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False "saving" with switching to PC

What? AA games thrive on the PC, see things like Wasteland 2, Divinity Original Sin, Age of Decadence, Assetto Corsa, Space Engineers, Pillars of Eternity.

The console market and the major publishers were the ones that killed small non-AAA games.

Smaller AAA games (meaning not the huge ones lile CoD, Battlefront, Assassin's Creed etc.) isn't the same as what you call AA games. Pretty big difference in budget between the games you list there (that are often crowd founded) and something like Until Dawn, Bloodborne, etc.
 

UnrealEck

Member
AAA games is already a risky proposition because of the huge investment to the publisher and lower overall return and each title sold would make it even more so.
And while Nintendo probably has a strong enough first party that they would still continue as a third party developer, I doubt Sony and Microsoft would see that as a feasible investment overall and would probably just pull out and sell their studios. And that would be a blow as well, I can't see a game like Until Dawn ever happening without a platform holder pouring money into it, to make their platform more desirable.

With the disappearance of consoles scenario, the people who would have been buying those games int he first place would be almost all continuing the hobby on the one platform. The sales of a game like Until Dawn (which is on one platform in a scenario where there's several platforms) would barely diminish. In fact, there might even be an even larger audience if almost everyone left still enjoying the hobby were on the one platform.
 

kavanf1

Member
Especially if someone is new to PC gaming, the amount of amazing title that can be had for next to nothing and can provide literally years of gaming is mind boggling.

That lasts for a couple of years, then you start entering the "Steam sales are shit nowadays, I remember when they used to be good" phase. The reality of course being you've already bought everything you want...
 
With the disappearance of consoles scenario, the people who would have been buying those games int he first place would be almost all continuing the hobby on the one platform. The sales of a game like Until Dawn would barely diminish. In fact, there might even be an even larger audience if almost everyone left still enjoying the hobby were on the one platform.

A doubt a game like Until Dawn would even be founded in the first place in that scenario.

And besides if we believe that a lot, if not most console gamers, are pretty average consumers that just want to buy things that work without thinking to much about price or technical aspects, I have a hard time believing everybody would just migrate over to PC. It certainly isn't a given. Gaming isn't the only hobby out there by a long shot and for a lot of console gamers, I imagine it isn't even what they primarily spent their free time on.
 
A doubt a game like Until Dawn would even be founded in the first place in that scenario.

And besides if we're believe that a lot, if not most console gamers, are pretty average consumers that just want to buy things that work without thinking to much about price or technical aspects, I have a hard time believing everybody would just migrate over to PC, it certainly isn't a given. Gaming isn't the only hobby out there by a long shot and for a lot of console gamers, I imagine it isn't even what they primarily spent their free time on.
Lol

-consoles just work!
-console gamers actually have lives!

whatyearisit.jpg indeed.
 

Mega

Banned
"You don't save money by spending money" as a focal point of your argument on why PC gaming supposedly isn't really cheaper? Wow.

There's literally no arguing that PC gaming is cheaper almost immediately (within months) after you get a PC and buy games for it, contrasting against a similar amount of console game purchases. This includes AAA games.

Then there's the ridiculous fallacy of PC being too complicated for the average gamer. When, 15 years ago? What a joke. Consoles have become more complex and PC-like while PCs have simplified all aspects of the process to get started playing as quickly and easily as possible. The very casual gamer wont even touch consoles because they're not how it was in the past with SNES or Playstation, and now you see mobile eating some of its lunch and a resurgence in PC gaming that we havent seen since... ever?
 

Carlius

Banned
in the longrun you save on pc a lot more yes. console money comes form the immediate gratification of day 1 purchases and having a larger market, while the pc money comes from the long term sales,which gives games infinite life.
 
I paid Fallout 4 for 30€ on release date, LEGALLY, for a physical version. Games are usually 10 to 20€ cheaper. Sometimes even cheaper.
There's also all these stores such as Greenmangaming.
It's not only cheaper thanks to sales or waiting... it's also cheaper on day one. And for AAA releases.
 
