• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • Hey Guest. Check out the NeoGAF 2.2 Update Thread for details on our new Giphy integration and other new features.

News Dragon Quest 11's original release has been delisted in favour of new Definitive Edition

synce

Member
Sep 18, 2012
3,636
147
625
The JP dub won't fix the localization, and the orchestral OST won't fix the compositions. I don't think the game needs cutting edge graphics but the Switch version just looks like a PC game on lowest settings, it's clearly not designed with the hardware limits in mind. This is a straight downgrade through and through, and a good reminder not to invest too much in digital
 
Dec 2, 2018
650
1,353
410
This was my first Dragon Quest - played the original version on PS4. The way Squenix has handled the definitive edition (separate release, no save game transfers) has completely soured me on the game and made me very unlikely to buy a DQ game again, certainly not on release.
 
  • Praise the Sun
Reactions: sid2vicious

Evangelion Unit-01

Master Chief
May 18, 2020
1,969
5,352
820
What a disaster. XI S is the superior release in every way except for the graphical compromise made for Switch.

I dislike that the new release on HD consoles doesn’t feature the original graphics but I am somewhat willing to look past it. Seeing as all of these changes were implemented on Switch version and not the original, SE would need to either completely update the original with the S content or update S with the original graphics. Porting the game from Switch is much easier and cost effective. I’m not sure that the game would even release on other consoles at this point if they had to do that much work. It isn’t how I would like things to be but I can make peace with it.

There isn’t any reason to remove the original though. That is inexcusable. I understand they’d rather sell the higher margin S right now and that’s fine. Increase the price on the original to match S; nobody will choose to buy the original. Delisting the game is not the right thing to do and frustrates the part of me that believes these experiences need to be preserved. Was there any warning this was going to be delisted? I own S on Switch might have bought a copy of the original on PC/PS4 if I had known.
 
Last edited:

Dargor

Member
Sep 5, 2013
2,488
1,662
670


"at least as good" :messenger_tears_of_joy:


 

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
Its really lazy that they didnt rectify the mesh LOD bias for the PS4 version of the DE.

Just get a PC my JuR-Puh-G friends, your old (new) pal Kuranghi will show you the dark arts of ini editing. I can spot an aliased edge at 400 yards:



No longer will you say to yourself "Why do that rotund womans boob's go all square when I walk 10 feet away from her?!??":



Meanwhile the Switch players are staring at their grass aliasing and saying "this is fine, I didn't buy it for the graphics, I'm fine with it", SURE guys, EVERYTHING IS FINE:



Please know this is made in jest and I know some (most?) people don't care about grass aliasing.
 
Last edited:
  • LOL
Reactions: killatopak

sid2vicious

Banned
Jun 27, 2016
1,283
1,378
435
This was my first Dragon Quest - played the original version on PS4. The way Squenix has handled the definitive edition (separate release, no save game transfers) has completely soured me on the game and made me very unlikely to buy a DQ game again, certainly not on release.

I can echo this thought.
 

laser_printer

Member
Dec 10, 2019
2,231
3,643
490
Sactown
It's a pretty substantial graphical downgrade. Not sure where the "slight" comments are comming from. There's reduced geometry, massively reduced foliage density, reduced texture quality, worse lighting, etc

OG PC release:


Definitive Edition PC:





There's a lot of perks though which make the tradeoff worth it:
- Orchestrated music and japanese voice acting
- QoL improvements
- New content
- The whole 2D mode
- 60fps on Ps4 Pro and X1X (Ps5 and SX too, obviously) as well as lower hardware requirements on PC
- Included in Gamepass


But the graphical downgrade is a shame. It has made the game go from looking amazing to just "nice".
Here's hoping that maybe modders will be able to restore at least some of the downgraded stuff on PC

Maybe because you're on PC but I actually prefer the definitive edition in those screenshots
 

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
Maybe because you're on PC but I actually prefer the definitive edition in those screenshots

Although there are downgrades I think they used a higher value for the tonemapper quality variable so the contrast/shading/depth of the image is much better overall in the DE version. That and some better ambient occlusion on the trees and grass maybe? Thankfully you can easily get the other stuff back with a simple ini tweak on PC, the grass density, etc.
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: laser_printer

Fbh

Member
Dec 6, 2013
15,478
11,166
1,070
Wait. They downgraded the game?

