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[DonkeyPunchJr]

PSVR2 performing better than PSVR1 in the only worldwide PSVR2 sales number we have to compare:

https://www.counterpointresearch.com/insights/global-xr-ar-vr-headsets-market-share/

Is this the only official sales data we got? The first 6 weeks? I’m no expert but it sure looks like those 2 lines are going to cross in the next 1-2 weeks and PSVR2 will fall behind. Seems like the only thing this proves is that the sales are more front loaded. That trajectory doesn’t exactly inspire confidence.

 

[Ar¢tos]

This is beyond stupid.

Polyarc (Moss developer) has 46 people and managed to port Moss 1 for PS5 and rework the inputs for PSVR2.

Innerspace VR (Fisherman's Tales developer) has less than 25 people and also managed that and only charge 3.99$ for their work.

Vertical Robot (Red Matter developer) has 10 people, managed to do that and offer it for free.

There are many other small developers that managed that and offer it for free or for a small cost.

Meanwhile.....

Rec Room Inc. has 180 people, it's worth 3.5$bn, has made versions of the game for PS4, PSVR, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series, Android, iOS, Quest, Pico and Windows, and is also going to port to Apple Vision that will cost 3.5k$ and has an install base of ZERO but can't justify making a PSVR2 version.

Let's all hold hands and shed tears of sympathy for the 3.5$bn developer that can't justify doing less than half of the work (they already have a PS5 version, they only need to rework the inputs) that teams as small as 10 people have done.

 

[Resenge]

PSVR2 in less than a year had GT7, Horizon:Call or the mountain, Dark Pictures:Switchback VR, Firewall Ultra, RE Village, and RE4R

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

This is beyond stupid.

Polyarc (Moss developer) has 46 people and managed to port Moss 1 for PS5 and rework the inputs for PSVR2.

Innerspace VR (Fisherman's Tales developer) has less than 25 people and also managed that and only charge 3.99$ for their work.

Vertical Robot (Red Matter developer) has 10 people, managed to do that and offer it for free.

There are many other small developers that managed that and offer it for free or for a small cost.

Meanwhile.....

Rec Room Inc. has 180 people, it's worth 3.5$bn, has made versions of the game for PS4, PSVR, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series, Android, iOS, Quest, Pico and Windows, and is also going to port to Apple Vision that will cost 3.5k$ and has an install base of ZERO but can't justify making a PSVR2 version.

Let's all hold hands and shed tears of sympathy for the 3.5$bn developer that can't justify doing less than half of the work (they already have a PS5 version, they only need to rework the inputs) that teams as small as 10 people have done.

It’s not about whether they have the resources or how much sympathy they deserve, it’s about whether it’s worth their time/money to port it.

 

[FinalBossWithTheMostPower]

Fell for the hype, and while the technology is there, the support isn't.

I haven't pIcked it up since summer, despite wanting to check out the RE4 VR mode when it dropped last month.

 

[Chukhopops]

This is beyond stupid.

Polyarc (Moss developer) has 46 people and managed to port Moss 1 for PS5 and rework the inputs for PSVR2.

Innerspace VR (Fisherman's Tales developer) has less than 25 people and also managed that and only charge 3.99$ for their work.

Vertical Robot (Red Matter developer) has 10 people, managed to do that and offer it for free.

There are many other small developers that managed that and offer it for free or for a small cost.

Meanwhile.....

Rec Room Inc. has 180 people, it's worth 3.5$bn, has made versions of the game for PS4, PSVR, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series, Android, iOS, Quest, Pico and Windows, and is also going to port to Apple Vision that will cost 3.5k$ and has an install base of ZERO but can't justify making a PSVR2 version.

Let's all hold hands and shed tears of sympathy for the 3.5$bn developer that can't justify doing less than half of the work (they already have a PS5 version, they only need to rework the inputs) that teams as small as 10 people have done.

I think the issue is that Rec Room isn’t a one and done port, it’s kind of a live service game and PSVR2 would be one more version they need to maintain in parallel to all the others.

 

[Ar¢tos]

It’s not about whether they have the resources or how much sympathy they deserve, it’s about whether it’s worth their time/money to port it.

But porting for Apple Vision that hasn't launched yet and has no install base is worth it and less of a risk?

I think the issue is that Rec Room isn’t a one and done port, it’s kind of a live service game and PSVR2 would be one more version they need to maintain in parallel to all the others.

