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Next-gen is a failure if a single title launches at 30fps

Codes 208

Member
I like 60FPS as much as the next guy but if people expecting me skip a game because it doesn't run at 60FPS are out of their mind.
Precisely. Plenty of My favorite games this gen were 30fps like Bloodborne and BotW. Would 60fps be nice? Yes, more is always better, but i also understand you cant give more frames without taking something else in return whether its resolution or graphics
 

Ballthyrm

Member
Beginning November, every single game launched on PS5 and Xbox needs to hit a bare minimum of 60fps for it to be a true generational leap. With the amount of money these consoles will cost with all the flops, anything less than 60fps is unacceptable. Anything less than 60fps will be the result of lazy devs trying to push their game out as fast as possible and Microsoft, as well as Sony should mandate a 60fps minimum when launching a title on their platform.

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Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
Precisely. Plenty of My favorite games this gen were 30fps like Bloodborne and BotW. Would 60fps be nice? Yes, more is always better, but i also understand you cant give more frames without taking something else in return whether its resolution or graphics
Funny thing is people in NeoGAF all going crazy over "ray-tracing" and how its going to change gaming and these same people still expecting the games run 60FPS.
 

Stuart360

Member
Every PS1 game could of been 60fps. Its not simply a power thing. Devs will often push graphics over framerate on consoles, its always been like that, and always will be like that, unl;ess Sony and Microsoft madate 60fps in every game, and they wont do that.
If you care that much about framerate, PC is your only choice.
 

Kagero

Member
I hate this argument. Same with resolution. Shit stunts creativity and holds back innovation. Give me next gen physics/graphics any day.
 

Nickolaidas

Member
Yeah because sitting at a desk is hard work. 🤣
Go cry some more.
Don't know whom you're kidding when you're 'working', but you shouldn't judge based on yourself. Just because someone isn't digging doesn't mean that he can't do stressful and tiring work.
 

Lupin3

Targeting terrorists with a D-Pad
As much as I fucking loathe 30 fps, I'm sure It'll be present. Just like the pile of "the rest of the game you paid for" roadmaps.
 

chriskun

Member
He’s just saying they are not lazy, so you’re point makes no sense. In response to “no one is holding a gun to their heads dude”(forgot to quote)
 
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V4skunk

Banned
Don't know whom you're kidding when you're 'working', but you shouldn't judge based on yourself. Just because someone isn't digging doesn't mean that he can't do stressful and tiring work.
Try harder mate. The majority is not stupid.
Being a dev is long hours for sure but saying it is hard work is a joke. And yes being a labourer digging is much harder work and pays much much less.
 

Ballthyrm

Member
With adaptive sync on the new console i think we can say goodbye to that idea.
It would probably be locked at 30 for people that have TV's without adaptive sync.

And probably 30 and above for people with the new tech.
I expect them to make the same thing they did last time, IE more powerful version of the base console for people who care about 4k or 60 fps.
 
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Stuart360

Member
I think there will probably more 60fps next gen, especially in the first couple of years with all the cross gen shit, but by the end of the gen i expect 70-80% of all the games released will be of been 30fps.
 
I like 60FPS as much as the next guy but if people expecting me skip a game because it doesn't run at 60FPS are out of their mind.
If it's not a fighting game, 60fps is a no go. If a game can't run higher than my refresh rate, it's a no go. 60fps should be the absolute MINIMUM for all games in the last 10 years. Prioritizing resolution over framerate was the worst mistake devs made this generation.
 

Ballthyrm

Member
If it's not a fighting game, 60fps is a no go. If a game can't run higher than my refresh rate, it's a no go. 60fps should be the absolute MINIMUM for all games in the last 10 years. Prioritizing resolution over framerate was the worst mistake devs made this generation.

That's not where the Horsepower is going.
It's going in better light, better vfx, better AI, better visual distance, better networking, and so on.

Most AAA games still don't run 30fps 1080p most of time, they have adaptive resolution to keep a 30fps lock and a ton of other adapative tech features.

Please go watch 40-50 hours of digital foundry youtube channel and learn a thing or two.

Sure, any PvP game should target 60 fps, lower input lag, private servers, and rollback netcode.
It need a ton of investment though and it usually mean your solo game and your multiplayer game are two separate games.

For PvE game i think it should be up to the Devs to pick what they think is best.
 
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That's not where the Horsepower is going.
It's going in better light, better vfx, better AI, better visual distance, better networking, and so on.

