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Opinion Drama Platform OPINON: Sony Not Offering Performance Upgrade To Ghosts For Free Feels Anti-Consumer

Is Sony justified charging $10 more for performance upgrade when other platforms do it for free?

  • Yes

    Votes: 97 23.2%
  • No

    Votes: 232 55.5%
  • Yes but only if tied with new exclusive content not related to resolution/framerate (give examples)

    Votes: 89 21.3%

  • Total voters
    418
  • Poll closed .

Razvedka

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Oct 20, 2018
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$20 for an expansion is fine. I'd like to get it if it reviews well.

$10 extra for some rumble and fixing the lip syncing is just weird. It's literally the newest and most recent PS4 exclusive, so I find it surprising that stuff isn't grandfathered in a bit. I think inFamous SS added PS4 Pro texture updates for free and were among the first of the Sony studios to do it.
Exactly. My point in the post was as a PS5 owner I'm paying a $10 tax for... What exactly? Lip sync? Rumble?

$20 for the expansion is fine. I just fail to see what my extra $10 gets me over PS4 owners.
 
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arvfab

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Exactly. My point in the post was as a PS5 owner I'm paying a $10 tax for... What exactly? Lip sync? Rumble?

$20 for the expansion is fine. I just fail to see what my extra $10 gets me over PS4 owners.

You get the PS5 version of the game, which will probably have even better performance improvements, graphical improvements, 3D audio, DualSense features, support for activity cards, faster loading times and an own trophy list.

If you think it's not worth the 10$/€ you don't have to upgrade it.
 
Oct 16, 2017
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You are correct in saying that they do not have to give this away for free and that we also do not have to buy it. They just come off as looking scummy for charging for this. Whether that matters to them or not who knows...
What makes it Scummy?
People are literally simultaneously consider the 10 dollar upgrade as unimportant and they don't need it, AND say that Sony need to give it to them for free or they would get mad. You are LYING.

You are either lying about the upgrade being insignificant to you, or you are lying about thinking Sony is scummy for wanting to charge for it.

Is the upgrade significant? Or is it not significant? Pick ONE.
 

SlimySnake

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$20 for an expansion is fine. I'd like to get it if it reviews well.

$10 extra for some rumble and fixing the lip syncing is just weird. It's literally the newest and most recent PS4 exclusive, so I find it surprising that stuff isn't grandfathered in a bit. I think inFamous SS added PS4 Pro texture updates for free and were among the first of the Sony studios to do it.
This. I see Doom Eternal's free PS5 patch everywhere on my youtube feed nowadays with people boasting about ray tracing and 120 fps, and then I see Sony charge $$ to do the same for Death Stranding and Ghost of Tsushima, the first such Sony first party titles to get upgrades.

That's right, before GoT, no legacy Sony first party title got a PS5 SKU. Meanwhile every third party developer went out of their way to add support for PS5 features for free. The list is huge:

- Borderlands 3
- Metro Exodus (Ray tracing)
- Control (Ray tracing)
- Doom Eternal (Ray tracing)
- Mortal Shell
- Final Fantasy 7
- Avengers
- No Man's Sky
- Rainbow Six Seige
- Star Wars Fallen Order ( A fucking EA game)
- Cyberpunk is also getting a free upgrade later this year
- CoD Warzone is getting one later this year
- Witcher 3 Wild Hunt as well

These are all games that came out before the launch of new consoles. Some of them had DLC they wanted to sell, some didnt. But even if they had DLC to sell, they didnt tie upgrades to the DLC like Sony is doing with DS and Days Gone.

It just feels cheap. Like Sony is some indie developer who is trying to get by and cant afford these upgrades for free. It feels like they are leaching their consumer base for every dollar they can get. I didnt like the $10 price hike but their games feel expensive and bigger than most other games so ok, fine premium games for a premium price. But this is just wrong on so many levels.

It's wrong because it bucks the industry precedent of offering these upgrades for free. It's wrong because they arent even adding ray tracing or 120 fps support like third parties have. It's wrong because they have gone out of their way to port Horizon and Days gone to PC while ignoring the PS4 owners. At least Days Gone got a 60 fps patch, but even that is locked behind 1800p checkerboard even the PS5 should easily be able to handle native 1800p 60 fps if not a full 4k 60 fps seeing as how a 1.8 tflops GCN 1.0 GPU can easily do 1080p 30 fps.