They already have a ps5 version, they have to maintain it with or without VR rendering.

 

[RJMacready73]

This is beyond stupid.

Polyarc (Moss developer) has 46 people and managed to port Moss 1 for PS5 and rework the inputs for PSVR2.

Innerspace VR (Fisherman's Tales developer) has less than 25 people and also managed that and only charge 3.99$ for their work.

Vertical Robot (Red Matter developer) has 10 people, managed to do that and offer it for free.

There are many other small developers that managed that and offer it for free or for a small cost.

Meanwhile.....

Rec Room Inc. has 180 people, it's worth 3.5$bn, has made versions of the game for PS4, PSVR, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series, Android, iOS, Quest, Pico and Windows, and is also going to port to Apple Vision that will cost 3.5k$ and has an install base of ZERO but can't justify making a PSVR2 version.

Let's all hold hands and shed tears of sympathy for the 3.5$bn developer that can't justify doing less than half of the work (they already have a PS5 version, they only need to rework the inputs) that teams as small as 10 people have done.

Chap that's not how business works, they don't do it for charity they do it to make money and yes they may be worth loads and have loads of Devs but their overheads and profit margins will be massively different from those small teams you just mentioned and if it's not gonna make a certain amount of money it doesn't get made, as for the Apple Vision, we don't know what deals are in place around that

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

But porting for Apple Vision that hasn't launched yet and has no install base is worth it and less of a risk?

Probably? Being one of the first games available on a new system with tons of buzz has a lot more potential upside. Do you think the devs were lying about their secret anti-Sony agenda or something?

 

[willothedog]

But porting for Apple Vision that hasn't launched yet and has no install base is worth it and less of a risk?

They already have a ps5 version, they have to maintain it with or without VR rendering.

It is already on iOS

 

[Ar¢tos]

It is already on iOS

Apple Vision doesn't run iOS, it runs VisionOS. They're related, but they aren't the same thing.

 

[yurinka]

Is this the only official sales data we got? The first 6 weeks? I’m no expert but it sure looks like those 2 lines are going to cross in the next 1-2 weeks and PSVR2 will fall behind. Seems like the only thing this proves is that the sales are more front loaded. That trajectory doesn’t exactly inspire confidence.

Yes, it's the only data we have from Sony. From the market analyst firms we have related graphs, there are many more. I posted some of them.

Graphs don't mean shit when we're not seeing anything other than Meta Ports and complete silence from Sony on their plans for the unit

Yes, you're free to act like authistic and ignore the related interviews, game announcements, trailers, reviews and releases plus the sales graphs like Sony and the market analysis firms.

But if you make a little effort you'll see that at launch they already had announced more games for the first year than the ones they released for year 1 of PSVR1 and the PSVR2 one includes more big brands, AAA games, and popular VR games.

Your link gives this graph

Which talks about a 50% decline in total sales during the same quarter VR2 launched and had a 30+% market share, which as highlighted earlier , was frontloaded and represented the majority of VR2 current LTD.

Yes, this graph seems to show a YoY decline in the quarter PSVR2 was released.
It also shows that decline is improvement over the one that the VR market had in the previous quarter, when Quest 3 was released.

How can you claim PSVR2 is selling better than the first one, when we literally only have 6 weeks of data?

Because we have this official sales data saying it was selling better than PSVR1, matching what Sony previously said was their goal.

Plus also we have a recent interview with the head of marketing of SIE saying they are happy with its sales plus the graphs from all the market analysts firms (I shared some, there are more) showing that PSVR has a 30-33% of the market share of the total VR market and most of the non-stanlone one.

This graph are projections made by a random analyst in 2020 that ended up being hilariously wrong.

Yes, as said in the graph, it's from late 2020. To show how it was the market back then. As they estimated, the VR market kept growing over years, Quest is now a market leader and PSVR has around a third of the total market and most of the non-standalone VR market. They are one of the main XR/VR/MR/AR specific market analysis firms.

It was DOA as soon as they announced it was wired and wasn’t standalone.

The sales data says the opposite, that its performing better than PSVR1, that has a 30-33% of market share of the whole XR/VR/MR/AR market and most of the non-standalone VR market.

It’s not about whether they have the resources or how much sympathy they deserve, it’s about whether it’s worth their time/money to port it.

They are pretty successful, should have resources to make the port. With the $145M invesment they received late 2021 they got valued in $3.5B. The most likely scenario is that they asked Sony a lot of money for the port and Sony didn't want to pay that much.

