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Why is Zelda II the best Zelda Ever?
- Thread starter pollo
- Start date
Christopher
Member
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say thank god the damn Zelda song wasn't in OoT I was tired of that overworld theme...hell I didn't even like the remix they did to in Majora's Mask.
Hyrule Field > Zelda Overworld (in context of OoT)
Hyrule Field > Zelda Overworld (in context of OoT)
Zelda 2 is easily the best zelda ever. People biased by "expectations" at the time. It's the scariest(those wolf things, and the blue knights!), arguably the hardest, and for me the most fun. It played NOTHING like dragon quest, rambo, or metroid :lol . That's just laughable IMO.
I don't see what was wrong with it that people despise it so much.
I don't see what was wrong with it that people despise it so much.
Version 3.0
Member
Zelda 2 was hardly the only Zelda to do something different. Majora's Mask, duh. But they've all had their contributions to the series' evolution, which has been considerable over the years.
I'd make a nice, long post about it, but I don't have to. I've already put it in on my site, with pictures and videos:
http://www.gameswelike.com/web/zelda/Zelda History.htm
I'd make a nice, long post about it, but I don't have to. I've already put it in on my site, with pictures and videos:
http://www.gameswelike.com/web/zelda/Zelda History.htm
cartman414
Member
ToxicAdam said:
Normally I don't bump up dead threads, but I couldn't resist this. I've never personally played Rambo, but Metroid's system at the time was underdeveloped to begin with, and the top view borrowed from Dragon Warrior was only a means of getting around the game world. What it brought to the table was an awesome combat system, and to the overworld map, moving enemy encounter icons, which in a perfect world would have destroyed the random encounter in RPGs.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
hahahax said:
:lol There are so many things wrong with that post.
For one thing, Dragon Quest was released the year before Zelda II was in Japan.
For another, Dragon Quest wasn't even the first Japanese rpg to use that formula.
Most importantly, they all ripped it off from Ultima.
And man, I don't Like Zelda II at all. It's the Simon's Quest of that series.
cartman414
Member
Scrow said:
Doesn't have to be changed necessarily. The Zelda II recipe could've been the start of something great as a pseudo-side series. The Castlevania series shouldn't be the only one allowed to shift gears, not to mention into something similar, and apparently without looking back.
Besides, Zelda II sure beats Ocarina of Time in my book.
RyuHayate said:
I'd say yes.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
The OP is right. 
brandonh83
Banned
I could never get into Majora. Just didn't really feel like a Zelda game to me. I'm gonna take heat for that, but whatever. I think Zelda II is okay but I find it highly inaccessible due to the little "mini-stages" you get into when you run into an enemy on the map. I thought they were just kind of pointless and got in the way.
cheekymunky
Banned
You know Bagu? Then I can let you cross.
cartman414
Member
brandonh83 said:
The enemy encounters you mean? They sure beat the random encounters of any number of traditional RPGs.
brandonh83
Banned
cartman414 said:
To me, no, they don't. Random encounters in RPG's are sort of one of the biggest points about them; they assist in character building and are generally built around said battles. They're not my favorite aspect about RPG's, but if you play an RPG you generally know that you're going to have to deal with them. In Zelda II, it's just a tedious, pointless chore that accomplishes nothing and doesn't really fit well in the Zelda universe. I agree with you that if you don't like random encounters in general, then yes, they're better than RPG random battles. But in a Zelda game? No thanks.
cartman414
Member
brandonh83 said:
That's a bit of a double standard there.
In Zelda games you typically have several enemy encounters anyways. (With the possible exception of the quite barren Ocarina of Time. Oh, snap.) Having visible enemy encounters on the world map was a nice way of splitting the difference, and would help in standard RPGs so that you would have more choice in whether you wanted to engage in combat, and would not deny you the option of level building if that's your thing.
brandonh83
Banned
cartman414 said:
I know what you mean, and I don't think you're exactly wrong. I'm just speaking from personal experience; in a Zelda game, I'm used to the enemies already being around... in Zelda II though, the encounters just seem artificial or something, I can't really explain it. But I'm glad you don't have a problem with it.
cartman414
Member
brandonh83 said:I know what you mean, and I don't think you're exactly wrong. I'm just speaking from personal experience; in a Zelda game, I'm used to the enemies already being around... in Zelda II though, the encounters just seem artificial or something, I can't really explain it. But I'm glad you don't have a problem with it.
Hope you caught the small edit I made which explained why I think more RPGs should employ visible encounters. (Oh, and they could still appear and disappear at random. They don't have to be preset.)
I think one reason why they went with the big overworld/random encounter thing at the time was because they wanted to emphasize a greater overworld in comparison with the original. I guess the reason why I didn't mind it was because I thoroughly enjoyed the combat system.
