Kerotan
Member
Yep. So much for being 2TF weaker.Another 0.1% win for the PS5? Time for a 10+ page thread
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[VGTECH] Crash 4 PS5 / XSX / XSS
- Thread starter ErRor88
- Start date
Elog
Member
We know the importance of I/O already. The better question is how capable the PS5 is vs an XSX vs a PC. The latter question is the one we can mostly only speculate about since some key specifications are unknown (mostly latency values). The crowd that claims - and have claimed since that EU5 demo - that I/O is not important for graphics is simply wrong however.
CitizenKratos
Member
PS5 was built for UE5 and largely, vice versa. It wasn't a bribe, but it was a partnership of sorts. Perhaps the first test for UE5 will come with the UE5 version of Fortnite to be launched this year.
Gold is malleable so they would be useless?As that Remedy dev said himself, its the tools baby.
PS5
Series X current
Series X future
And the higher the karat, the more malleable it gets.
alabtrosMyster
Banned
Yeah, but MS was too busy working on their products placement everywhere on their dashboard and even before you launch games, so they had to neglect the tools.
Also,their "engineers" seem to spend more time doing YouTube videos as opposed to, I don't know, coding maybe?
MasterCornholio
Member
As that Remedy dev said himself, its the tools baby.
PS5
Series X current
Series X future
I don't get it. When did the Remedy developer say the XSX tools would be more valuable than the PS5 tools?
As someone who works with tools I agree it's a pretty dumb thing for
Stuart360
to say. Also I think he's trying to suggest that the PS5s tools won't improve which is also pretty silly.
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geordiemp
Member
And the new tools, we will see amazing things next E3....or the one after. Just you wait.
Whatever.
Both Ps5 and XSX and 6700 are 2 shader engine, 4 shader array systems so they will all be closer than you believe, sooner you start to accept that fact the better and this group of GPU will not compete with their more parrallel bigger brothers with 3+ shader angines and 6+ shader arrays like 6800 and Nvidia equivalents.
Keep dreaming.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Just watched the video and there were a few moments that the series x dropped frames in gameplay, outside of cutscenes. This one goes to ps5, even if it’s a close one. ideally gameplay should be as Smooth as possible and that’s ps5 in this case.
skit_data
Member
Because they are FULLRDNA2Mesh ShadingVRSSFS-tools of course. Not the standard tools we all know for a fact PS5 is using.
Edit: Cant forget SFS
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MasterCornholio
Member
Developers didn't exactly complain about a lack of RDNA2 features. They mostly (per Digital Foundry) complained on how difficult it was for some of them to transition from an SDK to a GDK.
Even with RDNA2 features the PS5 tool kit can still be easier to work with.
Edit: I remember that Cerny talked about making it easier for developers to design their games.
I don't think RDNA2 features can be used to argue ease of development. But that's just my opinion.
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skit_data
Member
Of course, Im mostly making fun of the idea that tools being behind must certainly be related to not being able to use all these features when its probably more related to unifying the GDK. Because Ive seen this idea entertained quite a lot the last 24 hours.
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MasterCornholio
Member
Developers always had access to RDNA2 features. It's just some of them didn't incorporate them into their software. You can't expect developers to stop development midway just to incorporate SFS, VRS and Mesh Shaders. Games have to be designed with them. Same goes for the PS5 and it's features.
Mr_Potato
Banned
You call bullshit but it comes from a Epic dev and I don't know why he would lie lol
Then when MS says "teraflops are everything, 12>10 so we win" where it's clearly marketing, everybody takes it as gospel
People are so crazy... Look it's easy, I help you :
Developer = technical guy like engineers. Loves tech, usually says the truth. Says complex things but it's worth trying to understand. Has no people helping him communicate. Doesn't make ads. Can be fired if he talks too much. May be a fanboy but it's relatively rare.
Marketing / management guy like Phil Spencer or Jim Ryan = seller, doesn't care that much about tech, says buzzwords like Teraflops or Power of the Cloud, usually lies to sell more products because well... that's his job. Has people helping him communicate and using him for ads.
