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Platinum’s new CEO wants to create ‘larger, riskier’ games and hints at live service focus

Swift_Star

Gold Member
This.

Unfortunately, with many companies setting up subscription services (Gamepass, Sony Spartacus etc), lots of games will need to go down the live service route. Live service games are perfect for subscription models because they keep people paying every month to play the latest updates.
It’s probably what will kill the hobby for lots of us, at least the millenials I think. The younger audience like live services games.
 
The fate of every business is to either crumble into dust with the passing generations, or adapt and become something else.

Unfortunately I think Platinum will become something else, but that something else will be owned by Tencent.

Oh well. If Platinum stops making games I want I guess I'll just have to play one of the other thousand of good games I haven't played yet.
 

Buggy Loop

Member
They mean like a game where you literally fight « live service » with fury

video games snake GIF


Right? Right?

The situation seems dire, with their apologies to Microsoft, then they mention they want to work with them again, it seems like a signal they are close to bankruptcy.
 

Elios83

Member
This won't end well for them...
It takes a lot of know-how and experience to make a successful GaaS.
Sony just spent 3.6 billions to get that knowledge.
If they're struggling with their traditional output, they should go mobile and focus on the japanese market to make easy money.
They're instead risking everything in something that seems bigger than them.
 

IDKFA

Member
It’s probably what will kill the hobby for lots of us, at least the millenials I think. The younger audience like live services games.

Absolutely.

My 14 year old son plays mostly live service games with his friends, such as Fortnight, Warzone, FIFA and Minecraft. In fact, all his friends are mostly into live service games and hardly touch anything with a single player narrative. Same goes for my nephew as well.

Majority of younger gamers prefer live service games that have multiplayer experiences, which is why I'm confident that a vast majority of games will be online, multiplayer live service games in the future. Plus, they'll all be tied to a subscription/streaming model as well.

Sad fact is, although single player games still sell well (God of War on PC is a great example), live service games make far more money for publishers.
 

wolffy71

Member
Something has to give with the industry. Games are too expensive to make, the crunch, the attempt to lessen production time by rushing out unready games, and people's unwillingness to spend over $60 means other ways to generate income is a must.

Microtransactions, season passes, gaas, nfts, monthly subs, or we just pay more per game. Its one of em tho.
 

Three

Member
Live service is the definition of less risk.
1)Make a barely finished game with low amount of content.
2)Release into the wild to see if people bite on the gameplay loop
3) release the rest of the game as microtransactions and "live service" season passes.
 
Absolutely.

My 14 year old son plays mostly live service games with his friends, such as Fortnight, Warzone, FIFA and Minecraft. In fact, all his friends are mostly into live service games and hardly touch anything with a single player narrative. Same goes for my nephew as well.

Majority of younger gamers prefer live service games that have multiplayer experiences, which is why I'm confident that a vast majority of games will be online, multiplayer live service games in the future. Plus, they'll all be tied to a subscription/streaming model as well.

Sad fact is, although single player games still sell well (God of War on PC is a great example), live service games make far more money for publishers.
Single player just can't match the experience of playing with or against real people. Maybe some day studios will actually invest in real AI to make single player more robust and dynamic. They should've been doing that ages ago though.
 
What's wrong with games having an end? Who wants a game to just keep going and going until your so burnt out, you can't play anymore?
 
Live service games?
Needs money?
A company with an inconsistent history at best?

Smells like Xbox is about to get the Japanese studio they've been looking for.
 

Astral Dog

Member
Damn they literally said they're tired of making well designed games.
Not really, just said they want to continue making what they done in the past along with trying a different strategy.

What they said is somewhat concerning, but im not worried yet, it appears they will continue making action games along with new live service content like Babylon's Fall, probably because their games are considered too 'short'.

As long as i get my quality action games from them they can do whatever, it appears they are expanding for that porpuse
 

Holammer

Member
Live service games?
Needs money?
A company with an inconsistent history at best?

Smells like Xbox is about to get the Japanese studio they've been looking for.
*If* Phil Spencer posts a flirty response. Yes, they're about to acquire them.

Recently before Riot announced League of Legends for EGS there was cringe corporate flirting between Riot & Epic on twitter.
That shit is 100% marketing.
 
*If* Phil Spencer posts a flirty response. Yes, they're about to acquire them.

Recently before Riot announced League of Legends for EGS there was cringe corporate flirting between Riot & Epic on twitter.
That shit is 100% marketing.
I mean there is straight a post of Phil Spencer having sent them over a bouquet of flowers recently on Twitter lol
 

Holammer

Member
I mean there is straight a post of Phil Spencer having sent them over a bouquet of flowers recently on Twitter lol
Yep, but I feel that Kamiya could post that one organically even as a joke without the greasy fingerprints of marketing.
When the back and forth starts. Then it's happening.
 

G-Bus

Gold Member
How does a GaaS differ from a game that just gets a lot of DLC?

Is it microtransactions? What if these are purely cosmetic and have no interference with gameplay and progression.

I just don't get why a game that gets a ton of content added over a long period of time can be a bad thing, assuming it a game you really enjoy.

