Potato Chip PRO
Member
True... But since it's Gamepass related and I can see theme of this thread is headed. That thanks to Gamepass, Xbox useres don't "buy games" anymore.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Outriders retails at 17% in UK on Xbox (due to being free to all XGPU subscribers), PlayStation 4/5 has 83% of retail sales
- Thread starter Mr.NiceGuy
- Start date
dcmk7
Banned
Yeh.
If they released the next FIFA on GamePass, then that would definitely get Europes attention. Since football is huge.
I don't even think UK gets any coverage of the MLB.
FatKingBallman
Banned
MLB 19 or MLB 20 was on PS+ offer and didn't do shit in Europe. Really.
Astrobot, Demons Souls, Godfall, Destruction Allstars, Spiderman "dlc". Not quite the same, you're not counting right even if you were to say they aren't heavy hitters just like the single low budget game The Medium. Soon to add Returnal, and Ratchet and Clank too.
Mr.NiceGuy
Member
This is a good point. We will have a better picture when NPD and monthly europian sales that has digital data drops.
Stuart360
Member
Are you really trying to use these percentages as some kind of corralation with console sales numbers?, while the game launched day one on Gamepass?. And you called me 'genius' sarcastically lol.
The gap should of been ever wider than this because of Gamepass. It seems there are still a fair amount of Xbox gamers that havent jumped to Gamepass yet.
Stuart360
Member
Gears 5, Gears Tactics, etc.
Both consoles were in a similar state at launch, and a similar state for the first year or so.
Dabaus
Banned
I wonder what the game pass on pc vs Xbox subscription numbers look like. If it’s half and half I wonder if MS pulls the bandaid off in a year or 2 and drops Xbox hardware altogether and makes gamespass as a steam/ epic game store competitor. There’s no way third parties are looking at these sales splits and thinking MS is going to be writing them checks for gamespass indefinitely do they?
What happens when Sony get serious about ps now and Starts marketing it? Sure it will take time to get the numbers up but they have a 120 million pool to pull from vs MS 40 or so million. Plus Sony hardware actually sells, and has good attach rates too.
What happens when Sony get serious about ps now and Starts marketing it? Sure it will take time to get the numbers up but they have a 120 million pool to pull from vs MS 40 or so million. Plus Sony hardware actually sells, and has good attach rates too.
Last edited:
DaleinCalgary
Member
which is disappointing as the World Series includes only 2 countries
FatKingBallman
Banned
These games already existed long time before XSX launch. One console surely had more exclusive games at launch. And NEW ones. And one console surely has more exclusives in first year. Let's not kid ourselves
Last edited:
AutumnLeaves
Member
Just one point? You're being too nice.
dcmk7
Banned
Bad sales?
Gears 5 is a crossgen game from 2019 what are you talking about?
Gears tactics again on xbox one.
Last edited:
Stuart360
Member
And?, did it not get a next gen patch?. Its patch had a lot more work done to it than a lot of the patched cross gen games we have had so far this gen.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Makes sense Xbox disc sales for Outriders tanked. Tons of Gamepass people.
Why pay $60 or $70 when you can get it for cheap on GP? Even if someone wants to support the dev in full with a sale right away, why buy disc? If they are a GP subber they can buy a digital copy of Outriders for 20% off like all GP games.
For those of you who don't know, any game on GP can also be bought digitally at 20% off.
Why pay $60 or $70 when you can get it for cheap on GP? Even if someone wants to support the dev in full with a sale right away, why buy disc? If they are a GP subber they can buy a digital copy of Outriders for 20% off like all GP games.
For those of you who don't know, any game on GP can also be bought digitally at 20% off.
Last edited:
dcmk7
Banned
When the first game starts with a cross gen title and the second a PC port.
It's really, really not the same state.
Mr.NiceGuy
Member
LOL, I'm not the one who wrote 3 posts in this thread just just to try to downplay the gap between the PS5 version and Series X/S ones. How much more wider the gap should be when it's 83% against 17%?
OH and here is Hitman 3 sales in the same market and that is not a GamePass game.
Hitman 3 Outsells Its Predecessor And Shoots To No. 1 On UK Sales Chart
In terms of physical games, the PS5 version of Hitman 3 accounts for 49% of sales.A stella
www.thegamer.com
See a pattern here?
Jaysen
Banned
The whole point of Game Pass is to provide value to its subscribers. Are you really arguing that lower sales numbers in this case is a bad thing? Oh nooooo those poor Xbox owners are so much worse off now for not having to pay 60 dollars for a game lol.
dcmk7
Banned
It takes more work to, you know, develop a new game from the ground up and have it ready for launch.
Trogdor1123
Member
If you are on Xbox and don't have game pass you are doing it wrong. These numbers should be more drastic imo.
Honestly you are moving goalposts beyond belief. A lot of games got next gen patches on PS5 too but do you honestly think that is a counter to:
"2 new consoles which seem like an after thought with little to no new exclusive content"
Do you somehow associate higher framerates and res (which a lot of PS4 games have got too) to be 'new exclusive content'?
dcmk7
Banned
Your first sentence was actually quite good.
