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Penn State football pedophilia thread (UPDATE: NCAA sanctions handed down)
- Thread starter BertramCooper
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Instigator
Banned
GoldenEye 007 said:
Makes little sense. Raped women are also involuntary. Why use an unnecessary long and nebulous description for something that can only be two things: rape of minors or statutory rape?
Scott Paterno said:
WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS?!?
You're not the goddamn prosecutor of this case, Scooter! Its not up to you to decide if there is enough evidence to prove something happened and whose at fault. You had a legitamite accusation with a DIRECT EYEWITNESS statement and your wrinkled decrepit father had an obligation to report it to more than just his boss.
Police take reports on everything. Why don't you let THEM decide whether to take it seriously or not.
blame space
Banned
this is some grim shit
Hari Seldon
Member
Lanbeast said:
Penn State only gets a little funding from the state. Contrary to its name, it is not a state school.
Hari Seldon
Member
JoeBoy101 said:
One thing that no one seems to be reporting is that the person Joe Paterno reported the incident to was the head of the campus HR and campus police. So Paterno reported it to the correct people.
http://www.postgazette.com/pg/11311/1188148-298.stm
Hari Seldon said:
Is that link going to where its supposed to be going? That article doesn't mention much at all about Paterno.
EDIT: Hang on, reading fail. Lemme look at it again.
EDIT2: I dunno, Hari. I see your argument, but strikes me as a weak one. That's like seeing a rape and reporting it to the mayor because he oversees the police department of a city. Perhaps he had that in mind, but given it happened in 2002, Paterno would have to be blind to miss the inaction in the near 10 years between then and now.
samus i am
Member
Did Joe Paterno do what what required of him? Yes. For that reason I think he shouldn't be asked to retire. However, I personally think he could and should have done more.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Hari Seldon said:
It is a land grant university.
Man, this is seriously making me relive my enitre childhood in State College.
Ken Masters
Banned
samus i am said:
But he knew what was going on, to say "hey, he reported something so he's clean" is bullshit, but that's what the sport media will say
Dude Abides
Banned
ChiTownBuffalo said:
Any ideas about why his wife seems to have been completely clueless?
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Dude Abides said:
I dunno man, growing up in State College in the 80's was very...idyllic. It was a university town, relatively diverse for where it was located in Pennsyltucky. I can only guess that Mrs. Sandusky was raising the kids and letting her husband go to work, and being happy she had a spouse of prominence in town? I have no clue to be honest.
For me, Mrs Sandusky was the nice woman who washed my pants after I took a spill all over some dog crap in the back yard. Despite there being a pantsless young Asian boy in the house, wasn't like Mr. Sandusky was putting the moves on me. I'm flabbergastedm confused and horrifed to be honest.
I still don't get how Paterno is at fault. He reported the information given to him to the proper people within the College, and as far as I know, we don't really know what happened after that. For all we know, he could have been told that a proper investigation had taken place and nothing of the sort was found. How is he supposed to know that his superiors are shitty enough people to cover up child molestation? He certainly could have followed up intensely, but it's easy to make those types of judgements after the fact...
samus i am
Member
Ken Masters said:
But he did report it. He just didn't follow up on it, which he isn't really required to do.
Alcibiades
Member
Paterno really should have followed up a bit more, but I wouldn't say he is at particular fault for not resolving this. He didn't see a crime take place, but rather heard something second-hand. He wasn't there and doesn't know what did or didn't happen or whether this is some false accusation, so he reported what he heard to people in charge of handling these things.
It is the graduate assistant who should have been more vigilant IMO. He should have found out who the boy was, gone to talk the mother, and gotten the police involved (though I can see even being witness to something like that being pretty traumatizing). That said, neither of them are at fault compared to the higher ups who tried to cover things up and then lied about it.
Makes me sad for humanity when I read about this
It is the graduate assistant who should have been more vigilant IMO. He should have found out who the boy was, gone to talk the mother, and gotten the police involved (though I can see even being witness to something like that being pretty traumatizing). That said, neither of them are at fault compared to the higher ups who tried to cover things up and then lied about it.
Makes me sad for humanity when I read about this
Ninja Scooter
Member
Paterno should be gone because he doesn't do shit and is nothing but a figure head. Penn St. should be itching to use this as a reason to run him out of town.
