• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Final Fantasy VII Remake: Rebirth Demo dropping tomorrow

Genuine question. When you consider the Open World angle, the lengthier story and side story, the insane amount of mini games, and the overall size of the game, is it really….uh…THAT shocking that there’s technical imperfections, when they’re getting this game out in 4 years?

Unless you’re willing to wait 5-7 years between releases, with no compromise to the amount of content an FFVII remake should have, performance and visual issues should probably be expected. To make this game in its current form, look truly next gen, you’re looking at about two more years of development time. I don’t think people want this whole trilogy to take almost two decades to make, and neither does Square.
I trust the GAFs consensus on graphics as much as I trust Michael Jackson in a room full of children by himself.
 

Reallink

Member
Japan studios simply can’t compete with some western stuff.. you simply don’t spot shit like this is most western AAA titles.. this is just rushed shit and offsite shit
They really can't. Not even with unknown and unseasoned teams on a "low budget" like the recent Lords of the Fallen. Many of the visuals in this demo are nearing Team Ninja and Fromsoft levels of decade old jank. Maybe even worse, TN/Froms assets and engines are just terrible, but this almost looks like an UE asset store flip made by amateur modders. The elaborate cutscenes and ld0 character models you never get to see in game look great however. Seems thats where 90% of the man power and budget went.
 
Last edited:

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
Japan studios simply can’t compete with some western stuff.. you simply don’t spot shit like this is most western AAA titles.. this is just rushed shit and offsite shit
They get things right about the stuff I care the most.....for example in terms high tech graphic GOW 2018 beats out Bloodborne easily but enemy/boss variety in God of War doesn't even come close to Bloodborne.

In the final trailer for FFVII Rebirth we saw some crazy amount of side activity and in demo Piano mini game has crazy amount of depth in it....which makes me excited how other side actively going to be like.

People love to droll over realistic and high tech graphics for RDR2 is because you dont see much discussion when it comes actual gameplay or mission design because R* focus on that game was give high tech graphics.
 
Last edited:

Krathoon

Gold Member
I do like how this is a more realized version of Final Fantasy 7. I can't quite get into the demo. Maybe if I play it on the weekend.

Does the demo save at certain points. I played 15min and it did not save.
 

Muffdraul

Member
I do like how this is a more realized version of Final Fantasy 7. I can't quite get into the demo. Maybe if I play it on the weekend.

Does the demo save at certain points. I played 15min and it did not save.
It auto saves and once you have access to the main menu you can save at will.
 
Seems like there are slight changes and some may be due to lighting .
I do like how this is a more realized version of Final Fantasy 7. I can't quite get into the demo. Maybe if I play it on the weekend.

Does the demo save at certain points. I played 15min and it did not save.
It does save periodically.
 

Larxia

Member
People love to droll over realistic and high tech graphics for RDR2 is because you dont see much discussion when it comes actual gameplay or mission design because R* focus on that game was give high tech graphics.
The graphics really aren't the only great thing about RDR2. The game is also fantastic for plenty of other reasons.
RDR2 is probably the best open world I've ever seen in a game, and no I don't just mean the visuals, but how interactive and alive it is. There is always something happening, it feels incredibly alive, all the NPCs have a real routine, you can see the map changing as you progress through the game, the attention to details is spectacular, it's just a really insane open world, it's very immersive and it made it one of the best games ever to me.

Yes, it's true that the missions aren't the best, especially if you play them back to back and ignore the open world, they are too scripted, but the story, acting, atmosphere, all of this was great so it helped making them interesting nontheless.

Playing an open world game that doesn't feel like a ubisoft-ish game is something extremely rare these days, and when it's also with this attention to detail (not just visuals, but everything, from side activities, how activities trigger, npc AI, everything), it's a pure joy.
 

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
The graphics really aren't the only great thing about RDR2. The game is also fantastic for plenty of other reasons.
RDR2 is probably the best open world I've ever seen in a game, and no I don't just mean the visuals, but how interactive and alive it is. There is always something happening, it feels incredibly alive, all the NPCs have a real routine, you can see the map changing as you progress through the game, the attention to details is spectacular, it's just a really insane open world, it's very immersive and it made it one of the best games ever to me.

Yes, it's true that the missions aren't the best, especially if you play them back to back and ignore the open world, they are too scripted, but the story, acting, atmosphere, all of this was great so it helped making them interesting nontheless.