For some reason people believe what sellers say and think tech guys lie while it's mostly the opposite, maybe because tech guys can't be understood as easily.
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MasterCornholio
Member
You call bullshit but it comes from a Epic dev and I don't know why he would lie lol
Then when MS says "teraflops are everything" where it's clearly marketing, everybody takes it as gospel
People are so crazy... Look it's easy, I help you :
Developer = technical guy like engineers. Loves tech, usually says the truth.
Marketing guys like Phil Spencer = seller, doesn't care that much about tech, says buzzwords like Teraflops or Power of the Cloud, usually lies to sell more products.
For some reason people believe sellers and think tech guys lie while it's mostly the opposite
I prefer to see actual proof with games. Right now I don't know if it's true or not until we see them.
Lysandros
Member
The actual gameplay runs better in PS5 at slightly higher FPS and without the additional stutter of the XSX version. 'It shouldn't be' (??) but PS5 is a very arrogant machine who doesn't know its place.
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demigod
Member
MasterCornholio
Member
I don't even know what "most powerful" means anymore after these comparisons. I missed the days when comparisons were so simple between the X1 and PS4.
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Insane Metal
Member
Come on guys the tools are coming. Any day now.
MasterCornholio
Member
I really hope this doesn't last the entire generation. Arguing over tools is getting really tiresome.
Shmunter
Member
There’s an IGN interview with Control dev that claims Sony stuck with what works and MS has changed things forcing devs to put in work for the new gen.
I can see requiring new work means getting a handle on it vs doing it as always.
But this brings it back to PS5 ports are more likely to be copy paste PS4 code recompiled vs XsX ports requiring a refactoring for the new hardware forcing opportunities for taking advantage of the new system.
Not sure why final outcomes do not reflect the above workflow.
and keeps mocking tools and gpu differences). I save this too
yes except sony bought epic shares for 250 millions for this reason they got ue5 presentation and all the talks. The deal means Sony gets a percent interest in the game development studio and publisherYou call bullshit but it comes from a Epic dev and I don't know why he would lie lol
Then when MS says "teraflops are everything, 12>10 so we win" where it's clearly marketing, everybody takes it as gospel
People are so crazy... Look it's easy, I help you :
Developer = technical guy like engineers. Loves tech, usually says the truth. Says complex things but it's worth trying to understand. Has no people helping him communicate. Doesn't make ads. Can be fired if he talks too much. May be a fanboy but it's relatively rare.
Marketing / management guy like Phil Spencer or Jim Ryan = seller, doesn't care that much about tech, says buzzwords like Teraflops or Power of the Cloud, usually lies to sell more products because well... that's his job. Has people helping him communicate and using him for ads.
For some reason people believe what sellers say and think tech guys lie while it's mostly the opposite, maybe because tech guys can't be understood as easily.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
So are you saying future gaming development engines wont benefit from being designed to take advantage of faster SSDs, faster I/O? I'm pretty sure both Sony and MS have had in house engines redesigned to do just that.
Them saying they redesigned UE5 to take advantage of the PS5 should be seen as a win for everyone and not PR, they even explained how scalable UE5 will be, all the way to smartphones.
You think MS is gonna stay with the exact same NVMe specs for future consoles? Some of yall that wanna throw out its all pr seem to accept that MS wont have a better NVMe in future consoles ever. Thats one wild position to take.
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Bernd Lauert
Banned
Not sure why you would mention Avengers, which is clearly not just a lazy port.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
Maybe most devs are doing copypaste for both and it works less good on XSX for obvious reasons. Who knows.
ethomaz
Banned
Because it uses the same resolution settings as PS4 Pro?
Bernd Lauert
Banned
And all the other settings are different, which means it's not a lazy port.
ethomaz
Banned
That is irrelevant to what he said and what you asked.
