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[bender]

But it's clearly not because of the consoles specifically because both Morrowind and Oblivion were designed with consoles in mind. The increasing focus on more accessible games has been happening for years and it's happened regardless of platforms. Just take a look at classic WoW vs WoW now. WoW in 2004 only had quest markers and you had to figure out everything else by the quest text.

Now look at WoW now: Your map shows you every quest location and also shows you exactly where you need to go. A game that has never even touched a console.

Morrowind interface was designed for a keyboard and shoehorned onto the Xbox. Oblivion's interface and systems were streamlined for a controller and to appeal to a larger audience. And depending how you want to look at it, that's not a bad thing. Skyrim has been released dozens of times and has countless sales. Sticking with Morrowinds more complex systems and interface wouldn't have garnered Bethesda nearly the success.

It's been a long time since WoW Vanilla but I don't think the maps gave you all that information back in the day. I seem to recall a lot of trips to thotbot to figure out what mobs dropped what and where they were located on the various zones. WoW is also the perfect example of streamlining. Remember having multiple ranks of every spell and then calculating which ones were most mana efficient? I do.

 

[Rykan]

Morrowind interface was designed for a keyboard and shoehorned onto the Xbox. Oblivion's interface and systems were streamlined for a controller and to appeal to a larger audience. And depending how you want to look at it, that's not a bad thing. Skyrim has been released dozens of times and has countless sales. Sticking with Morrowinds more complex systems and interface wouldn't have garnered Bethesda nearly the success.

My issue isn't with the fact the series clearly has been streamlined overtime, My issue is with the fact that you said this was because of consoles. Morrowind has been designed with consoles in mind. It wasn't a "port job" done by some third party contractor. It's been developed for xbox internally by Bethesda and came out only 1 month after the PC release.

The games have been streamlined overtime, as many games franchises have. There is no evidence to support the claim that it was "dumbed down" specifically for consoles.

 

[bender]

My issue isn't with the fact the series clearly has been streamlined overtime, My issue is with the fact that you said this was because of consoles. Morrowind has been designed with consoles in mind. It wasn't a "port job" done by some third party contractor. It's been developed for xbox internally by Bethesda and came out only 1 month after the PC release.

The games have been streamlined overtime, as many games franchises have. There is no evidence to support the claim that it was "dumbed down" specifically for consoles.

Your issue is that you are taking an insult where this is none. I didn't say Bethesda outsourced the port but rather, the interface was designed with a keyboard in mind.Consoles have a different primary interface (controllers) and Morrowind obviously wasn't designed with those in mind like say Oblivion and Skyrim. And the reason it was ported to the Xbox is because architecture (Intel Celeron + NVidia GPU + standard HDD). Systems being "dumbed down" because of consoles wasn't my intention. The systems in later TES games were dumbed down to appeal to a larger audience.

Use your own WoW example and look how it has evolved from Vanilla to now. I'm almost positive the game didn't launch with the mapping systems you pointed out. The spell systems were streamlined and there are tons of quality of life improvements. Some for the better and some not so much. Like you said, it never touched consoles but it didn't garner a massive userbase.

 

[Kumomeme]

we need more of cultural appreciation game like this instead of those dumb political stuff

 

[Bartski]

I still think Legends is highly underrated, this game literally converted me to think positively about future Sony MP games if they're done right.

Also thanks everyone for un-derailing the thread from GoT vs TLOU2 sales wars, that just had to happen at some point right?

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

Recently playing Skyrim EE.

It's map isn't littered with icons, there are no activities to complete either.

You need to walk to every landmark before it shows on your map.

And every noteworthy location is visible from afar, making you curious what's in there.

Also it's much more involved role playing game. Makes you choose at every step whether you wanna help, hinder, steal or kill whoever you are dealing with.

I guess it's been long time since you played it.

 

[Jormatar]

Deserved. Congrats to the team.

 

[nowhat]

Also thanks everyone for un-derailing the thread from GoT vs TLOU2 sales wars, that just had to happen at some point right?

Does it really, though? I find it quite tiresome. Like, get a life. Or a pair of too muscular arms if you want to use all that rage in a more constructive fashion.

(and for the record, Joel had to die, there was just nowhere to go with that character after the first game)

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

Does it really, though? I find it quite tiresome. Like, get a life. Or a pair of too muscular arms if you want to use all that rage in a more constructive fashion.