Playing an open world game that doesn't feel like a ubisoft-ish game is something extremely rare these days, and when it's also with this attention to detail (not just visuals, but everything, from side activities, how activities trigger, npc AI, everything), it's a pure joy.
You can have the all detail in open world you want but if its not fun to control your character with crap mission design then I'm not gonna bother playing the game, its that simple.

I put over 500+ hours in Elden Ring even without high tech visuals because it was fun to actually play the game....I replayed FFVIIRemake multiple times and beating all the super bosses because it had fun combat.

Some people might enjoy these realistic simulation game for sake of "immersion" but I dont need that crap to get immerse in my games.
 
Last edited:

Larxia

Member
You can have the all detail in open world you want but if its not fun to control your character with crap mission design then I'm not gonna bother playing the game, its that simple.

I put over 500+ hours in Elden Ring even without high tech visuals because it was fun to actually play the game....I replayed FFVIIRemake multiple times and beating all the super bosses because it had fun combat.

Some people might enjoy these realistic simulation game for sake of "immersion" but I dont need that crap to get immerse in my games.
I honestly didn't have problems with RDR2 controls. Yes it's heavy, but it's never been a problem for me as I loved the sim aspect of the game.
I also do find the movements in most JRPGs awful, like how you always have invisible walls everywhere, or how you can never jump etc... FF VII Remake was terrible for this. Sometimes you don't even know where to go until you go close to an object and you see a glowing icon on the floor telling you you can jump over this barrier, but you can't jump over the same identical one on the other side of the room, just because the devs decided so. It's a terrible game design and it's really not intuitive, it's for me much worse than what RDR2 does.
 
Last edited:

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
I honestly didn't have problems with RDR2 controls. Yes it's heavy, but it's never been a problem for me as I loved the sim aspect of the game.
I also do find the movements in most JRPGs awful, like how you always have invisible walls everywhere, or how you can never jump etc... FF VII Remake was terrible for this. Sometimes you don't even know where to go until you go close to an object and you see a glowing icon on the floor telling you you can jump over this barrier, but you can't jump over the same identical one on the other side of the room, just because the devs decided so. It's a terrible game design and it's really not intuitive, it's for me much worse than what RDR2 does.
You cant be serious!....

you like simulation and I enjoy good combat in my games.....different taste, I guess.
 

Spukc

always chasing the next thrill
They get things right about the stuff I care the most.....for example in terms high tech graphic GOW 2018 beats out Bloodborne easily but enemy/boss variety in God of War doesn't even come close to Bloodborne.

In the final trailer for FFVII Rebirth we saw some crazy amount of side activity and in demo Piano mini game has crazy amount of depth in it....which makes me excited how other side actively going to be like.

People love to droll over realistic and high tech graphics for RDR2 is because you dont see much discussion when it comes actual gameplay or mission design because R* focus on that game was give high tech graphics.
The quality control is the issue in most japanese games.

Also bloodbourne was a freakshow i went to the london museum of art (games) and that game is miles above the rest
 

Larxia

Member
You cant be serious!....

you like simulation and I enjoy good combat in my games.....different taste, I guess.
It's true though, for example there can be multiple ladders in a level, but only the one with the green arrow icon can be climbed, it feels inconsistent and not immersive.
And I enjoy good combats too, I even love a lot of arcade games, I like different type of experiences, I just meant the controls in RDR2 didn't bother me because I was really immersed in the whole simulation aspect of it. Really loved that game.

I'm also a big fan of Kingdom Hearts, in critical mode, and that's very arcade in comparison, I also love Bayonetta, Tony Hawk, or SSX, these are all very fast paced arcade games, I just think RDR2 is great at what it tries to do, but I guess it's not for everyone, but if you like the proposition, it's quite perfect (outside of some missions being too scripted, but then again, FF7 is as bad or worse with its level design).
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Is there an VFR mode? Like 45 fps?
Tried the last of us 2 in VFR mode that shit is insane


I don't think I can recall any Japanese developed game that does all those unlocked / VRR focused visual modes. FF16 still doesn't have the widely-requested 40hz mode yet either.

* Except Ghostwire Tokyo.
 
Last edited:

Bojji

Member
Oh yeah, sometimes I like to forget that game exists :messenger_grinning_sweat:

I'm not surprised hahaha but looks like it's much better game than many "hits" so far this year. In Forspoken DLC game turns from "ok" into legit good game, what happened SE? So much wasted potential...
 
