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[onQ123]

They need to say something tomorrow at the financial report

 

[Soosa]

MS said they are losing $200 on every series x. Just $100 on a series s. Its possible that they are simply not making these consoles in large numbers to reduce the losses taken and force a bigger series s adoption rate.

That said, i see xbox series x consoles everywhere i go. And have been seeing them since since summer 2022. Its possible the demand simply isnt there.

That forcing doesnt work.

Series s have been available since the launch and used ones (mint cib condition) wont sell for low as 100€ here.

So how could they force them, giving them for free?

Series x is having some issues as they are harder to find than ps5 now

 

[ReBurn]

I did a for fun search of all my local areas targets, gamestops, and walmarts and my conclusions are the following

1. Series S is available everywhere
2. PS5 Disc edition is Available everywhere and not bundled
3. Series X is available everywhere but only in Forza or Diablo bundles. Not a single store had console only.
4. Didn't see any Digital PS5's in stock at all.

Why bundle a console with a game pass game and charge $60 extra? Xbox sales are already behind why gate keep the bigger console. I feel like this will just push more people to buy the S or PS5.

At least Diablo isn't a game pass game (yet) so you get a game you wouldn't normally have access too. At this point I assume everyone who buys a new Xbox subscribes to game pass.

Who has the time to search all of their local stores to see how many video game consoles they have? I mean if that's how you want to spend your downtime that's cool and all but I couldn't think of a less useful data cache to grind for.

 

[t_wilson01]

Who would have thought that after twenty years of selling game consoles (not to mention phones, tablets, music players and several other things) the small start-up company Microsoft still can't get a handle on the manufacturing side of things.

Live and learn.

 

[Topher]

Who has the time to search all of their local stores to see how many video game consoles they have? I mean if that's how you want to spend your downtime that's cool and all but I couldn't think of a less useful data cache to grind for.

To be fair, it only takes a couple of minutes to look on those store's websites and see what the stock looks like. Nothing really wrong with that in the context of this thread with the acknowledgement that this is anecdotal information since some areas might get more/less stock than others.

 

[ReBurn]

To be fair, it only takes a couple of minutes to look on those store's websites and see what the stock looks like. Nothing really wrong with that in the context of this thread with the acknowledgement that this is anecdotal information since some areas might get more/less stock than others.

Yeah, I know. It's just that it's not even enough info to find a useful pattern in other than you may not be able to buy a specific console within a few miles of the person doing the search. And websites may not have accurate stock information.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

PS5 is not the same as Series Consoles

Never said it is, but hardware prices are hardware prices. They both get their components from mostly the same places. There are differences no doubt, but they arent that far apart.

And I am talking specifically about the XSS console, how can that thing have a $400 BOM when the PS5 has a $450 BOM.

 

[Drew1440]

Microsoft has to enforce the support of all 3 SKUs then, otherwise they risk their full eco system. The Series S buyers would feel cheated if not every game works acceptable.
Yes, it will make things more difficult for devs, but I guess it will be easier to additionally support a faster plattform than supporting the crippled Series S, so the hardest part is already done anyway.
Things like dynamic resolution should also make it easier to support faster / slower devices, it will just display in different resolution.

Not really, if a developer cannot support three SKU's they can just target the Series S and negate the 4K support. The game will still run on the Series X regardless.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Never said it is, but hardware prices are hardware prices. They both get their components from mostly the same places. There are differences no doubt, but they arent that far apart.

And I am talking specifically about the XSS console, how can that thing have a $400 BOM when the PS5 has a $450 BOM.

Yeah, There’s no way the series S costs that much to make

 

[DenchDeckard]

So.... we are entertaining the possibility that even when being outsold by almost 3 to 1 on a monthly basis (globally), MS is actually holding back units ignoring the possibility to be increasing their install base at the most critical time of the console race?

Find that extremely unlikely.

What's 6 months of sales, or a years of sales, or even a generation of console sales when compared to a 70 billion dollar purchase?

 

[onQ123]

Never said it is, but hardware prices are hardware prices. They both get their components from mostly the same places. There are differences no doubt, but they arent that far apart.