Lol

-consoles just work!
-console gamers actually have lives!

whatyearisit.jpg indeed.

GAF isn't the world. A lot of people were counting out the new consoles before release because they were just like PC's and thinking they were dead in the water, but both are still selling great. So easy of use, especially conceived easy of use, most be pretty important to some people.

Don't really know what you're trying to achieve with the second comment. If you think the average gamer (the people we're talking about here) care as much about the medium as the average GAF poster I don't know what to tell you. It's not about having a life, just about how invested you are. I have many friends and family that buy a good number of AAA games a year on their console of choice, but don't really read a lot gaming related news or care about the medium beyond the immediate entertainment it gives them.
 

ViolentP

Member
You can often purchase a vehicle cheaper if you go manual transmission. You will have to learn to drive a manual, however.
 

Armaros

Member
GAF isn't the world. A lot of people were counting out the new consoles before release because they were just like PC's and thinking they were dead in the water, but both are still selling great. So easy of use, especially conceived easy of use, most be pretty important to some people.

Don't really know what you're trying to achieve with the second comment. If you think the average gamer (the people we're talking about here) care as much about the medium as the average GAF poster I don't know what to tell you. It's not about having a life, just about how invested you are. I have many friends and family that buy a good number of AAA games a year on their console of choice, but don't really read a lot gaming related news or care about the medium beyond the immediate entertainment it gives them.

I don't know what you are trying to do with bring up hilarious over the top hyperbole and stereotypes from years ago.

Your personal anecdotes not withstanding because they are just that, personal anecdotes.
 
I don't know what you are trying to do with bring up hilarious over the top hyperbole and stereotypes from years ago.

Your personal anecdotes not withstanding because they are just that, personal.

I don't see how saying "I'm not sure everybody would automatically migrate over to PC" is more hyperbolic than saying "everybody would surely migrate over".
 
Way to completely ignore 3rd world countries, like Brazil, where the price of a RECENTLY RELEASED AAA PC game can be 60% CHEAPER than its console port counterpart.

While PC parts around here are more expensive than in the US, the games also are, in the majority of cases.

But hey, I'm not really saving up right? I'm from a 3rd world country so I have no voice anyway.
 

Mihos

Gold Member
I don't save money anywhere because I buy pretty much everything...

That being said, I get way more content on PC than console for the same amount of money. Exactly how many games it takes to reach that tipping point... I don't know... but $500 on console gets me between 8 and 15 games across all consoles.... same $500 gets me damn near every game on PC. Not to mention the backwards compatibility to older titles that will never be available on console and mods, emulators, fan games like Streets of Rage remix etc..
 

purdobol

Member
It's a choice between closed platform and open platform really.
One cannot definitely tell which one is cheaper because it differs from person to person.

To be able to compare we'd have to build PC that performs on par with consoles (which is almost impossible). Then we'd have to buy the same games and compare the bills.

PC gaming can be cheap and can be expensive. Depends on what experience user wants. One thing is certain though. PC platform is more flexible. And that's the main advantage over consoles. It always was and probably always will be. At the cost of ease of use (debatable) you get flexibility.
 

JimmyRustler

Gold Member
All I can say is that ever since I bought a PC I have spent much less for a game on average but much more in total.

Sales are killing me...
 

Armaros

Member
A doubt a game like Until Dawn would even be founded in the first place in that scenario.

And besides if we believe that a lot, if not most console gamers, are pretty average consumers that just want to buy things that work without thinking to much about price or technical aspects, I have a hard time believing everybody would just migrate over to PC. It certainly isn't a given. Gaming isn't the only hobby out there by a long shot and for a lot of console gamers, I imagine it isn't even what they primarily spent their free time on.

Do show me where I use "over the top hyperbole" and "blatant stereotyping"?

