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[RiamuBME]

I played through the demo today. I was pleasantly surprised with actually what I already assumed was going to be, for lack of a better word, shit.

The combat was actually decent, not only decent, but fun. It wasn't a drag like the previous two games in the series, it was actually fun to almost play it like a fighting game. Although that isn't very 'RPG', I thought it was a good system. Reminded me of the Crisis Core system almost. I certainly can see why Sakurai likes the system.

The only problems for me were to do with the story and the graphics. I have no idea what happened in XIII-2. I don't even care, I hate the characters and the XIII's story was convoluted and so full of not needed hyperbole. Graphically, to me anyway, it looks worse than XIII-2 looked and maybe only just up to par with what XIII was demoing. I don't know if they have made some cutbacks or some shit, but it had some janky looking textures and moments. Maybe I have already been spoiled by the recent next-gen titles. Hopefully the final version of the game will look slightly better.

I am actually thinking of pre-ordering now. Before it wasn't even on my radar.

 

[HTupolev]

Did anyone else also find it rather odd that they played the entire opening cutscene during the opening credits? I actually let that play, because I thought it was actually just the opening credits scene. But then wondered what the hell was going on and why the characters seemed to be talking during a scene with no audible dialogue. Then, when I actually started the game, it replayed that entire scene again, but this time it made a lot more sense.

XIII-2 does the exact same thing, although I appreciated this one a lot more because the music was actually carefully matched to it. It's a tad cheap, but it's an aesthetically nice alternate take on the opening CGI. Not incredible, but it impressed me more than the opening credits of the other XIII titles. Especially with the transition to the actual title screen; I haven't seen a game open a title screen so well in over a decade. Not that that's saying a whole lot, because most games suck at this, but it's something.

Graphically, to me anyway, it looks worse than XIII-2 looked and maybe only just up to par with what XIII was demoing. I don't know if they have made some cutbacks or some shit, but it had some janky looking textures and moments. Maybe I have already been spoiled by the recent next-gen titles. Hopefully the final version of the game will look slightly better.

Overall aesthetic result, who knows, but overall graphical impressiveness probably won't improve from demo to full game. The texture shimmering and low geometric detail are par for the course with FFXIII games, and low texture quality is inevitable in a game that both has large areas and doesn't seem to support texture streaming. It's not an issue that they can "optimize" away overnight.

(On the plus side, texture pop is probably not going to be an issue, heh...)

 

[Exentryk]

I miss the stagger bar.

 

[Perfo]

What does it mean "Lightning got a new message" when starting the DEMO? I couldn't figure it out.

 

[mechphree]

I like the combat a lot. I've never played the previous games so I was completely lost. I probably would pick it up as used..

 

[Fahrenheit]

Man FF13 was one of the biggest disappointments, didn't touch 13-2. Played this demo and really dig the gameplay but the plot seems as dumb as ever.

 

[BocoDragon]

Graphically, to me anyway, it looks worse than XIII-2 looked and maybe only just up to par with what XIII was demoing.

Are you implying that you think XIII-2 was better looking than XIII? It was not. XIII-2 was a significant step down in graphical polish from XIII. And I'm not saying XIII-2 was ugly.

Probably, the XIII series was a decline in graphics from each game to the next.

 

[Kain]

I just finished the demo. I have to say I skipped all the cutscenes because the writing gives me headaches. It's been getting worse from game to game, these guys are geniuses hurting brains.

Now, to the game itself. The demo without cutscenes is maybe 15 minutes long, but the combat is a strange mix betweeen Valkyrie Profile and FFX-2. It was not bad by any means, but it's not brilliant, like nothing in this series has been since FFXII. It's just... normal and unremarkable.

 

[SoraanTribal]

What does it mean "Lightning got a new message" when starting the DEMO? I couldn't figure it out.

I really don't know. I was confused by that as well, and an icon (I think blue) popped up above her head, and I had no idea what it meant. Does anyone else know?

 

[RPGCrazied]

I really don't know. I was confused by that as well, and an icon (I think blue) popped up above her head, and I had no idea what it meant. Does anyone else know?

Probably just a new entry to the datalog? Since its disabled in the demo you really can't check it.

