Were you around for the Killzone 3 debacle?
Oh hell yeah xD that was a disaster for Sony and I wonder how so many fell for the '05 trailer expecting that to be gameplay. That said, they've avoided such a fiasco since; Uncharted 4 was pretty close between the reveal trailer and final game on PS4 Pro IIRC, TLOU2 even moreso (and in some cases the final game looking better in parts than that game's reveal trailer).
They don't want another Killzone 3 disaster ever again and it's understandable why. In Microsoft's case I'm hoping games like Hellblade II hit very close to their initial reveals, just to cut down on folks complaining about downgrades.
I'm not very familiar with XGS output, cadence, and production, but I thought State of Decay, Perfect Dark, and Hellblade 2 would be very close to launch by this stage, because:
Especially for HB2 and SOD3, it's already been 3+ years, which is usually enough for sequels. Not sure why some are saying that these are 2023/2024 games.
- State of Decay launched in 3 years ago in May 2018.
- Perfect Dark has been playable for many years now, according to executive tweets
- Hellblade 2 is in production since 2017 or 2018, I think?
Personally, I am not excited about SOD3, but I do want to see Hellblade 2 this E3.
For full-blown sequels? I think you need more than 3 years but then again it depends on when the sequel begins production. Some sequels start maybe 3/4 the way through the first game while others may not start initial phases until the first game is completed. Others still may not get greenlit until a decent while afterwards.
If the sequel is revamping lots of engine features and game mechanics from the first one, that will also require a good deal of time. So 3 years is more in the ballpark for certain expansion content; Miles Morales is a pretty good example of that, as well as the Lost Legacy standalone expansions, though at least one of those was only 2 years following the preceding game, not 3.
Ms have the warchest to pretty much decimate anything with the amount of first party stuff they are sitting on right now…it’s just a mater of when they are going to fire the barrage……this trickle a couple of first party stuff out won’t really cut it anymore….as gamers it’s gonna be a great time
We shouldn't conflate money with talent, though; statistically speaking at least a few of those teams they have should consistently turn out great results. However, the optimal desire is that most of those teams should hit that threshold, not just some, and money can only get you but so much.
Other platform holders both current and past have worked with a good deal less money but generally more consistent releases of high-quality 1P content for their duration as platform holders. Myself personally, if I were to rank Microsoft between them, Sony, Nintendo, Sega, SNK, NEC and Atari, it'd be something like: Nintendo > Sony > SEGA > Microsoft > SNK > NEC > Atari.
Why? Well because in addition to just sustaining good releases I'm also looking at industry-defining releases too and on that note I don't think there's anyone who'd complain about Nintendo taking the crown there. However, I'd say SEGA have had more of an impact in that area than Microsoft as well, considering games like Outrun, Virtua Fighter, Daytona, VF2 & 3, Sonic, Phantasy Star Online etc. revolutionized certain gaming genres or in some cases, were graphical powerhouses (and in cases like VF3 on the Model 3 arcade board arguably the best-looking game on a technical level PERIOD) in the entire industry for a little while.
IP-wise outside of Halo and arguably Gears (because initially that was an Epic IP) I don't think Microsoft has had too many industry-defining moments in terms of 1P software, but that is NOT the same thing as saying they've had no good internal 1P software because they clearly have (Crackdown 1 & 2, Forza, Flight Simulator, Gears 5 etc.). That of course goes up even further in taking 3P exclusives basically treated like 1P especially in the 360 era, but that's overly complicating the argument.
So maybe the warchest going forward will make a difference and we'll not only get a better consistency of good 1P content but more industry-leading great 1P content as well. But traditionally, Nintendo, Sony, and SEGA...they've been able to have more on that latter front with less money to work with (especially in SEGA's case), and depending on how far you go back that's still the case even accounting for inflation. It's part of the reason I'm actually not too interested in yet more Xbox new AAA game rumors or the such; I want to see results from at least a few of the games they've ALREADY announced and shown off, because seeing (and playing) is believing
How many more posts like this are there going to be? They have 23 plus studios! Much more than Sony or Nintendo, they are as far away from the Xbox One generation as one could possibly be.
Not much else to say here other than what I was just saying, i.e Quantity != Quality.
Keep hearing about all these studios Microsoft's has now but that's not really the issue at all anymore.
The argument isn't whether or not they can produce enough content at some undetermined time in the future, it's whether or not they can do it before customers get sick of fucking waiting. It's the impact of that content not being there at launch. It's about already being outsold in hardware 2 to 1 and the lack of momentum against their biggest competitor because of software issues. It's the impact of not having content clearly laid out for the foreseeable future.