You ruined it with the second. Embarrassing yourself with a cringey impression.
Captain Toad
Banned
That probably depends on whether it exceeds or fails to meet expected sales.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
we dont know enough about gamepass revenue sharing to say if this is a bad thing or not.
netflix as we know spends an absurd amount of money to get developers on board. rian johnson's two knives out sequels arent worth $400 million. the first movie made $311 million. sequels tend to do more. but lets assume both sequels had been released in theaters, they wouldve made $600 million. half of that cut goes to theaters. so $300 million goes to rian and the producers. rian got $400 million from netflix so a $100 million more than he wouldve gotten if the movies had come out on theaters and made the same amount of money as the first one.
the westworld guys got $250 million. the game of thrones guys got $200 million. again, not something they have to share with theaters. so they get rich.
now if the publisher or developer of outriders got $60 million thats 1 million in raw sales. since retailers take 20% of the cut and distribution costs are another 10%, royalty fees another 10%, they wouldve needed to sell 1.5 million copies to earn $60 million. now there is a small chance outriders becomes a massive success like destiny and sells 5-10 million at which point the deal the publisher signed with Microsoft starts to look bad, but right now, for a B game like outriders that wouldve sold 2-3 million copies across both platforms, $60 million is a lot of money.
but again, we dont know how much microsoft is offering these guys because unlike amazon and netflix, they dont reveal the deal figures.
netflix as we know spends an absurd amount of money to get developers on board. rian johnson's two knives out sequels arent worth $400 million. the first movie made $311 million. sequels tend to do more. but lets assume both sequels had been released in theaters, they wouldve made $600 million. half of that cut goes to theaters. so $300 million goes to rian and the producers. rian got $400 million from netflix so a $100 million more than he wouldve gotten if the movies had come out on theaters and made the same amount of money as the first one.
the westworld guys got $250 million. the game of thrones guys got $200 million. again, not something they have to share with theaters. so they get rich.
now if the publisher or developer of outriders got $60 million thats 1 million in raw sales. since retailers take 20% of the cut and distribution costs are another 10%, royalty fees another 10%, they wouldve needed to sell 1.5 million copies to earn $60 million. now there is a small chance outriders becomes a massive success like destiny and sells 5-10 million at which point the deal the publisher signed with Microsoft starts to look bad, but right now, for a B game like outriders that wouldve sold 2-3 million copies across both platforms, $60 million is a lot of money.
but again, we dont know how much microsoft is offering these guys because unlike amazon and netflix, they dont reveal the deal figures.
Last edited:
Dabaus
Banned
Another thing to think about is, does gamespass being a great value make people want to go out and buy Xbox hardware or does is it simply justify current Xbox owners feeling good about their purchase? By all measures so far from last gen gamespass never moved the needle for Xbox hardware sales and in fact whenever we did get a few npd numbers they were awful. I believe it was the February of 2019 that Xbox one was like 60 thousand sold in the US, (could be wrong on my head/month but I vividly remember the number.) If the Xbox hardware doesn’t start to take off and we won’t know until shortages let up, then there’s only a finite number of potential subscribers on the Xbox platform and the rest has to come from pc.
So I’m saying at what point does ms cut their losses on Xbox hardware and just becomes a platform agnostic subscription service? To me that’s the end game here for them.
Another thing to think about is does the average joe even know gamespass exists or care for that matter? Does average joe like to stream tv shows but doesn’t necessarily mean he wants to not own his game? Sure game pass makes headlines on message boards like this and other places but does the average person even know or care? To me these sales figures reflect that they don’t and we’ll see it again with the show mlb.
So I’m saying at what point does ms cut their losses on Xbox hardware and just becomes a platform agnostic subscription service? To me that’s the end game here for them.
Another thing to think about is does the average joe even know gamespass exists or care for that matter? Does average joe like to stream tv shows but doesn’t necessarily mean he wants to not own his game? Sure game pass makes headlines on message boards like this and other places but does the average person even know or care? To me these sales figures reflect that they don’t and we’ll see it again with the show mlb.
Last edited:
Stuart360
Member
So it doesnt count basically?, ok fair enough.
dcmk7
Banned
What makes it the same state?
One has had a lot of effort put into it.
The other has done the bare minimum.
Hezekiah
Banned
Some people say that GamePass increases sales?
But anecdotally many people that subscribe aren't willing to pay anything like full price for games.
Stuart360
Member
PS gamers buy more physical than digital?.LOL, I'm not the one who wrote 3 posts in this thread just just to try to downplay the gap between the PS5 version and Series X/S ones. How much more wider the gap should be when it's 83% against 17%?
OH and here is Hitman 3 sales in the same market and that is not a GamePass game.
Hitman 3 Outsells Its Predecessor And Shoots To No. 1 On UK Sales Chart
In terms of physical games, the PS5 version of Hitman 3 accounts for 49% of sales.A stella
See a pattern here?
Lets give the new consoles at least 6 months of being freely available in stores before championing a winner.