Don't see the issue with destiny, and going off those 1 million pre orders for a $50 piece of DLC, a lot of others don't either.

Development costs are going up. People want more and more in these world's. Why not keep them alive for longer periods of time with content?

I guess like anything this can all be implemented in good and bad ways. Just seems to be a lot of general hate and disgust around this stuff.
 

Dane

Member
Creating GAAS games isn't risky. It's following the trend. What a joke
It's not about being risky, it's about playing smart. Platinum is a studio like others who sell the lunch to buy the dinner, they have one financial success for every 3 financial flops. Remedy for example got a major owned IP success with Control but they also had signed contracts with Epic for funding both that game and a permanent one with Alan Wake 2 + CrossfireX SP and Control MP.

Obsidian, InXile and Double Fine were acquired by Microsoft all for same reason, it wasn't worth being independent if they were always at the brink of bankrupt and all three (even Platinum) had to ask for money on Kickstarter, 14 to 20 year old companies.

Their intention is that the GaaS game will be the funding machine for the other projects and remain independent, or they will throw the towel.

How does a GaaS differ from a game that just gets a lot of DLC?

Is it microtransactions? What if these are purely cosmetic and have no interference with gameplay and progression.

I just don't get why a game that gets a ton of content added over a long period of time can be a bad thing, assuming it a game you really enjoy.

Don't see the issue with destiny, and going off those 1 million pre orders for a $50 piece of DLC, a lot of others don't either.

Development costs are going up. People want more and more in these world's. Why not keep them alive for longer periods of time with content?

I guess like anything this can all be implemented in good and bad ways. Just seems to be a lot of general hate and disgust around this stuff.

You have a great point, look at Payday, Desntiny, Warframe and etc, the thing is that it became a massive trend for the industry to deliver crude software in expectation to be their money maker with zero effort.
 
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Notabueno

Banned
I don't understand how we've reach a point of irrational degeneration to the point where a rep let alone a CEO can even dare saying "moving away from well-designed games" without any warning popping up in mind.

What does Kamiya say about it? Maybe he's a tired old crust out of passion who doesn't care about game and just wants to get a rich retirement.
 

SSfox

Lies about why mods reply ban and warn me.
The new PG CEO photo leaked


This new CEO guy need to get fired already or he will destroy PG
 
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Astral Dog

Member
I don't understand how we've reach a point of irrational degeneration to the point where a rep let alone a CEO can even dare saying "moving away from well-designed games" without any warning popping up in mind.

What does Kamiya say about it? Maybe he's a tired old crust out of passion who doesn't care about game and just wants to get a rich retirement.
Read the lines, games like Bayonetta and other Platinum games are always critisized for being too 'short' by the gamer community thats why he says one off.

This pr babble just means they are looking to provide different kind of content than they are used too, not that they will stop making it. We already going to see the launch of Babylon Fall next month.

But we won't run out of Bayo/Nier/Astral Chain etc either, of course as long as companies want to publish them

Edit: Capcom just doesn't make Devil May Cry only, and Square not only makes Final Fantasy XIV, Platinum needs to expand to different genres, rather than just linear action games, thats what they are saying here.
 
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Fbh

Member
How does a GaaS differ from a game that just gets a lot of DLC?

IMO the biggest difference is that GaaS usually aim at keeping players engaged for long periods of time. A "live service" game doesn't want you coming back every 6 months to check out some new DLC, they want you to log in and engage with the game daily.
As such they are designed to be time consuming. They'll often revolve around loot, grinding/farming, slow progression systems and replaying the same missions over and over to slowly improve your character. All of which are things I personally hate in games and one of the main reasons I stay away from games like these.

A "live service" version of Bayonetta isn't just same old Bayonetta with a lot of costume DLCs.
It's Bayonetta with loot, and a leveling system, and numbers popping up from your attacks, and bullet sponge enemies with levels that you'll do no damage to unless you grind for better gear, and cool weapons locked behind time consuming grinds or timed events, etc.

The one hope if they go down this route is that they still have fun and well balanced campaigns, and the shitty live service grind works as an extensive post game or an altogether separate game mode.

I mean when you see Playstation teaming up with someone who does you better than you. I would do the samething.



Eh, I'd wait for this to be out before calling them better than platinum.

Remember when Lost Soul Aside was going to show capcom how it's done? Game still isn't out and it's probably not going to be as good as DMCV.
 

Oddvintagechap

Gold Member
Eh, I'd wait for this to be out before calling them better than platinum.

Remember when Lost Soul Aside was going to show capcom how it's done? Game still isn't out and it's probably not going to be as good as DMCV.
Im not even this game’s market audience. I hate games that treat me like a sexually frustrated 14 year old.

But it’s gorgeous. Might just have to buy it even if it’s simply a musou game.
 

anthony2690

Member
I hope platinum games can make another good game.

I feel like most of their output has been pretty rubbish to average.

I still think their best two games are probably bayonetta 1 and vanquish.

But I've always felt their games have been mega over rated, Nier Automata was pretty pants, great ost though.
 
