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DF: Returnal: Housemarque Pushes PlayStation 5 HARD - With Spectacular Results

Loope

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That can’t happen because one console had to hitch onto the pc install base because it couldn’t stand alone so it made its service available everywhere. Always the little brother. The other routinely sells 100 million+ units.
Sad Cry GIF by Team Coco
 

Thirty7ven

Sony make cringe trainers.
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I think it will be fine. Now that we established on that "tech" thread where several people piled on VFXVeteran, because "best looking" is subjective and you shouldn't use objective metrics to compare graphics. Xbox fanboys just need to say: " no it isn't the best looking, the best looking game is this" and it's a circle, because neither of you can prove it either way.

You're quite right, I'm just going by what my eyes see and the reactions of most people online. But you know, ghoulish looking people need love too, and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
 

Loope

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You're quite right, I'm just going by what my eyes see and the reactions of most people online. But you know, ghoulish looking people need love too, and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Ghoulish looking people? Don't know what you're talking about. All i said is, if it is subjective, then there is no need to discuss anything. I don't remember seeing a next gen from MS to say if it is the "best looking" or not.
 
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Fredrik

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Oh and for the PC lovers raving about DLSS everyday of the week...anyone care to remind folks how that “reconstruction” tech works? DLSS performance mode does what?
I found this text:

”The A.I. algorithm is trained to look at certain games at extremely high resolutions (supposedly 64x supersampling) and is distilled down to something just a few megabytes in size, before being added to the latest Nvidia driver releases and made accessible to gamers all over the world.”



No idea what Housemarque does but like I said I’ve seen DLSS with really low internal resolution and to my eyes it still looked great, with the performance gain it made an otherwise unplayable game run smoothly at Ultra everything with RTX on. It’s nice.
 

geordiemp

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Who is joe miller ? No idea who he is, I am from uK, and which country is my gold prince Bo_Hazem Bo_Hazem ? Facts are facts but fun coincidence we made same observations.

Anyway, if you look logically at the resolution and frame rate performance of heavy effects - Valhalla is the most obvious one as it was clear effect which could be done any time you lit your torch.
 
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Reconstrution IS NOT upscaling

Simple explanation by KZ devs 8 years ago :






Upscaling image is just simple explanation as to fill TV screen ( if TV can produce image beyond 1080p resolution ). Resolution technique doesn't do that. Period!



You were wrong in every damn single post.
"AMD FidelityFX Contrast Adaptive Sharpening (CAS), which enables visual sharpness with optional upscaling to restore detail lost after Temporal Anti-Aliasing (TAA) is applied is currently our most widely adopted effect. However, our new effects are now also being integrated into some of the hottest games available now and coming soon."

That's funny even AMD calls it upscaling. I better send them an email and tell them fat Batman knows better.
 
Jun 1, 2016
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Who is joe miller ? No idea who he is, I am from uK, and which country is my gold prince Bo_Hazem Bo_Hazem ? Facts are facts but fun coincidence we made same observations.

Anyway, if you look logically at the resolution and frame rate performance of heavy effects - Valhalla is the most obvious one as it was clear effect which could be done any time you lit your torch.
One of the biggest PS fanboys who should be ignored.
 
Mar 27, 2020
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Right about what?

I thought the original argument was that "he saw no RT?" from a few days ago. This is also a new video that came after DF's, check the date. ;)

That the IQ was similar to Native 1440P.

Edit: Ok nevermind took me a little but I realized he obtained the resolution results from DF.
 
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evanft

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No matter who releases the game, MS, Sony, Nintendo, etc. Would you be ok with a game releasing with raytracing, if it only includes RT audio? Imagine all the people praising a game for it's RT abilities, to end up realizing it's nothing they can even see. This is why it seems disingenuous.

LMAO who gives a shit?
 
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Shadowstar39

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I said ages ago and was laughed at, but 1080p 60 is the actual sweetspot for this generation.

It's realistically achievable with all the bells and whistles.

Good 1080p sets don't even need to worry about shitty scaling.