 

[Perfo]

Yeah that must be it guys, a new datalog entry perhaps.

The interactions with Hope are fun, that's a nice idea they got from many western games where characters are costantly interacting with each others. Sad the conversation keeps moving on if you get into a battle, I'll probably walk slower when one starts so I can listen before battling. Like we said time is not going to be a problem so I think I can play it with my pace, so enjoying every little conversation between the two.

On a side note I just informed my little cousin (11yrs old) that LR: FFXIII is finally releasing and, after loving XIII-2 so much (and complaining about old fans saying "this is shit, i want ff7 again blabla!!1!!!!1" usual boring stuff from nostalgics!) he did run to the nearest gamestop and preordered a copy. I'm so happy for him he is going totally media-blackout to it and seems so proud of it... little genius

 

[Esura]

Yeah that must be it guys, a new datalog entry perhaps.

The interactions with Hope are fun, that's a nice idea they got from many western games where characters are costantly interacting with each others. Sad the conversation keeps moving on if you get into a battle, I'll probably walk slower when one starts so I can listen before battling. Like we said time is not going to be a problem so I think I can play it with my pace, so enjoying every little conversation between the two.

On a side note I just informed my little cousin (11yrs old) that LR: FFXIII is finally releasing and, after loving XIII-2 so much (and complaining about old fans saying "this is shit, i want ff7 again blabla!!1!!!!1" usual boring stuff from nostalgics!) he did run to the nearest gamestop and preordered a copy. I'm so happy for him he is going totally media-blackout to it and seems so proud of it... little genius

Your little cousin got good taste.

 

[Ganon Dragmire]

What does it mean "Lightning got a new message" when starting the DEMO? I couldn't figure it out.

It's a message from Light. You can see it in the outworld menu, and you'll be able to send this:

 

[SoraanTribal]

It's a message from Light. You can see it in the outworld menu, and you'll be able to send this:

Oh.. hmm, I looked there and it did make the blue icon go away (I think), but I didn't see anything new. Weird.

Speaking of datalog - is the one in LR the same type of datalog from XIII/XIII-2 where it gives summaries of events happened so far and details everyone/everything? I know the datalog gets a lot of hate (for good reason - especially if it keeps story details in there that players should really see in a cutscene), but I do enjoy reading it as I play.

 

[Perfo]

I do love the datalog. I just don't like that the entries are most of the time fairly short. I would've love something more complex and detailed.

I think it's returning this time too, will it feature any difference or improvement? Also... is there a summary of XIII and XIII-2 events somewhere?

 

[kick51]

Are you implying that you think XIII-2 was better looking than XIII? It was not. XIII-2 was a significant step down in graphical polish from XIII. And I'm not saying XIII-2 was ugly.

Probably, the XIII series was a decline in graphics from each game to the next.

Definitely a decline.

XIII's image quality might be top 5? top 3? for last gen. PS3 version, obv

this looks better in the demo than the screens, but still has that somewhat muddy XIII-2 image quality

 

[SoraanTribal]

I do love the datalog. I just don't like that the entries are most of the time fairly short. I would've love something more complex and detailed.

I think it's returning this time too, will it feature any difference or improvement? Also... is there a summary of XIII and XIII-2 events somewhere?

Yeah, they can be really short sometimes. :/ I'm sure the datalog will cover events in XIII and XIII-2. They might even have something like what XIII-2 did with a narrator going over the events - not sure.

Definitely a decline.

XIII's image quality might be top 5? top 3? for last gen. PS3 version, obv

this looks better in the demo than the screens, but still has that somewhat muddy XIII-2 image quality

I definitely think the image quality, art design, and the amount of polish of the games got a bit worse as the series progressed. FFXIII is still one of the best looking games from last gen - there wasn't a single area I didn't think looked great (well okay, maybe that garbage dump place, forget the name). XIII-2 was a step down in terms of visual fidelity, but it wasn't an ugly game by any means. The first area is actually quite beautiful with the crystallized Cocoon hanging in the background, and Academia was gorgeous as well. The new Archelyte Steppe was an improvement over the XIII one in some ways if not just for the addition of real grass, lol. XIII was basically a hallway, so it's not too surprising it is the best looking one in the series, though.

