Dis
Member
And the goodwill of Final Fantasy fans is based on the Final Fantasies that where turn based 1-10. (11 14 are online mmorpg i dont count them)
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Square Enix's stock falls by 30%
- Thread starter Kurotri
- Start date
And the goodwill of Final Fantasy fans is based on the Final Fantasies that where turn based 1-10. (11 14 are online mmorpg i dont count them)
Mibu no ookami
Member
I'm not suggesting anyone "sucks" in fact most of their most talented employees on some of their best games left and probably took people with them in the process.
What I'm saying is bringing back people like Sakaguchi who was on a downward path and has had no success since is probably not the answer.
Hudo
Member
Fair enough. But what is the answer then? Because I highly doubt Sony buying Square is an answer to any of their problems.
DonkeyPunchJr
World’s Biggest Weeb
No dude, the real reason is because they don’t make enough traditional turnbase games. All they need to do is make a big budget Final Fantasy that’s just like the games I remember from when I was 12, except make it more bigger and better. It would sell 30 million easily. I’ve been saying this for decades, how come Square Enix won’t listen to me?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
That is true, but other than launching on a sub service, reducing launch-price seems like the only way to get those great games more exposure. They get buried otherwise.
Interfectum
Member
I said it when the sales figures for FF16 came out and everyone was cheering... they didn't compromise the fuck out of FF16 only to 'meet sales expectations.' They wanted this to be their mainstream breakout hit.
Fabieter
Member
Stop making aa games completely and focus on highly save and focustested aaa games like 95 of the rest of the industry.
Punished Miku
Gold Member
They tried stuff like that with Dungeon Encounters and Voice of Cards. I bought both. Barely saw anyone on here discuss it.
Tams
Member
Only because they did fuck all marketing for it and it was a salvaged project.
And unlike Forespoken, it's actually a fantastic game.
Hudo
Member
Don't forget DLCs, season passes and microtransactions.
Punished Miku
Gold Member
They made a sick live action trailer for it that was actually really impressive. I think they marketed it a lot in the hopes it would be their GTA.
Trekinspace88
Neo Member
Squares stock dropped because of a sharp decline in mobile and a partial one in MMO revenue. This article is pure clickbait nonsense.
Unknown?
Member
By the responses here, most didn't read it or look into the reason for it.
Hudo
Member
Aren't DQX and FF14 performing quite well? Weird. I mean, they also keep the servers for FF11 running and the producer said that they'll keep em running as long as it's profitable to do so.
Mibu no ookami
Member
They used to put out 3 mainline FF games per generation.
One of these became MMORPG per generation.
So that limits it to 2 per generation.
People loved FFX, XI was online as you mentioned, and XII was a moderate success.
With the PS3, they started doing 1 game per generation and 1 mmo...
FF13 - disaster (PS3)
FF15 - disaster (PS4)
FF16 - Action Game (PS5)
They used to have multiple teams working on Final Fantasy games at once to ensure the ability to release multiple games per generation. They've lost sight of that. Probably because of Tetsuya Nomura and the resources surrounding Kingdom Hearts, but then remember there was no Kingdom Hearts game on PS3... AND it used UE4, meaning significant profit sharing across platform holders AND Epic. Not to mention his obsession with milking FF7 as if he were the story director of that game, while Kitase is riding the pine pony.
balls of snow
Member
One one hand, I like xvi. On the other hand Fuck You for abadoning Deus Ex.
Punished Miku
Gold Member
It's fine if you think that's all that's going on with the company. I'm not telling you what to think.
Personally, I'm taking a broader view and I'm doing that on my own, and not because an article is telling me. I think FFXVI did alright, but less than they expected and will not have the legs they expected. I think FFVIIR-2 will do less than they want. I think they have no other big games for the next year. I think their AA games are not selling. And I think they've miscalculated the risks associated with exclusivity deals. In addition to mobile and MMO decline you've mentioned.
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Hudo
Member
At least they can't blame their incompetence on Eidos and Crystal Dynamics anymore.
Mibu no ookami
Member
I said Sony shouldn't buy them.
But what they should do is bring in more talent. Instead of buying companies like Eidos and Crystal Dynamics, you buy smaller companies like Sabotage.
Hudo
Member
Don't worry, Kingdom Hearts 4 will rake in the cash for Square. Nomura will be the next president.
fart town usa
Gold Member
It's a shame but not surprising.
Unknown?
Member
Your post is merely speculation as you have no data on profit from these games. Less than they expected means zero when we know their expectations are unrealistic like with Tomb Raider.
It also has nothing to do with the huge drop.
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Punished Miku
Gold Member
He'd be wise to refuse. He's the best they've got. I don't think there's anything left in binding yourself to "Cid, chocobos and crystals" and then inviting a ton of criticism no matter what you do. What they need more than him on FF is some new IP that sell that's not FF, and he's starting to provide that.
Hugare
Member
I fear for Square ...
As much as I dont love their business decisions, I would rather have them remaining independent
They have the talent and the money, but they really need to be smarter with their investments
And design. FF XVI suffered from being a game that completely shifted gears at half way through to become a MMO-lite.
FF VII Rebirth will probably be pretty great tho
As much as I dont love their business decisions, I would rather have them remaining independent
They have the talent and the money, but they really need to be smarter with their investments
And design. FF XVI suffered from being a game that completely shifted gears at half way through to become a MMO-lite.
FF VII Rebirth will probably be pretty great tho
Fabieter
Member
Well ofc its like even nintendo, sony and ms are doing for their big games. All those big aaa companies are basically the same and sqaure needs to come along.
If people don't even buy your passion products like they claim they would. Scrap all of it and go for the aaa industry norm. It's probably their only way besides getting bought. And I expect anyone who buy hem to do the same anyway.