And I am talking specifically about the XSS console, how can that thing have a $400 BOM when the PS5 has a $450 BOM.

It could be as simple as PS5 having onboard storage vs Series S/X having basically off the shelf storage & the fact PS5 moved to 6nm & sell a lot more so they can bring the price down

 

[ZoukGalaxy]

Who would have thought that after twenty years of selling game consoles (not to mention phones, tablets, music players and several other things) the small start-up company Microsoft still can't get a handle on the manufacturing side of things.

They are still more in the "start" step than the step "up".

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

What's 6 months of sales, or a years of sales, or even a generation of console sales when compared to a 70 billion dollar purchase?

I can tell if you are serious. I am going to assume you are joking and not answer this.

It could be as simple as PS5 having onboard storage vs Series S/X having basically off the shelf storage & the fact PS5 moved to 6nm & sell a lot more so they can bring the price down

Nope... things like that would not have that kinda swing in BOM. ie are you taking the pis here? $400 BOMSeries S vs $450 PS5 BOM that has a disc drive. And that is launch BOM prices, not prices as of the tail end of last year this year.

Series S $400BOM?????	PS5 disc SKU $450 BOM
500GB	700GB+
~190mm2 die	~320mm2 die
10GB GGDR6	16GB GDDR6
No disc drive	Disc drive
128bit bus	256bit bus

Does that make sense to you? And I just listed out the things that have the biggest sway on the BOM. Sony would also be spending more on everything else compared to the XSS, cooing, PSU, casing, shipping, and even external IO. Now I can see the XSX costing MSike $530-$550 to make, but not a chance the XSS cost $400 to make.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

If xcloud was so vital to Xbox they should have planned it from the start. The next gen consoles are out since 2020. The ABK purchase is on since early 2022, and probably in talks before that. Either they have planned for it since and xcloud servers needs are accounted for and the consoles production follow those plans, or they are still in doubt/ not upping production of consoles for X reasons.

They have been, and it's growing faster than they can keep up, especially considering global regional support.

 

[Ronin_7]

They need to say something tomorrow at the financial report

Don't expect good financial reports from anyone and you won't be disappointed.

 

[SHA]

Is it harder to manufacture more than ps5? I don’t think this is the case , but it's clearly not up to Microsoft to decide the number of units.

 

[onQ123]

I can tell if you are serious. I am going to assume you are joking and not answer this.

Nope... things like that would not have that kinda swing in BOM. ie are you taking the pis here? $400 BOMSeries S vs $450 PS5 BOM that has a disc drive. And that is launch BOM prices, not prices as of the tail end of last year this year.

Series S $400BOM?????	PS5 disc SKU $450 BOM
500GB	700GB+
~190mm2 die	~320mm2 die
10GB GGDR6	16GB GDDR6
No disc drive	Disc drive
128bit bus	256bit bus

Does that make sense to you? And I just listed out the things that have the biggest sway on the BOM. Sony would also be spending more on everything else compared to the XSS, cooing, PSU, casing, shipping, and even external IO. Now I can see the XSX costing MSike $530-$550 to make, but not a chance the XSS cost $400 to make.

The Quote was actually from a few months ago around October so they might have been talking about Serious S being sold for $199 or $249

 

[coffinbirth]

3 SKUs mean having to debug, test, and optimize the whole game 3 times. It's a massive undertaking for devs, specially small devs. If they don't allow devs to skip series S when the "pro" comes out, eventually even more devs will stop making xbox versions of their games. It's already not profitable for some devs, it will only get worse.

They've been doing exactly this the entire time this gen supporting Xbox One, Series S and Series X.

 

[coffinbirth]

I see Series Xs all over the place. My local Walmart had 5 or 6 sitting in case the other day. Prior to that, I had never seen a Series X in a store before until a few weeks ago. Also if they are restricting supply even more than normal, it's definitely to do with new bundles, not just "they don't want to make as many" or some such. That's just nonsense, to be candid.

Yeah, anecdotally, Series X was about a month or two behind PS5 in being in stock everywhere around me.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

The Quote was actually from a few months ago around October so they might have been talking about Serious S being sold for $199 or $249

Oh ok then... at $199, it could make some sense.