 

[haikira]

Anyone have any good story catch up videos for the original XIII? My friend and I really like the demo for returns and are going to power through XIII-2, while waiting for this to come out. Just wanted to get caught up on the story for the original, before we jump into the middle.

 

[ktynn]

I honestly love the art direction; the game looks very detailed and shiny, i love it.

Also; the combat system is addictive as hell, and the effects/sprites are simply gorgeous.

I have to admit that storywise, i'm completely lost here aswell, but ye... i guess there will be somekind of cutscene sequence that comes with the full game, clearing up everything

 

[SoraanTribal]

Anyone have any good story catch up videos for the original XIII? My friend and I really like the demo for returns and are going to power through XIII-2, while waiting for this to come out. Just wanted to get caught up on the story for the original, before we jump into the middle.

You can possibly try this story recap. I didn't watch the entire thing, so I don't know how accurate it is, but I'm sure it'd be good enough to know what happened. XIII-2 has a part on the main title screen where you can listen to a narrator go over the events of XIII, though.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Anyone have any good story catch up videos for the original XIII? My friend and I really like the demo for returns and are going to power through XIII-2, while waiting for this to come out. Just wanted to get caught up on the story for the original, before we jump into the middle.

Probably pretty easy to go to youtube and watch cutscenes from XIII. I'm sure an uploader has them all up at this point.

 

[Ganon Dragmire]

Probably pretty easy to go to youtube and watch cutscenes from XIII. I'm sure an uploader has them all up at this point.

Like this 9 hour video of all of FFXIII's cutscenes. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxMcuzOgVrU

but if anyone still has questions we are discussing the series here:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=756569&highlight=lightning+returns

 

[HTupolev]

Are you implying that you think XIII-2 was better looking than XIII? It was not. XIII-2 was a significant step down in graphical polish from XIII. And I'm not saying XIII-2 was ugly.

Probably, the XIII series was a decline in graphics from each game to the next.

In some respects XIII-2 is graphically doing more than XIII. It's got a lot more alpha and overdraw (like with the grass on the Steppe), it's got areas with multiple shadow-casting light sources (like the lighting in the dark eclipse spots)... Of course, it also runs at 20fps a lot of the time.

this looks better in the demo than the screens, but still has that somewhat muddy XIII-2 image quality

Image quality is a weird discussion, because it depends on so many things.

XIII-2's is actually a lot like XIII's, they both look 720p2xMSAA, with similar texture filtering. But objects in the distance in XIII-2 can be weirdly blurry. It might be a rudimentary DOF-ish effect.

The image quality in the LR demo has substantial differences from XIII-2's. They're both kind of blurry, but in LR's case it's because the textures just plain aren't very high-quality. And if the demo is anything to go by, LR seems to have dropped the MSAA.

XIII's image quality might be top 5? top 3? for last gen.

FFXIII definitely has above-average IQ for games in the 720p ballpark for seventh-gen. Some areas of the game maintain impressive consistancy, and overall more clarity than a lot of 720p games with similar amounts of shimmering.

But the IQ is absolutely smoked by many of the 1080p games (which tend to manage substantially more clarity with less shimmering), and you could argue that a moderate number of 720p games (like Forza Horizon, pushing 720p4xMSAA) have it beat as well.

 

[Yoshichan]

Anyone got a link to a video where someone is pro as shit and beats the demo boss super easily/fast?

 

[HTupolev]

Anyone got a link to a video where someone is pro as shit and beats the demo boss super easily/fast?

Oh come on.

Second result on my first Youtube search was a well-presented 17-second kill.

There are tons of videos of fast Zaltys kills on Youtube. 16s seems to be the line, but I could be wrong, I haven't exactly searched very far.

 

[SoraanTribal]

Question about the full game - it's about the quest system. Can you pick up all the quests from Chocolina or does she have separate quests from regular NPCs? Do you have to return to the NPCs to complete quests or can you just go back to Chocolina to turn everything in? In some of the walkthrough videos I've seen, the player goes back to Chocolina to pick up and turn in quests, but then later, he gets a quest from a NPC. Just not sure how that all works.