Last edited:

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
I'm also a big fan of Kingdom Hearts, in critical mode, and that's very arcade in comparison, I also love Bayonetta, Tony Hawk, or SSX, these are all very fast paced arcade games, I just think RDR2 is great at what it tries to do, but I guess it's not for everyone, but if you like the proposition, it's quite perfect (outside of some missions being too scripted, but then again, FF7 is as bad or worse with its level design).
If your idea immersive just watch overplayed animation every time you loot body then I dont want any of that crap.....to me thats not immersive that just annoying.

I rather take green arrow on ladders in FFVIIR over any of crap RDR2 does for sake "immersion" any day.

Edit: I guess broken wanted system in RDR2 doesn't take you out of your "immersion"?
 
Last edited:

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I'm not surprised hahaha but looks like it's much better game than many "hits" so far this year. In Forspoken DLC game turns from "ok" into legit good game, what happened SE? So much wasted potential...

Their smaller-budget projects have been a lot more on-point and of the caliber I would associate with the Square Enix of the PS1/2 era.

Star Ocean 2nd R is probably one of the bests JRPG's I've played in a long while. I haven't touched Octopath 2 yet but considering how much I enjoyed the first, I'm sure the second will be just as good, if not better.
 

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
The quality control is the issue in most japanese games.
Western games doesn't? is that why we get games Cyberpunk that got released and it downright broken or majority Bethesda games....

if I'm not mistaken Witcher 3 next gen update was also broken.
 

Bojji

Member
Their smaller-budget projects have been a lot more on-point and of the caliber I would associate with the Square Enix of the PS1/2 era.

Star Ocean 2nd R is probably one of the bests JRPG's I've played in a long while. I haven't touched Octopath 2 yet but considering how much I enjoyed the first, I'm sure the second will be just as good, if not better.

I REALLY liked Remake too, this is the best FF series they have right now. FFXV was good, FFXVI is good too (but story is soooo stretched out) while Remake was much better than them.

This is one of the reasons I'm so disappointed in how this demo looks :(
 

Larxia

Member
If your idea immersive just watch overplayed animation every time you loot body then I dont want any of that crap.....to me thats not immersive that just annoying.

I rather take green arrow on ladders in FFVIIR over any of crap RDR2 does for sake "immersion" any day.

Edit: I guess broken wanted system in RDR2 doesn't take you out of your "immersion"?
It's not just that... It's the whole thing. How the events on the map and how you encounter things happen naturally, everything feels much more organic than in most other games, you don't have a boring quest log where everything feels like a chore, you just live in the world and experience things while exploring, it's very refreshing and immersive. Also all the details like how bodies will remain there and start to decay after days, how the environment change related to NPC activities, how you can build a camp anywhere to sleep instead of just resting on a save point or a menu, it's a lot of things.

And no you guessed wrong, I do hate the wanted system, the police in general is really bad in RDR2, it's a huge and weird oversight for a game that focused so much on realism and immersion.
 

Gambit2483

Member
Genuine question. When you consider the Open World angle, the lengthier story and side story, the insane amount of mini games, and the overall size of the game, is it really….uh…THAT shocking that there’s technical imperfections, when they’re getting this game out in 4 years?
That's a good point. I can't think of any other JRPG that appears to be on the level of Rebirth as far as ambition in scope, length and content.

Also, let's not forget this is just a demo and demos are often not based on the final build. Not saying it will look drastically different but there's a good chance that the visuals are not entirely representative of the final product. Most demos even make a point of this.
 
Last edited:

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
It's not just that... It's the whole thing. How the events on the map and how you encounter things happen naturally, everything feels much more organic than in most other games, you don't have a boring quest log where everything feels like a chore, you just live in the world and experience things while exploring, it's very refreshing and immersive. Also all the details like how bodies will remain there and start to decay after days, how the environment change related to NPC activities, how you can build a camp anywhere to sleep instead of just resting on a save point or a menu, it's a lot of things.

And no you guessed wrong, I do hate the wanted system, the police in general is really bad in RDR2, it's a huge and weird oversight for a game that focused so much on realism and immersion.
The idea simulation games is different system working together but nothing in RDR2 works together well, once you start mission all the so called "immersion" goes out the window and you have no freedom and you need follow it to the letter or failed the mission, no matter how much you invest or be total asshole in the camp the story is going to play it out the same and wanted system is just broken mess.....and this game is trying to be hyper realistic.