(and for the record, Joel had to die, there was just nowhere to go with that character after the first game)

You think people understand what a character arc is? Just keep digital daddy alive

 

[GymWolf]

I still think Legends is highly underrated, this game literally converted me to think positively about future Sony MP games if they're done right.

Also thanks everyone for un-derailing the thread from GoT vs TLOU2 sales wars, that just had to happen at some point right?

Legends is better than the main game.

 

[rofif]

It's the one game I am yet to play.... it just looks like boring ass standard open world game.
I am sure it will be fun when I finally get it but any gameplay I look at, depicts 2 people stiffly talking to each other in flat lighting night

 

[Bartski]

Legends is better than the main game.

for me it was in a lot of ways, for sure. My favorite DLC ever made for a Sony game, the fact it was free baffles me to this day

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

I still think Legends is highly underrated, this game literally converted me to think positively about future Sony MP games if they're done right.

I've always been a bit apprehensive about legends. I feel like I'll be so far behind the curve I wouldn't get the chance to have fun.

 

[GymWolf]

for me it was in a lot of ways, for sure. My favorite DLC ever made for a Sony game, the fact it was free baffles me to this day

Yep, i'm not even a multy guy and i enjoyed that thing a lot.
Also having some actual challenge and not feeling always super op was a nice change of pace.

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

It's the one game I am yet to play.... it just looks like boring ass standard open world game.
I am sure it will be fun when I finally get it but any gameplay I look at, depicts 2 people stiffly talking to each other in flat lighting night

Sounds like a bunch of ass summing. It's a lot more than you seeing random clips at random times.

 

[GymWolf]

It's the one game I am yet to play.... it just looks like boring ass standard open world game.
I am sure it will be fun when I finally get it but any gameplay I look at, depicts 2 people stiffly talking to each other in flat lighting night

So you only watched gameplay from sidequests chit chat?!

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

Bullshit, if people still play it you are gonna always find a group

Guess I'll hop right on then. PS5 upgrade will make it even better.

 

[Bartski]

I've always been a bit apprehensive about legends. I feel like I'll be so far behind the curve I wouldn't get the chance to have fun.

Everyone starts at bronze. You don't get any of those toxic kill number racing cunts there populating "nightmare", just beginners. There is an discord channel where you can find people to co-op with at all exp levels.
I made friends in this game from the opposite side of the planet, it works.

 

[GymWolf]

Guess I'll hop right on then. PS5 upgrade will make it even better.

I cancelled that post because i actually don't know if people still play the thing.

But it is free so you kust need to try.

I jumped in months after the release and it was still full choke of people.

 

[Roberts]

Even though I never finished it and got distracted by other games, it is probably the best Sony open world game. I just wish the storytelling was a bit less Hollywood and more something like Daiei Film, but then it probably wouldnt have sold the impressive 9m

 

[rofif]

So you only watched gameplay from sidequests chit chat?!

maybe... I know I will play it one day and probably have fun.
Been waiting for DC price drop for ps5. 70 is too much for me on game I am so unsure

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

maybe... I know I will play it one day and probably have fun.
Been waiting for DC price drop for ps5. 70 is too much for me on game I am so unsure

So get ps+ extra . I saved myself from buying that upgrade and got ......don't kill me...extra value out of it. I only recommend this if you already had plus.

 

[rofif]

So get ps+ extra . I saved myself from buying that upgrade and got ......don't kill me...extra value out of it. I only recommend this if you already had plus.

I have extra. I just dont feel like playing got right now. I still have a month left from the upgrade

 

[Swipeyowifelike]

I have extra. I just dont feel like playing got right now. I still have a month left from the upgrade

If that's the case

 

[GymWolf]

Been waiting for DC price drop for ps5. 70 is too much for me on game I am so unsure

If you like samurai old movies and katana parry based combat you should have fun.

 

[NahaNago]

I still haven’t gotten this.

Same, I was waiting to play it on ps5.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Cos its a huge drop of compared to the original

TLOU I aprox +20 mill copies

TLOU II aprox +10 mill copies

An estimate 50% drop judging by those numbers so they rather not talk about it, not something to be proud of/brag about.

Anyway congrats to GoT

Tlou 1 had sold less than 10M in its second anniversary. You really don't know what you're talking about lmao.
It was only when the remaster was released that the game increased in sales.
Ghost of Tsushima was at 7M or something before it was re-released which TLoU 2 still wasn't.
Also, the second game surpassed 10M early this year even if the number was revealed in June.

