No Word Count
Member
"It is better to be deep and simple than shallow and complex."MGS series is great and smart.
There is absolutely nothing "smart" about Metal Gear.
Last edited:
"It is better to be deep and simple than shallow and complex."MGS series is great and smart.
A game where you shoot stuff in an open world and follow a story?Can anyone explain to me what kind of game this is because I'm still non the wiser. Maybe even more confused after seeing the trailer.
"It is better to be simple and complex than deep and shallow."
There is absolutely nothing "smart" about Metal Gear.
Taken on its own, this is an opinion.-One of the most complex and revolutionary games ever.
-Nothing smart about it.
![]()
"It is better to be deep and simple than shallow and complex."
There is absolutely nothing "smart" about Metal Gear.
Ad hominems are not an argument.Yeah, you're out of touch.
Ad hominems are not an argument.
I'm past trying to argue with you, you're clearly here to disrupt the thread.
At first it was trying to understand, then it was trying to understand WHY, then you vanish for a couple of days and, by chance, forget to quote the people who were last engaging with you only to start it all over again with new users.
Now you're explicitly going after Kojima, something you said previously wasn't your point at all.
I am fully aware of what other people think of his works. I'm not looking for past people's input in his work. I'm asking for the imput of the people in this thread - as is the purpose of a discussion forum.And you also seem to be completely unaware of the man's legacy and impact.
Ad hominems are not an argument.you're out of touch with reality on this topic and should look to educate yourself further.
An inaccurate assumptions, but whatever works for you.
That's awesome. You've developed your own personal opinion on a subject based on your own observations, weighing the positive and negatives from the subject in question from your own perspective.Speaking for myself, I find pretty much the entirety of Nintendo's output uninteresting. I don't buy their games anymore because I know they aren't catering to my tastes...
At no point have I ever said that anyone is "categorically wrong". Not in a single sentence that I've written on the thread so far. I've said I completely disagree with them, and asked them to explain why they feel the way they do, but I've never said that they're "wrong".but I'd never be so arrogant to tell people who do enjoy them/rate them highly that they are categorically wrong for holding their opinions.
That would be great. I am always happy to see that. It's exactly what I'm looking to hear from people. Why they like his work.I could explain in boring detail precisely why I hold my views, because I have my reasons...
Well, then you wouldn't bother to expand on this so we can tear it apart.At no point have I ever said that anyone is "categorically wrong".
There is absolutely nothing "smart" about Metal Gear.
Sure mate, whatever makes us end this discussion."It is better to be deep and simple than shallow and complex."
There is absolutely nothing "smart" about Metal Gear.
I'm not following.Well, then you wouldn't bother to expand on this so we can tear it apart.
I'm not following.
That's an opinion I stated.
No, I find it hard to comprehend why people like his games, or see anything good in this one. It's legitimately baffling to me.
lol how long u guys gonna let words of ivory turn this thread into a shit pile?
seems like a waste of time just talking to him. let him have his shit opinion in silence.
I don’t know why anyone is attacking Ivory. He just wants to know why you like Kojima games that’s a little more than, “they’re amazing!”.
Even Clear gets it.
This would have been less dramatic if someone had just said, “I think Kojima does this, this, and that really well” etc
If ivory is a troll, and look, I don’t know if he is or isn’t, then I apologize. I still think Clear did the best job handling his question.Because he's the type of person that will "debate" or argue against your opinion. Like really........does he not honestly understand why people like Kojima games? He's been a gamer since MGS1 and STILL doesn't know why?![]()
Taken on its own, this is an opinion.
You see a game that is "complex". I see a game that is simple and poorly written. It gives you loads of ways to do one thing, but only a handful of things to actually do. It has decent ideas at the core of its narrative, but the actual execution of those ideas is beyond amateur, and the awful acting doesn't do it any favour. From 4 onwards, it was just a mess.
As for revolutionary... how, exactly? What has the series given us that has shaped the design of the games that come since?
