This is crazy, think about what you're saying for one minute, lol. I know some ppl love Game Pass, c'mon.

 

[johnjohn]

Why does it no make sense.

If a game is on Gamepass, sells 3000 copies on Xbox but 200,000 on PS it demonstrates it’s a popular game that will be a success on Gamepass and that, more importantly, X gamers are tied into Gamepass.

For the record, I’m loving the game on my PS5 but I have absolutely no idea who anyone can push this as a ‘fail’ for MS.

Yea, this is a massive win for Xbox and Game Pass. How can anyone think that a hit game launching on the service is a negative lol? And looking at the Most Played list on Xbox, this is a massive hit.

 

[Esppiral]

Is this a joke thread?

 

[GametimeUK]

I never bought Outriders for my Xbox because I already had Outriders on my Xbox with Gamepass. It will be the same story with MLB too.

 

[Stuart360]

Question is how much did they get paid for being on gamepass. And how much do other 3rd party studios get paid, For day 1 gamepass and later in the cycle gamepass?

and How much does gamepass make?

MS has the money to sustain it but it is actually a good idea for them long term, especailly when it comes to bigger Triple AAA titles

You have to speculate to accumilate. And i dont think Microsoft care really, they are in for the long run. Just imagine how much subs are going to be boosted when the likes of the next DOOM, Fallout, Starfield, and especially the next Elder Scrolls release on Gamepass day one. And thats not including all the other first party games hitting the service day one from now on.
Like i have said many times, i expect 50mil Gamepass subs by the end of the gen, and in reality i'm probably low balling with that number.

 

[IDappa]

Why would anyone buy the game on release day?, It's almost like people would rather see if they like the game first and then purchase it after the fact, almost like back in the day you would rent a game from a blockbuster and then purchase it from a retail store if you enjoyed it.

Original poster truly believes that if it's on gamepass people will purchase it in the first initial release seconds?.