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[Poltz]

Concerned about Sony.

 

[systemr123]

let's see tomorrow if they lose you forever.

Also if you look a few slides down you see they’ll actually going to invest more money in single player games vs now/the past as well. They just invest extra more in love services which I hate.

But investing more in single player games in the first place makes me happy, I don’t need that other stuff in my life though .

 

[Cyborg]

Awsome results! Excepted more Extra/Premium subscribers.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Am I reading this wrong or something. What does this chart indicate?

Basically, everything is coming to PC....and more gaas.

You guys simping over big Jim slade but he's on a mission....and it isn't console business.

 

[PuppetMaster]

What are all the announced Sony live service games this vocal minority is complaining about?

There are non on my radar. Are these all unannounced games?

 

[Duchess]

Unless Sony and Insomniac screw it up, Spider-Man 2 is going to massively increase PS5's lead this year (or in 2024, if it happens to release then - I believe Sony actually said "fiscal year").

 

[jonnyp]

This chart by itself provides zero context and I think is causing people to incorrectly interpret.

1. Investment allocation majority shift from SP to live service =/= decreased output in SP games, especially in the extremely likely scenario that Sony is growing the market size as opposed to cannibalization of one segment's resources by another. Meaning nominal investment dollars for both segments recognize net increase.

2. Sony is a newcomer to live service market so initial investment will be higher at present compared to single player operations which at this point is well established; SP infrastructure investments for Sony signature 1st party SP games took place during latter half of PS3 and peaked during PS4 I would say.

No one of us that you quoted said it would mean decreased single player output but it does show a ridiculous focus on GaaS shit.

 

[Three]

What irks me the most about this is the fact that they are clearly stating that's what they want to put more investment into from a first party perspective. So 60% of their resources will be going towards live service crap? Nah, not for me, they can forget seeing my money going forwards if that's where they're heading.

Keep in mind that they are just increasing spending and investment overall though. Notice the size of the light blue 40% is the same size as the light blue 80% of the past meaning they don't see a reduction in traditional game releases/investment just an increase in games overall boosted mostly by GaaS. Just buy the single player games they will continue to release. I did fear that there would be an increased presence of GaaS with declining game sales and a shift to subs.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

This is why I'm starting to lose interest in Playstation.

Sony is the only one still investing in triple A single player games.

 

[reksveks]

Just buy the single player games they will continue to release

Agree, this is all that meaningfully matters.

Notice the size of the light blue 40% is the same size as the light blue 80% of the past meaning they don't see a reduction in traditional game releases/investment just an increase in games overall boosted mostly by GaaS

Devils advocate but there would have 5 years of inflation between the two FY so one could maybe argue that is terms of resources, SP games is getting a minor decrease.

 

[TaylorSwiftFan]

What are all the announced Sony live service games this vocal minority is complaining about?

There are non on my radar. Are these all unannounced games?

Doesn’t matter that they’re not on your radar - they are coming as per Sony’s slides.

 

[CGNoire]

Sony is the only one still investing in triple A single player games.

Until they realize they dont need SP games anymore. Not all AAA SP game fans are willing to fund that with there purchases.

 

[Bonfires Down]

Sony is the only one still investing in triple A single player games.

 

[Woopah]

Am I reading this wrong or something. What does this chart indicate?

Not sure, what does it indicate?

By FY25 they expect to be releasing as many PC and mobile titles as PS5 titles.

With Sony riding this wave of momentum, how could the competition possibly respond?

This seems like a rout.

I'd say there's plenty of room for both Xbox and Switch to grow alongside Sony, as long as they make the right moves.

What are all the announced Sony live service games this vocal minority is complaining about?

There are non on my radar. Are these all unannounced games?

Most are unannounced, we'll probably see some of them tonight.

 

[hepfom]

I'll bet the reason their investment is increasing so much is because they are going after sports licenses for their GAAS catalog. We haven't heard anything about the Premier League rights since February. I wonder if Sony decided to get involved in the bidding?

 

[reksveks]

We haven't heard anything about the Premier League rights since February. I wonder if Sony decided to get involved in the bidding?

You talking about rights for being in a game? EA has exclusive rights it seems to the PL and the bigger leagues.

Welcome to the Club - EA SPORTS FC™ is the Future of Interactive Football

A New Era Begins in 2023 - After EA SPORTS Delivers Most Expansive FIFA Ever This Year

www.ea.com

 

[Astray]

That's not what I wanted to see.

They're adding a lot of live service investment to kickstart that segment in their publishing range. But Singleplayer remains strong.

They want to do this because it guards against companies like ABK deciding to sell to Xbox, deal feels dead rn, but I definitely can see why Sony panicked there.