Fucking why??

As far as I know due to the challenges of bringing the game to Switch that version ended up being more like a weird custom remake than a straight port, so there's apparently no easy way to bring over the extra content to OG release and it's easier to just port the Switch version to Ps4/Xb1 and PC.

With that said it's disappointing that it seems to be little more than a high res port. It wouldn't have killed them to maybe improve the textures and foliage density a bit.



If anyone wants it here are my edits for engine.ini for the DQXI Steam PC demo, it should work with the full release as the saves carry over, worst case you may have to copy it over to the ini's for the full game:

[SystemSettings]
r.DefaultFeature.AntiAliasing=2
r.PostProcessAAQuality=6
r.TemporalAACurrentFrameWeight=0.2
r.TemporalAASamples=8
r.TemporalAASharpness=0.8
r.Tonemapper.Sharpen=1
r.Tonemapper.Quality=5
r.SkeletalMeshLODBias=-2
r.StaticMeshLODDistanceScale=0.25
r.ViewDistanceScale=10
r.MotionBlurQuality=4
r.MotionBlur.Amount=0.3
r.MotionBlur.Max=1
r.MotionBlur.Scale=1
r.MotionBlurSeparable=1
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.01
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=16
r.Shadow.TexelsPerPixel=10
foliage.DensityScale=7
grass.DensityScale=7
foliage.LODDistanceScale=15

Add these at the end of the file for better... lots of stuff. If you don't like a sharp image then remove or reduce the value for "r.Tonemapper.Sharpen=1", I'd keep "r.TemporalAASharpness=0.8" as is though since the temporal AA does blur the image and that counters it.

"r.ViewDistanceScale=10" is one of the biggest changes you can make, it will add enemies to the field basically as far as you can see which I thought really made it feel a lot better, no more 10m away fading in Bongo Drongos. This setting mostly affects the CPU I've read so avoid if you have a banger. Most people can fire this right up to 10 though if they have a high end CPU I'd reckon. I'm on a 3770K@4.3 and its gravy.

I am sharpening a lot because I'm playing with a 4K native output that being supersampled from 6K internally, you can do this by changing "ScreenPercentage=100.000000" within GameUserSettings.ini to something higher, I don't really understand how it multiplies the axis because I use a value of "125" and that seems to be about 6K going by the size of the steam overlay toast in the bottom right corner. Thats on 4K native remember so if you are on 1080p and horsepower to spare then you can go higher probably. Just don't set it to like 200 if you can't actually play with those settings (due to unplayable fps) because you get a taste of something you can't have. A value of 150 appeared to be 8K and it was simply glorious but I can't maintain even 15 fps at that IQ level.

The motion blur is a personal choice ofc but I'd really recommend it if you are capping to 30. Even if you are running at 60 I think its adds a lovely animated film quality to the animations because they are so fast at points even 60 isn't enough frames to really see whats happening, similar to glory kills in Doom.

The two variables with "mesh" in them will give you back the nice models from the original version, when they are seen at a distance. In the DE it changes to the non-shaded versions of the models when they are a very short distance from the camera. Apart from just dropping the mesh quality for cutscenes in general, I think sometimes its a double whammy of crapness because the camera is much further away from the chars than you think it is (they are decreasing the FoV and zooming in to create a certain visual style). which introduces another drop in model quality on top of the general cutbacks they made.

Here is a link to where you can find the config files depending on platform/store:


TL;DR - These settings will make it look ace beans, use 'em if you have left over GPU usage or don't mind capping to 30. Which is what I've done to get 6K + big tweaks on my GTX 1080. If you want me to explain any of the other settings just ask, I've spent a bit too much time tweaking this game (and most other UE4 games really) to be honest...