4k isn't ready yet in the console gaming world.
Yep, its also not ready for pc world unless you are rich or for old games. Its why i didn't splurge on a 1440 or 4k monitor on pc. I'd rather have 100fps+ synced refresh and more graphics options maxed than higher resolution and having to turn things down. That and the cost for 60fps + 4k is expensive, even before the chip shortage it was over 1k gpu for entry. Now you are looking at $1500+ just to get a low high end 3060ti, let alone a 3080. I don't have that kind of money. Ryzen 3600 with 2060rtx is what i am sporting for 1080p (well until evga gives me the stepup email to get my 3060ti, but thats been 4 months and no movement).

I bring pc up as it costs a ton to do current gen 4k (you can get away with it on older games). Consoles are cheaper than pc and always will be lower spec. They can get performance gains by dedicated programing and optimization. Usually only done on 1st party games. AS the graphics ratchet up, the resolutions or fPS is going to dip. I expect it will be resolution. Now nvidias dlss seems to solve some of these issues, but consoles don't have that.
 
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The IQ is fairly poor but I'd call it a non-issue TBH as it looks like such a fast paced game. While it's really obvious when someone points it out I didn't notice it in the preview footage as there is too much happening on screen for it to stand out.

The performance is a bigger issue if you are sensitive to drops. I posted in other threads that I could see it dropping in the preview videos and got LOL reactions. Drops to 46fps in the VG Tech video which isn't ideal for a fast paced bullet hell game and clearly obvious without frame rate measuring software as plenty of people did notice it before the DF video.
 
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DeepEnigma

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I can see why they don't allow him here. If he's going to do that might as well give DF the credit for it. It's practically plagiarism at this point.
Been saying. He will put out a baited video before DF or the like, make spurious (9/10 false) claims for the great forum twitter wars, then follow up after others analyzed. Information moves so fast, people don't catch it unless they pay attention to the dates, his twitter style posts, etc..
 
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Hunnybun

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There will always be compromises. Ratchet footage is at 30 fps, so it might be pretty close to native 4K.

I think it must be FAIRLY high res because they obviously have enough headroom to reduce it significantly for the 60fps mode. I'd bet it's something around 1800p on average and perhaps 1260p or so in the Performance mode.
 
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Yep, its also not ready for pc world unless you are rich or for old games. Its why i didn't splurge on a 1440 or 4k monitor on pc. I'd rather have 100fps+ synced refresh and more graphics options maxed than higher resolution and having to turn things down. That and the cost for 60fps + 4k is expensive, even before the chip shortage it was over 1k gpu for entry. Now you are looking at $1500+ just to get a low high end 3060ti, let alone a 3080. I don't have that kind of money. Ryzen 3600 with 2060rtx is what i am sporting for 1080p (well until evga gives me the stepup email to get my 3060ti, but thats been 4 months and no movement).

I bring pc up as it costs a ton to do current gen 4k (you can get away with it on older games). Consoles are cheaper than pc and always will be lower spec. They can get performance gains by dedicated programing and optimization. Usually only done on 1st party games. AS the graphics ratchet up, the resolutions or fPS is going to dip. I expect it will be resolution. Now nvidias dlss seems to solve some of these issues, but consoles don't have that.

hah, dont say it out loud man, those who splurged huge money on 4k 1440p tvs/monitors will surely do their best to downplay 1080p

with supersampling, 1080p is still the sweetspot of monitors, especially if you're playing with a 24 inch monitor
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Who is joe miller ? No idea who he is, I am from uK, and which country is my gold prince Bo_Hazem Bo_Hazem ? Facts are facts but fun coincidence we made same observations.

Anyway, if you look logically at the resolution and frame rate performance of heavy effects - Valhalla is the most obvious one as it was clear effect which could be done any time you lit your torch.

I'm from Oman, he's from Kuwait :) All from the GCC (Gulf Cooperation Council).
 
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supernova8

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You are a bit stuck on definitions and the magic notion around purity of pure ray tracing vs rasterisation (which Pixar used without RT for many many years without people complaining about something they were missing necessarily).

There is a visual aspect to it which is the game was able at that image quality and framerate as well as scene rendering complexity they delivered a working GI solution at 60 FPS.
I just read this quote earlier in the morning and this discussion


In other words the workarounds that have been used to fake lighting are so good that when we finally get actual RT it's not as impressive? Makes sense.
 