You think the majority of PC gamers spend all their time tinkering and getting their games to work or finding cheap deals?
 
It's a choice between closed platform and open platform really.
One cannot definitely tell which one is cheaper because it differs from person to person.

To be able to compare we'd have to build PC that performs on par with consoles (which is almost impossible). Then we'd have to buy the same games and compare the bills.

PC gaming can be cheap and can be expensive. Depends on what experience user wants. One thing is certain though. PC platform is more flexible. And that's the main advantage over consoles. It always was and probably always will be. At the cost of ease of use (debatable) you get flexibility.



Yes it is. I mean, you can already build it for cheap by yourself. Or there's even the Alienware Alpha.

As for buying the same games, AAA are generally cheaper on PC, that's a fact. And by that, I mean on same day and date release.
 

Durante

Member
Everyone could be saving money by moving to PC gaming.

As with everything else related to PC gaming, how much you want to take advantage of the various opportunities and possibilities opening up is your personal choice.

:bow
Succinct and apt.

People and these boards and else where that clammer for the death of the console, completly fail to realize that without consoles a lot of AAA development wouldn't be feasible any more because of piracy and the lower price expectancy on PC.
If I were clamoring (I assume that's what you meant) for the death of the console, I'd call that killing two birds with one stone (though I disapprove of such brutality even in metaphors).

So PC gamers: enjoy what you have, but when you talk down to the "ignorant console peasants", remember that these dudes are the ones that makes a lot of your hobby possible.
#notmyhobby
In fact, chasing AAA money on consoles nearly killed my favourite part of the hobby for around a decade.
 

Armaros

Member
Succinct and apt.

If I were clamoring (I assume that's what you meant) for the death of the console, I'd call that killing two birds with one stone (though I disapprove of such brutality even in metaphors).

#notmyhobby
In fact, chasing AAA money on consoles nearly killed my favourite part of the hobby for around a decade.

The irony is that the biggest reason why PC gaming had gotten huge is all the games that Consoles Devs completely abandoned or would never make.

Could you imagine LoL, Dota,CS:GO being developed under the watch of MS/Sony and no PC?
 

Akronis

Member
The irony is that the biggest reason why PC gaming had gotten huge is all the games that Consoles Devs completely abandoned or would never make.

Could you imagine LoL, Dota,CS:GO being developed under the watch of MS/Sony and no PC?

He's using the old "PC gaming is full of pirates" argument so I don't even think it's worth arguing with him.
 
You think the majority of PC gamers spend all their time tinkering and getting their games to work or finding cheap deals?

Did you read what you quoted? Never said that. I don't think all console gamers refuse to spend time online for cheap deals either.

So unless you think saying that; there might be a difference between what a console gamer is looking for vs what a PC gamer is looking and that probably influences their choice of platform, counts as over the top hyperbole and blatant stereotyping, you don't have a case here.

Edit: I was trying to make the point that, a system with both consoles and PC is the most healthy for the marked, since it, based on the numbers we have now, bring in the most reason for investment from companies. A gaming landscape without consoles might be fine, but it is an uncertainty and assuming everything would just continue as usual is a dangerous proposition in my view.

And I'll leave it at that, people seem to read the half of what I'm posting that fits with their agenda, so I don't think there's any point in continuing down this road.
 

purdobol

Member
Yes it is. I mean, you can already build it for cheap by yourself. Or there's even the Alienware Alpha.

You misunderstood. What i mean was that building PC that will get you same experience as Consoles is almost impossible. Simple due to technical reasons. Hardware is not utilized to it's fullest on PC as it is on Consoles. And games demands more or less horsepower (depends on a port).

For comparisons we'd have to build PC that for example have same performance on the same settings and resolution as console counterpart. And then check how much this hardware costs. And then add the cost of games. It could be cheaper who knows.
 

