Support NeoGAF

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

The show was definitely ass. One thing I’m happy about though is that as gamers on Playstation we can still vote with our wallets. The ultimate way to tell Sony you don’t like their direction is to let all these GAAS bomb hard.

I don’t know why they are straying from the main thing that has always brought them success (their first party AAA SP games) but they need a solid course correction.
I wouldn’t even be upset with the showcase if they showed gameplay to some of these GAAS games but the problem is none of them had any gameplay, just boring CGI trailers. That’s not how you do a big game reveals in 2023. MS gets criticized for showing too much CGI for good reason. I wonder why Sony thinks it’s okay for them to follow in that direction lol.

At least we’ve got Spiderman 2 and FF16 launching this year so things aren’t Xbox level dire yet but they need to wake the fuck up

 

[Woggleman]

There was a time when Sony was damn near keeping SP games alive but now they want to hop on the GAAS train. I also have a sinking feeling that ND will go the way of Rockstar when Factions comes out. I hope I am wrong.

 

[Dane]

They'll be fine just like Microsoft, no one is going to hit 100% all of the time, there's a first time to fail at something, and this ain't Sony first rodeo just like Xbox and Nintendo.

I think in retrospect is that if it wasn't for the pandemic their catalogue would actually have been dried out after the PS5 first twelve months since last year games were slated for 2021, because outside of Spiderman for this year, they'll probably just have Marathon for next year.

This is the result of the length of AAA game development ballooning out of control, because everyone wants to have "muh graphics!" Games, especially big AAA single player games, take far longer to make today than they used to. What you saw last night was the result of that. A lot of big games just aren't ready to be shown yet, so what do they have to fill in the gap? Indie games, CGI trailers, and GaaS trash. Welcome to the future of gaming. A future where you're lucky if your favorite IP puts out two games per generation.



Just think on that next time you want to whine and moan about certain aspects of a new game's graphics not looking up to your standards. Also as great as 2023 is shaping up to be with it's big releases, prepare yourselves for 2024 to be a barren wasteland.

We have reached a struggling point in the industry where the question about graphics and massive ambition vs dev time will be starting to get a lot more attention, this is something that people really should take note.

 

[ToadMan]

Sony for a while now focuses all their marketing on the next big release. With FF and Spiderman on the horizon, there was no way they would show anything to steal their thunder.

Yeah this is an important point.

Sony will let FF16 run it’s course and then SM2, especially when they’re finding people are being more careful about game purchases.

They don’t want people skipping games available now because they’re hyped for something further out.

This year is already stacked for Sony. Just in June they’ll have FF16, SF6 and D4 - they get a slice from all the units sold on their platform so they want them all to shine. Not be overshadowed by coming releases.

This has been an incredible year already. Literally every month seems to have a high rated AAA game available on and sometimes more than 1.

I don’t see how this should lead to concern about PS right now. Concern for what happens in future maybe but right now PS has a crazy amount of high quality content.

 

[AJUMP23]

It will be ok.

 

[Robb]

One bad showcase is nothing to be concerned about. If they start doing bad show’s consistently that’s another story.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

Obviously this was a terrible showcase in terms of games, but the most troubling thing about it to me was the quasi-announcement of that bizarre Wii U controller thing. That shows that the idiots are running the show at Sony, and that Jim Ryan's four years at the helm are finally starting to catch up with them.

 

[Madflavor]

We have reached a struggling point in the industry where the question about graphics and massive ambition vs dev time will be starting to get a lot more attention, this is something that people really should take note.

I hope it's sooner rather than later. People really need to understand the double edge sword of pushing graphical fidelity further and further. Like this shit just looks prettier and prettier through magic.

 

[Bernardougf]

Dont wish for anybody to get fired...

But this Gaas push has to fail.... big time.. or gaming as we know it will be restricted as fuck

 

[drganon]

No point in getting stressed out over one bad showcase.

 

[GHG]

These reactionary threads immediately after a poor showing/release/review are always funny.

You guys should understand that these companies aren't planning for the immediate gratification, they have the next decade mapped out.

Yeh, and how's that worked out for you?

 

[ungalo]

I'm all for the creativity over graphics in the AAA field, but it's getting pretty tiring seeing everybody talk about the inflating budgets because our standards are so high.