Bonus UE4 Temporal AA tweaking advice: Even though a lot of people on t'internet (PCGamingWiki included, but they just aggregate forum posts kind of, so not their fault) will say use 16 samples, don't do that, use 8 or even 4. As it will reduce ghosting massively with only a miniscule loss of stability in areas that are hard to anti-alias even at 8K, so don't lose sleep over them.

They also say to set "r.TemporalAACurrentFrameWeight" to "0.45" instead of my value of 0.2, which is because it "almost totally gets ride of ghosting at the loss of some temporal stability", well the reaosn you use Temporal AA is to get a super clean, non-vibrating image imo so I went with 0.2 and reduced the sample count to 8 instead. Simply reducing the sample count to 8 from 16 will remove more ghosting than changing the CurrentFrameWeight value and won't lose you stability in the process.

If you are using motion blur these things are even less of an issue because it will make the ghosting only visible when you are rotating the camera at full speed and looking for the black outline trails off of your character, mostly over grass. Ie, its not a problem in any way.


Thx for this.
Will check it out when I get the game.

Does
foliage.DensityScale=7
grass.DensityScale=7
foliage.LODDistanceScale=15

Actually get it closer to the OG release?
 

Al3x1s

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Nov 24, 2018
5,361
4,831
675
If anyone wants it here are my edits for engine.ini for the DQXI Steam PC demo, it should work with the full release as the saves carry over, worst case you may have to copy it over to the ini's for the full game:

[SystemSettings]
r.DefaultFeature.AntiAliasing=2
r.PostProcessAAQuality=6
r.TemporalAACurrentFrameWeight=0.2
r.TemporalAASamples=8
r.TemporalAASharpness=0.8
r.Tonemapper.Sharpen=1
r.Tonemapper.Quality=5
r.SkeletalMeshLODBias=-2
r.StaticMeshLODDistanceScale=0.25
r.ViewDistanceScale=10
r.MotionBlurQuality=4
r.MotionBlur.Amount=0.3
r.MotionBlur.Max=1
r.MotionBlur.Scale=1
r.MotionBlurSeparable=1
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.01
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=16
r.Shadow.TexelsPerPixel=10
foliage.DensityScale=7
grass.DensityScale=7
foliage.LODDistanceScale=15

Add these at the end of the file for better... lots of stuff. If you don't like a sharp image then remove or reduce the value for "r.Tonemapper.Sharpen=1", I'd keep "r.TemporalAASharpness=0.8" as is though since the temporal AA does blur the image and that counters it.

"r.ViewDistanceScale=10" is one of the biggest changes you can make, it will add enemies to the field basically as far as you can see which I thought really made it feel a lot better, no more 10m away fading in Bongo Drongos. This setting mostly affects the CPU I've read so avoid if you have a banger. Most people can fire this right up to 10 though if they have a high end CPU I'd reckon. I'm on a 3770K@4.3 and its gravy.

I am sharpening a lot because I'm playing with a 4K native output that being supersampled from 6K internally, you can do this by changing "ScreenPercentage=100.000000" within GameUserSettings.ini to something higher, I don't really understand how it multiplies the axis because I use a value of "125" and that seems to be about 6K going by the size of the steam overlay toast in the bottom right corner. Thats on 4K native remember so if you are on 1080p and horsepower to spare then you can go higher probably. Just don't set it to like 200 if you can't actually play with those settings (due to unplayable fps) because you get a taste of something you can't have. A value of 150 appeared to be 8K and it was simply glorious but I can't maintain even 15 fps at that IQ level.

The motion blur is a personal choice ofc but I'd really recommend it if you are capping to 30. Even if you are running at 60 I think its adds a lovely animated film quality to the animations because they are so fast at points even 60 isn't enough frames to really see whats happening, similar to glory kills in Doom.

The two variables with "mesh" in them will give you back the nice models from the original version, when they are seen at a distance. In the DE it changes to the non-shaded versions of the models when they are a very short distance from the camera. Apart from just dropping the mesh quality for cutscenes in general, I think sometimes its a double whammy of crapness because the camera is much further away from the chars than you think it is (they are decreasing the FoV and zooming in to create a certain visual style). which introduces another drop in model quality on top of the general cutbacks they made.