Akronis

Member
You misunderstood. What i mean was that building PC that will get you same experience as Consoles is almost impossible. Simple due to technical reasons. Hardware is not utilized to it's fullest on PC as it is on Consoles. And games demands more or less horsepower (depends on a port).

For comparisons we'd have to build PC that for example have same performance on the same settings and resolution as console counterpart. And then check how much this hardware costs. And then add the cost of games. It could be cheaper who knows.

People have already done that math. It is cheaper with the discounted games and some multi-plats run better on the i3/750Ti combo than on consoles, at console-settings or above.
 

Armaros

Member
GAF isn't the world. A lot of people were counting out the new consoles before release because they were just like PC's and thinking they were dead in the water, but both are still selling great. So easy of use, especially conceived easy of use, most be pretty important to some people.

Don't really know what you're trying to achieve with the second comment. If you think the average gamer (the people we're talking about here) care as much about the medium as the average GAF poster I don't know what to tell you. It's not about having a life, just about how invested you are. I have many friends and family that buy a good number of AAA games a year on their console of choice, but don't really read a lot gaming related news or care about the medium beyond the immediate entertainment it gives them.

Did you read what you quoted? Never said that. I don't think all console gamers refuse to spend time online for cheap deals either.

So unless you think saying that; there might be a difference between what a console gamer is looking for vs what a PC gamer is looking and that probably influences their choice of platform, counts as over the top hyperbole and blatant stereotyping, you don't have a case here.

You don't think the bolded could be directly applied to the majority of PC users?

You think the huge number of people that play only one or two games (wow, league of legends, CS:GO) don't act similarly?

You try to say GAF doesn't represent the world and that's true and yet you to pretend PC GAF here represents PC gaming all over.
 

purdobol

Member
People have already done that math. It is cheaper with the discounted games and some multi-plats run better on the i3/750Ti combo than on consoles, at console-settings or above.

Well then. So it's cheaper and more flexible. And can be used for other purposes. And can be upgraded. And have bigger library of games.

It's a damn good platform for gaming. That's for sure.
 

Omadahl

Banned
I'm a big fan of spending $45 or less on day one for games I really want. I'm an even bigger fan of getting games a year later for less for $20.
 

Rathorial

Member
I REALLY do think you save money going to PC gaming in the long run, because I did so during college when I had a fixed budget. I obviously needed a computer to do basic tasks, so spending some more to make it play games was cheaper than buying both a decent work-only PC and a console.

You mention people frowning on third-party sites, but I don't think it's hard to find one that is legit. I've used greenmangaming for years, who have a 20-30% coupon on new games almost perpetually, and I've yet to not get what I ordered. Suddenly the $60 day one big game became a $35-48 purchase instead. The savings weren't just an excuse to spend, but the only way I could get these games at all.

Then the PC games I played with mod tools kept adding additional content, letting me get more out of a game before going out to get something new. Instead of $50-60 a year on Xbox Live (later PS+), I could use that money on new or old games.

While brick and mortar $60 AAA games are a thing many people buy, there are certain PC F2P games that drew a large audience. I met people who don't even really play games much who were into League of Legends, or gave up Battlefield to play Planetside 2. Hearthstone draws in more people than the average AAA game as well. If anything these service-based multiplayer F2P games are becoming a thing the more casual people on the platform consume now.

PC gaming still has more of the technical hurdles than consoles, and if you don't build it yourself will cost more at the beginning...but consoles have adopted PC features that brought along complexity and a loss to "pure" plug and play. PCs have also gotten only more user-friendly and automated. I think that and the additional ways to save money is why more and more people have flocked to it in the last half decade.

Steam's growing userbase can't just be hardcore gamers and new kids, there is a portion of console folks moving over (even if just to be a secondary platform).
 

joecanada

Member
I think a person could save money by pc gaming, but that person is not me... for example:

I couldn't justify a 400 PC as I would want to make this better and that better, and it would generally be outclassed by ps4 in later years.

I currently share all ps4 games with multiple people meaning I play 50% of new releases but buy about 25% of them.