If that's the case, where is the generational leap ? Something is wrong in the equation. Less games, less creativity, no graphical leap. Just look at the games from 2014-2015 and tell me we made tremendous progress in almost 10 years. And let's say it's not just about the visuals : more than 10 years ago, most games were already on average well conceived, as products, we already had made those progress in terms of quality control.

If you read the article from Kotaku about the budgets, you see that it's also mostly the marketing cost that are out of control. And for what ? I'm not even sure, the marketing campaigns seem more minimalistic than back in the days in my opinion.

Although i think we should have again renounced to 4K for this generation of consoles, takes too much ressources for not much benefit compared to what we could do in 1080p.

 

[DonF]

I'm not concerned, but I'm also not pleased.

Ps studios is full of fucking amazing talent and Im not seeing it.

Games take longer now to develop, but the idea of having a lot of studios is to have a schedule of steady great AAA and AA first party releases.

I don't like this Jim ryan fellow.

 

[adamsapple]

Yeh, and how's that worked out for you?

YMMV but I'm, personally, indifferent leaning more towards satisfied.

 

[Sanepar]

Yeh, and how's that worked out for you?

Sometimes I don't understand if these guys are gamers or investors... What they want a hobby that delivers what they want to play as a consumer or to earn money because sales are high?

 

[Lupin25]

Well, it felt like we hardly seen much from Sony themselves.

3rd party partners were most of the show

No Naughty Dog - Honestly shocking
No Sony Santa Monica
No Guerilla Games - Even their mp game?
No Sony Bend - No surprise
No Sucker Punch - Expected
No Housemarque - Expected

Their best devs weren’t even present, outside of Bungie & Insomniac. Haven, Arrowhead, I’m not sure about yet (Helldivers 2 did look good).

Insomniac even has Wolverine and a mp game in development, but clearly they’re focused on SM2, which looks like it could slip to Nov like GoW Ragnarök last year with no firm release date yet and some polish needed.

Sony is still keeping most of their cards to their chest, or at least just showing off what’s coming sooner rather than later.

 

[Bernardougf]

These reactionary threads immediately after a poor showing/release/review are always funny.

You guys should understand that these companies aren't planning for the immediate gratification, they have the next decade mapped out.

Yeah MS is expert in this wating for the next decade department

 

[Bernardougf]

its just one bad showcase, come on

And thats the excuse any xbox fan will use forever until they are caught in this eternal loop of denial they are in.

It was a horrible showcase ... so lets us call it for what it is and do our part.. if they dont care.. fuck it .. at least we tried... better than keep living in the same loop dream as the green side

 

[splattered]

I don't think that is quite fair. I think I and others have had concerns about their Gaas talk, but I've always been of the mind as long as they are expanding their output and not shifting it then it will be alright. Yesterday showed that shift. But let's be clear, Sony has done a good job with their first party output. This showcase was supposed to show PlayStation gamers that hasn't changed, but Sony somehow was able to fill that void with a shitton of doubt. So yeah, it is one thing to be concerned, but quite another to see those concerns become reality.

I don't get why it would be shocking though... I mean just think about the studios that they've been purchasing over the last few years. It's been largely multiplayer and PC port companies. People keep fighting the idea that Sony is changing and following market trends rather than focusing on what they've always done. To me I mean it's been pretty damn obvious what their current end goal is and that's to be as profitable as possible and I think that's going to be through diversifying their output and going after monetization and stuff because it's working for other companies. I've been saying this over and over on the forum here and people keep saying I don't know what I'm talking about. But here we are.

 

[Adam_802]

yesterday really shook a lot of people up huh

 

[Rudius]

Nintendo got us all sorted, so don't panic.

There is a difference.

Nintendo makes great games with outdated technology since 2006.

Playstation has been making great games with top quality tech for its time.

I'll take a good with PS3 graphics if I have no options, but I'd rather have what PS was offering.

 

[MagnesD3]

There is a difference.

Nintendo makes great games with outdated technology since 2006.

Playstation has been making great games with top quality tech for its time.

I'll take a good with PS3 graphics if I have no options, but I'd rather have what PS was offering.

I'd watch nintendo, the only things that they will guarantee great are Mario and Zelda and even then Zelda isn't really Zelda anymore.

