Messofanego
Banned
Dude, just make your own thread then. Why are you telling OP what to do?
Some of you take this way too seriously.
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The New JL Trailer is Everything Wrong With DC's Dark Movie Universe
- Thread starter LionPride
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Dude, just make your own thread then. Why are you telling OP what to do?
Some of you take this way too seriously.
captainnapalm
Member
Eh, I don't think Justice League vs Darkseid and the forces of Apokolips is a story that really lends itself to bright colors. Some of the scenes in the trailer even looked like they might be on Apokolips, or some kind of post-Darkseid invasion earth or something. It's not cheery, colorful material.
Aside from that, you can criticize Snyder for a lot, but please don't ask him to make his visuals look more like Marvel's. The guy actually has his own visual style and sensibility. Some people actually appreciate that in films.
Aside from that, you can criticize Snyder for a lot, but please don't ask him to make his visuals look more like Marvel's. The guy actually has his own visual style and sensibility. Some people actually appreciate that in films.
More_Badass
Member
They are? And lumping together all comics together like that is nonsense. Go read Scott Snyder's Batman, then Arkham Asylum, then the new Batman Rebirth. Same character, three very different tones, styles, and aesthetic
The heroes are constantly altered to fit the creator's tone. There is no one "comics/superheroes are all bright and colorful" style, least of all with Marvel and DC
Thor:The Dark World.
I prefer Fong's work without Snyder.
pirateluigi
Member
To be fair, both of those shots are meant to homage Apocalypse Now.
About the article: I can understand not being a fan of BvS aesthetics. There's something off putting about it that's hard for me to put my finger on. It's not as simple as being too dark though. Maybe it is the desaturated look.
Finally, I never mind a film that's got a dark tone. Heck, Logan is an early front runner for my favorite flick of the year and that movie is dark as hell. BvS has loads of problems not related to tone, but it seems to be an easy scapegoat.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I meant to say specify Superhero comics but sure they are. Batman is probably the darkest superhero comics get and it's generally still pretty colorful. Arkham Asylum is an outlier in terms of almost everything but the other two you mentioned are way more colorful than the average Zack Snyder film. The colors were the best part of the Scott Snyder run.
And that's Batman. If you could find a Justice League comic that wasn't super colorful in comparison to the average Zack Snyder superhero flick I would be shocked.
I still would love to see the current batsuit seen in a live action setting.
I've always been a reluctant supporter of all black batsuits because, when you get down to it, I always throught they looked the best.
This is the first modern colorful batsuit that I think looks great. Purple cape, yellow outline over batlogo, grey suit. It's a genuinely unique, innovating take on the idea. I love it.
CassidyIzABeast
Member
The bigger story here is that Wired has figured out how to fix shoddy editing and a poor script through color grading.
What did he mean by this?
Member
Scenes taking place at sunset or night with poor light sources such as an alien warzone or a sewer underneath Gotham are dark.
And apparently everything wrong with the DC universe
And apparently everything wrong with the DC universe
I don't get the article.
The problem with the DCEU isn't that it takes place at night, it's that the movies ignore the background and best materials relating to the individual characters in favor of try to fit them all in the mold of grimdark Batman.
Like DC doesn't have a static tone across their cast of characters, and the ideal would be if the movies reflected what was best about each individual character instead of focusing so much on trying to fit the universe together.
It's okay to have a universe where one guy is the idealized stand-up 1940s man who always looks toward a better future and another is a crazy vigilante who punches criminals in the night while thinking this is a great solution to crime. Their conflict with arise naturally without having to make the former guy murder people en masse.
The problem with the DCEU isn't that it takes place at night, it's that the movies ignore the background and best materials relating to the individual characters in favor of try to fit them all in the mold of grimdark Batman.
Like DC doesn't have a static tone across their cast of characters, and the ideal would be if the movies reflected what was best about each individual character instead of focusing so much on trying to fit the universe together.
It's okay to have a universe where one guy is the idealized stand-up 1940s man who always looks toward a better future and another is a crazy vigilante who punches criminals in the night while thinking this is a great solution to crime. Their conflict with arise naturally without having to make the former guy murder people en masse.
Anton Sugar
Member
Given the variety of comic styles and designs, what does this mean? Especially when it comes to Watchmen, which Moore wanted to look very specifically like its own entity and borrow very little from established comic book norms.
My biggest complaint with Watchmen is just that Snyder didn't seem to *get* the graphic novel's visual identity. He "faithfully" used panels for his frames as inspiration, but what purpose does this serve? The movie screen is not a single panel out of a 3x3 grid.
Snyder basically took the understated, subtle beauty (and ugliness) of Watchmen and turned it into what Moore was pushing away from: a garish sort of beauty and indulgence.
What did he mean by this?
Member
Its not thinkpieces. More like editor mandated clickbait. This marvel vs dc stuff is big business
GamingPheasant
Banned
People already have the Marvel movies. Let them try and fail. Earning $2.3B with their first connected universe movies doesn't seem to indicate that people disagree with the films' tone and direction.