What was Sony thinking making this and not making any big games for it.

In its first three quarters Sony already released Gran Turismo 7, Horizon CoM, Firewall Ultra or Ghostbusters: Rise of the Ghost Lord. Plus also several third party games like Resident Evil Village, Resident Evil 4 Remake, No Man's Sky, Pavlov and so on.

 

[willothedog]

Apple Vision doesn't run iOS, it runs VisionOS. They're related, but they aren't the same thing.

Yes I know and almost as if Apple have already made an SDK to easily port existing iOS/iPadOS apps over.

 

[ReBurn]

VRsense controllers have IR but the Dualsense doesn't.
How would you play Astro Bot (that was played with the DS4) with the Dualsense on the PS5 if there is no external camera tracking it or it's light for the flashlight levels?
You have to play with your arms constantly stretched so the controller is in front of the headset?

The light bar on the DS4 was tracked the same way as the light on the move controllers. Tracking motion would work exactly the same way. There was nothing special DS4 was doing that the IR lights couldn't. The buttons could map to VRSense controller.

Why would they bother to enable the PSVR tech demo game for PSVR 2? That doesn't make my sense.

 

[FoxMcChief]

By that logic, both the ps4 and ps5 should have been CELL based because of bc.

No, because they were wrong with ps3 as well, then coarse corrected again.

 

[Baki]

PSVR2 hardware is decent, it is the software side that lets it down.

-the promised revised reprojection fix has not arrived.
-no dedicated social apps (such as recroom, vr chat,bigscreen)
-missing 3D movie support and DLNA streaming of content
-creative apps like sculptVR, tiltbrush, google earth absent.
-no VR 'home' space like other HMDs.

Yes, it's the only data we have from Sony. From the market analyst firms we have related graphs, there are many more. I posted some of them.


Yes, you're free to act like authistic and ignore the related interviews, game announcements, trailers, reviews and releases plus the sales graphs like Sony and the market analysis firms.

But if you make a little effort you'll see that at launch they already had announced more games for the first year than the ones they released for year 1 of PSVR1 and the PSVR2 one includes more big brands, AAA games, and popular VR games.


Yes, this graph seems to show a YoY decline in the quarter PSVR2 was released.
It also shows that decline is improvement over the one that the VR market had in the previous quarter, when Quest 3 was released.



Because we have this official sales data saying it was selling better than PSVR1, matching what Sony previously said was their goal.

Plus also we have a recent interview with the head of marketing of SIE saying they are happy with its sales plus the graphs from all the market analysts firms (I shared some, there are more) showing that PSVR has a 30-33% of the market share of the total VR market and most of the non-stanlone one.


Yes, as said in the graph, it's from late 2020. To show how it was the market back then. As they estimated, the VR market kept growing over years, Quest is now a market leader and PSVR has around a third of the total market and most of the non-standalone VR market. They are one of the main XR/VR/MR/AR specific market analysis firms.


The sales data says the opposite, that its performing better than PSVR1, that has a 30-33% of market share of the whole XR/VR/MR/AR market and most of the non-standalone VR market.


They are pretty successful, should have resources to make the port. With the $145M invesment they received late 2021 they got valued in $3.5B. The most likely scenario is that they asked Sony a lot of money for the port and Sony didn't want to pay that much.


In its first three quarters Sony already released Gran Turismo 7, Horizon CoM, Firewall Ultra or Ghostbusters: Rise of the Ghost Lord. Plus also several third party games like Resident Evil Village, Resident Evil 4 Remake, No Man's Sky, Pavlov and so on.

PSVR1 sales were shit. Doing marginally better is meaningless. Vita was considered a failure at 17M units sold. VR1 barely hit 5M units. VR2 doing marginally better is DOA.

 

[yurinka]

PSVR1 sales were shit. Doing marginally better is meaningless. Vita was considered a failure at 17M units sold. VR1 barely hit 5M units. VR2 doing marginally better is DOA.

It has nothing to do with Vita. Vita was considered a failure because sold 17M while in the previous generation of the mature portable consoles market there were over 230M portables sold.

PSVR was a success because its sales were in line with what Sony expected for a nascent market. Sony was realistic with PSVR1 and also is realistic with PSVR2, which is on track of meeting their expectactions to sell somewhat better than PSVR1. Sony dominates the non-standalone VR market and has around third of the total VR market when also including standalone.