 

[ZywyPL]

Maybe THIS will finally shut all the TLOU 2 haters up that kept insisting that Ghost outsold it. Ghost isn't even at 10 million and TLOU 2 passed 10 million earlier this year. I love both games but I've grown so annoyed at people telling me that I was wrong and that Ghost sold more when every single sales chart always showed TLOU2 was outperforming it. "Where are the numbers though" they said. Well now you have them.

Both games are like just 500k units apart in sales and you're acting like its at least 1:10 ratio.

Also - what's the deal with caling anyone who dates to criticize TLoU2 a "hater"?

 

[Editaur]

Sucker Punch has definitely come a long way.

 

[GymWolf]

Sucker Punch has definitely come a long way.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Tlou 1 had sold less than 10M in its second anniversary. You really don't know what you're talking about lmao.
It was only when the remaster was released that the game increased in sales.
Ghost of Tsushima was at 7M or something before it was re-released which TLoU 2 still wasn't.
Also, the second game surpassed 10M early this year even if the number was revealed in June.

Still at it stand right now tlou 1 +20m vs tlou 2 +10m

The drop prob has something to do with abby the golf club joel beater you can check the old tlou2 to see how people here react to the second game alot of negativity around it

If tlou 2 can surpass tlou 1 then we can talk again

 

[SeraphJan]

People thinking its a Ubisoft open-world clone, but the combat in this game is way better than any Ubisoft game

On top of that its very atmospheric, which is definitely a plus for this type of game

Its a 10/10 rating even in Japan

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Still at it stand right now tlou 1 +20m vs tlou 2 +10m

The drop prob has something to do with abby the golf club joel beater you can check the old tlou2 to see how people here react to the second game alot of negativity around it

If tlou 2 can surpass tlou 1 then we can talk again

Why would a game that came out 10 years ago that's about to have a remake....and that has been released in 3 different console generations (with a PC version on the way) be surpassed by a game that was released on a single platform, 2 years ago? lmao. And above all, the TV show is about to start...the season that will cover the events of the first game.

Dude it's just not realistic and you know it. You're just setting up TLOU2 to "flop" because you have an agenda when the truth is, if Sony had been let down by TLOU2 numbers we wouldn't have such a big push for this IP, and you know it.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

It's clear all the drama and divisiness affected this game performance. It should be closer to 20 M.

I am glad because TLoUP2 storytelling is a fucking mess and is objectively bad. They wanted to be all sophisticated and fancy and it was all a mess in the end.

Congrats to Sucker punch tho. Remember?

 

[Airbus Jr]

Why would a game that came out 10 years ago that's about to have a remake....and that has been released in 3 different console generations (with a PC version on the way) be surpassed by a game that was released on a single platform, 2 years ago? lmao. And above all, the TV show is about to start...the season that will cover the events of the first game.

Correction 2 platform and i dont have agenda im just telling it ( the numbers) for what it is

The moment abby struck that golf club into joel..thats where everything falls apart..

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Dude it's just not realistic and you know it. You're just setting up TLOU2 to "flop" because you have an agenda when the truth is, if Sony had been let down by TLOU2 numbers we wouldn't have such a big push for this IP, and you know it.

At least massively underperformed.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Correction 2 platform and i dont have agenda im just telling it ( the numbers) for what it is

The moment abby struck that golf club into joel..thats where everything falls apart..

At least massively underperformed.

The way some of you still haven't gotten over the game's plot, lmao.

Whatever floats your boat.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

The way some of you still haven't gotten over the game's plot, lmao.

Whatever floats your boat.

I got the plot. I don't have any issues with the Plot Points, Characters, gameplay, level design, etc.

The only issue the game has is its fucking asinine pretentious storytelling.

 

[Woopah]

At least massively underperformed.

At the very least its a game that sold very well. We cannot say with any certainty that it underperformed at all, let alone "massively"

Back on topic, I think it is fanstatic what GoT has achieved. I thoroughly enjoyed it and that's even before it became one of my favourite online multiplayer games ever.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Wonder how many people made it to the third island? Hell I quit after only a little bit of time after making it to the second island. Maybe I should revisit it. I enjoyed my time but was burnt out after getting to the second area.

Platted the game and enjoyed every moment of it. Gonna start the expansion soon on the PS5.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

At the very least its a game that sold very well. We cannot say with any certainty that it underperformed at all, let alone "massively"

It is the sequel of one of the greatest games ever made. Before part 2, part 1 has sold almost 20 M.