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DeepEnigma

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In other words the workarounds that have been used to fake lighting are so good that when we finally get actual RT it's not as impressive? Makes sense.
Take the Lumens GI system in UE5 for example. To the average person, they won't notice a major or if any difference between that method and RT.
 
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geordiemp

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Ah, I wondered why people started bringing up Valhalla. Now I know they're parroting a Twitter warrior.

No I am not parroting any twitter account from someone I never heard of.

JUst made the same clearly easy to make observation - that alpha and heavy effects dip frame rate in every game analysed by Digital foundry.

And Valhalla was easiest one for me to look for as DF made a big deal about it in their analysis and it tanked XSX so much compared to Ps5, about 15 %.

Anyway, the point stands even if you dont like the messenger - XSX sucks at post processing effects.- but teh good news is as most games on gamepass have to run on Xb1 you wont get many examples of fancy effects anyway and cerainly not in Halo lol.

So your fine.
 
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hah, dont say it out loud man, those who splurged huge money on 4k 1440p tvs/monitors will surely do their best to downplay 1080p

with supersampling, 1080p is still the sweetspot of monitors, especially if you're playing with a 24 inch monitor

I'm planning on getting a secondary monitor with HDR. Even if it isn't 4K I still should be able to get extremely good image quality. Then I have a 4K monitor if I want the full experience. To be honest I don't really notice the difference between 1440P and 4K on that monitor.
 
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Dumbest crap ever - the thread. An amazing game comes out that is super fun and purely arcade in way that rarely happens anymore, and instead of being celebrated, things devolve into pissing about a tech analyst saying the game is great and tech is great.
 

Warnen

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Dumbest crap ever - the thread. An amazing game comes out that is super fun and purely arcade in way that rarely happens anymore, and instead of being celebrated, things devolve into pissing about a tech analyst saying the game is great and tech is great.

comes into an analyst thread and complains about analyzing stuff…

I get your point but the OT is for chatting about the game.
 
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"AMD FidelityFX Contrast Adaptive Sharpening (CAS), which enables visual sharpness with optional upscaling to restore detail lost after Temporal Anti-Aliasing (TAA) is applied is currently our most widely adopted effect. However, our new effects are now also being integrated into some of the hottest games available now and coming soon."

That's funny even AMD calls it upscaling. I better send them an email and tell them fat Batman knows better.

I copied the words from a dev. So, cut the crap. Reconstruction and checkerboard techniques ARE NOT upscaling.
 
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comes into an analyst thread and complains about analyzing stuff…

I get your point but the OT is for chatting about the game.
“analysing stuff”. Is that what’s going on here? We’ve had the analysts give us the data and say it’s great. Is that what’s being reflected here, or is this just a bunch of idiot console warriors throwing shit at each other?
 

Warnen

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“analysing stuff”. Is that what’s going on here? We’ve had the analysts give us the data and say it’s great. Is that what’s being reflected here, or is this just a bunch of idiot console warriors throwing shit at each other?
so just like every other DF thread then?

BTW not disagreeing with you, honestly all these DF threads should be quarantined to an OT of there own.
 
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No I am not parroting any twitter account from someone I never heard of.

JUst made the same clearly easy to make observation - that alpha and heavy effects dip frame rate in every game analysed by Digital foundry.

And Valhalla was easiest one for me to look for as DF made a big deal about it in their analysis and it tanked XSX so much compared to Ps5, about 15 %.

Anyway, the point stands even if you dont like the messenger - XSX sucks at post processing effects.- but teh good news is as most games on gamepass have to run on Xb1 you wont get many examples of fancy effects anyway and cerainly not in Halo lol.

So your fine.
You back to being a Warrior I see.
I copied the words from a dev. So, cut the crap. Reconstruction and checkerboard techniques ARE NOT upscaling.
What you copied didn't have the word upscale in it.
What I copied is directly from AMDs post about fidelity fx and CAS.
You are both wrong. It's ok. It's time to admit it though.
 

geordiemp

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You back to being a Warrior I see.

What you copied didn't have the word upscale in it.
What I copied is directly from AMDs post about fidelity fx and CAS.
You are both wrong. It's ok. It's time to admit it though.