Most AAA games still don't run 30fps 1080p most of time, they have adaptive resolution to keep a 30fps lock and a ton of other adapative tech features.

Please go watch 40-50 hours of digital foundry youtube channel and learn a thing or two.
Common sense shows that devs have been aiming at 4k, vs 1080p @60fps.
Please go watch 40-50 hours of digital foundry youtube channel and learn a thing or two. Please do that.

Would you not expect lighting, AI, physics, etc, to get better over time? That's a given. But when MS and Sony push 4k, instead of focusing on framerate, this is why you get subpar experiences. I can't blame devs 100%, because it all starts with the hardware. Using a weak ass Jaguar cpu was a really dumb decision to begin with.
 
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nikeboy94

Member
If a game releases at 30fps, it just means the dev poured more into the graphics, not because they're lazy.

Before any game is made, a decision is made at a creative level about whether they will be targetting 30fps or 60fps (on console), depending on the type of game they want to make. When that same game comes out on PC, the devs give us that freedom to utilise our pricy graphic cards to push resolution and framerate above and beyond their target.

The next generation may be in a position where games look amazing even when they target 60fps and more devs may opt to do that rather than go for 30fps, but we will always see games at 30fps due to the push for graphics, and it will not always be due to laziness or rushes to meet release dates.
 
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If a game releases at 30fps, it just means the dev poured more into the graphics, not because they're lazy.

Before any game is made, a decision is made at a creative level about whether they will be targetting 30fps or 60fps (on console), depending on the type of game they want to make. When that same game comes out on PC, the devs give us that freedom to utilise our pricy graphic cards to push resolution and framerate above and beyond their target.

The next generation may be in a position where games look amazing even when they target 60fps and more devs may opt to do that rather than go for 30fps, but we will always see games at 30fps due to the push for graphics, and it will not always be due to laziness or rushes to meet release dates.
You sir, have a big brain. Said it better than I could to Ballthyrm Ballthyrm
 

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
If a game releases at 30fps, it just means the dev poured more into the graphics, not because they're lazy.
It also depends on budget, time and man power or if the devs want to go with open world or even the game uses lot of physics similar to Control (which I heard has some FPS issues for that very reason).
 
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No, it's not. That's where most of the resources get spend on every game.
So why is 4k even a thing for games? 4k should only be for movies and what not, unless the hardware can output that. There are so many games that go for high end visuals, but prioritize that over framerate. It's the dumbest thing to do, as framerate, input lag, etc are extremely vital to reaction time and make a better experience than 24fps with a higher resolution. That shit is pure cringe.
 
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Ballthyrm

Member
So why is 4k even a thing for games? 4k should only be for movies and what not, unless the hardware can output that. There are so many games that go for high end visuals, but prioritize that over framerate. It's the dumbest thing to do, as framerate, input lag, etc are extremely vital to reaction time and make a better experience than 24fps with a higher resolution. That shit is pure cringe.

4k != high end visuals
If you think i'm defending 4k, well, i'm not.

4K is as you said the biggest waste of horsepower you can do in a game.
Most people sit far enough from their TV that they couldn't even see the difference.
 
4k != high end visuals
If you think i'm defending 4k, well, i'm not.

4K is as you said the biggest waste of horsepower you can do in a game.
Most people sit far enough from their TV that they couldn't even see the difference.
So.... With that being said, why is 4k the aim for many games, rather than running at 1080p 60fps with better textures, ai, physics, lighting, aa, ambient occlusion, lod, etc? Would it make more sense to sacrifice resolution for Fidelity and immersion? 30fps is horrible, dropping below 30fps is a nightmare. 60fps is barely tolerable. Maybe I'm spoiled.
 

Stuart360

Member
So.... With that being said, why is 4k the aim for many games, rather than running at 1080p 60fps with better textures, ai, physics, lighting, aa, ambient occlusion, lod, etc? Would it make more sense to sacrifice resolution for Fidelity and immersion? 30fps is horrible, dropping below 30fps is a nightmare. 60fps is barely tolerable. Maybe I'm spoiled.
Imo next gen consoles should of targeted 1440p. That would leave room for much better visuals. We couldnt even hit 1080p with every game this gen, then they are going straight to 4k. Its a waste of resources, and dont get me started on Ray Tracing.
 