I'm not too pissed about this. i'll wait to see and judge. i hope bayonetta 3 is awesome and they make another Nier game. I'm looking forward to Final Fantasy: Stranger of Paradise. They have exceeded my expectations time and time again so i am excited for this rather than doubtful.
 

Astral Dog

Member
Platinum Games have almost never sold what they needed to. Vanquish didn't, despite being amazing. Bayonetta never did. The list goes on. NieR Automata saved Platinum as much as it saved Yoko Taro. There just isn't sales there to support them for what they cost. Even when they worked at Capcom, they made games that didn't sell.

What they need is to be hired by other companies to make IP that people like.
Thats not (only) what they want, despite what some people like to believe, Platinum is not THAT invested in Metal Gear or Nier, because its not their IP, they do gain a lot of recognition and experience working on those series, but its not their characters or story, and they do not have any control over the work ,for example Konami cut them out after they stoped making Metal Gear despite high sales.

I bet they didn't see much of those 5 million sold of Nier Automata either, since thats all Square Enix property and Platinum was only hired to work on the gameplay.

Platinum wants to publish their own games, not only make other company games, thats why Bayonetta and Astral Chain are still important to them, and why they published(with permission) Wonderful 101 on other systems. Platinum wants to expand to other genres to see if they find more success there, but they won't stop making their usual quality content as long as companies are willing to publish them, i don't see why the singleplayer content will run out
 
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sainraja

Member
I guess everything is going towards having some form of Games as a Service (GaaS) thing. They all run the risk of over saturating the market with them and could turn people away simply because of that haha. I mean, you kinda have to pick one and stick with it. You can't invest your time and money into multiple GaaS games. I don't think I could.
 
People don't seem to realize that Platinum have been on life support for a long time.

Let's take a look at their back catalog:



That's a very mixed output. Their peak was from their inception until 2014. They churned out hit after hit. Then presumably the money ran out, so they had to take on a shitload of licensed properties from Activision to pay the bills. They had a minor renaissance with Nier and Astral Chain but by and large they are a failing developer.

Scalebound was cancelled due to mismanagement. Their years of work on Granblue Fantasy: Relink has presumably been thrown out the window after Cygames parted ways with them in 2019. Cygames have been developing Granblue in-house now for 3 years, so i'd bet there is nothing left of Platinum's code.

Babylon's Fall beta impressions are that it's a literal 2/10 game, which is very concerning since this was meant to be just Nier with GaaS. They created a new studio in 2020 specifically to help with this and already it's a failure.

Add in the fact they are losing talent. They lost their CEO this year. They lost Yusuke Hashimoto. They lost the westerner Bayo 3 lead designer to Tango Gameworks. And speaking of Bayonetta 3, even that looks safe as hell (toning down some of the signature sexualization if the recent reveal was any suggestion).

Like many JP developers (Nagoshi, Grasshopper) Platinum are even whoring themselves out to the Orient to stay afloat. They partnered with Tencent in 2020, which is basically signing a deal with an organ of the CCP.

Face it, the party is over for Platinum. Maybe Kamiya can beg Microsoft for forgiveness and Phil Spencer can buy them.
 
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Fbh

Member
People don't seem to realize that Platinum have been on life support for a long time.

Let's take a look at their back catalog:



That's a very mixed output. Their peak was from their inception until 2014. They churned out hit after hit. Then presumably the money ran out, so they had to take on a shitload of licensed properties from Activision to pay the bills. They had a minor renaissance with Nier and Astral Chain but by and large they are a failing developer.

Scalebound was cancelled due to mismanagement. Their years of work on Granblue Fantasy: Relink has presumably been thrown out the window after Cygames parted ways with them in 2019. Cygames have been developing Granblue in-house now for 3 years, so i'd bet there is nothing left of Platinum's code.

Babylon's Fall beta impressions are that it's a literal 2/10 game, which is very concerning since this was meant to be just Nier with GaaS. They created a new studio in 2020 specifically to help with this and already it's a failure.

Add in the fact they are losing talent. They lost their CEO this year. They lost Yusuke Hashimoto. They lost the westerner Bayo 3 lead designer to Tango Gameworks. And speaking of Bayonetta 3, even that looks safe as hell (toning down some of the signature sexualization if the recent reveal was any suggestion).

Like many JP developers (Nagoshi, Grasshopper) Platinum are even whoring themselves out to the Orient to stay afloat. They partnered with Tencent in 2020, which is basically signing a deal with an organ of the CCP.

Face it, the party is over for Platinum. Maybe Kamiya can beg Microsoft for forgiveness and Phil Spencer can buy them.

There's plenty of truth here even if it's sad.

It also sucks because it felt like they were on an upward trend with Nier being amazing and Astral Chain being pretty good too.

I still wonder if there's really no place in the market for their games. Nier did pretty well and only launched on PS4 (later coming to PC...then much later to Xbox), and other games in a similar style to their own, like DMCV, seem to have done fine too.

I'd just love to see one final game from them in their traditional style launching as a proper multiplatform release on Ps5/PC/SX
 
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