You know, the people that post in Sony threads that are xbox fans and call others warriors are the saddest warriors on GAF by far.

What are you doing in this thread exactly ? Its a DF thread about a Sony first party game and your trolling likr a 10 year old idiot about ma pixels.

Embarrasing and it makes you look exactly what you are.

I am here as I am buying the game. You are here because why exactly young warrior ?
 
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there's no such thing as 1440p checkerboarded up to 4k. that's something I would expect some casual to say as CBR doesn't work like that at all. so either they had someone on the line that has no idea what they were talking about or there was some misunderstanding

also the pixel counts come out as 1080p so that's clearly bullshit to begin with.

what's most likely the case is that it runs at 1080p native and uses UE4's temporal AA to upscale it to 4k, which isn't really convincing ever

The game is incredibly sharp. So something does seem way off on the analysis. It's certainly NOT entirely 1080p as some are jokingly claiming.
 
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You know, the people that post in Sony threads that are xbox fans and call others warriors are the saddest warriors on GAF by far.

What are you doing in this thread exactly ? Its a DF thread about a Sony first party game and your trolling likr a 10 year old idiot about ma pixels.

Embarrasing and it makes you look exactly what you are.

I am here as I am buying the game. You are here because why exactly young warrior ?
How bout read my posts before shit talking? I'm having a semantics argument and other then that all I've said is this game looks great and the gameplay looks fantastic. Take your bullshit somewhere else old Warrior.
 

VFXVeteran

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Take the Lumens GI system in UE5 for example. To the average person, they won't notice a major or if any difference between that method and RT.
It depends on how you RT GI. Lumens won't do area lights with soft shadows. An absolute requirement for good GI bounce. Also, the AO suffers when any object is in shadow and using the bounced light as a constant ambient term. I showed this in another thread.

If people see games like in Metro Exodus EE for a few months, it will be very obvious that Lumens isn't up to snuff against RTGI.

Also keep in mind that that UE5 demo *could have* used the RT code in UE4 (now used in The Medium). Likely the demo wouldn't have ran at reasonable FPS.
 
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Panajev2001a

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It depends on how you RT GI. Lumens won't do area lights with soft shadows. An absolute requirement for good GI bounce. Also, the AO suffers when any object is in shadow and using the bounced light as a constant ambient term. I showed this in another thread.

If people see games like in Metro Exodus EE for a few months, it will be very obvious that Lumens isn't up to snuff against RTGI.

Also keep in mind that that UE5 demo *could have* used the RT code in UE4 (now used in The Medium). Likely the demo wouldn't have ran at reasonable FPS.
You may notice, but you might be overly sensitive to some differences and might appear much more noticeable to you. You are underestimating how what might be might be noticeable to you might not be that way for everyone else too.
 
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Clear

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You have to admit, what PS5 is being shown capable of with this first gen software line-up bodes extremely well for the future. If history teaches us anything is that when working with fixed-spec hardware experience elevates performance massively; I mean say what you want about TLOU2, but a presentation simply was not on the cards at launch.
 

geordiemp

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How bout read my posts before shit talking? I'm having a semantics argument and other then that all I've said is this game looks great and the gameplay looks fantastic. Take your bullshit somewhere else old Warrior.

You call everyone a warrior except yourself and do your PC DLSS master race thing. I am happy for you if thats your thing.
 

geordiemp

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Shown wrong and subject changed. I hadn't said a single negative thing about this game or PlayStation in this thread. Unlike you who brought up Xbox at first opportunity and called it shit. Grow up.

No, I was responding to the resolution troll posts by xbox fans with no new games to talk about and pointing out correctly affects and alpha tank performance on both consoles.

You called about 4 or 5 poeople warriors in this thread alone, what is wrong with you ? Do you think your better ? LOL
 
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DeepEnigma

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You may notice, but you are underestimating how it is noticeable to you and how it has to be for everyone else IMHO.
I knew he would latch on to my post. I carefully worded it, but still did not pass the comprehension test.

You're average Joe Gamer won't notice the difference. This would be their response,
 
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Rob_27

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I did have a funny moment when the camera panned. Reminded me of Mass Effect wasn't it?