It feels icky because it is. Because their competition MS has released 120 fps modes for Gears 5 and Ori. Doom is a fucking first party MS game now and they felt that PS5 owners deserved an upgrade.I highly doubt Sony paid them for it since Sony doesnt even want to pay first party devs to do these for free. This Doom upgrade is on MS. Think about that for a second.

I think this is the new direction of Sony under Jim Ryan. Expect more of this penny pinching. Every move he's made from making games cross gen to porting games to PC, closing revered studios despite posting record profits, increasing price of games to $70 despite them selling more and better than ever, and now charging for haptic feedback and native SKUs reeks of penny pinching.

To be fair, this is how big companies thrive. Amazon made billions while forcing employees to wear trackers that monitored their every move, while forcing warehouse employees to pee in bottles, while pitting office employees against each other in a dog eat dog office culture. MS killed all their competition by buying them out if not straight up cheating them. See Dos and Apple. They now charge $70 a year for MS Office when it used to be $100 to own it lifetime. Apple forces a $200 profit per iPhone no matter what cost which results in steadily increasing prices for phones that started as $500 premium products to now $1,100-1,300 products and near slave conditions in China. Sony is no different. They are passing the costs to consumers just like most big companies nowadays.
 
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evanft

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Here's a selection of games that have done free PS4->PS5 upgrades.

  • A Plague Tale: Innocence
  • Assassin's Creed Valhalla
  • Borderlands 3
  • Crash Bandicoot 4
  • Doom Eternal (ray tracing added)
  • Final Fantasy VII Remake
  • Greedfall
  • Immortal: Fenyx Rising
  • Jedi Fallen Order
  • Maneater
  • Marvel's Avengers
  • Metro Exodus (ray tracing added)
  • Mortal Kombat 11
  • Nioh 2
  • No Man's Sky
  • Sackboy
  • Saints Row: The Third Remastered
  • Spider-Man Miles Morales (ray tracing added)
  • Terminator Resistance
  • Watch Dogs: Legion
  • Yakuza 7
But hey, Sony should totally be charging for upping the resolution, adding dualsense support, and Japanese lip sync.
 

ZywyPL

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I think this is the new direction of Sony under Jim Ryan.

When Shawn Layden left Sony he openly admitted that current development model in unsustainable, and Ryan is doing everything to change that and make the games as profitable as possible, that's his job as the CEO after all. But the he does it in a way where buying Sony's games on day 1 is the worst deal in the industry, because you know there will be a PC port some time later, then there's gonna be a Director's Cut for the consoles, and then again Director's Cut but for PC, it's really the best to just patiently wait for the "complete" edition to land on Steam/EGS and call it a day.
 

Shmunter

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If someone was happy to buy a game at launch, that does not give them the right to be given gifts later. Tell me exactly what you were expecting other than "you need to send gifts to customers".

Look, enough with it. If Xbox is willing to give you free games so you would switch sides, and you think that is fine, then switch already. Any attempt to argue that Sony is doing something wrong for selling a product for money, is just you not wanting to switch. So just go switch to Xbox if you like subsidized software so much. Don't stand around trying to call Sony evil. Go and play Xbox games.
What gifts are you even going on about? Sorry, I’m confused…..
 

Silent Viper

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Nah this is a non issue.
Doesn't matter. I wont mind tapping her aussie ass.


Back to topic - Charging for graphics and performance upgrades is one of the worst practices of modern console gaming era and it needs to die asap.

People who defend it are blind famboys and corporate slaves.
 
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sainraja

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It is definitely weird how Sony is handling all this. Basically, they are failing in how they've communicated it and packaged it all. I am surprised that so many here haven't picked up on it. What they are doing isn't any different than what has happened in the past. The expansion being there is kinda what is muddying the waters here. I will explain.

So, if you have the PS4 version and you upgrade it to PS5 you are going to get the PS5 enhancements since those are part of the PS5 version.
If we simply upgrade to the directors cut, we will only get the expansion. The game version here remains the PS4.

Now if we want to upgrade to the PS5 version, we will have to pay $10. The $19.99 dollars is for the actual Iki island expansion.