There is no traditional ‘game over’ state in Death Stranding. Lose your life during combat and you’ll find yourself in an upside-down realm, searching for a way back to the living. Choose your combat methods carefully, as killing your foe is > almost never the solution – and every death carries a consequence.
Actually is a second life. I guess you'll lost a life if you die on limbo as well. Act like a second chance.So apparently there’s no game over screen in the game. From the games pager over at PlayStation.com
Yes but no traditional “snake? Snaake? SSSSNNNAAAAKKKKEEEE!!” Screen. Looking forward to see the consequences of dyingActually is a second life. I guess you'll lost a life if you die on limbo as well. Act like a second chance.
Knowing Kojima probably the game will have many easter egg.Yes but no traditional “snake? Snaake? SSSSNNNAAAAKKKKEEEE!!” Screen. Looking forward to see the consequences of dying
Hopefully, because that is one of my favorite aspects of his games.Knowing Kojima probably the game will have many easter egg.
Metal Gear Solid was a revolutionary masterpiece, it's not an opinion, but a fact. It's one of the most trascendental and important videogames ever made and it's going to be remembered forever, just like Mario, Tetris or Final Fantasy. It was one of the first videogames that taught the public that videogames could be more than just for kids. It shaped videogames by allowing them to be cinematic and adult themed.
It must have Easter eggs. Kojima is a master at them and always loves his Easter eggsKnowing Kojima probably the game will have many easter egg.
Via N4G: A member from Insomniac Games gives insight to the tech used in Death Stranding....lots of Tweets.
Wrong thread, but someone can post it in the Digital Foundry one so whatever.
I just realised there are no explictly sexualised female characters this time round. Makes me wonder if Kojima was troubled by the Western reaction to MGSV's Quiet.
I must have missed that. Still I suspect there won't be anything comparable to the discussions about Quiet's character design.Oh don't worry twatter has already been bitching that one of the girls is called fragile and some girl gets licked in the trailer.
I must have missed that. Still I suspect there won't be anything comparable to the discussions about Quiet's character design.
Really feels as if Kojima is playing it safe on this occasion.
Why do these people try to make their opinion seem objective when it's not based on several factors such as general consensus from both gamers and critics alike? Instead of trying to make yourself look like a moron for going against the dominant consensus, why don't you just admit that Kojima and his games are not your cup of tea?"It is better to be deep and simple than shallow and complex."
There is absolutely nothing "smart" about Metal Gear.
He stated that he likes MGS up to Snake Eater and didn't like whats after. Saying that the series isn't actually smart is what I disagree on. Other than that? Its up to him to like and dislike what he wantsWhy do these people try to make their opinion seem objective when it's not based on several factors such as general consensus from both gamers and critics alike? Instead of trying to make yourself look like a moron for going against the dominant consensus, why don't you just admit that Kojima and his games are not your cup of tea?
I'm sick and tired of listening to these low-quality opinions about my Sensei![]()
Even Clear gets it.
I'm not a huge fan of the franchise at all, but I absolutely agree with this.Metal Gear Solid was a revolutionary masterpiece, it's not an opinion, but a fact. It's one of the most trascendental and important videogames ever made and it's going to be remembered forever, just like Mario, Tetris or Final Fantasy. It was one of the first videogames that taught the public that videogames could be more than just for kids. It shaped videogames by allowing them to be cinematic and adult themed.
He stated that he likes MGS up to Snake Eater and didn't like whats after. Saying that the series isn't actually smart is what I disagree on. Other than that? Its up to him to like and dislike what he wants
I've askedSure mate, whatever makes us end this discussion.
He finds it terrible which we don’t. He thinks after MGS3 the series is a mess and on that we disagree too. It’s okay lad, his opinion won’t change ours and if he doesn’t wanna elaborate then just ignore.I've askedNo Word Count to please elaborate several points he made in a previous post but I never got a response.
Post #453: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/death-stranding-november-8-2019.1483654/page-10
He's welcome to a discussion if he wants one. No wasting time pointing out "ad hominems" though, since it has nothing to do with Hideo Kojima and the quality of his games.