Here is a link to where you can find the config files depending on platform/store:


TL;DR - These settings will make it look ace beans, use 'em if you have left over GPU usage or don't mind capping to 30. Which is what I've done to get 6K + big tweaks on my GTX 1080. If you want me to explain any of the other settings just ask, I've spent a bit too much time tweaking this game (and most other UE4 games really) to be honest...

Bonus UE4 Temporal AA tweaking advice: Even though a lot of people on t'internet (PCGamingWiki included, but they just aggregate forum posts kind of, so not their fault) will say use 16 samples, don't do that, use 8 or even 4. As it will reduce ghosting massively with only a miniscule loss of stability in areas that are hard to anti-alias even at 8K, so don't lose sleep over them.

They also say to set "r.TemporalAACurrentFrameWeight" to "0.45" instead of my value of 0.2, which is because it "almost totally gets ride of ghosting at the loss of some temporal stability", well the reaosn you use Temporal AA is to get a super clean, non-vibrating image imo so I went with 0.2 and reduced the sample count to 8 instead. Simply reducing the sample count to 8 from 16 will remove more ghosting than changing the CurrentFrameWeight value and won't lose you stability in the process.

If you are using motion blur these things are even less of an issue because it will make the ghosting only visible when you are rotating the camera at full speed and looking for the black outline trails off of your character, mostly over grass. Ie, its not a problem in any way.
I don't see a difference in the grass and aliasing etc. while using these. Same distance culling to the npcs in the village too but you mention only the monsters there so maybe it doesn't apply to them. Can you tell which is which based on these? Did I get the wrong file or something, it had next to no settings inside it, just some file path structure lines at the top so I just pasted your stuff underneath. I had high hopes for the AA at least but maybe the UE implementation is not as good as I hoped, it seems like for most games it doesn't do as well as say, the Alias Isolation mod.
 
Last edited:

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
Thx for this.
Will check it out when I get the game.

Does
foliage.DensityScale=7
grass.DensityScale=7
foliage.LODDistanceScale=15

Actually get it closer to the OG release?

I believe it goes beyond it, as these are just UE4 variables, not really unique to the game, the game just use them. The view distance default is like 1/10 of what I changed it to. The monsters appear like half a mile away from you instead of 30 feet.
 
Mar 26, 2010
4,165
2,132
1,035
Great game btw.

I only played the OG so I can't speak to enhancements and negatives of the special edition, but if you play this game and avoid grinding to level up you will get interesting challenging fights and spare yourself the fatigue that comes from lengthy jrpgs stretching themselves out. Then if you want to do all the end game content there are ways to level up a lot really fast at the end of the game. Maybe I should have been playing all dragon quests like that all along, I don't know, I had stopped playing them because of dense and slow they are and it would feel tedious because of grinding/leveling. But DQXI was a delight.
 

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
I'm not really seeing a difference in the grass and aliasing and stuff while using these. Also same distance culling to the npcs in the village but you mention only the monsters increasing so maybe it doesn't apply to them anyway. Can you tell which is which based on these?

Not sure about the grass, I'll have to retest it but it decreased pop-in of grass in Hotto for me so assumed it would do the same elsewhere. The AA you need to have the in-game AA be set to off (I think, worst case just cycle the AA settings and when its right all the grass aliasing should be gone) I also was like "wtf its the exact same" until I figured that out. I think without the temporal AA taking over from the FXAA, the tonemapper sharpen pass makes the aliasing worse as well.

I couldn't find a way to increase the NPC fade in distance, no. The mesh settings improve the detail of the NPC and PC models at a distance but the shading/AO still fades in at the same distance and can't be changed afaik.
 

Al3x1s

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Nov 24, 2018
5,361
4,831
675
Not sure about the grass, I'll have to retest it but it decreased pop-in of grass in Hotto for me so assumed it would do the same elsewhere. The AA you need to have the in-game AA be set to off (I think, worst case just cycle the AA settings and when its right all the grass aliasing should be gone) I also was like "wtf its the exact same" until I figured that out. I think without the temporal AA taking over from the FXAA, the tonemapper sharpen pass makes the aliasing worse as well.