I hate fiddling with settings, and would spend 0 time doing this at home, despite what people argue repeatedly I see "help me with my settings" posted everywhere.

Hate fiddling with anti-virus, windows, anything that I have to deal with at work basically. Pretty much anything including waiting for the PC to boot up.
 
You misunderstood. What i mean was that building PC that will get you same experience as Consoles is almost impossible. Simple due to technical reasons. Hardware is not utilized to it's fullest on PC as it is on Consoles. And games demands more or less horsepower (depends on a port).

For comparisons we'd have to build PC that for example have same performance on the same settings and resolution as console counterpart. And then check how much this hardware costs. And then add the cost of games. It could be cheaper who knows.

Such efforts were made years ago, but I'm sure the pricing has changed dramatically. There are PC gaming OS devices out there that streamline the gaming process and lock down non-essential functions not related to gaming. I've seen them at internet gaming cafes. Last time I did the calculations was around 2008 though.
 

Mega

Banned
You don't think the bolded could be directly applied to the majority of PC users?

You think the huge number of people that play only one or two games (wow, league of legends, CS:GO) don't act similarly?

You try to say GAF doesn't represent the world and that's true and yet you to pretend PC GAF here represents PC gaming all over.

Agreed. He's making sweeping generalizations about PC gamers and doesn't even realize it. I don't overclock my PC, I don't lose sleep over settings and patches, I don't mess with mods. If I want a new game to play, I just open Steam or one of the other braindead easy to use store fronts, pick what looks interesting and buy it. Sale or no sale, it'll be cheaper than consoles and nope, I don't waste a ton of time scouring for sales like some people think all PC gamers do. Game downloads in a bit and I'm off playing.
 

GRIMREEFZ

Member
Yea, I save tons gaming on PC. Not everybody does. We understand that. Bc those who dont game on console primarily. I own EVERY console. But prefer to buy a game on PC bc performance and price.
 

b0bbyJ03

Member
when people say you can save money it doesn't mean that they're telling you you're gonna spend less money overall. Just means that you're buying the same products for less. How many games you buy is gonna determine how much you spend. what a crazy op. lol
 

Fat4all

Banned
i can save more money by buying a deck of cards...

thumbs-up-gif.gif
 

pislit

Member
I don't agree with everything in this post, as I think all consumers are pretty price aware and shop's for deals, even your typical console everyman, but it does really hit the nail on the head in one regard, namely how important consoles are for AAA game development.

People and these boards and else where that clammer for the death of the console, completly fail to realize that without consoles a lot of AAA development wouldn't be feasible any more because of piracy and the lower price expectancy on PC. You might feel consoles are an antiquated concept, but the console consumers is important for the industry and without consoles Sony and Microsoft (and partly Nintendo) wouldn't be pouring billions into the industry to try to claim consumers and diversify their product and we would see less games overall.

So PC gamers: enjoy what you have, but when you talk down to the "ignorant console peasants", remember that these dudes are the ones that makes a lot of your hobby possible.

You are seeing AAA video games in consoles to start with because they are made in PCs.

The argument was always value for your money, full stop PC gets you the most value and more for your money than consoles. No one is arguing that you stop playing consoles because PC has the better value for the price. That's it.
 

Moonstone

Member
I buy my PC games all at retail (except DL only games of course) and they are usually cheaper than console games (germany here). Usually about 10-15€.

However, I think this debate is not helpful.

There are 2 big groups of people:
A) People who have always used a desktop PC - not just for gaming
B) People that don't. They don't like desktop PCs (ugly) and like to surf with the macbooks, laptops tablets and so on.

For group B) gaming pcs are really expensive. And they probably won't make up the cost with games.
For group A) there is only the GPU to buy.