 

[Goli]

Question about the full game - it's about the quest system. Can you pick up all the quests from Chocolina or does she have separate quests from regular NPCs? Do you have to return to the NPCs to complete quests or can you just go back to Chocolina to turn everything in? In some of the walkthrough videos I've seen, the player goes back to Chocolina to pick up and turn in quests, but then later, he gets a quest from a NPC. Just not sure how that all works.

There are two kind of side quests, the ones you get from NPCs around the world, and the ones Chocolina gives out (the Canvas of Prayers quests). The ones from NPCs generally are more involved and have a little storyline of their own, each has different completion requirements, some need items, some need you to find someone and such, while the Canvas of Prayers quests are more like generic fetch quests (bring me xx of x item and such), and to complete those you must turn in the required item(s) to Chocolina, then the quest is complete.

 

[SoraanTribal]

There are two kind of side quests, the ones you get from NPCs around the world, and the ones Chocolina gives out (the Canvas of Prayers quests). The ones from NPCs generally are more involved and have a little storyline of their own, each has different completion requirements, some need items, some need you to find someone and such, while the Canvas of Prayers quests are more like generic fetch quests (bring me xx of x item and such), and to complete those you must turn in the required item(s) to Chocolina, then the quest is complete.

Oh, I gotcha. Thanks for the information. Yeah, the quests with Chocolina definitely seemed to be a bit on the boring side, unfortunately. I take it you get roughly the same types of rewards with both types of quests?

 

[Perfo]

I have one more question. Can you fight main bosses again like in the DEMO over and over to get better scores? And where you do that... like in the DEMO they keep appearing in the same spot or you get to do that through the Ark?

 

[adamsapple]

Ok, so I played through the demo (JP) on 360 and just now English on PS3. Here's some impressions of mine ..

- The PS3 version seemed a bit visually better, maybe it's the colors, maybe 360 version was a bit washed out, but I thought the PS3 version looked a bit "vibrant".
- Lightning's English voice acting is .. better .. than before I guess. She sounds a bit more lively, and less monotonous.
- I think i might begin the game on Easy. Even though I didnt have any trouble in the demo, i've read enough on how the game has a spike to scare me already .
- Another thing I noticed, I could swear the sprint (RT) was MUCH faster on the 360 JP demo, in the PS3 US demo the sprint is barely above the standard running speed, may just be my imagination, but I couldn't help but feel I was sprinting much faster before.

 

[RiamuBME]

Are you implying that you think XIII-2 was better looking than XIII? It was not. XIII-2 was a significant step down in graphical polish from XIII. And I'm not saying XIII-2 was ugly.

Probably, the XIII series was a decline in graphics from each game to the next.

From my brief time with XIII-2 I remember it being decent looking. I was massively impressed by XIII at the time, but this was nearly four years ago. Lighting Returns does seem like a bit of a let down, graphically, compared to what is currently out.

 

[R_thanatos]

Ok, so I played through the demo (JP) on 360 and just now English on PS3. Here's some impressions of mine ..

- The PS3 version seemed a bit visually better, maybe it's the colors, maybe 360 version was a bit washed out, but I thought the PS3 version looked a bit "vibrant".
- Lightning's English voice acting is .. better .. than before I guess. She sounds a bit more lively, and less monotonous.
- I think i might begin the game on Easy. Even though I didnt have any trouble in the demo, i've read enough on how the game has a spike to scare me already .
- Another thing I noticed, I could swear the sprint (RT) was MUCH faster on the 360 JP demo, in the PS3 US demo the sprint is barely above the standard running speed, may just be my imagination, but I couldn't help but feel I was sprinting much faster before.

it's maybe a matter of taste but i find the english lightning lacking any sense of conviction and any sense of "emotions"

 

[Exentryk]

Anyone got a link to a video where someone is pro as shit and beats the demo boss super easily/fast?

Oh come on.

Second result on my first Youtube search was a well-presented 17-second kill.

There are tons of videos of fast Zaltys kills on Youtube. 16s seems to be the line, but I could be wrong, I haven't exactly searched very far.

12 seconds - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5y5rbvEDOo
Maybe with enough retries and luck, 11 might be possible. But that seems to be the best possible time.

 

[Arthea]

Played a demo this weekend. Not impressed at all. Well. combat kinda has potential, only I hate limited items during combat. Even if it's logical and easy way to make a game seem challenging, it never works better than other methods, never.
I might buy it for cheap, though.