 

[onQ123]

Oh ok then... at $199, it could make some sense.

This is the video around the 10:25 mark

 

[German Hops]

Is it harder to manufacture more than ps5? I don’t think this is the case , but it's clearly not up to Microsoft to decide the number of units.

MS inherently wants to push more S units , since it's all digital.
They could easily manufracture more X units if they wanted to.

 

[MisterXDTV]

MS inherently wants to push more S units , since it's all digital.
They could easily manufracture more X units if they wanted to.

Considering the current trend, they should consider Series S the main platform as it's cheaper to make and it's all-digital...

Series X will continue to get killed in sales by Sony and Nintendo anyway...

There's no demand for it

 

[German Hops]

There's no demand for it

Aye, I think the Xbox One X is probably in more demand, due to its UHD capabilities.

 

[DarkMage619]

Sony upped the price of the PS5 but they weren't sneaky with it.

You also didn't get an award winning game. You just paid more for the same thing. I don't see that as a win.

 

[Daneel Elijah]

They have been, and it's growing faster than they can keep up, especially considering global regional support.

Online servers seems to always be behind the needs. And Xcloud is ambitious. But using the same base for online servers and consoles is not supposed to be at the detriment of both. I do not see why Sony do not have the same problems with Playstation Now, but I suppose that the two services are not equal in what they are trying to do.

You also didn't get an award winning game. You just paid more for the same thing. I don't see that as a win.

And then I hope that you will not be surprised when people will continue to say that the Xbox brand is nonexistent outside of the US. a price increase is a clear change. A sneaky one like the alleged xbox forza bundle, if true, is damaging to the brand. I am happy to be a early PS5 adopter.And will mock my friend who refused to buy a PS5 until TEKKEN arrives.Remember that this is unpredecented. And understandable. But forced bundles are an old trick. And a forbidden one in most countries. There is no "win", just different losses. And the fact that more money was probably lost to scammers than Sony gained frol the price increase said it all about what is the loss for Sonyand their consumers. This thread is mostly rumors and speculation. But even if you consider it just bias and ill will to the Xbox brand, the situation is just not good. I hope that it will change soon and that we can move on.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

Online servers seems to always be behind the needs. And Xcloud is ambitious. But using the same base for online servers and consoles is not supposed to be at the detriment of both. I do not see why Sony do not have the same problems with Playstation Now, but I suppose that the two services are not equal in what they are trying to do.

My understanding is Sony do not support the same regions with localised hardware as Xbox does, so it's apples and oranges e.g. streaming game some country A actually goes to cloud servers in country B on Sony where for Xbox it is contained within the same country more often in more places. Sony also do not support the same levels of ecosystem and releases with streaming e.g. one account across console, mobile, PC and that goes for ownership, streaming, security, game saves, crossplay etc. They're quite different offerings.

Given the ABK acquisition and notes we've seen about pushing mobile/devices and Game Pass anywhere with any device the capacity has to be there up front, not lacking and being a shit service. The latest report has around 3 Billion gamers globally and considering PCs+Consoles+handhelds make up fuck of that it's pretty clear what sort of scale MS has to take Game Pass/xCloud to in readiness for a global push on game streaming services. The reach of partners like Samsung that MS/Xbox are already making headway with equates to a very global presence.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Who would have thought that after twenty years of selling game consoles (not to mention phones, tablets, music players and several other things) the small start-up company Microsoft still can't get a handle on the manufacturing side of things.

Live and learn.

Microsoft is fundamentally a software company. Their other hardware products like Surface aren't great compared to leading edge OEM PC manufacturer products either.

 

[YOU PC BRO?!]

At this point, I'm ready for a mid gen upgrade. Devs aren't making use of current gen features so brute force is the only way to go.

In regards to technology this has to be one of the most underwhelming console generations of all time.

 

[DenchDeckard]

At this point, I'm ready for a mid gen upgrade. Devs aren't making use of current gen features so brute force is the only way to go.

In regards to technology this has to be one of the most underwhelming console generations of all time.

Definitely. 3 years in and there hasn't been anything that's really blown me away and nothing that couldn't be done last gen imo