I find Tears of kingdom more immersive than RDR2 and that is not even trying to be realistic.
 
Last edited:

Spukc

always chasing the next thrill
Western games doesn't? is that why we get games Cyberpunk that got released and it downright broken or majority Bethesda games....

if I'm not mistaken Witcher 3 next gen update was also broken.
Yes lets pick the biggest failure ever
 

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
Yes lets pick the biggest failure ever
They are big ass games with high budget, heck CPR had enough budget to hire Keanu Reeves for their games.

In other hand games like Elden Ring, RE4R and and upcoming Rebirth which people love to whine about the graphics are no where close be that broken.

But hey Witcher 3 was success.....I'm sure that game got released with perfect technical mastery.....right?
 
Last edited:
Are the gameplay/stats in the demo modified (like being more powerful to make it easier than if you played the same segment in the full game) or is it literally the opening of the full game?
 
Most Sony games have different engines and developers and all new games have few different display modes for everyone. This can be implemented in every game.

It doesn't really work like that. Different teams have different levels or expertise, time and budget. And like I said before, two drastically different engines are being used here.
Also, this is SE.....not Sony.
 

Bojji

Member
It doesn't really work like that. Different teams have different levels or expertise, time and budget. And like I said before, two drastically different engines are being used here.
Also, this is SE.....not Sony.

Only thing needed for them to implement this is will to do this.

They have done X number of pc ports and every game had to have a lot of options so this is not some exotic new techbology. PS5 has 120hz display mode implemented from day one and insomniac used it very quickly in their game for 40fps mode, other Sony devs followed suit and options greatly expanded after VRR system update (it's probably mandatory for them by sony). Square themselves used it one year ago and this was one of their least founded teams (probably).

There is no technical reason not to implement this, only "time, money" and other bullshit like that.
 
Only thing needed for them to implement this is will to do this.

They have done X number of pc ports and every game had to have a lot of options so this is not some exotic new techbology. PS5 has 120hz display mode implemented from day one and insomniac used it very quickly in their game for 40fps mode, other Sony devs followed suit and options greatly expanded after VRR system update (it's probably mandatory for them by sony). Square themselves used it one year ago and this was one of their least founded teams (probably).

There is no technical reason not to implement this, only "time, money" and other bullshit like that.

Awesome. You should be a developer. Go out there and show these lazy devs, champ. Lack of money, time and tech are NOT an excuse.

You Got This Spider Man GIF
 
Last edited:

Madflavor

Gold Member
I mean Tears of the Kingdom reused so many of the exact same assets as Breath of the Wild, it borderlined on being the same game. It still took them 6 years to polish that game up so it ran as perfectly for them as possible.

Rebirth also reuses a lot of the same assets as it's predecessor, is a MUCH bigger game, and they're getting it out in 4 years. If this game had very little visual imperfections and truly looked next gen, then I would demand to know what kind of black magic Square performed to make that happen.
 

Bojji

Member
Awesome. You should be a developer. Go out there and show these lazy devs, champ. Lack of money, time and tech are NOT an excuse.

You Got This Spider Man GIF

Lol, i pay money for their creations and there are many people like me expecting quite simple and basic (in 2024) things from games. I don't care about any excuses, if they can't implement it in gold version then they can patch it in day 1 patch, if they can't do that in day 1 patch then they can inform consumers that patch is in the works. But they simply just don't give a fuck.

This game at least has functional 60 mode mode it's not the end of the world.
 

paolo11

Member
This is interesting, Jon is saying the performance mode, not the quality mode is actually running at about 1440p. Not 1080p or less like some, including myself are assuming. He says the blurriness on the performance mode is caused by the post processing not resolution. This sounds like something that they may be able to improve upon by tweaking their solution. May be a similar situation to Horizon Forbidden West I wonder.

8CeAf1j.png
It sure doesn’t look like 1440p to me. I thought it was 720p. Can it be fixed easily thru patch?
 

Synless

Member
I told you fucks it wasn’t 800p, it was quite obvious if you played intergrade, very similar look in performance mode.
 

SkylineRKR

Member
A question about OG ff7 zack

been decades since I played the game, but what was the point of having Zack in the story but for surprise! factor? What’s the point of having cloud go amnesiac? Now with rebirth, won’t that undermine cloud interactions with sepht if they play the surprise! card again?