 

[Topher]

I don't get why it would be shocking though... I mean just think about the studios that they've been purchasing over the last few years. It's been largely multiplayer and PC port companies. People keep fighting the idea that Sony is changing and following market trends rather than focusing on what they've always done. To me I mean it's been pretty damn obvious what their current end goal is and that's to be as profitable as possible and I think that's going to be through diversifying their output and going after monetization and stuff because it's working for other companies. I've been saying this over and over on the forum here and people keep saying I don't know what I'm talking about. But here we are. But here we are.

Who has been arguing that Sony hasn't been trying to diversify their game output? I think that has been well established on this forum for quite some time so no idea who you have been arguing with on that front. The problem most have here is, as I said, the shift away from their big single player games, at least based on what they showed yesterday. I don't know that anyone has a problem with Sony finding new revenue streams. The problem I think many of us have is taking for granted the single player games that have become synonymous with PlayStation.

 

[ARK1391]

Geez people need to calm down. There were 3 total GaaS games at that showcase.

1. Fairgame$
2. Foamstars
3. Marathon

EDIT: Forgot to point out only one of these is even first party.

Tower of Fantasy is an MMO, if you consider that GaaS then that's 4.

32 game trailers were shown. Stop crying, you have 3 games to avoid if you hate GaaS.

We saw very little of Sony's first party, which to me says that Sony isn't rushing those games. They are dominating console sales and are giving their teams time to deliver the quality their players expect. Which is only a good thing.

Spider-Man 2 comes this fall, why drop a bunch of bombs right before FFXVI and Spider-Man 2. Show them in December or January to keep people interested after your 2 big hitters this year are out.

Besides you all whine and cry about games getting announced too early. None of the other first party games are coming this year. Sony won't pull an EA and compete with their own titles for mind share. Sure, the showcase wasn't mindblowing. But I'm personally looking forward to a ton of the games they showed. I can wait to see the other first party titles either, but my PS5 isn't going anywhere. And lets be honest, neither is yours.

 

[mckmas8808]

Its got nothing todo with jim, yes he is the ceo, but do u think all day long he sits there saying yes this is the game we gonna concentrate on or no lets scrap this etc, he will have a big team under him who will make all the decisions, and he will only go off what he being told, i bet after the confernce yesturday he will have asked what people thoughts are and they would have all told him bull and said it was great, and not trying to say blame people of colour or lbgt but i think the industry is full of people who cant do there job and instead of getting rid of them they just get promoted higher and higher till u have A company clueless

If it's anything like you paint it, Jimbo needs to be FIRED!!! If the bolded is true, then Jim doesn't deserve to be CEO of Playstation. Because the person you just described sounds like a hack.

 

[Sleepwalker]

The big problem with the GaaS push is also that to me it seems they are way too late, with the exception of bungie.

Theres only so much elasticity in that market. The average player might play 5-10 single player games a year, but for GaaS they play 1, 2 at max concurrently. Are they gonna quit Fortnite/Destiny/Cod/battlefield/Fifa for fairgames? I dont think so but time will tell I guess.

 

[Stuart360]

It depends how you look at it for me. If you're a Playstation ONLY gamer, and have no intention of getting a Xbox or PC, then every game shown at the show was a Playstation game, and the show would of been a solid if a little underwhelming show.

I'm sure thats how Jim probably viewed the show too.

 

[mckmas8808]

You are now seeing Big Jimbos and Hermans plans coming to fruition.

No we know for a fact Herman can lead teams to making great games. He built Guerilla Games from the dirt. It resulted in Killzone, Horizon, and the Decima engine. GG are some of the best devs on planet Earth. Even their Killzone game on PSP was amazing!

We have reached a struggling point in the industry where the question about graphics and massive ambition vs dev time will be starting to get a lot more attention, this is something that people really should take note.

Dane..............I think you have hit the nail on the head here. Something me and others will need to really consider. I was hoping Unreal 5, Decima, and other modern engines would help with this. But alas....

GUYS..... D Dane has a point here

Yeah this is an important point.

Sony will let FF16 run it’s course and then SM2, especially when they’re finding people are being more careful about game purchases.

They don’t want people skipping games available now because they’re hyped for something further out.