Thanks for the link.I've askedNo Word Count to please elaborate several points he made in a previous post but I never got a response.
Post #453: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/death-stranding-november-8-2019.1483654/page-10
He's welcome to a discussion if he wants one. No wasting time pointing out "ad hominems" though, since it has nothing to do with Hideo Kojima and the quality of his games.
You’re welcome, dick.Cheers, fuckface!
Seriously though, the point I was making is that once a series achieves a certain level of sustained success, you simply can no longer argue that it has no value, even if you yourself can't see any.
The only exception to this I'd say are instances where the popularity is based on a cult of personality, where the "work" is less important than the artist. So, for instance, its not unreasonable to be dismissive of the music produced by a teeny pop idol who's basically trading on his/her sex-appeal to a target demographic.
So, back on topic, although Kojima does have something of a cult following, his multi-decade popularity has to be almost exclusively based on his products, and as we have the experimental "control" represented by the critical majority/consensus, its safe to conclude that its his work, not his auteur status is what's keeping him relevant and in-demand as a creative.
As to what the appeal of his work is; well I'd imagine its due to him being a great exponent of mixing eastern and western influences, and having a distinctive authorial voice in spite of marshalling budgets on par with corporate AAA products.
In short. he makes idiosyncratic blockbusters, big games with broad commercial appeal that deviate from the cookie-cutter template we've grown accustomed to. As to the precise nature of the appeal, you either see it or you don't, and no dialectic map is going to make it any easier to find or appreciate.
Did you also notice that everyone in the trailer is crying at some point? It makes the actual action meaningless if everyone is doing it.Thanks for the link.
Insanely busy week, so I haven't been able to give the time for detailed replies to as many posts as I would have liked. I'm up early this morning though and have a few hours to spare, so I'll answer this as best as I can.
Hopefully with this reply you'll see that I'm actually discussing this topic in good faith.
-----
I'm not entirely sure how I can elaborate more on the acting being bad than I already have, but I will try my best.
Easily the most offending culprit in this regard in the trailer is Sam. I know Reedus is capable of far greater range as an acting than what is shown here, but so far every single line delivery comes across as your typical generic action lead - pretentiously gruff, monotone in delivery and lifeless in expression.
It's like a poor man's Snake. And Snake's voice had already become a parody of itself the further into the series we got. So that's saying a lot.
Everyone else in the trailer (except maybe Mads Mikkelson) sounds utterly bored, as if they're barely even interested in delivering their lines. It's just a load of badly delivered exposition dumps with caricatured personalities that don't speak or emote like any real people does.
It could certainly be argued that this is a case of a trailer trying to cram in too much, but this has been a recurring issue in all of Kojima's work, so I'm not expecting any miracles there.
Regarding the comment that "the writing is as subtle as a brick to the face", this is referring to the fact that the trailer is trying to present what it thinks is a deep, meaningful message to the viewer, but it goes out of its way to spell it all out to you, in the most overbearing fashion possible, that it comes off as laughably amateurish as a result.
I legitimately laughed my ass off when I heard the lead character's name.
There is very little room for interpretation or analysis of any of Kojima's work, because every single "nuance" of it is spelt out to you over hour long cutscenes. This has been a recurring issue with almost all of Kojima's stuff, and from what I've seen in the trailer, its apparent to me that little has changed in that regard here.
This is what I was referring to when I said that just because something is complex, it doesn't actually make it deep. I strongly believe that when Kojima didn't have Tomokazu Fukushima doing all of the heavy lifting for him anymore, the quality of his writing went from amateur to "dived off a cliff" bad. He had nobody to reign in his worst writing and design habits. That's why I think every game after 3 is an utter mess.
Now, I would love to hear your thoughts on what I just said, as well as your opinion on why you think the game looks good to you! So far, beyondI haven't yet seen a single person respond to my initial post with any sort of critique of what we've actually seen.