At this point, I would like to see where this goes rather than them aping Marvel. I feel people will STILL intensely "criticize" them for it even if the successfully do that.
They haven't made a good superman movie since Christopher Reeves. Chances are this will be a terrible movie.
Brian_FETO
Banned
I like the way Snyder's movies look, it'd just be nice to have some substance there
The constant "no THIS is the problem!" complaining is useless when it's every single thing being nitpicked. Too serious! Too grim! Too dark! Why's it nighttime! Where's the color! Where's the jokes! The suits are wrong!
At a certain point if everyone has a problem with everything about these movies than there is nothing they can do to salvage them to critics. Made even worse when they have no vision for it (or are scared to actually go through with anything) so you get these half assed attempts at appeasing complaints in a way that doesn't make sense with what they're trying to do
I love the heavily stylized always dark always raining aesthetic. I get people don't. It's whatever. It'd just be nice to see DC actually follow through with something and make a solid demonstration of "this is what we're trying to do". I'd like to think JL will be that but I doubt it will
"Why don't they just do what Marvel does" is fucking boring and makes for an even more saturated market of the same shit. I'd rather watch some mediocre stuff that looks cool and gives me something else than inoffensive more of the same
The constant "no THIS is the problem!" complaining is useless when it's every single thing being nitpicked. Too serious! Too grim! Too dark! Why's it nighttime! Where's the color! Where's the jokes! The suits are wrong!
At a certain point if everyone has a problem with everything about these movies than there is nothing they can do to salvage them to critics. Made even worse when they have no vision for it (or are scared to actually go through with anything) so you get these half assed attempts at appeasing complaints in a way that doesn't make sense with what they're trying to do
I love the heavily stylized always dark always raining aesthetic. I get people don't. It's whatever. It'd just be nice to see DC actually follow through with something and make a solid demonstration of "this is what we're trying to do". I'd like to think JL will be that but I doubt it will
"Why don't they just do what Marvel does" is fucking boring and makes for an even more saturated market of the same shit. I'd rather watch some mediocre stuff that looks cool and gives me something else than inoffensive more of the same
this is fair
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
What's all this about dark and light? Pure aesthetics. What WB needs is to stop meddling, get better script writers, and get better directors. Firstly, they need to stop the menace that is Zack Snyder.
The problem isn't necessarily that the DC movies are too dark, it's that Snyder's visual style has one mode and one thing it does and that's it. All the shots in that JL trailer look almost identical in color temp, tone, and even setting at times. Other than Bruce in the mountains, not a single shot in that trailer looks like it takes place in a real location. The greenscreen and set extension is incredibly obvious, like The Hobbit obvious. There's no scope or size to it, and everything feels suspiciously claustrophobic, similar to Indy 4.
I mean say what you will about Marvel's flatter cinematography but at least they have a sense of place most of the time. There's almost nothing of visual interest in this trailer. It's cluttered and hard to read when it should be flowing and easy to decipher, especially the Flash stuff. Usually Snyder at least has a few striking shots in each film, even if they're not earned at all, but I guess they're holding those back for the later trailers or SDCC? The only pleasant surprise here is that Aquaman isn't the grumpy "stupid land dwellers don't get how important I am" dickhead that he's often portrayed as being in the early JL days. I really think it's shockingly likely that the Aquaman movie will end up being the best DCEU film in the end.
I mean say what you will about Marvel's flatter cinematography but at least they have a sense of place most of the time. There's almost nothing of visual interest in this trailer. It's cluttered and hard to read when it should be flowing and easy to decipher, especially the Flash stuff. Usually Snyder at least has a few striking shots in each film, even if they're not earned at all, but I guess they're holding those back for the later trailers or SDCC? The only pleasant surprise here is that Aquaman isn't the grumpy "stupid land dwellers don't get how important I am" dickhead that he's often portrayed as being in the early JL days. I really think it's shockingly likely that the Aquaman movie will end up being the best DCEU film in the end.
paragonpro
Banned
I liked the trailer, i dont think ive been on any forum that hates these movies nearly as much as gaf. Whats wrong with dark?
His visual style is good, but everything else isn't for the most part.
You should check out most sites that review movies then.
Nemesis121
Member
FUCK that BS...
DC can stay dark, and Marvel can stay light, we can't have the stand fucking comic book movies from Marvel and DC...
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Nothing, but as a trailer that wants to sell you the movie, some see the start of the trailer till the end just one light scale
Like yes if shits going down, smoke, dreary, fires galore raging, decimation laid about you use the dark to convey the visual scope of the scene
Yet throughout the whole trailer to some including me it felt like that the whole things is just stuck on that visual base
Some of the scenes come off really looking fake, cause the visual tone doesn't match what's happening in front of you
Prime example when Wonder Woman goes her superhero fall pose and joins Aquaman and Cyborg in that alien space location
The color is so muted, Cyborg almost is blending into the scene, Aquaman looks very dull, Wonder Woman looks tolerable cause the focal point is on her
Could've used some different color grade or just lighting it differently, just to show the Superheroes in a good standing
Mighty Chin
Banned
I'm sure Marvel would be just fine with DC staying dark.