To me it's pretty simple. If the games come too late (my argument is they are already too late) it will have a negative impact on their ability to build and maintain momentum into this gen. It's been 6 months and no 1st party exclusives to speak of. Meanwhile their competitor is releasing solid game after game after game.
Spin it anyway you like, they might have enough studios now, but they still very much have a software timing problem.
Yep, it is the timing that is very important here. Say Halo Infinite is a disappoint (I don't think it will be in fact I think it'll be very good since they've got Joseph Staten back but we'll see) and Starfield isn't as polished as it should be. Let's say some of these upcoming 3P exclusives don't quite hit (i.e they're more like The Medium) and expected heavy hitters like Hellblade II and Avowed really are 2023 releases...
By that time only the most faithful are going to be waiting around patiently, others will have moved on. As an example the SEGA Saturn actually got quite a lot of its best games in 1998, roughly three years after the system came out in America. But by then it was too late; PlayStation cemented itself (and arguably had its best year software-wise in 1998 as well) and N64 was cleaning up after the marketshare SEGA left behind.
I don't want that happening with Xbox because even if generations are longer now, that cementing of users in install bases and ecosystems is very real and doesn't take too long to start before the snowball of momentum carries onward. And I'm one of the folks who feels that in spite of some messaging from Microsoft, console sales at least for the next few years WILL matter because native hardware will remain the best way of enjoying GamePass until cloud streaming tech and data plans in places like America both improve to a wider degree and more affordable means (for game streaming-friendly internet service and quality modems/routers).
Now that I think about it in some ways XBO's last year reminds me of the Saturn's in the West; the system was technically still available but it was clear to see a need to move onwards and mindshare-wise competitors (Sony and Nintendo) just ate up almost everything. We also know that Dreamcast saw a lot of great 1P support almost from jump but especially in year 2000, roughly a year or so after the Japanese launch.
If there's any hopeful patterns of similarity between the two, we should start getting some great 1P (or timed/full 3P exclusive partnership) gaming content from MS starting late Summer into the Fall, and particularly picking up in 2022. Which means if we're going to see a glimpse of that incoming, it should preferably start with E3 in two weeks. And I already said what I think needs to happen to really help bring that forth in the OP.
temper expectations and saying that everything will be "meh" are two different things ...the reality is that halo infinite will probably be the game that will sell the most so far on any new console.
I dunno about that, unless Halo Infinite is just a massive revolution for the IP. Can't recall how many copies Halo 5 and MCC sold on XBO and PC, but I do remember seeing MCC reached 10 million players on PC recently. 10 million players != 10 million copies sold, though. At best it is very near that but we simply don't know.
In any case, it would still be a ways off from Uncharted 4, God of War and especially SpiderMan 2018 which in the latter's case has actually sold 2x that number as copies to customers.
I thought they have sold almost every unit they have made. If they had more 1st party software would they have sold more than what they already had? Also the virus seems to have impacted them far more than Sony so that also seems to have affected their software output. Developers had already complained about the state of their GDK initially, which was overhauled to make software for three different platforms easier, which is something no other platform holder had to deal with. They had several unique situations that affected their business. I'm willing to see what e3 has before making any conclusions.
The question then is why did it impact Microsoft much more than Sony? And we aren't even talking about the whole of the companies because Sony's movie division got royally screwed over due to COVID (I would also argue do to the increased flux of work done online therein needing cloud systems and services Microsoft as a whole weathered COVID very well especially when you look at their revenue figures for 2020), just the gaming divisions.
Outside of owned internal teams I think it's fair to say Sony's gaming division is bigger than Microsoft's Xbox division or at least has been that way for a long while, yet still they were able to have 1P content in a timely fashion for their new console whereas Microsoft didn't. Why is that? It's a good question worth asking IMHO, and I think the answer comes down to upper divisional management, or lack thereof. That can also transpire to lack of communication or contingency plans. Maybe the fact several of Microsoft's new studios were still settling in and hiring up to the point of the lockdowns also meant they were still slow in getting up to speed on their projects, so perhaps they could've went about that a bit differently?
After all when you hire new people, even industry professionals, they need a period to get acclimated with the workflow of the new place, the corporate culture, and get up to speed on where the project is at and what needs to be done. For every new addition there's at least a bit from the rest of the team that has to be taken away from their focus on the project to initiate the new hire for a bit, one way or another, directly or indirectly. I don't work in the industry so I can't say this from experience, but it just seems like a logical thing that would've been done.
Xbox is being Xbox, which is why this thread even exists.
Lol damn, well that is one way to retort I suppose.