I couldn't find a way to increase the NPC fade in distance, no. The mesh settings improve the detail of the NPC and PC models at a distance but the shading/AO still fades in at the same distance and can't be changed afaik.
Does the mesh lod thing also work for environment stuff? Like say, the sign just outside the first church (pretty much the only thing I noticed loding, alongside a distant tree at the beginning of the game)?

Also there's some kind of lod AO or shadows or something, you can notice it added ahead of you when going over the tiny bridge in the first village again just outside the church, anything to fix that one?

Overall the game is beautiful regardless except for that NPC culling and the grass aliasing. the model difference I couldn't even see them without side by side comparisons, nothing looked really "off".

Like I watched a comparison video and the water shaders are also different here but they're still very nice looking shaders all the same, I loved how water looked in the first area and took screens.
 
Last edited:

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
Does the mesh lod thing also work for environment stuff? Like say, the sign just outside the first church?

Also there's some kind of lod AO or shadows or something, you can notice it when going over the tiny bridge in the first village again just outside the church if you keep going forward.

Overall the game is beautiful regardless except for that NPC culling and the grass aliasing. the model difference I couldn't even see them without side by side comparisons, nothing looked really "off".

No for the first part unfortunately, its just the "skeletal" model quality. I'm on a giant screen thats really close, I don't think I would've noticed it on a smaller set either but it bothered me when I could see the tesselation decrease so I boosted it.

For the second part thats one of the main things I wanted to change but I couldn't no. Here is the link where I got some of the stuff and they have another shadow variable to do with max resolution, maybe you can glean something else from it - https://steamcommunity.com/app/742120/discussions/0/3338745825890596031/

There may be more variables within UE4 that could help with this but I gave up tweaking because I just wanted to finally play. I tweaked for like 2 hours before starting proper, just running around that first area talking to Gemma, lol.

"Brill-e-ant!"

Gemma rules.

Tell me if you get the Temporal AA working and what you think of it. I was so happy I didnt have to look at those fizzing trees and grass anymore when I finally got it working. Its transformative imo, I thought my Switch was filled with ants when I tried the demo on it.
 
Last edited:

K.S v2.0

Banned
Dec 3, 2020
525
857
335
I picked up the definitive edition for the JP voice since the dub in the original totally put me off. TBH, outside of TEH FORAMS (or forums in general...) any NORMAL PERSON.jpg who picks up the definitive is not going to notice a god damn difference AT ALL.

Sure, if you put some screens side by side, like that one with the mountainside shadow, ok that one is glaringly obvious. But for the rest? We're seriously at the level of OMG HOLY FUCK THAT BLADE OF GRASS HAS TWO WHOLE PIXELS LESS!! THIS IS FRAUD GODDAMNIT I WILL SUE!

For me, what stood out the most almost immediately was the QoL improvements, some of these QoL changes are HUGE and greatly improve the experience. IMO this is what honestly matters. Yes, the fact there is a downgrade at all is shitty, no denying that, but at the end of the day if your entire gameplay experience is completely destroyed by the lack of two whole pixels on a blade of grass... You really, REALLY should just go back to TLoU2 since gameplay clearly doesn't matter to you.

Also, did you just assume the gender of that blade of grass?!
 
Last edited:
  • LOL
Reactions: Isa

blackjon24

Member
Jul 31, 2015
632
398
440
Why should i care if it would be too much work for square to make this the best version possible? They wouldn't be doing it for free since they are having us buy the game again.

I'll just stick to the original, it was long enough as it was
 
Last edited:
  • LOL
Reactions: Al3x1s

Al3x1s

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Nov 24, 2018
5,361
4,831
675
No for the first part unfortunately, its just the "skeletal" model quality. I'm on a giant screen thats really close, I don't think I would've noticed it on a smaller set either but it bothered me a bit so I boosted it.

For the second part thats one of the main things I wanted to change but I couldn't no. Here is the link where I got some of the stuff and they have another shadow variable to do with max resolution, maybe you can glean something else from it - https://steamcommunity.com/app/742120/discussions/0/3338745825890596031/

There may be more variables within UE4 that could help with this but I gave up tweaking because I just wanted to finally play. I tweaked for like 2 hours before starting proper, just running around that first area talking to Gemma, lol.