This year is already stacked for Sony. Just in June they’ll have FF16, SF6 and D4 - they get a slice from all the units sold on their platform so they want them all to shine. Not be overshadowed by coming releases.

This has been an incredible year already. Literally every month seems to have a high rated AAA game available on and sometimes more than 1.

I don’t see how this should lead to concern about PS right now. Concern for what happens in future maybe but right now PS has a crazy amount of high quality content.

This is Jimbo's vision of running Playstation. He doesn't believe in conferences and hyping up PS gamers. He only cares about selling games in the current quarter. And he's a quarter-to-quarter exec. It works......ONLY IF, you constantly have high level content coming out.

 

[DenchDeckard]

No we know for a fact Herman can lead teams to making great games. He built Guerilla Games from the dirt. It resulted in Killzone, Horizon, and the Decima engine. GG are some of the best devs on planet Earth. Even their Killzone game on PSP was amazing!



Dane..............I think you have hit the nail on the head here. Something me and others will need to really consider. I was hoping Unreal 5, Decima, and other modern engines would help with this. But alas....

GUYS..... D Dane has a point here




This is Jimbo's vision of running Playstation. He doesn't believe in conferences and hyping up PS gamers. He only cares about selling games in the current quarter. And he's a quarter-to-quarter exec. It works......ONLY IF, you constantly have high level content coming out.

Guerilla games have great tech but their games are nothing but flash...kinda shit tbh. I enjoyed killzone 3 though, played the whole game with the move controllers.

 

[bender]

They are just continuing down a path that started with GOW on PS2, a path that helped them turn around the fortunes of the PS3, and a path that made the PS4 so successful. They want blockbuster titles that have media opportunities outside of gaming. The smaller, more daring endeavors have lessened along the way with Media Molecule being one of the few "passion project" developers left standing. For as much as we love Shadow of the Colossus, Puppeteer, Tokyo Jungle and the like, those aren't going to push the type of numbers that Sony wants to invest in internally. Instead the smaller projects are funded through third parties for timed exclusives which isn't a terrible strategy. And while I have little interest in most of the games Sony is putting out these days, it's hard to argue with success. At least I still have Gran Turismo..

 

[tmlDan]

And thats the excuse any xbox fan will use forever until they are caught in this eternal loop of denial they are in.

It was a horrible showcase ... so lets us call it for what it is and do our part.. if they dont care.. fuck it .. at least we tried... better than keep living in the same loop dream as the green side

horrible is hyperbolic, temper your expectations next time. Spiderman looked amazing.

yes, it wasn't a showcase of dreams but you guys are all crazy in here

 

[mckmas8808]

You know what, @davidjaffe made a comment in his Redfall video.

Shu would not be rude. But if he played something shit he’d be like ‘this is not good’.

And devs would shit themselves and strive for more so the next time he rocked up, they could present him with something worthy of his time.

Does Herman Hulst have the stones to rock up at any Sony first party studio and say that? No.

So why Herman able to do it at Guerilla Games for 15 years then?

 

[ToadMan]

Here's my problem with stupid Jimbo's 2 big AAA games a year strategy. That means with can't get Wolverine, DS2, and ND's Factions in 2024.

I think factions will end up being a longer form or heavily time sink/mtx experience so I don’t think it will count as one of the 2 big releases. They said it will be a standalone free to play thing right?

I took the 2 big release comment to be 2 big 1st party “buy our console/platform” style traditional games.

But let’s see.

 

[Banjo64]

So why Herman able to do it at Guerilla Games for 15 years then?

Oversaw 2 utterly unremarkable franchises.

 

[DosGamer]

One thing we can rest on.. and that is the fact that Sony's future is much brighter than that of the Xbox.
having said that, yesterday was all over the place. Its almost like they said.. ok devs... send us a bunch of shit, we will go thru it and if you make the show you make the show.

Didnt like the flow of it. Cant understand why they didnt show some games, and what they did show was a lot of CG and not actual gameplay.

 

[Draugoth]

As a PlayStation player, I feel concerned about the future​

Jiam Ryan and Playstation Owners finally realizing that the Xbox sales strategy of Cloud Gaming, Subscription Catalog and GaaS games is protifable and that you too will be getting only one exclusive game a year soon

 

[EverydayBeast]

Sign a big developer, it’s not panic time for Sony. They’re ripe for a big AAA exclusive.