Its obviously an alternate reality, or its in limbo. But its a reality where Avalanche died in the tornado, as you see the party getting carried away by medics. It seems Biggs is alive too in this particular timeline.

What its going to add remains to be seen. I think they put it there to flesh out Aerith and Zack, and it won't really interfere with Cloud but we'll see.
Similar to RE4R and Elden Ring, once the games comes out and people start enjoying the game NONE of these graphic whining matters, none of it.

We go through same crap every time......This should be clear by now that majority of Japanese devs maybe other than Kojima dont care about having top of the line high tech graphics.

Dont worry we gonna go through same crap of graphic whores whining once Capcom release demo for Monster Hunter Wild....because of course we will.

100%

I mean Infinite Wealth isn't the most pretty or technically advanced game in the world, but for me it beats the likes of Horizon 2 to hell. Do you think I worry about the graphics for even one second? Game is full of fucking charm.

You know what it is? You start to notice things with the graphics if the game is shit. Or indeed when its just a demo that doesn't scratch the surface of this game. I reckon I play FFVII Rebirth next month, enjoying its battle system and throwbacks. If the game is indeed good, then by all means give me these uneven textures instead of a fucking turd with awesome graphics.
 
Last edited:
Maybe it’s just something I need to get used to, but controlling Cloud outside of battle feels really stiff. I wish there was a jump button. It also probably doesn’t help that I was forced into slow-walking mode every 5 seconds. How did the devs just choose to ignore this criticism of Remake and still include it in here? Also, the QTE’s. Just like with XVI: dumb. Stop including these in your games please.

The mini-map also sucks; I almost want to turn it off.

Battles were really fun.


Music IMO was actually MUCH better than Remake’s; I was pleasantly surprised. The new tracks were phenomenal and the recreated tracks sound like really well-done faithful modern takes.

Visuals were good. Just like XVI there’s areas with bland/bad lighting. Opening CG cutscene was really good-looking.



Overall, I know I’ll think of Rebirth as, at the very least, good.
 
Last edited:

SkylineRKR

Member
Genuine question. When you consider the Open World angle, the lengthier story and side story, the insane amount of mini games, and the overall size of the game, is it really….uh…THAT shocking that there’s technical imperfections, when they’re getting this game out in 4 years?

Unless you’re willing to wait 5-7 years between releases, with no compromise to the amount of content an FFVII remake should have, performance and visual issues should probably be expected. To make this game in its current form, look truly next gen, you’re looking at about two more years of development time. I don’t think people want this whole trilogy to take almost two decades to make, and neither does Square.

I think the PS5 can't do much better with games this scale, unless perhaps Guerrilla is at the helm. But Horizon 2 bored me after 5 hours and I never had the desire to play beyond the timed premium demo. People were clamoring to the idea that once cross gen was dropped, we would see a revolution in graphics. I always said no you won't.

Square confirmed Rebirth is truly open world, moreso than FFXVI which blatantly cut areas off. And more importantly, there seems to be far much more to do in terms of content and equipment management.

Sure, you can play Callisto Protocol if you want rather flawless graphics. But its a dumpster fire with awful gameplay and nothing to see.
 
I think the PS5 can't do much better with games this scale, unless perhaps Guerrilla is at the helm. But Horizon 2 bored me after 5 hours and I never had the desire to play beyond the timed premium demo. People were clamoring to the idea that once cross gen was dropped, we would see a revolution in graphics. I always said no you won't.

Square confirmed Rebirth is truly open world, moreso than FFXVI which blatantly cut areas off. And more importantly, there seems to be far much more to do in terms of content and equipment management.

Sure, you can play Callisto Protocol if you want rather flawless graphics. But its a dumpster fire with awful gameplay and nothing to see.
Yeah, I'm not sure why so many are obsessed, I think so many games look literally amazing these days.. Hell, I'm still impressed from time to time with games from two gens go basically. I think things have looked so good for a long time. But everyone likes what they like I guess. 🤷‍♂️
 
Yeah, I'm not sure why so many are obsessed, I think so many games look literally amazing these days.. Hell, I'm still impressed from time to time with games from two gens go basically. I think things have looked so good for a long time. But everyone likes what they like I guess. 🤷‍♂️
Beside some face models for the enemies, I think Splinter Cell Chaos Theory still looks amazing....and it's a 2005 game.
 
Top Bottom