My PC is 5 years old (i2500k) and the only gaming related expenses I had was a 970 - which is or was cheaper than a PS4 (when I bought it).
Yeah I got a new monitor and a bigger SSD recently, but I didn't buy those for gaming. My monitor (1440p) is actually not optimal for my GPU and it is no gaming monitor. I'll buy usually all 5 years a new PC - just for surfing, compiling, encoding and other stuff there are also other reasons like new interfaces e.g. new USB standards and so on.

Those expenses aren't related to my gaming budget. The 970 was actually the most expensive GPU I ever bought. And with every upgrade, you can migrate a lot of hardware and the OS. Consoles are bought only for gaming (except some netflix stuff).

I wouldn't see this as a discussion about what is cheaper. If you like to have a desktop PC with a big monitor, there are actually no costs except the GPU, where you also can pickup one for 200€ or even less. PC exclusives require in most cases no highend PC.

The initial question is ridiculous: "Should I buy a PC for 1200€ or buy a console for 350€ and make up the difference with games after 4 years?" Nobody actually thinks this way. If you like PC gaming and desktop PCs in general you already have a PC or you wil get one - even if it is not top notch. If you don't stay - with your console. That's fine.
 

pislit

Member
Best Buy GCU > Steam Sales

$48 AAA games on day 1 - all day, err day

America =! The World

There is GMG and other storefronts that offer steeper discounts on PC.

And the SEA market / Russia has much lower day 1 prices if you are we are going that "in my territory exclusively there is this thing that offers cheaper prices" route.
 

Miker

Member
Best Buy GCU > Steam Sales

$48 AAA games on day 1 - all day, err day

Besides only being available in America, as noted above, Best Buy charges tax, which really makes it $52 in most states. Steam doesn't charge tax in most states, and as everybody else has mentioned in this thread, oftentimes AAA pre-orders will be much cheaper than $52. Hell, I remember MGSV going for $35 before release due to nVidia promotions.
 

Hypron

Member
Hate fiddling with anti-virus, windows, anything that I have to deal with at work basically. Pretty much anything including waiting for the PC to boot up.

I get what you say in your post, but this... Isn't true anymore. You don't need to install an anti-virus since Windows 8 and a PC with an SSD will boot faster than a console.
 

Into

Member
For people who are "hardcore" into vidya and do not understand how others are not, or go crazy that some casual just buys Fallout 4 on Xbox One or whatever.

Here is the thing, you are hardcore about vidya, and they arent. But they might be hardcore about fashion, sports, fitness, comics, films, whatever the fuck, and you arent. So in some of those areas you are the "casual" because you wear a plain white t shirt that cost a nickle at Walmart and they are equally shaking their head, as you are that they own a shitty PC with no graphics card or no PC at all.

Everyone is into something, and i am Into.
 

Mohasus

Member
You save because the games don't work properly, you give up trying and end up watching netflix.

Why waste 2 hours tweaking settings when you could watch a movie?
 

StevieP

Banned
perfectsil said:
Best Buy GCU works on PC games too

And it still isn't the best deal. PC gaming is cheaper, period. There is almost no situation in the world where it isn't.

For people who are "hardcore" into vidya and do not understand how others are not, or go crazy that some casual just buys Fallout 4 on Xbox One or whatever.

Here is the thing, you are hardcore about vidya, and they arent. But they might be hardcore about fashion, sports, fitness, comics, films, whatever the fuck, and you arent. So in some of those areas you are the "casual" because you wear a plain white t shirt that cost a nickle at Walmart and they are equally shaking their head, as you are that they own a shitty PC with no graphics card or no PC at all.

Everyone is into something, and i am Into.

If you're hardcore enough to make an account on an enthusiast forum, you're should be educated about the most hardcore/enthusiast-oriented platform.

You save because the games don't work properly, you give up trying and end up watching netflix.

Why waste 2 hours tweaking settings when you could watch a movie?

I know, it takes me a really long time to double-click my mouse too. Sometimes even more than 6 hours. This post has been brought to you by the letter L and the year 2004.
 
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