 

[Stooky]

 

[Banjo64]

Jiam Ryan and Playstation Owners finally realizing that the Xbox sales strategy of Cloud Gaming, Subscription Catalog and GaaS games is protifable and that you too will be getting only one exclusive game a year soon

Who knew that eating endless losses, spending hundreds of billions of pounds on game studios, data centres and infrastructure was such a sound strategy?

 

[mckmas8808]

I think people are right to be concerned, big boy Jimbo outlined PlayStation's push towards GaaS not too long ago and that, is indeed concerning. GaaS didn't make PlayStation what it is, Story driven single player games did and I would consider it naive to shy away from what made the platform desirable in the first place.

All things considered, this was just a glimpse of what the Jim/Hermen era of PlayStation holds. I wholeheartedly doubt that what they had shown, was everything. Undoubtedly the bigger games and high budget single player titles are still under wraps. What people wanted, was a showcase. And that's what they got. Will people react the same way if team Green's showcase is overshadowed by Indies and only very few first party games?

I'm pretty sure they too have a bunch of GaaS titles planned, because that's where today's young gaming society is headed (Gen Z's & Millennials) and that's where the big corpos are aiming to go, alongside a bigger push to mobile gaming, because that's where the money is.

So why did Zelda sell so much? Are they assuming teens don't like single player games?

 

[Draugoth]

Who knew that eating endless losses, spending hundreds of billions of pounds on game studios, data centres and infrastructure was such a sound strategy?

I mean, if they can manage to spend 70 billion on an acquisition than Xbox must be doing something right in the eyes of the management board.

 

[mckmas8808]

Guerilla games have great tech but their games are nothing but flash...kinda shit tbh. I enjoyed killzone 3 though, played the whole game with the move controllers.

That's a okay opinion to have, but most don't agree with the bolded.

 

[Bernardougf]

horrible is hyperbolic, temper your expectations next time. Spiderman looked amazing.

yes, it wasn't a showcase of dreams but you guys are all crazy in here

Well terrible for ME.. sorry .. shouldn't try to objectify the showcase for everyone ...

For me was terrible. There it is.

 

[Dane]

No we know for a fact Herman can lead teams to making great games. He built Guerilla Games from the dirt. It resulted in Killzone, Horizon, and the Decima engine. GG are some of the best devs on planet Earth. Even their Killzone game on PSP was amazing!



Dane..............I think you have hit the nail on the head here. Something me and others will need to really consider. I was hoping Unreal 5, Decima, and other modern engines would help with this. But alas....

GUYS..... D Dane has a point here




This is Jimbo's vision of running Playstation. He doesn't believe in conferences and hyping up PS gamers. He only cares about selling games in the current quarter. And he's a quarter-to-quarter exec. It works......ONLY IF, you constantly have high level content coming out.

I've been doing a 3D models for years, realistic stuff will take absolutely more time even with all the tools to help, you have also to add texture and material creation which also takes a huge time.

 

[White-fire]

Here's my problem with stupid Jimbo's 2 big AAA games a year strategy. That means with can't get Wolverine, DS2, and ND's Factions in 2024.

Why not? It's a mimimum of 2 a year. DS2 is not being made from a Sony owned studio.. I don't get your point.

 

[mckmas8808]

Oversaw 2 utterly unremarkable franchises.

You mean two iconic franchises.

How you can think they are unremarkable is beyond understanding.

 

[mckmas8808]

Why not? It's a mimimum of 2 a year. DS2 is not being made from a Sony owned studio.. I don't get your point.

Sony views DS2 to be a 1st party game since they own the IP. Death Stranding is all Sony.

 

[Salty Popsicle]

You should be more concerned about Xbox's future since they still haven't released a worthwhile exclusive game this generation. Starfield is their last bet and I really think it will fail hard.

Always that one person. Can't handle that their favorite console company had a lackluster showcase, so they deflect by wishing the competitions big game to fail.

 

[Banjo64]

You mean two iconic franchises.

How you can think they are unremarkable is beyond understanding.

iconic in what way?

 

[WilliamSBirkin]

After the show, i realized something, how i miss E3 and the megatons announcements that always came at the end of each presentation.