"Brill-e-ant!"

Gemma rules.

Tell me if you get the Temporal AA working and what you think of it. I was so happy I didnt have to look at those fizzing trees and grass anymore when I finally got it working. Its transformative imo, I thought my Switch was filled with ants when I tried the demo on it.
Couldn't get it working, no, tried with different AA settings in game. I don't think any of the settings worked for me. Maybe cos I had a game started already it's fudged up the settings internally (though I tried with starting a new save to test just so I could redo the beginning of the game to take screens and compare), or it's Windows 10 doing something weird causing the game to put the files it actually uses in a different path instead of my documents/whatever and those do nothing in my case, or whatever. Ah well...
 
Last edited:

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
Couldn't get it working no. I don't think any of the settings worked for me. Maybe cos I had a game started already it's fudged up settings (though I tried with starting a new save to test just so I could redo the beginning of the game to take screens and compare), or it's Windows 10 doing something weird causing the game to put the files it actually uses in a different path instead of my documents/whatever and those do nothing in my case, or whatever. Ah well.

This is my config files path: %%\Documents\My Games\DRAGON QUEST XI S DEMO\Steam\Saved\Config\WindowsNoEditor

The demo is only available on Steam, right? There isn't a Windows Store version or something, right?
 

Al3x1s

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Nov 24, 2018
5,361
4,831
675
I use the full game on Steam, same path sans the word DEMO, yes.

Most annoying thing is directional input skipping dialogue, gotta remind self to lift the thumb off in cut scenes and dialogues to avoid skipping something, ha.

Also I really wanted to play with camera distance, maybe enable some FPV mode or something for photos, but I guess that'd just make the lower res textures far more apparent, oh well.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Kuranghi

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
I use the full game on Steam, same path sans the word DEMO, yes.

Most annoying thing is directional input skipping dialogue, gotta remind self to lift the thumb off in cut scenes and dialogues to avoid skipping something, ha. Also I really wanted to play with camera distance, maybe enable some FPV mode, but I guess that'd just make the low res textures more apparent.

Try putting "[/script/engine.renderersettings]" above the tweaks instead of [SystemSettings].

That didn't work for me so I used "[SystemSettings]" that I knew had worked in the engine.ini of other UE4 games, like Spongebob: BfBB.

edit - 2nd idea - copy and paste the tweaks into "GameUserSettings.ini" under "[/Script/DQ11.DQ11UserSettings]" if the above doesn't work. I'm sure this can work, its worth persevering for a bit because the temporal AA + sharpening is so much better than the FXAA.
 
Last edited:

Kuranghi

Member
Apr 17, 2015
4,000
6,936
780
First time playing the game. I got the XB1 version.
Im only 5 hours in but the game is grade A amazing. I love it. DQ is like the comfort food of videogames.

A dev said the demo "could be 10 hours long" and I spent 19 on it lol
 

ethomaz

is mad because DF didn't do a video on a video of a video of a video on PS5
Mar 19, 2013
38,805
37,403
1,310
38
Brazil
Is it really that much of a downgrade?

I just downloaded the demo on steam, wasnt aware the definitive edition made any unsavoury changes.
Yes the downgrade in graphics are pretty clear.
 

ethomaz

is mad because DF didn't do a video on a video of a video of a video on PS5
Mar 19, 2013
38,805
37,403
1,310
38
Brazil
that’s a lot of hours
That is what the game save is saying... I will check again tomorrow.

I do love the game btw.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Isa

Kataploom

Member
Jan 30, 2014
1,228
788
725
Colombia
Because you can’t buy the original one. There are clear advantages to the original release that probably only PC users can fix.











Granted it may not seem big to some but the bigger problem is that you‘re locked into what they deem best for you to buy. What if the new version of a different game literally is worse in every way or full of bugs and you can’t even buy the original release.