And i dont get your point about sales anyway. I have said numerous times on here i expect PS5 to sell 100+mil, and XSX/XSS to have a little rebound from last gen with 60-70mil total.
Shadowstar39
Member
So sad that you people are all on board the no ownership, rent everything train. Exactly where big corps want you. Consume consume consume. Take your complimentary gold game coins, and buy that outfit or feature, the next batch will be 19.99 for 2000 coins. Open up that loot box and be happy with what we give you.
Nah, physical goods are tangible property. Sad how people forget.
Last edited:
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Still struggling to see how the economics of this work out.
The basic reality has to be that whatever MS pays through up-front or residuals (pay per play) needs to be greater than the number of retail sales made below expectations.
Obviously there are benefits beyond this if the product itself contains additional monetization (which is why MLB doesn't seem like a terrible fit, especially for Sony), but objectively if that isn't the case... the money has to come from somewhere.
I'd stress also that I can see more margin on MS' end as basically the premise of GP is that realistically speaking most gamers aren't going to play that many titles in any given month so the "rental" back-end can be distributed asymmetrically. However for the devs... I dunno. You have to wonder what precisely the deals are that MS is cutting?
I mean, for instance will they make assurances that a title will be the spotlight release for its launch month, or do the normal rules of competition still apply?
The basic reality has to be that whatever MS pays through up-front or residuals (pay per play) needs to be greater than the number of retail sales made below expectations.
Obviously there are benefits beyond this if the product itself contains additional monetization (which is why MLB doesn't seem like a terrible fit, especially for Sony), but objectively if that isn't the case... the money has to come from somewhere.
I'd stress also that I can see more margin on MS' end as basically the premise of GP is that realistically speaking most gamers aren't going to play that many titles in any given month so the "rental" back-end can be distributed asymmetrically. However for the devs... I dunno. You have to wonder what precisely the deals are that MS is cutting?
I mean, for instance will they make assurances that a title will be the spotlight release for its launch month, or do the normal rules of competition still apply?
EliTheIceMan
Member
Seriously though GP is hurting sales
GHG
Member
I think I misinterpreted your post as saying "its not selling well on PC" or words to that effect. If it's actually selling well on Steam then nevermind, the server issues aren't having an impact there.
I play on PC. Physical games stopped being a thing there in the mid 00's for the most part. Console gamers are the ones grabbed by the balls. On PC we can always pirate as a last resort.
dcmk7
Banned
The interview with Phil made it seem like they are literally making it up as the go along.
Be interesting to know how much money they are spending for each new subscriber. And whether that ratio is increasing or decreasing.
GHG
Member
Most? At best a handful of indie devs have come out saying it's had a positive impact on sales.
Like I said previously in the thread, it works well for games that haven't had the luxury of being backed by a marketing cycle prior to release.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
You're right. Physical products are owned and tangible. But they are also more expensive.
And unless it's real estate or a collector's item in good condition, most things in life that are purchased go down in value. And a good portion of things that are used have zero value. Even games get to a point EB will offer you $1.
Like most people, I'm sure you are on Netflix or Spotify or even a monthly cable tv plan. Instead of monthly fees where you own nothing, you can scrap all that and just purchase as a disc or digital file every tv show and movie that comes out at $20 each, and surf the internet for local 6 pm news.
Last edited:
I think it must be per play since there are no MTX. However I do think this game is getting more exposure from xbox users just by being on gamepass alone so that may be a good thing for Square Enix if it's per play. Might even be the sole reason for an xbox port. We will never know unless we get numbers.
So what's the reason for the massive difference in your view?
Sir Vilhelm
Member
Try playing that tangible Outriders game when the server shuts down
Excess
Member
GHG
Member
It's a small sample size so far in terms of sales but over the next year a trend will start to emerge.
If the majority sentiment that exists here also applies to the general populous of gamepass subscribers then the results won't end up being any different to what we have with this game:
Game Pass users: Do you buy the games afterwards to support the devs?
I bought Halo MCC on Steam despite having it on Game Pass because i want to have it on Steam and give extra support for bringing one of my favorite franchises to PC. Also thinking of doing the same with Gears 5 since Steam has it on sale now. Have you bought any games from Game Pass since...
Yselacrey00
Banned
How? Why would you want the game twice?
Gone
Banned
Holy shit the meltdown by some playstation fans is actually laughable, albeit a bit sad.
Why the fuck would anyone buy it on Xbox if it's on GamePass?
"The narrative was that GamePass increased sales", well not for an "AAA" game with 70$ price tag, every sane person would play it for "free" with their subscription.
Microsoft paid Square and both are making money while Xbox players are having fun, why does anything else matters?
Keep crying, it's tasty.
Why the fuck would anyone buy it on Xbox if it's on GamePass?
"The narrative was that GamePass increased sales", well not for an "AAA" game with 70$ price tag, every sane person would play it for "free" with their subscription.
Microsoft paid Square and both are making money while Xbox players are having fun, why does anything else matters?
Keep crying, it's tasty.