Dude Abides
Banned
samus i am said:
I think the notion is that when one of your assistants tells you he saw your former DC, who is still closely associated with the athletic department, butt-fucking a ten year old in the shower of your athletic facility, there may be a moral obligation to do something more than the absolute bare minimum.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
The thing that makes me stop is this:
Joe Paterno is a football coach, and not a criminal investigator. If he kept pressing for investigation or inquiring about it, at what point does it become interference? At what point would law enforcement usually say, "Chill, joe. We got this."
I will admit that having been raised from ages 6 - 13 in State College during the 80's, I have had a very healthy dose of the JoePa Kool-Aid.
Joe Paterno is a football coach, and not a criminal investigator. If he kept pressing for investigation or inquiring about it, at what point does it become interference? At what point would law enforcement usually say, "Chill, joe. We got this."
I will admit that having been raised from ages 6 - 13 in State College during the 80's, I have had a very healthy dose of the JoePa Kool-Aid.
Schmitty
Member
It's been reported in The Daily Collegian (student newspaper) that Penn State administration is using insurance money set aside for lawsuits to cover the costs of the legal fees they are paying. There was uproar from alumni and students alike when we heard the uni was paying those fees so now they are on damage control with that.
The Daily Collegian is filled with letters to the editors of disgust from the situation. It is almost unanimous that everyone involved needs to go, including some who want the president, Spanier to go as well. It is a grim day on campus.
I'd rather the AD be caught paying players.
The Daily Collegian is filled with letters to the editors of disgust from the situation. It is almost unanimous that everyone involved needs to go, including some who want the president, Spanier to go as well. It is a grim day on campus.
I'd rather the AD be caught paying players.
Schmitty said:
Yea, supposedly he was only told of something inappropriate but not details. So simply based on that you report it and let other take care of it.
My question is who is the graduate that witnessed it, and why did he/she not say anything to the police when nothing happened internally after weeks or months or even years?
Dude Abides
Banned
Schmitty said:
Paterno was the second person that McQueary told, after telling his dad. I find it difficult to believe that McQueary was all vague about it. Paterno testified that after the McQueary spoke to him, he told Curley that McQueary said he had seen Sandusky "fondling or doing something of a sexual nature." I think, if McQueary is to be believed, that what JoePa was told was enough to know something serious had occurred.
Edit:
AndyD said:
Mike McQueary, current WRs coach. Maybe he didn't want to make waves and jeopardize his future with the program. Nobody involved in this story comported themselves well.
Alcibiades
Member
disagree completely... paterno could go 0-12 and I don't think he should be fired (and I thought the same for bowden)... when a person contributes that much to your university (and hey it's not like Penn St. hasn't been competitive the last decade) you humor that person in a figurehead position until they are in their grave...Ninja Scooter said:
but all of that is football, not really related here... i don't think he should be fired, but if he was better for this than for his football record...
What I don't understand is how creepy adults are given so much alone time with kids. I also think the wife must have at least had some suspicions if not outright known about her husband. Supposing she is in the house, isn't is suspicious her husband is sneaking out of bed anytime the kids are sleeping in the basement?
I don't like to prejudge people and consider myself really, really open-minded, but when an adult man wants to spend a lot of time alone with little kids there is no way that isn't gonna raise a red flag for me. Although I probably would publicly raise suspicions I'm at least going to keep more alert and look for any other signs. And I wouldn't be hesitant to keep and eye out even if the person I suspected was a friend or family member.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Paterno needs to be run out of town. Yea, he only heard the info second hand, but he allowed this predator on campus until 2009. He let the guy coach kids until 2009. That's unconscionable. I can see him not wanting to call the cops on his friend of 3 decades, but he heard the guy was violating young boys. And he continued to give him access to young boys.
I respected Paterno a lot, and it does not make me happy to say this.
I respected Paterno a lot, and it does not make me happy to say this.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
BertramCooper said:
Rockview State Penintentiary is actually right outside State College.
Schmitty said:
Yeah, and Paterno (I mean the PR hack who actually wrote that statement) is lying through his teeth. The "I didn't know" tact is just him trying to cover his ass after the fact.
Remember, the first public accusations against Sandusky came out in 1998. Then, surprise!, he resigns the next year. When the 2002 accusations arose, you mean the God of Happy Valley couldn't put 2 + 2 together?