 

[LakeOf9]

I still go back to that gamingbolt (I think?) article pre PSVR2 release that criticized Sony’s handling of it and foresaw a big failure and made an argument for having invested in a portable instead.

Back then GAF laughed at it. Now of course it’s clear that article was right.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Is this the only official sales data we got? The first 6 weeks? I’m no expert but it sure looks like those 2 lines are going to cross in the next 1-2 weeks and PSVR2 will fall behind. Seems like the only thing this proves is that the sales are more front loaded. That trajectory doesn’t exactly inspire confidence.

Sony will brag when a game or hardware sells great. When it doesn't they wont say anything.

Case in point. PS subs have been a stated number for ages. Last summer they stated they will not be disclosing PS sub numbers anymore which coincided closely when they also stated the price of PS sub will increase 33%. So you can tell sub plans will sink and Sony wont want to say it anymore. But over the years when PS subs peaked around 48M during covid they had no problem telling about it.

 

[Baki]

It has nothing to do with Vita. Vita was considered a failure because sold 17M while in the previous generation of the mature portable consoles market there were over 230M portables sold.

PSVR was a success because its sales were in line with what Sony expected for a nascent market. Sony was realistic with PSVR1 and also is realistic with PSVR2, which is on track of meeting their expectactions to sell somewhat better than PSVR1. Sony dominates the non-standalone VR market and has around third of the total VR market when also including standalone.

VR2 will never sell enough units to sustain a healthy SW ecosystem that encourages devs to build original games for the platform. That’s what I mean by DOA. You can’t sustain a platform which only sells <1M units a year.

 

[RavageX]

No, the resident evil remakes are very different to the originals. That is like saying resident evil 2 remake is the same as the 1998 one, lol.
Remember that psvr2 is less than a year, Even consoles in year 1 are dry.

Not only that, VR makes it an entirely new way to play. Let em die on that hill if he wants.

 

[Three]

VR2 will never sell enough units to sustain a healthy SW ecosystem that encourages devs to build original games for the platform. That’s what I mean by DOA. You can’t sustain a platform which only sells <1M units a year.

Which is why most games are lower budget (usually indie) and multiplatform in the VR space. This was expected. The only thing I will say is that we should get a lot more VR hybrid games really, other than that everything is as expected.

 

[yurinka]

VR2 will never sell enough units to sustain a healthy SW ecosystem that encourages devs to build original games for the platform. That’s what I mean by DOA. You can’t sustain a platform which only sells <1M units a year.

They did it with PSVR1 and many other VR headsets and they'll do it with this one. Because the non funded by Sony release their games multiplatform, for several VR devices.

 

[reinking]

Sony need to do a better job of supporting them by making porting old PSVR1 games easier though.

 

[Valedix]

Can't believe they went the VR route instead of handheld. PS Portal don't count.

 

[LavitzSlambert]

Expensive hardware, requires a PS5, wired, no big exclusives, missing ports of excellent PCVR games, and no backwards compatibility with PSVR1.

What did people expect? There is no compelling reason for this. Sony should have waited a bit longer and released it with quality exclusives at launch, and full PSVR1 BC.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

I still go back to that gamingbolt (I think?) article pre PSVR2 release that criticized Sony’s handling of it and foresaw a big failure and made an argument for having invested in a portable instead.

Back then GAF laughed at it. Now of course it’s clear that article was right.

Anyone thinking clearly knew the potential for failure was extremely high, given the price tag, lack of quality games, lack of adoption etc. so I don't feel sorry for anyone who willingly took a second bullet.

 

[Magic Carpet]

Polyarc (Moss developer) has 46 people and managed to port Moss 1 for PS5 and rework the inputs for PSVR2.

Innerspace VR (Fisherman's Tales developer) has less than 25 people and also managed that and only charge 3.99$ for their work.

Vertical Robot (Red Matter developer) has 10 people, managed to do that and offer it for free.

There are many other small developers that managed that and offer it for free or for a small cost.

I feel bad about coming into a PSVR2 thread when I no longer have a PSVR2. But I'll throw my through on this.

These other developers might have less people but they have a much bigger pool of sales.
They sell their games on OTHER devices. Quest, PC whatever.

I bet if Sony would just sell Astrobot on other systems they could justify spending money on porting it over to PSVR2 and everywhere else.
The exclusive game is not helping the situation.

 

[Romulus]

Did they port rec room to Quest when it's user base was still small?