 

[Elaugaufein]

Hmm. I wasn't expecting to be impressed by this and I was disappointed but not completely for the reasons I expected.

My interest in ARPGs is much lower than turn based and I'm not great at them either. Ive found tbe overarching FFXIII story terrible both per game and as a "unified" whole so far. I'm basically in this to have the complete XIII saga since I've come this far and for no other reason. I'm not going to buy XV on name alone like I did XII & XIII since I'm pretty clearly no longer the target audience. That said onwards:

I was expecting to find this demo a chore but that's pretty much the opposite of what happened. The story makes as much sense as I ezpected so that's all good. But the combat seems too easy really and as said I'm usually bad at these things . The enemies are slow and telegraph their moves hugely, and they can't seem to deal with range. The field enemies don't seem to aggro very easily either. The scoring system is also really generous I had an enfrost potion (and both buff potions) I totally forgot about and still finished the demo boss on one go with 5 stars (not an impressice time ~4:30).

With that accomplished the demo also seems way to short. At 2 GB in size it takes longer to download than to playthrough since I'm not the type of person to try and obsessively reduce my time on a boss once I've five starred it.

 

[SoraanTribal]

The scoring system is also really generous I had an enfrost potion (and both buff potions) I totally forgot about and still finished the demo boss on one go with 5 stars (not an impressice time ~4:30).

The scoring system is fucked up if you ask me. I beat the boss in half your time, but only for 4 stars for some reason. I've seen several people get far longer times, but still get 5 stars, but I only got 4. I wonder if it's something I'm doing wrong in battles.

 

[Notxbox]

See I don't agree with most of you. I was impressed with the opening cutscene graphically. During gameplay I wasn't much focused on the graphics as you are inside for the whole demo and there isn't too much going on.

This story is so all over the place though. I'm not sure I beat XIII-2 because I was stuck at some point and couldn't figure out where to go next. I'm going to try to find a good recap on youtube.

 

[Z3M0G]

I miss the stagger bar.

Me too. You can still stagger, but I didn't understand how it worked at all in the demo...

 

[distantmantra]

I miss the stagger bar.

Same here. I noticed the wavy line above the enemy turned yellow, which I think meant they were staggered, but I couldn't tell for sure.

 

[Goli]

I have one more question. Can you fight main bosses again like in the DEMO over and over to get better scores? And where you do that... like in the DEMO they keep appearing in the same spot or you get to do that through the Ark?

You can refight against all bosses in the full game when you're in the Ark, and you can also fight against all last ones there as well, as long as you've beaten them in the corresponding difficulty setting.

Same here. I noticed the wavy line above the enemy turned yellow, which I think meant they were staggered, but I couldn't tell for sure.

The line turning yellow is like the mid point in the stagger bar, then it turns red and it waves... violently, then the enemy gets staggered.

 

[matmanx1]

I thought the demo had one of the best looking CGI intros I have seen in a long while.

The gameplay was fun and the music, as expected, is very good.

I will keep my preorder and play the game for the battle system and the music and try to ignore the story as much as possible.

 

[Mitochondrion]

In some respects XIII-2 is graphically doing more than XIII. It's got a lot more alpha and overdraw (like with the grass on the Steppe), it's got areas with multiple shadow-casting light sources (like the lighting in the dark eclipse spots)... Of course, it also runs at 20fps a lot of the time.


Image quality is a weird discussion, because it depends on so many things.

XIII-2's is actually a lot like XIII's, they both look 720p2xMSAA, with similar texture filtering. But objects in the distance in XIII-2 can be weirdly blurry. It might be a rudimentary DOF-ish effect.

The image quality in the LR demo has substantial differences from XIII-2's. They're both kind of blurry, but in LR's case it's because the textures just plain aren't very high-quality. And if the demo is anything to go by, LR seems to have dropped the MSAA.


FFXIII definitely has above-average IQ for games in the 720p ballpark for seventh-gen. Some areas of the game maintain impressive consistancy, and overall more clarity than a lot of 720p games with similar amounts of shimmering.