Sandusky was a potential candidate for my alma mater's (Virginia) open head coaching job in the late 90s and word on the street is that it was Paterno himself who warned us off.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
I bet they wish he would stop wearing Penn State apparel.
GoldenEye 007
Member
The Pennsylvania attorney general is laying into the university at his press conference. Says Joe Paterno has been cooperative.
krameriffic
Member
Needs more Herman Cain gif.
GoldenEye 007
Member
Penn St. PD first "handled" this issue in 1998? And didn't do anything? WOW
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
lush said:
Whoa whoa whoa.
Just because this happened doesn't mean Paterno all of the sudden ripped off his rubber mask and turned into a monster. Joe Paterno is still a good person, he's just not the paragon of coaching perfection everyone else made him out to be. At worst, he's self interested.
Jerry Sandusky was his friend for I'm assuming 30 or so years. So when he heard about the first allegations back in 98 he reported to the police and the University authorities. Why didn't he get more into it? Would you want to fully delve into what sort of monster your friend/colleague of 30 years is? By knowing less, and completing due diligence of reporting, Joe gets to play both sides, which is totally human. He reports a crime, and he also protects himself. That's completely understandable. And from what is coming out, he pretty much kept other schools from hiring Snadusky, which explains the bitterness from Sandusky.
Yeah, I wished he woulda done more. But, I can't say I wouldn't have had the same conflict.
bigtroyjon
Member
Are you kidding me? He knew he was a fucking pedophile and still let the guy bring a kid along on a bowl trip and didn't say a word when the guy would bring kids to practice.ChiTownBuffalo said:
Paterno may have covered his ass criminally but morally he is just as fucked up as the rest of the people covering this up.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
bigtroyjon said:
Nope, I am not kidding you.
I am saying that in situations like this, with the length and history of the type of relationship Paterno and Sandusky had, it wouldn't be as black/white as people on the outside see it or want it to be.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
ChiTownBuffalo said:
The "understandably conflicted" argument, while probably relevant for things like fraud, is pretty much thrown out the window when you strongly suspect your friend of 30 years is raping little boys. Honestly, if Paterno warned other schools off from Sandusky that just makes it even worse.
bigtroyjon
Member
ChiTownBuffalo said:
I guess all I can say is that if you think that a 30 year old friendship is worth allowing someone to rape 10 year olds, then I think you've got some serious mental problems.
diffusionx
Gold Member
ChiTownBuffalo said:
Paterno might have covered his own ass, he was probably crushed that his friend of 30 years was a deviant (who wouldn't be shocked, if this came out about your friend?) but it still makes him an enabler.
We're not talking about Sandusky giving players bundles of cash. We're not talking about Sandusky doing lines of coke with the QB or whatever. That would make Paterno an asshole, but all these coaches are.
We're talking about Paterno continuing to give Sandusky access to young boys years after it was obvious that he was a predator. If JoePa wanted to stop Sandusky's BS foundation work that was really a front for molestation, he could have. He didn't, so Paterno deserves the criticism he is getting. Paterno is a very, very bad person.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
bigtroyjon said:
Either my writing sucks or your comprehension sucks.
All I said, was that JoePa's action or inaction, was colored by his relationship with Sandusky. I didn't say it was OK, but I'm also saying that it doesn't make JoePa a monster on Sandusky's level.
blame space
Banned
krameriffic said:
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
ChiTownBuffalo said:
Your reaction is colored by your relationship with the family. Which in your case, is perfectly understandable! You spent a lot of time with a seemingly idyllic family which apparently held an unspeakably dark secret, which is very difficult for you to reconcile many years later.
And it's not about something as binary as Paterno being a "monster" or not, or even a "bad person" or not. I don't really know what the official criteria is for "bad people". But ignoring compelling evidence that your old friend is a child rapist is BAD. Really bad, and not in a particularly "understandable" sense. If it's not a black and white issue, then it's a very very very very dark gray, at least.
MaddenNFL64
Member
I don't think JoePa should be hurt at all by this. He told someone directly related to Campus police. He's not a hero by any means, but he's not a villain.
Get everyone else the fuck outta there though.
Get everyone else the fuck outta there though.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Joe Shlabotnik said:
Ok, I will admit that. My interactions with the Sandusky's have never been anything but positive. And as I stated before, given when I was a resident of State College, I left there is a very slanted image of who Joe Paterno is.
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