Maybe I'm missing something, but how does this comparison accommodate for the increased prices for PS5 versus PS4 in the given timeframes? Full game revenue is actually down (which makes sense given the increase cost) and the overall spend increase is actually due to subscriptions and accessories (which are also more expensive), as well as higher "addon" buy in - which I believe would be microtransactions and DLC? At a glance, this would appear to favour PS5 simply due to the price increases this generation?

A former boss of mine taught me something about price increases: Companies mainly use them when they are in leading market positions, and thus feel dollar growth is stagnant.

Say you have a million customers buying day 1 at $60, getting you $60m in cash*.

If you raise the price to $70, some customers will start moving towards other brands or not buying day 1, let's say that's %5 of customers, meaning that now you have 950k customers buying at $70, this gets you $66.5m day 1 (which means you got 6.5m extra!), Now you start doing sales etc and you slowly grow the customerbase back to your original 1m (or more!), And voila you got the dollar amount growth going again.

Sometimes you don't even get an immediate decrease, like what happened with the new Zelda!

The math is brutal to us consumers, but it works if you have a super desirable product.

* I'm discarding the percentages paid to retail and dev and focusing on simple revenue for simplicity's sake, even if you add the percentages back in, it will still be the same effect for all involved provided that said percentages are stable.

 

[Portugeezer]

Most single player games bomb.

Not from Sony.

So why can't I expect the same wkth GaaS? Maybe the majority are hits and a lot of popular games stop being that popular since sony is offering something better (which is not hard).

I agree, but with singleplayer, once you're done you're done.

Live service is constantly competing for people's time, and with each successful live service game, the available pool of players becomes smaller and smaller.

I have confidence TLOU Factions will be big.

 

[lh032]

I agree, but with singleplayer, once you're done you're done.

Live service is constantly competing for people's time, and with each successful live service game, the available pool of players becomes smaller and smaller.

I have confidence TLOU Factions will be big.

Sony need constant revenue streams from GaaS as well.

So if GaaS succeed for Sony, its good for us SP fans

 

[Zathalus]

Sony is the only one still investing in triple A single player games.

Hardly.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Most single player games bomb.

Not from Sony.

So why can't I expect the same wkth GaaS? Maybe the majority are hits and a lot of popular games stop being that popular since sony is offering something better (which is not hard).

It's very hard to create a successful gaas. You need a concept that will draw audiences, and if it's a competitive genre then good luck. The difficulty then is not to have people try your gaas, but keep making them come back which means continuous support.

You will see how hard it will be for Sony to break into that space. This move comes from investors demand not a userbase one, because there are no shortage of live service games on Playstation. Meanwhile Nintendo is out there making bank without needing to shift their whole strategy, maybe because they don't have investors on their back demanding to extract more and more and more from each player.

My bet is Sony will come up short on their live service games, and their single player offerings will be fewer this gen, and discourse around Playstation by the hardcore fanbase will shift.

Also sidenote, their % spending forecast for PS games in 25 decreased from their forecast last year. Sounds great Jimbo.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Sony is the only one still investing in triple A single player games.

Shit, I didn’t realize Nintendo stopped making games.

 

[nemiroff]

Wow, their PC side is growing a lot faster than I was expecting.

VR headset sales = disappointing. As someone who's positive to all things VR I was hoping they was going be able to somewhat drag the VR market up from the lull. But it appears they basically have been selling upgrades to existing customers (or am I wrong here?)

 

[Nautilus]

That's not what I wanted to see.

Oh boy, that's not good.

 

[Nautilus]

Shit, I didn’t realize Nintendo stopped making games.

Yeah, some seem to ignore Nintendo for some reason.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Oh boy, that's not good.

PlayStation hasn't died yet. I'd say give them the benefit until they start failing if it happens.

 

[Horseganador]

 

[MasterCornholio]

PlayStation

 

[OmegaSupreme]

With Sony riding this wave of momentum, how could the competition possibly respond?

This seems like a rout.

We've seen how. By trying to buy everything they can. Good job Sony. Truly impressive.

 

[Bonfires Down]

That is indeed a huge investment into GaaS before they had even one such release. No doubt it is something they should pursue, but AAA single player has been working extremely well for them so such a sudden and large shift in priorities seems premature.

Games are not getting any cheaper to produce so just keeping the same investment onto SP games will result in fewer such releases.

 

[PeteBull]

Time to call xbox from now on- Brand C

 

[darrylgorn]

People get way too worked up about Live service games.

It's 2023.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Basically, everything is coming to PC....and more gaas.

You guys simping over big Jim slade but he's on a mission....and it isn't console business.

It's not PC business, either. The future is platform agnostic, and selling your shit on every possible platform is just a stepping stone for a couple of years. End goal clearly is streaming, totally independent of hardware capabilities.

 

[Topher]

It's 2023.