So, all the leg work has been done to establish the Last of Us Ip.

Again, part 2 should be closer to 20M. if you see the best performing PlayStation games....they are closer to 20M. Just look at God of War 2018.

Back on topic, I think it is fanstatic what GoT has achieved. I thoroughly enjoyed it and that's even before it became one of my favourite online multiplayer games ever.

Yep. I wonder if they are going to do a sequel or something else entirely.

 

[Bartski]

here is a fresh idea - let's derail an unrelated thread to argue about TLOU2 story! That never happened before.

 

[Ozzie666]

The passion and soul that went into this game still sits with me. Even with whatever flaws you want to throw at it, the game deserves to keep selling and a true sequel. The artistic creation and the respect to old cinema just keeps adding to it. As a package overall and as a game, it's fantastic. One of the best experiences I had right after Spider-Man and God of War on my PS4. I have a lot of appreciation for it, even if its not perfect. But during a time of open world fatigue, I think it did enough to be different.

The craftsmanship deserves your respect and a piece of your soul, anything else would be uncivilized.

 

[Pelta88]

The passion and soul that went into this game still sits with me. Even with whatever flaws you want to throw at it, the game deserves to keep selling and a true sequel. The artistic creation and the respect to old cinema just keeps adding to it. As a package overall and as a game, it's fantastic. One of the best experiences I had right after Spider-Man and God of War on my PS4. I have a lot of appreciation for it, even if its not perfect. But during a time of open world fatigue, I think it did enough to be different.

The craftsmanship deserves your respect and a piece of your soul, anything else would be uncivilized.

And that's how you build the two things that are essential to this hobby Mindshare & Momentum.

You can't purchase it. It's not sold in store or at any particular dev/publisher. You have to craft it and build on it. IP by IP.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

It is the sequel of one of the greatest games ever made. Before part 2, part 1 has sold almost 20 M.

Again, part 2 should be closer to 20M. if you see the best performing PlayStation games....they are closer to 20M. Just look at God of War 2018.

Once they will start bundling them, both will reach 20 million in no time.

 

[Lupin25]

It is the sequel of one of the greatest games ever made. Before part 2, part 1 has sold almost 20 M.

So, all the leg work has been done to establish the Last of Us Ip.

Again, part 2 should be closer to 20M. if you see the best performing PlayStation games....they are closer to 20M. Just look at God of War 2018.


Yep. I wonder if they are going to do a sequel or something else entirely.

You’re still making the mistake of comparing a game that’s 2 YEARS OLD versus one that is originally 9 YEARS OLD.

Not enough time has passed yet my guy lol…

10 million sales in 2 years on one SKU (PS4) is a failure now?

 

[imsosleepy]

being in this world was so immersive, what a wonderful game to play this was and great combat mechanics as well. Loved every second of it. Enjoyed it more then horizon myself

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

You’re still making the mistake of comparing a game that’s 2 YEARS OLD versus one that is originally 9 YEARS OLD.

Not enough time has passed yet my guy lol…

10 million sales in 2 years on one SKU (PS4) is a failure now?

Is the SEQUEL to one of the greatest games ever made.

God of War 2018 achieved ≈20 M in roughly the same amount of time.

The last of us part 2 should be closer to 20M. There is no spin of any kind. Period

 

[Chiggs]

Ghost of Tsushima is the more successful game of the two:
-GoT had a far higher average selling price compared to TLOU II.
-GoT had an immensely lower head count (and hence, development budget) compared to TLOU II.
-GoT is a new IP, whereas TLOU II was a sequel to a +20 million seller.
-TLOU II is probably at about 10.5m as of now and it's likely reaching the product's EOL sooner rather than later (thanks to the already aggressive price reductions taking place), however, once GoT receives the same aggressive price promotions that TLOU II received, it will more than likely outsell TLOU II even on that (mostly useless) metric.

Interesting post. I just wished you had worked this in somewhere:

• TLOU2 is the Alien 3 of the franchise.

 

[TheTony316]

Cos its a huge drop of compared to the original

TLOU I aprox +20 mill copies

TLOU II aprox +10 mill copies

An estimate 50% drop judging by those numbers so they rather not talk about it, not something to be proud of/brag about.

Anyway congrats to GoT

That's not a fair comparison. TLOU1 took almost 10 years to reach 20 million. Part 2 did half of that in just 2 years with one SKU.