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If Playstation or Xbox cannot contact an PSN/XBL activation server or equivalent, they will be bricks in the future (highly unlikely)

Zog

Banned
Wait, so was I right in thinking setting it to "offline" solves it? :pie_thinking:
You have to get online to set it up before you can set it to offline. So let's say you buy an Xbox One in about 10-15 years and you can't connect to the Xbox servers, you couldn't use it at all. If you bought a used one you wouldn't want to format it because then you would be unable to use it after that. Honestly, people should not accept this from any company.
 
Difference is that all my Steam games are sitting on an HDD safely archived...because...ya know...I'm actually allowed to access the file system and back up my files. Digital distribution itself was never the problem it was digital distribution in walled gardens.

How exactly are you going to play your steam games without steam?
 

clem84

Gold Member
Sorry if this has been asked before.

Would it be possible for Sony to issue one last OS update before ending support for legacy consoles, for games to forego this activation using the CMOS? It seems to me this would be an easy solution.
 

Mr Moose

Member
Difference is that all my Steam games are sitting on an HDD safely archived...because...ya know...I'm actually allowed to access the file system and back up my files. Digital distribution itself was never the problem it was digital distribution in walled gardens.
I'm not a PC gamer so I have no idea, but do playing Steam games require a Steam account? Like if you've downloaded it, lets say Steam is down, can you launch it without any problems?

You have to get online to set it up before you can set it to offline. So let's say you buy an Xbox One in about 10-15 years and you can't connect to the Xbox servers, you couldn't use it at all. If you bought a used one you wouldn't want to format it because then you would be unable to use it after that. Honestly, people should not accept this from any company.
Thankfully most of my games are disc based so on the rare chance the servers do get killed and Sony goes bye bye I'll still be able to play them, even if I have to just use a guest account.
Fuck the all digital future.
 

GHG

Member
Exactly, alot of 'ifs & buts'. if Steam or Epic stores go bust, ther would be alot of digital libraries lost

The seven seas exist to be sailed for a reason.

Preservation on PC will never be an issue for that very reason. Even if one day I can't access my purchased games legitimately there will always be another way outside of my backups.
 

Zog

Banned
The seven seas exist to be sailed for a reason.

Preservation on PC will never be an issue for that very reason. Even if one day I can't access my purchased games legitimately there will always be another way outside of my backups.
People shouldn't have to resort to piracy to play the games they bought.
 
I'm not a PC gamer so I have no idea, but do playing Steam games require a Steam account? Like if you've downloaded it, lets say Steam is down, can you launch it without any problems?
As long as Steam is in offline mode, yeah. Failing that (lets say that you need to reinstall it or the game has some kind of additional always online DRM)...well...it's an open system, with no code signing shenanigans like on console, I can use whatever executables I like, there's nothing stopping me from patching the DRM out. I'd NEVER go all digital on any of my consoles, but I happily do so on PC.
 

Zog

Banned
As long as Steam is in offline mode, yeah. Failing that (lets say that you need to reinstall it or the game has some kind of additional always online DRM)...well...it's an open system, with no code signing shenanigans like on console, I can use whatever executables I like, there's nothing stopping me from patching the DRM out. I'd NEVER go all digital on any of my consoles, but I happily do so on PC.
It may be true that Steam is 'Digital Distribution done better' than on consoles but Steam is where the cancer of Digital Distribution really got popular and then spread to consoles.
 
It may be true that Steam is 'Digital Distribution done better' than on consoles but Steam is where the cancer of Digital Distribution really got popular and then spread to consoles.
Like I said, digital distribution isn't the problem, it's the walled garden it's done in. If the consoles were more like PCs in that regard (which they never will be because the manufacturers don't understand piracy) then I'd have no problem with it. Where I get the data is irrelevant as long as I can continue to use it in perpetuity. On PC I can. On console I cannot.
 

ethomaz

Banned
Wait, so was I right in thinking setting it to "offline" solves it? :pie_thinking:
Yes.
But you need to change the battery first.

Won't the system require an online authentication first after the battery is changed? Isn't that the whole point of the potential issue?
If you change to Offline... nope... all games will work.

PS. Owned games... PS+ games needs internet because the console needs to check the subscription.
 
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ANIMAL1975

Member


There's the Smart Delivery too.

Thank god MS would never do anything sneaky...

The one that gives me reason to trust with their actions.

The plot thickens Craig of War Craig of War
Wizz-Art Wizz-Art
Marvel Studios Wow GIF by Disney+
 

ethomaz

Banned
Sorry if this has been asked before.

Would it be possible for Sony to issue one last OS update before ending support for legacy consoles, for games to forego this activation using the CMOS? It seems to me this would be an easy solution.
On Sony systems you just need to change the battery and set offline and play the game you have on storage.

Now if the servers goes down you probably won’t download others games but what you have works... digital or physical.
 
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Zog

Banned
I agree, but unfortunately that's what it will take in a few instances going forward as digital becomes the primary method of distribution for games.
It doesn't have to be this way but there are too many gamers who just don't think it's an important enough issue to stand against it.
 

Loxus

Member
Won't the system require an online authentication first after the battery is changed? Isn't that the whole point of the potential issue?
Since when is a battery tied to authentication.
Come on people, these company think way ahead of us.

PlayStation know one day the battery will die and all you have to do is just change it.
Only mistake they did was to tie it to trophies with all the time stuff.
This isn't any different than the PSN name change problem.
 