 

[Nautilus]

PlayStation hasn't died yet. I'd say give them the benefit until they start failing if it happens.

Oh, I will. Its just that its never a good thing to see these stuff being brought up by CEOs.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Oh, I will. Its just that its never a good thing to see these stuff being brought up by CEOs.

My opinion is if they continue to release games that I want to play that's all that matters to me.

Sure most gaas titles won't interest but I'm sure playstation will still have great single player games.

 

[Thirty7ven]

That is indeed a huge investment into GaaS before they had even one such release. No doubt it is something they should pursue, but AAA single player has been working extremely well for them so such a sudden and large shift in priorities seems premature.

Games are not getting any cheaper to produce so just keeping the same investment onto SP games will result in fewer such releases.

Miles Morales showed that you can do a smaller scope, iterative sequel/spin off and have it do really well.

It’s a shame they have apparently dropped that strategy.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

That is indeed a huge investment into GaaS before they had even one such release. No doubt it is something they should pursue, but AAA single player has been working extremely well for them so such a sudden and large shift in priorities seems premature.

Games are not getting any cheaper to produce so just keeping the same investment onto SP games will result in fewer such releases.

It's not the same investment.

eg. 40% of $500M is more than 80% of $150M.

And they used percentages without any actual numbers for a reason.

 

[RevGaming]

It's very hard to create a successful gaas.

It's very hard to create successful single player. Sony makes it look easy and this is why you have this view.

You will see how hard it will be for Sony to break into that space.

I have no idea. You don't know either. Let the games do the talking. Mlb and gt7 are good examples they can do it.

 

[RevGaming]

I agree, but with singleplayer, once you're done you're done.

Live service is constantly competing for people's time, and with each successful live service game, the available pool of players becomes smaller and smaller.

I have confidence TLOU Factions will be big.

I think sony has a chance since most multiplayer games... all of them are from ps4.

 

[RevGaming]

live service games are different. Unlike SP, you need engagement. Without that, you cant sustain those games, even if its high quality.
Think of it like shooter games.

Not really. I played a ton f of last of us and had not new content. You don't have to add that much if it releases with enough content day 1. Devs are doing it wrong.

 

[Gaelyon]

"Factions 2" or whatever will be its title, from ND, will be the standard by which we will judge how Sony new GaaS strategy is a likely success or not.
It's made by Sony's most prestigious and experimented studio, from a worldwide established IP growing with the HBO show, is developped from years ago and feature both single player gameplay and large multi... Hopefully the State of Play will confirm that very soon. If ND manage that feat it'll prove Sony can deliver on both side. Not an easy feat at all.

 

[Dr_Ifto]

Not really. I played a ton f of last of us and had not new content. You don't have to add that much if it releases with enough content day 1. Devs are doing it wrong.

From an engagement standpoint, SP games are one and done. THey dont get anymore from you.

 

[MasterCornholio]

From an engagement standpoint, SP games are one and done. THey dont get anymore from you.

True but maybe what they want is for you to buy more SP games in the future. I understand the value of engagement but it's only worth something if the player continually gives you money through MTX, subs or DLC.

 

[Crayon]

That is indeed a huge investment into GaaS before they had even one such release.

They have gt7. People are expecting Farmville or something?

 

[DeepEnigma]

They have gt7. People are expecting Farmville or something?

And MLB The Show. Another game that retains all its modes (Franchise, RttS, Online, etc) despite a GaaS Diamond Dynasty mode.

 

[Crayon]

And MLB The Show. Another game that retains all its modes (Franchise, RttS, Online, etc) despite a GaaS Diamond Dynasty mode.

There you go. Horizon mmo is out of the ordinary but otherwise you are talking twisted metal, socom, whatever.

I'd like to know whether gears is a third person cinematic story driven single player blah blah or a gass.

 

[feynoob]

Not really. I played a ton f of last of us and had not new content. You don't have to add that much if it releases with enough content day 1. Devs are doing it wrong.

Except you aren't the only person that is playing it.
You need alot of users to sustain it such a a game like that.
That means you need alot of content that can satisfy those people.

Look at halo infinite MP/F2P mode for example.

 

[Fabieter]

Thats just the investment percentage. If you remove the live service part and just look at the grey bars that represent traditional gaming, you see they are also planing to invest more in traditional gaming in 2025 compared to 2023, and will be on par with what they invested in 2019.

Its just a big extra investment on live services, that most will probably crash and burn. Also dont like to see it, but is where the industry is heading cuz when 1 live service game gets popular, it prints money for many years with little effort just requiring updates to keep ppl spending.

I mean yes but its indeed sad that they wont push more for sp games as they already do.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

From an engagement standpoint, SP games are one and done. THey dont get anymore from you.

Well there is DLC/expansions.