Imo next gen consoles should of targeted 1440p. That would leave room for much better visuals. We couldnt even hit 1080p with every game this gen, then they are going straight to 4k. Its a waste of resources, and dont get me started on Ray Tracing.
I agree with 1440p, but there are like no tv's that support that resolution. Either 1080p, or 4k, no in-between. So they literally waste resources to aim at 4k, rather than everything else. Frame rate comes later apparently.

On the other hand, I thought Ray tracing was a waste, AT FIRST. But playing metro, tomb raider, and control, completely changed my mind. I wish it was implemented in EVERY game, after framerate of course.
 
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Knightime_X

Member
They had a shitload of overhead coming into this gen and we still got plenty of 30fps. Again, this isnt new. Developers will push for what they want their game to be, whether its performance or graphics.

there are of course plenty of devs now pushing for 60fps as a standard and i commend those devs, but suggesting next gen requires 60fps to be successful is downright childish.
1.8tf vs 12ft
4k 60fps achievable at 5tf.

Not saying 30fps won't happen but this gen I feel it'll be the minority.

They can peasant frames per second all day long but for the ones who wish not to hadouken blood from our eyes throw us a bone and give a 60fps option.
Literally no reason not to other than being a 60fps hater or something.
 
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Butz

Banned
Beginning November, every single game launched on PS5 and Xbox needs to hit a bare minimum of 60fps for it to be a true generational leap. With the amount of money these consoles will cost with all the flops, anything less than 60fps is unacceptable. Anything less than 60fps will be the result of lazy devs trying to push their game out as fast as possible and Microsoft, as well as Sony should mandate a 60fps minimum when launching a title on their platform.

Cute how console players think 60FPS is a true generational leap when there's already 240hz monitors now :D
60FPS in games that need it, 30FPS in games that don't need (pretty much every single Sony exclusive because theyre slow paced TPS)
 
Cute how console players think 60FPS is a true generational leap when there's already 240hz monitors now :D
60FPS in games that need it, 30FPS in games that don't need (pretty much every single Sony exclusive because theyre slow paced TPS)
You forgot that their are ultrawide and 360hz displays!
 

Butz

Banned
Imo next gen consoles should of targeted 1440p. That would leave room for much better visuals. We couldnt even hit 1080p with every game this gen, then they are going straight to 4k. Its a waste of resources, and dont get me started on Ray Tracing.
The thing is that there are barely any 1440p TVs, so you'd either watch at 1080p with downsampling or 4k with upscaling.
 

Iorv3th

Member
With moderate or decent hardware, pc gaming is a breeze. If it's a taxing game, it might hover around 60fps or so, but definitely better than 30fps and BELOW, on consoles.

Depends on the game. Stuff like Dark Souls was locked to 30fps until dante fix came out.
 
Depends on the game. Stuff like Dark Souls was locked to 30fps until dante fix came out.
Which is a good and poor example, because the game should have never been locked, but at the same time shows what can be done on pc. Easy fix, and it works great. But should never have been locked to begin with. But pretty much only fighting games are locked at 60, everything else will play at whatever your hardware can output, including 1000fps in some games
 
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You want 60 fps or more ? Buy a PC.

You dream if you think that next-gen games will be mostly 60 fps ... Developers, especially AAA, aim for the best possible graphics and therefore the minimum acceptable framerate, ie 30 fps.
 

EDMIX

Member
Well based on history for most developers more powerful system means, bigger open world, higher resolution, higher quality models and more extras like ray tracing other crap.

So chances are developers might choose 30FPS in order to add higher quality graphics.

I would like developers give us option lower the resolution in order to get smoother FPS.

Huh? So you are saying developers have a choice and say in the matter? I'm just...SHOCKED to hear this. This is brand new /s

I don't get why many argue about FPS completely ignoring that its always been developer dependent. Its why I always laugh when I hear someone state frames as being some bullet point that MS or Sony must meet next gen. If a developer wanted 1080p 60fps this gen or even last gen, its not hard to do....simply forgo ALL FANCY FEATURES.

What works for Wipeout HD on PS3, clearly won't work for something like The Last Of Us on PS3, its not saying it can't be 1080p 60fps on PS3, its saying at what fucking cost?

So Naughty Dog can have a PS1 or PS2 looking game on PS3 JUST to hit some fucking number? So I don't get how the conversation is always on what Sony or MS can do about it, developers clearly are in control of how demanding they make their games. Not Sony nor MS.
 
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