Three

Member
And once you replace them, everything works without needing authentication.

The issue is that, people are focusing on replacing the battery too much, it's what happens AFTER the battery is replaced that's the problem.
Not true. Your windows 10 license key is stored in ACPI tables and is wiped if the battery dies. Guess what you need to do to access windows again? Authentication online.
 
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Loxus

Member
Not true. Your windows 10 license key is stored in ACPI tables and is wiped if the battery dies. Guess what you need to do to access windows again? Authentication online.
Depends on if the license is digital or physical.
 
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Not true. Your windows 10 license key is stored in ACPI tables and is wiped if the battery dies. Guess what you need to do to access windows again? Authentication online.
Except that's not true. Windows 10 is basically fully functional without activation of any description. All you have to put up with is a watermark (oooooh noooo) and being unable to change the wallpaper. That's all you get for your money...that's it.
 
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Mr Moose

Member
Yes.
But you need to change the battery first.


If you change to Offline... nope... all games will work.

PS. Owned games... PS+ games needs internet because the console needs to check the subscription.
So it really is just like when PSN goes down (back in PS3 days and early PS4 days mostly) and some games don't work on the PS4? Unticking connect to the internet is the workaround.
I think PS+ games show a date of when your PS+ ends, so they might be able to be played until that time.
We need more testing!
42DB6E181C5DD2A4EA3A98277991ED0A4CDA23F3

I honestly don't think this will really affect many if at all, especially any time soon but I am interested in this from a purely technical perspective.
Is there easy workarounds? What is affected? Why? Are saves linked to accounts or can you transfer them from one account to another? Trophies and shit won't matter, because we're talking "end of days" for the servers of each console.

Not true. Your windows 10 license key is stored in ACPI tables and is wiped if the battery dies. Guess what you need to do to access windows again? Authentication online.
Isn't it stored in the registry? Does the CMOS battery affect a lot? I've only used it to reset BIOS passwords before 🤩
 
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Well, this thread backfired on those wanting to bash PS5 and prop up Series X. Series X seems to be in a worse position than PS5 for this concern.

I still think it's pointless to worry about if these machines will be working 20 years from now. Future machines likely mean none of us will even care by that time.
 
The fact that anyone is defending this is shear insanity.
Once the battery dies and once Sony turns off the activation servers - you can not play any game on PS4 and PS5. Disc or digital. Your console turns into a brick.
Does anyone think Sony will keep up the activation servers forever? The company might not even exist 10-15 years from now.
This should spark a push for Sony to change this via firmware update - which they could do and all this will be moot.


It took 8 years to find it because that's how long some consoles' batteries last. This was just recently discovered.



Can it even be considered a flaw at this point if they've done it twice?
Actually they say you can still play PS4 disc games on a PS5 (but not a PS4) without a battery.
 
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sainraja

Member
Difference is that all my Steam games are sitting on an HDD safely archived...because...ya know...I'm actually allowed to access the file system and back up my files. Digital distribution itself was never the problem it was digital distribution in walled gardens.
I don't think with steam you can do that. You can with GOG.com. But Steam likely isn't going to be shutdown and I imagine if they were, they'd release the DRM restrictions on purchased content.
 
I don't think with steam you can do that. You can with GOG.com. But Steam likely isn't going to be shutdown and I imagine if they were, they'd release the DRM restrictions on purchased content.
You can totally do that. Whenever I reinstall Windows I install all my Steam games off my backup. All you need is the install folder, the appmanifest and to have logged in atleast once since purchasing the game.
 

sainraja

Member
You can totally do that. Whenever I reinstall Windows I install all my Steam games off my backup. All you need is the install folder, the appmanifest and to have logged in atleast once since purchasing the game.
I mean, you'd still need Steam but I read some of the later comments by you and others so it makes sense how you can still get it to still work, since we have a little more control over things on the PC side.
 
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ethomaz

Banned
Oh, so the issue is still real for the PS4.
PS4 and PS5 works exactly the same in that regard... you can play in offline mode any game you have in disc or already downloaded to HDD/SSD.

There is no need for activation or internet.
 
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Zog

Banned
I don't think with steam you can do that. You can with GOG.com. But Steam likely isn't going to be shutdown and I imagine if they were, they'd release the DRM restrictions on purchased content.
I doubt that they could legally remove the DRM restrictions on third party games.
 

sainraja

Member
Except that's not true. Windows 10 is basically fully functional without activation of any description. All you have to put up with is a watermark (oooooh noooo) and being unable to change the wallpaper. That's all you get for your money...that's it.
You won't get any future updates is my understanding if you don't activate (based on a Google search, that's 180 days after, no updates.)
 

Zog

Banned
You won't get any future updates is my understanding if you don't activate (based on a Google search, that's 180 days after, no updates.)
Yes but Windows doesn't prevent you from using it without connecting to the internet but the Xbox does.
 
You won't get any future updates is my understanding if you don't activate (based on a Google search, that's 180 days after, no updates.)
Used to be that way, in XP-7 (possibly 8 too?) but Windows 10 will update happily. Microsoft would rather you were using Windows 10 at this point, even if you're not paying for it. It was also only ever automatic updates, they could still be installed manually, even if it was a pain in the arse to find all the KB's. Besides which...if your Windows is unactivated and for whatever reason you can't get online to reactivate it...well how are you going to be getting updates?
 
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