There are also some preference for having the original version of the game code without any updates as some bugs or glitches can only be done pre patches on a physical version. Examples like the gold bar duplication glitch that was patched out in RDR2. Digital users are locked out while I can simply play the disc version without patching it and benefit from the glitch. It may seem cheap for some but at the end of the day, it’s the fact that I have a choice is the biggest benefit.
Because the "Definitive" version, isn't. It's a port of the Switch version with a major hit in graphics from the true PS4 version.
Lots of problems with digital over physical but it's because it restricts our options.

I still don't know how's this a problem exclusive to digital market... They could have just shipped the DE version to the store and not the original one and would be the same thing... The thing here is that you don't need to re-stock on digital (which is an advantage).

I know digital has its disadvantages, but I don't think this one is exclusivo from it.
 

Lady Bird

Matsuno's Goebbels
Feb 26, 2006
1,728
1,018
1,835
31
Portugal
Cutscene skipping, faster battles and orchestral ost are huge QoL improvements. New content is the icing on the cake, and then you have the 2D mode for a different and classic experience.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: MagnesG

Captain Toad

I advertise for PlayStation. For free.
Dec 1, 2020
2,016
5,283
565
I know digital has its disadvantages, but I don't think this one is exclusivo from it.

They had a digital version that had PS4-level visuals.

Then, the Switch version came out that included stuff like a 16-bit-style retro mode, but significantly downgraded 3D visuals.

Then, they ported that version to PS4 with the Switch's graphics and took away the true PS4 version away from being able to he purchased digitally.

So, if you want the actual (then) current-gen version, you have no choice to find a physical version of the original. If physical games didn't still exist, the real PS4 version of the game would be forever out of reach.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Panajev2001a

jaysius

Member
Oct 3, 2019
1,858
2,223
435
Does the Definitive edition make the story more interesting? or the combat system more engaging?
 

sid2vicious

Banned
Jun 27, 2016
1,283
1,378
435
I picked up the definitive edition for the JP voice since the dub in the original totally put me off. TBH, outside of TEH FORAMS (or forums in general...) any NORMAL PERSON.jpg who picks up the definitive is not going to notice a god damn difference AT ALL.

Sure, if you put some screens side by side, like that one with the mountainside shadow, ok that one is glaringly obvious. But for the rest? We're seriously at the level of OMG HOLY FUCK THAT BLADE OF GRASS HAS TWO WHOLE PIXELS LESS!! THIS IS FRAUD GODDAMNIT I WILL SUE!

For me, what stood out the most almost immediately was the QoL improvements, some of these QoL changes are HUGE and greatly improve the experience. IMO this is what honestly matters. Yes, the fact there is a downgrade at all is shitty, no denying that, but at the end of the day if your entire gameplay experience is completely destroyed by the lack of two whole pixels on a blade of grass... You really, REALLY should just go back to TLoU2 since gameplay clearly doesn't matter to you.

Also, did you just assume the gender of that blade of grass?!

 
  • LOL
Reactions: K.S v2.0

killatopak

Member
Aug 29, 2013
13,824
2,695
770
Cutscene skipping, faster battles and orchestral ost are huge QoL improvements. New content is the icing on the cake, and then you have the 2D mode for a different and classic experience.
I get that and I love those changes. I have my copy of the game already.

The problem I have is that we have no control of what we get to buy in the digital marketplace.
 

e&e

Member
Nov 17, 2020
702
689
435
Did they really use the switch version as the main without keeping the more powerful consoles graphics?
 

Evangelion Unit-01

Master Chief
May 18, 2020
1,969
5,352
820
I get that and I love those changes. I have my copy of the game already.

The problem I have is that we have no control of what we get to buy in the digital marketplace.
Yep. In my opinion everything about them porting the Switch version is a separate issue entirely. The new product doesn't mean that the old one should no longer be available. Even if they take the price up to $60 to avoid having a lower price version of the game available, that would be fine so long as the original remains available. At the end of the day of the day it is about preservation. For example, Persona 5 Royal doesn't mean that Persona 5 should be removed from the store.
 