Resolution was not changed in that game... that is why he listed it as a game that had no work done in resolution from PS4 Pro to PS5.
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Bernd Lauert
Banned
We were talking about lazy ports. Context matters.
ethomaz
Banned
You call a lady port a small difference in shadow but ignore no change in the resolution of a game?
That is his point.
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Shmunter
Member
Except, copy paste not possible on XsX as the tools have changed. This is a known fact by now.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
What? Avengers changed basically everything but resolution, how can it be a lazy port? They stuck with the resolution because PS5 can't push higher pixels. Meanwhile in Crash 4, they didn't even increase shadows from the One S version. The definition of a lazy port.
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Because apparently Avengers is using the same PS4 Pro resolution settings in the PS5 version. Crash isn't a "lazy port" either but (according to you) it's using the same shadow settings as the Xbox One X version -- which makes it a "lazy port"?
I wonder where you drew the line. So it's a lazy port if the XSX version uses the old-gen settings. But it's not a lazy port if the PS5 version uses the old-gen settings? That's very fair.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
That's a lot of assumptions for which you have no source, evidence, or data.
I think you'd also believe that Crash 4 is using Xbox One X shadow settings because Series X can't push higher shadow settings?
Bernd Lauert
Banned
The evidence and data is in the performance videos. PS5 can't sustain half of 4K, averages at half of 1800p and drops to half of 1440p at the lowest. Do you think Avengers devs were too lazy to change the resolution, while they changed basically everything else?
Skifi28
Member
Going by your last 6 posts back to back, It seems like you're contributing for most of them.Time for a 10+ page thread
Bernd Lauert
Banned
Page 5 soon, 5 more to go
LMJ
Member
So anybody whom actually HAS played the game and isn't only interested in a dick measuring contest, on either the Box to the XseX/S, 4 to the 5...
Does it feel significantly smoother/faster?
Does the Dualsense add anything?
Thinking about getting my Crash on, but might wait for when I finally get a PS5 first...
Does it feel significantly smoother/faster?
Does the Dualsense add anything?
Thinking about getting my Crash on, but might wait for when I finally get a PS5 first...
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Md Ray
Member
FearlessBelgian
Member
I really don't understand why they push the resolution so much on Serie X when by reducing it a bit they could offer a constant 60 fps framerate all the time with a still better resolution than PS5 ... Is this sabotage? ... The PS5 version seems more stable while running at a much lower resolution than the series X version ... Are the developers bad?
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I'm saying that Epic was very careful not to mention the Xbox name during and after the presentation for a specific reason. probably an economic reason and absolutely non-technical as some would have you believe.
To believe that they designed the UE5 most famous cross-platform graphics engine based on the specifications of a console on which any major first parties have never used this graphics engine, it is naive at least.EU It is mainly used on PCs and in the world of consoles, we know who uses it the most is Microsoft. If naughtydog, guerrilla, SSM abandon their rendering engines in favor of UE5, thus losing control over the engine, that's another matter, and it will only mean one thing. That Sony is preparing to release games on pc.
Everyone in next cycle will get better nvme ssd undoubtedly Sony too.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I thought the resolutions were the same on this game and ps5 is just running locked 60 in gameplay?
cutscenes don’t really matter but a consistent 60 should be the target in gameplay imo.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
They didn't really push anything, they just unlocked the resolution to target 4K60 and called it a day. It's a lazy port after all. Both consoles can't really deal with that resolution in cutscenes, but the devs didn't want to put in the work to get the game to a solid 60 fps all of the time.
geordiemp
Member
I was laughing at the E3 build up yes because we hear it every year from all console manufacterers.
About UE5, remember in Cerny presentation he said he went fast as it is better for small triangles. And ps5 has faster IO streaming in game.
Good luck with your UE5 hopes.
XSX will have edge with lots of compute in preloaded levels / light streaming, Ps5 small triangles and heavy data streaming.
That edge will never be exciting either way except when devs dont do a great job and bugs, but those will be outliers.
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