If they do another Zelda II style game they should use a purer Metroidvania style gameplay system. Pure 2d, with exploration and items. And plenty of towns as well. And hopefully a quick means of transportation a la the whistle in earlier games (or the Owl Statues in Majora's Mask).
Easilly up there in my list. Some of the dungeons were pretty bland though, and most boss encounters outright blew. Also the piss-poor localization made puzzle solving a headache in most cases.
Still, a great experiment and I'd love to see the experience system return in the series...you know make all that mob clubbing actually worthwhile again. I'd hate to see yet another Wind Waker debacle filled with tame fights and an explosion of hearts.
Still, a great experiment and I'd love to see the experience system return in the series...you know make all that mob clubbing actually worthwhile again. I'd hate to see yet another Wind Waker debacle filled with tame fights and an explosion of hearts.
cartman414
Member
Scrow said:
Out of the traditional Zeldas, a most definite step in the right direction. But yeah, too many hearts and a too generous enemy damage structure.
cartman414
Member
Scrow said:
Shorthand for the damage taken from each of the enemies in a game.
Walter Matthau
Member
pollo said:
How does that support that it's the best Zelda ever?
Anyway, Zelda II is not the best Zelda and you know it. It's not even the best game of it's type on the NES. You are right that the music is good and that it can be difficult.
brandonh83
Banned
Ristamar said:
I know there were a few notes from it in Ocarina of Time, but I was very disappointed that it wasn't in that game in full force.
cartman414
Member
parathod said:
What better games of its type were there? (I do understand that some say Battle of Olympus, which I have yet to really play.)
cartman414
Member
TheTrin said:
Personally I preferred Link's Awakening and the Oracle games. Less single-use items and greater challenge, not to mention the Roc items. My favorites in the series.
Archie said:
I'm avid enough about Zelda to own a few Link lollipops, but I have to agree here. I sometimes think Zelda II gets so much "praise" because the other half fo the time it's getting torn apart.
I don't think I've ever seen someone take the middle ground.
I admit, though, I always loved the way OoT linked to it with the names of their Sages and the town names in Zelda II.
cartman414
Member
Rydias said:
There are people on the middle ground. Me, I've been a fan since it first came out. It's held up better in my eyes than most other games from that era, and even thereafter.
Anyone who hasn't already should read Shane Bettenhausen's Zelda II related blog entry:
http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=6432567&publicUserId=1002415
BTW I started playing Battle of Olympus last night, and the combat seems a little less solid, even though I'm finding the game interesting. (A lot of the interiors consist of some random NPC though in such a uniform fashion though.)
MadraptorMan
Member
OoT's soundtrack is amazing, especially at the time it came out. The only thing that is laughable is this thread.
cartman414
Member
MadraptorMan said:
The OoT soundtrack thing was just a tangent though.
It's hard as heck and the music is really good.
It's not the best Zelda ever. It's the hardest Zelda by far and that is worth something. I wish later games in the series could have been as hard as the original's "Second Quest" or Zelda 2.
I liked that they tried something different, and I certainly wouldn't mind a modern 3D zelda experience or perhaps a 2D on DS that evoked elements of Zelda 2's gameplay. Since it's kind of the black sheep and most maligned however, I doubt Miyamoto would ever go that direction again.
I liked it at the time, but that last dungeon was incredibly frustrating. However, finally beating Shadow Link was incredibly satisfying as a result.
It's not the best Zelda ever. It's the hardest Zelda by far and that is worth something. I wish later games in the series could have been as hard as the original's "Second Quest" or Zelda 2.
I liked that they tried something different, and I certainly wouldn't mind a modern 3D zelda experience or perhaps a 2D on DS that evoked elements of Zelda 2's gameplay. Since it's kind of the black sheep and most maligned however, I doubt Miyamoto would ever go that direction again.
I liked it at the time, but that last dungeon was incredibly frustrating. However, finally beating Shadow Link was incredibly satisfying as a result.
MadraptorMan
Member
cartman414 said:
A rather long one, though.
cartman414
Member
JayDubya said:
I wonder if a petition along the lines of the Earthbound one would possibly work. Finding that many people though would be an issue.
beelzebozo
Jealous Bastard
Thread said:
reply: because today is opposite day.
SuperSonic1305
Member
Zelda II was the worst one. Horrible glitch fest from hell.
cartman414
Member
Archie said:
Your opinion. I could prove you wrong on the nostalgia deal if I wanted.
SuperSonic1305 said:
There are tons of games with worse glitches. Besides, Zelda II had more of what could be defined as quirks, and I can still think of games that had more persistent ones.
beelzebozo
Jealous Bastard
cartman414 said:
you've gotta admit:
that it is so underappreciated gives it a bad case of "underdog syndrome."
Aft Dread Pressure
Member
AniHawk said:
Hyrule Field has a version of it that is quite different from the original but the theme remains recognizable.
cartman414
Member
beelzebozo said:
True, but I was objecting to him playing the "nostalgia" card.
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