The route of upgrading to the PS5 version is the weird part because the only version that exists (so far) is the directors cut version which includes the Iki expansion and Sony is bundling the cost of the PS5 upgrade and the expansion together.

Not justifying any of this but other games have charged $10 for an upgrade to the next gen version. This happened in the past too. Would be nice if Sony treated this the way they treat/treated downloadable PSN games from PS3 --> to PS4 where we didn't have to pay a dime to get the next gen version; it was just cross buy and games that supported it we got no problem.
 
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DavidGzz

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They will do what they can get away with. It's essentially the opposite from what MS is doing. 1st parties on GP day one with free upgrades on everything while Sony charges $30 to people like me who bought Ghost day 1 and also waited in line for my PS5 for 4 hours. I won't buy it even though it was my GoTY. Fuck em.
 
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GymWolf

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And you have the option to just download the expansion for $20 and not pay for the upgrades ($10) if you don't want those feaures.

How is that anti-consumer or shitty or disappointing ... I just can't understand.
Where i said that it is anticonsumer?! We already had a free performance patch for tsushima on ps5 and i was already okay with that (since is free)

What i find disappointing is that the upgrade on ps5 is for stuff that i dont give a fuck about, if it was something like 4k textures and some other noticeable graphical features i could probably buy it, but i know that nobody is forcing me, i'm just disappointed about the upgrade per se and not the fact that is not free, if you know what i mean.
 
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Razvedka

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You get the PS5 version of the game, which will probably have even better performance improvements, graphical improvements, 3D audio, DualSense features, support for activity cards, faster loading times and an own trophy list.

If you think it's not worth the 10$/€ you don't have to upgrade it.
I got the PS5 version for free via a patch. I owned the game on PS4. You do understand that the 60fps/fast load times/etc enhancements were patched months ago?

They've not said the $30 will get you better graphics, better performance, or better loading over the free stuff already implemented. That's pure supposition on your part. I hope you're right, but you shouldn't be using it as an argument point.
 
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SlimySnake

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When Shawn Layden left Sony he openly admitted that current development model in unsustainable, and Ryan is doing everything to change that and make the games as profitable as possible, that's his job as the CEO after all. But the he does it in a way where buying Sony's games on day 1 is the worst deal in the industry, because you know there will be a PC port some time later, then there's gonna be a Director's Cut for the consoles, and then again Director's Cut but for PC, it's really the best to just patiently wait for the "complete" edition to land on Steam/EGS and call it a day.
You know I can buy that. If games are getting more expensive and they NEED to be on PC to maintain this level of polish and quality then fine. Just be honest about it. Dont port Horizon and say things like 'how porting one game doesnt mean every game will come to PC' then port Days Gone a few months later and say the complete opposite. Now they are saying things like PS5 games will be exclusive at launch knowing full well the idea is to get these games on PC on day one. I mean they literally just acquired nixxes to port those games to PC. Why lie?

I am not one to wait so I would probably pay $70 for the inferior version of the game just to get it on day one. But tbh, and I have said this before, but Sony games going to PC should help hardcore gamers who likely already have souped up PCs. My 2080 can do native 4k 60 fps at very high presets in Death Stranding where as the PS5 is offering only upscaled 4k which is likely the 4kcb solution literally half of native 4k. In ray tracing games, the 2080 is even better than the PS5, add DLSS 2.0 to the mix and we are looking at roughly 50% better performance for a $10 cheaper game. If I ever manage to get my hands on a 3080, that delta increases to 150%.

Couple that with not one but two $500 PS5 purchases I would make this gen and $60 a month for 7 years for PS+, and PC gaming becomes a far more attractive option. I am OK with Sony porting games as long as they are up front about it. I think it might be bad for their business in the long run, but I am not a shareholder and i couldnt care less about how much profits they make.

Just be honest.
 
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John Wick

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Care to explain what that is instead of doing drive-by posts?