But the IQ is absolutely smoked by many of the 1080p games (which tend to manage substantially more clarity with less shimmering), and you could argue that a moderate number of 720p games (like Forza Horizon, pushing 720p4xMSAA) have it beat as well.

I was disappointed that XIII-2 was a step down in graphics compared to XIII. There was few cutscenes that was the likeness of XIII. All the cutscenes in XIII was absolutely amazing. I wish XIII-2 was like it. It has very few.

I understand these were real time graphics so it explains the step down in graphics. Is there a reason why Square Enix do this? One thing I notice is that if you change the character outfit it will reflect in those real time cutscene. So maybe that is why?

 

[Caayn]

Sorry if this has come across already in one of these 18 pages. But has anyone taken the trouble to compare both demos(gameplay/cutscenes compression) side by side?

 

[Polishin8r]

wow I hate the demo I think game-play is worse than original XIII....what have they done ....at least it saves me money from buying this so called final fantasy

 

[SoraanTribal]

How does the guarding work exactly? Sometimes you still take a small amount of damage while other times it just says "Guard" (0 damage). Is it based on when you press Guard? Wait as long as possible before guarding? Or guard early?

And someone mentioned something about timing your button presses when attacking causes more damage? Or did I misunderstand that.

 

[Exentryk]

How does the guarding work exactly? Sometimes you still take a small amount of damage while other times it just says "Guard" (0 damage). Is it based on when you press Guard? Wait as long as possible before guarding? Or guard early?

And someone mentioned something about timing your button presses when attacking causes more damage? Or did I misunderstand that.

AFAIK, there are timing bonuses. So if you press the guard button at the right time, you'll reduce the damage you receive (possibly negating it completely at times). Same goes for attacks. I think they're called "Just Attacks"?

 

[SoraanTribal]

AFAIK, there are timing bonuses. So if you press the guard button at the right time, you'll reduce the damage you receive (possibly negating it completely at times). Same goes to for attacks. I think they're called "Just Attacks"?

Oh ok, that makes sense. I'd just have to play around with it to get the timing down.

 

[R_thanatos]

The scoring system is fucked up if you ask me. I beat the boss in half your time, but only for 4 stars for some reason. I've seen several people get far longer times, but still get 5 stars, but I only got 4. I wonder if it's something I'm doing wrong in battles.

YOu have to actually not lose your opportunities to deal damage for reaching 5 stars, as long as your in the right time range and you haven't missed those opportunities , you'll get it.
For 5 stars in this demo , you have to basicly deal the most damage possible while the boss is in stagger i think you can stagger him twice before you're scored 4 stars.

 

[HTupolev]

See I don't agree with most of you. I was impressed with the opening cutscene graphically.

Well, nobody is complaining about the quality of the Visual Works CGI.

It's top-notch, as usual.

I was disappointed that XIII-2 was a step down in graphics compared to XIII. There was few cutscenes that was the likeness of XIII. All the cutscenes in XIII was absolutely amazing. I wish XIII-2 was like it. It has very few.

I understand these were real time graphics so it explains the step down in graphics. Is there a reason why Square Enix do this? One thing I notice is that if you change the character outfit it will reflect in those real time cutscene. So maybe that is why?

A lot of cutscenes in FFXIII are handled in real-time as well.

In XIII-2, the animation/cinematography/whatever people were obviously spread more thin, though. More "have the characters play a stock animation while the camera sits around doing nothing at a sloppy angle" kinds of stuff. And of course the game had less Visual Works CGI to go around.

12 seconds - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5y5rbvEDOo
Maybe with enough retries and luck, 11 might be possible. But that seems to be the best possible time.

Nice.

 

[SoraanTribal]

YOu have to actually not lose your opportunities to deal damage for reaching 5 stars, as long as your in the right time range and you haven't missed those opportunities , you'll get it.
For 5 stars in this demo , you have to basicly deal the most damage possible while the boss is in stagger i think you can stagger him twice before you're scored 4 stars.

Hmm, weird. I mean, since I killed him pretty fast, I'd imagine I dealt a lot of damage quickly while he was staggered. I dunno, lol. I just find it's a very weird system if someone can take twice as long as me to kill the boss, but they got 5 stars because they dealt slightly more damage during the staggers/knock outs.