"Once you hate someone..."
MHWilliams
Member
Color grading and night scenes aren't the problem with DC's cinematic universe.
That said, I can agree with this wholeheartedly.
That said, I can agree with this wholeheartedly.
yanipheonu
Member
Honestly a big problem is its not really anything new. Yeah yeah, heroes teaming up to beat a major minion of a big bad guy.
I'm already getting tired of it from Marvel, and at least they have Ant Man or Guardians of The Galaxy as a fresh take, and a certain amount for self awareness.
Justice League all looks like Superhero stuff I've seen before, with the same schtick Snyder always has.
I'm already getting tired of it from Marvel, and at least they have Ant Man or Guardians of The Galaxy as a fresh take, and a certain amount for self awareness.
Justice League all looks like Superhero stuff I've seen before, with the same schtick Snyder always has.
pseudocaesar
Member
Imagine if Snyder had this all planned out from the beginning. The dark tone, the brooding atmosphere, all of it just to chronicle the story of Superman as the second coming. I can just picture the Justice League, beaten and bloody on the verge of defeat, and Superman descending from the clouds just as dawn breaks. Superman smiles, wrecks shit up, then they all go and get Kebabs
.
shawarma
shinra-bansho
Member
But it's a natural consequence of them all being similarly Snyder, i.e. bad.
In light of this GAF thread criticizing Marvel films' cinematograpy, I much prefer the MCU's look compared the oppressively dark look of the DC films.
beyond_death
Member
Ooh theyre talking about the literal dark look of the film. And as a huuuge fan of both Marvel and DC, out of Homecoming and JL, JL looks alot better visually.
Palette Swap
Member
I don't necessarily disagree, but it's missing the forest for the trees IMO. These kinds of looks aren't terrible in and of themselves IMO, it's just that they've become representative of Snyder's generally sociopathic approach. It's okay to have a dark tone, if the movie works as a movie and the audience feels engaged, with well delineated characters, who have congruent behaviors and goals, whîle the story flows forward. Except Snyder's movies have really underdelivered for me in these aspects and I felt like I was left with a very mechanical end product. The look and tone are symptomatic of this but aren't the root cause.
There might also be (in my case) a bit of fatigue seeing this kind of treatment applied to DC. After the Nolan movies, the Arkham games, and the Injustice franchise, I could use another approach to this universe. I assume they really wanted to have that tone for their cinematic universe because it gave them some cross media congruence, but it's a bit too much IMO.
There might also be (in my case) a bit of fatigue seeing this kind of treatment applied to DC. After the Nolan movies, the Arkham games, and the Injustice franchise, I could use another approach to this universe. I assume they really wanted to have that tone for their cinematic universe because it gave them some cross media congruence, but it's a bit too much IMO.
ArkkAngel007
Member
I don't mind the greyer, darker look of the two DCU films I've seen (Man of Steel, BvS). The cinematography is quite striking and looks quite good (bad CGI Doomsday and Ceiling-Bat excepted).
Heck, I don't even mind the dark tone. Can dig the don't-give-a-shit Batman and struggling Superman who had to commit an execution in a poorly executed scene.
It's all the contrivances along the way and how far left field this darkness goes that is just plain off, especially with Superman. This being the guy who made out with how-is-this-Amy-Adams Lois Lane over the ashes of a good chunk of city.
Snyder's directing and choice of photography isn't so much as the problem as the writing. Something he needs to step away from and bring in someone of better caliber than Goyer to take the reins.
Heck, I don't even mind the dark tone. Can dig the don't-give-a-shit Batman and struggling Superman who had to commit an execution in a poorly executed scene.
It's all the contrivances along the way and how far left field this darkness goes that is just plain off, especially with Superman. This being the guy who made out with how-is-this-Amy-Adams Lois Lane over the ashes of a good chunk of city.
Snyder's directing and choice of photography isn't so much as the problem as the writing. Something he needs to step away from and bring in someone of better caliber than Goyer to take the reins.
Schweinehund
Member
Complaint comes up every time.
I don't think tone has ever been a problem, at least for me.
What I would like to see is some variety though, for something that's touted as a director driven universe, they've all been shot with very similar aesthetics.
I don't think tone has ever been a problem, at least for me.
What I would like to see is some variety though, for something that's touted as a director driven universe, they've all been shot with very similar aesthetics.
Well said.
MHWilliams
Member
Correct.
The elements that Synder has to work with are completely fine. Visually, the DC films look wildly different than many other films out there. That's not a problem.
What is a problem is there's nothing behind them when it comes to the narrative.
Frozenprince
Banned
He's too reliant on that sound stage look. It takes you out of the realism of the shot.
tee hee boy do I love me some silly bright and colorful fun for the whole family
edit - and before some guy jumps on this yes I know this is Spider-Man - he's the only one whose comics I read so I'm not familiar with the other superheroes. I just agree w this post:
Fancyarcher
Member
I agree that the DC films have overall issues with darkness, but the Justice League doesn't strike me as being exactly "dark". It's pretty jokey.
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