Oct 16, 2020
146
341
250
I've been of the opinion that the definitive doesn't add that much. You could already mod in orchestral music on PC flawlessly and I did actually like the English voice acting. From the little I played of the Switch version, I didn't use the 2D mode either as you miss out on how good the 3D mode looks in its place. It's a gorgeous game, you should want the best looking original version.
 

sid2vicious

Banned
Jun 27, 2016
1,283
1,378
435
Did they really use the switch version as the main without keeping the more powerful consoles graphics?

Somewhere the translation must have gotten lost from "wanting definitive content" to "wanting switch version". I swear, they must be using tin-can telephones to pass this information...
 

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,808
2,152
485
I've been of the opinion that the definitive doesn't add that much. You could already mod in orchestral music on PC flawlessly and I did actually like the English voice acting. From the little I played of the Switch version, I didn't use the 2D mode either as you miss out on how good the 3D mode looks in its place. It's a gorgeous game, you should want the best looking original version.
Fast battle mode, skipping cutscenes, lots of other QoL features. This new version could slash off around half of your playtime with the same accomplishment.
 

K.S v2.0

Banned
Dec 3, 2020
525
857
335
Try putting "[/script/engine.renderersettings]" above the tweaks instead of [SystemSettings].

That didn't work for me so I used "[SystemSettings]" that I knew had worked in the engine.ini of other UE4 games, like Spongebob: BfBB.

edit - 2nd idea - copy and paste the tweaks into "GameUserSettings.ini" under "[/Script/DQ11.DQ11UserSettings]" if the above doesn't work. I'm sure this can work, its worth persevering for a bit because the temporal AA + sharpening is so much better than the FXAA.

Gonna correct your settings post slightly, it needs to look like this in Engine.ini:

Code:
[SystemSettings]
r.Tonemapper.Sharpen=1
r.Tonemapper.Quality=5
r.SkeletalMeshLODBias=-2
r.StaticMeshLODDistanceScale=0.25
r.ViewDistanceScale=10
r.Shadow.MaxResolution=8192
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.01
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=16
r.Shadow.TexelsPerPixel=10
foliage.DensityScale=7
grass.DensityScale=7
foliage.LODDistanceScale=15

[/script/engine.renderersettings]
r.DefaultFeature.AntiAliasing=2
r.PostProcessAAQuality=6
r.TemporalAACurrentFrameWeight=0.2
r.TemporalAASamples=8
r.TemporalAASharpness=0.8

As opposed to everything under SystemSettings.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kuranghi

Fbh

Member
Dec 6, 2013
15,478
11,166
1,070
Ok so quick compressed 1080p screenshot but the foliage changes to the Engine.ini file do seem to help with the grass a bit:



Density is still not as good as the OG release but definitely improved. LOD is also much better, notice how you can clearly see the grass next to the NPC's on the left.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BlackGauna

K.S v2.0

Banned
Dec 3, 2020
525
857
335
Ok so quick compressed 1080p screenshot but the foliage changes to the Engine.ini file do seem to help with the grass a bit:


Density is still not as good as the OG release but definitely improved. LOD is also much better, notice how you can clearly see the grass next to the NPC's on the left.

If you have a decent vidcard and want to increase the IQ, you can apply SSAA by editing GameUserSettings.ini and change the line ScreenPercentage=100.000000

At 1080p, ScreenPercentage=150.000000 = 1440p and 200.000000 is 4k.
 

Keihart

Member
Jun 23, 2013
4,955
3,334
765
Because you can’t buy the original one. There are clear advantages to the original release that probably only PC users can fix.











Granted it may not seem big to some but the bigger problem is that you‘re locked into what they deem best for you to buy. What if the new version of a different game literally is worse in every way or full of bugs and you can’t even buy the original release.

There are also some preference for having the original version of the game code without any updates as some bugs or glitches can only be done pre patches on a physical version. Examples like the gold bar duplication glitch that was patched out in RDR2. Digital users are locked out while I can simply play the disc version without patching it and benefit from the glitch. It may seem cheap for some but at the end of the day, it’s the fact that I have a choice is the biggest benefit.
Would it be any different than discontinuing the physical version? i guess you could find the game on the used market, but the game does exist in physical format and people that bought first still have that version, no?