Yea we can't always blame bad marketing. People love to save money with big sales and second hand sales but the truth is companys need those fullprice sales.
I would expect a turn based aaa final fantasy to dissapoint sqaure as well. And people will blame their marketing like always.
Hudo
Member
If it were up to me, I'd let Matsuno make another Ivalice game, at the very least. And this time, I would make sure that management wouldn't interfere.
diffusionx
Gold Member
FFXVI is a disaster. It’s a pretty good game, sure, but people want a RPG when they play Final Fantasy. Once word got out that they made an action game and called it FF, people stayed away. Hopefully this is a wake up call, make another RPG, make it turn based, advertise it as back to the roots and watch it sell like crazy. It’s not 2010 anymore, no need to be edgelord about your games, people actually really do like turn based RPGs.
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Punished Miku
Gold Member
So keep thinking it's just mobile and MMO decline.
Maybe you're right? I don't think so though.
Fabieter
Member
Dropping revenue doesn't mean it isn't profitable anymore but it will definitely tank your stock.
Fabieter
Member
So keep thinking it's just mobile and MMO decline.
Yea its about everything but I think its far fetched to think being fully multiplatform would have saved them tho. I would argue its one of their least problems.
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Punished Miku
Gold Member
I never claimed it would save them. At best it's a 20% boost on 2 games. Being multiplatform is more about slowly building the long term interest in your IP with more people, not about immediate pay off. And like I said, they can do whatever they want and keep making exclusives. I don't care.
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Virex
Banned
Both co-developed by Square and also published. And if you read my post, I was talking about FINAL FANTASY
Unknown?
Member
It's the sole reason for this drop. I don't think it's 100% the reason but if mobile and MMO didn't decline, their AAA output most likely wouldn't have dropped it more than a few points, maybe 5%. Not meeting expectations doesn't mean not being profitable, thus wouldn't drop stock by 30% if still making money.So keep thinking it's just mobile and MMO decline.
Fabieter
Member
But it also would have been no money from sony and even more dev time overall with the technical help sony provided for xvi. There is a possibility that the 20% revenue boost would have been eaten up by higher costs tho.
sigmaZ
Member
AAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHAH. I mean... that sucks. Bad business decisions lead to bad results. Square really screwed itself with that Eidos acquisitions and their whole approach to their non-FF games over the years. They should have invested more into indie games for PC and Switch instead. Lower production rates and less risk of failure. They keep chasing this western dragon, but they fail time and time again to grasp certain concepts of modern game design and appeal to wider markets. It's like a jpop group trying to debut in America or something. LOL But to be honest, I don't have the data they do, so I imagine they have a better idea of why they are failing at least I hope.
Roxkis_ii
Member
If you were hoping final fantasy, a series know from changing from game to game to stay the same, doesn't seem like a smart expection to have. Final fantasy is one game series. Maybe it's time you moved on instead of being upset Final Fantasy isn't stuck in the past.
Thick Thighs Save Lives
Gold Member
I wonder if there's anyone more obsessed with Square's financials and FFXVI sales than Takashi Mochizuki 
Hudo
Member
There's also a possibility that they would have recuperated these costs and make more by releasing FF16 on multiple platforms simultaneously.
Who knows. We will never know. All I can say right now is that if Square needs big platforms holders to help finance their biggest IP(s), then that is an unsustainable business model.
Fabieter
Member
There smaller games fail to meet expectations constantly too. OT2 should have sold 10m copies I'd its true what alot of people claim but its sold slower than ot2 while being on more platforms.
Virex
Banned
It's a pity as well. Sleeping Dogs was really good. I plan on replaying it in the near future and getting the platinum(only need a few trophies). Wish it sold more so we got a sequel
tryDEATH
Member
I think SE naive retraction to strengthen their Japanese roots is the wrong business strategy. Selling of their two best western studios for peanuts and going the Sony exclusive route is going to impact their stability.
Skipping Xbox with titles such as FFVII:1, Forspoken, FFVI, and the upcoming FFVII:2 is just moronic on a galactic level. They should be in a considerably stronger position now, but let their pride screw them over.
Skipping Xbox with titles such as FFVII:1, Forspoken, FFVI, and the upcoming FFVII:2 is just moronic on a galactic level. They should be in a considerably stronger position now, but let their pride screw them over.
Punished Miku
Gold Member
I'm not arguing that mobile and MMO aren't important. But long term, all of that is an extension of the prestige and health of their console business. One projects an image for the other. Their mobile stuff is huge in Japan, and their main console game got beat by Pikmin 4. It's a loose indication of waning interest in the IP more broadly. Stocks are also about looking ahead and seeing if you predict growth, and we know they don't have much coming up in the immediate future besides a remake, and we know their best team is going to be tied to that for potentially 2 more games. I don't see growth anywhere in the next several years except Dragon Quest. Like I keep saying, this is my opinion and I'm totally fine if you guys disagree.
Hudo
Member
Yeah. Sleeping Dogs was such an underrated game. I would've loved to see how United Front Games (RIP) would've improved on that formula with the sequel.
Fabieter
Member
Square Enix Reiterates Increasing Focus On AAA Titles Moving Forward
Square Enix will continue its ambitions in the gaming industry through an increasing focus on AAA releases in the coming years.
tech4gamers.com
Look there smaller games aint sustainable either. If their big and smaller games aint sustainable than a buyout is inevitable.
Hudo
Member
I do hope they gonna fix themselves up before any buyout happens.Square Enix Reiterates Increasing Focus On AAA Titles Moving Forward
Square Enix will continue its ambitions in the gaming industry through an increasing focus on AAA releases in the coming years.
Look there smaller games aint sustainable either. If their big and smaller games aint sustainable than a buyout is inevitable.