If it's a new SKU FOR THE PS5 with new stuff that is exclusive to the PS5, well no shit sherlock that you won't get it for free. Even if that is just controller/FPS/resolution/textures. You already got a BC patch with better framerate, for free, for those that has a PS5 but wants that little smother gameplay for the PS4-version, just like any other game that is on PS4 but you play it on PS5. You got a free game mode, Legends. What, you except them to hand free stuff forever to you just because you think you are entitled to shit? You ain't and it certainly is not anti-consumer.
Your right how stupid of us to assume this of Sony because other companies aren't giving free next gen upgrades are they?
If you had read my previous replies you would have known that I agreed Sony could expect to charge for the dlc content and $20 was a reasonable amount but the extra $10 for PS5 is a joke. They could have provided all this under the $20 but no they had to be greedy as fuck and want an extra $10.
Maybe you should rage at the other companies giving free next gen upgrades for free and tell them they should charge for it.
 

JORMBO

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What makes it Scummy?
People are literally simultaneously consider the 10 dollar upgrade as unimportant and they don't need it, AND say that Sony need to give it to them for free or they would get mad. You are LYING.

You are either lying about the upgrade being insignificant to you, or you are lying about thinking Sony is scummy for wanting to charge for it.

Is the upgrade significant? Or is it not significant? Pick ONE.
I can think it is a small update worth skipping if they are going to charge and also think it is scummy to try and charge for it.
 
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John Wick

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They could have, and that'd have been nice -- just like they gave Astrobot for free and Horizon Zero Dawn and Ratchet & Clank and 7 other games for free to everyone, not just PS customers -- but should they? No.

There is a difference b/w could have and should have. OP is suggesting they should have waived the $10, which is absurd, as this is the equivalent of asking others to work for you for free.

Just like you could have offered your professional services to clients for free, but should you? And if a client asks you to do an additional thing -- outside the scope of your contract -- and you bill your client for that, should you be called "extra greedy and demanding?" Absolutely not.

It's pretty much the same thing here.
C'mon man your one of the more sensible posters on here. I usually agree with what you say mostly as well but not on this.
If other companies can provide free next gen upgrades for free then Sony certainly can. There is no excuse. For the DLC they are getting $20. That should have covered the whole thing but no Sony had to be extra greedy and demand an extra $10 on top.
It would be a fair point if no one else was doing free next gen upgrades and Sony was a small poor developer but no they aren't and this should have been done under the $20 fee.
Sony followed in MS steps to charge for online eagerly didn't they? They should now be just as eager to give free next gen upgrades too.
 
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arvfab

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I got the PS5 version for free via a patch. I owned the game on PS4. You do understand that the 60fps/fast load times/etc enhancements were patched months ago?

They've not said the $30 will get you better graphics, better performance, or better loading over the free stuff already implemented. That's pure supposition on your part. I hope you're right, but you shouldn't be using it as an argument point.

You got a "PS5 aware" update, no PS5 version. You can easily check this fact, as you can start your current GoT version from an external drive, which is not possible for native PS5 games. Same as God of War patch.
 

M1chl

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Guys even if it's less than ideal situation, it's still not a Nintendo. I think the price is mostly fine with one exception. If you can't get PS5, you buy probably the expansion on PS4 and with that I believe that upgrade from it, to PS5 version should be free. But that's just me.
 

Topher

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I'm not going to buy the upgrade.

Season 9 Nbc GIF by The Office
 
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Lupin25

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Why do people keep saying Sony isn’t offering a free upgrade then if there’s an actual resolution/performance patch for the original game? Just like those devs on most of these lists...
 

HeisenbergFX4

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I guess people will vote with their wallets and we will see how this move pans out.

I for one have no issue dropping $10 for a true next gen upgrade and $30 when it includes DLC.

C'mon man your one of the more sensible posters on here. I usually agree with what you say mostly as well but not on this.
If other companies can provide free next gen upgrades for free then Sony certainly can. There is no excuse. For the DLC they are getting $20. That should have covered the whole thing but no Sony had to be extra greedy and demand an extra $10 on top.
It would be a fair point if no one else was doing free next gen upgrades and Sony was a small poor developer but no they aren't and this should have been done under the $20 fee.
Sony followed in MS steps to charge for online eagerly didn't they? They should now be just as eager to give free next gen upgrades too.

I do agree with you though certain next gen upgrades should be free though imo that should really only include when they unlock frame rates say.

True next gen upgrades should cost something
 

b6a6es

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You can literally play the original PS4 BC on PS and you’ll get 4K60, the DC only includes some upgraded texture , Distance, Loading screens & Haptic feedback, you don’t have to play anything if you don’t care about these features

Calling a 10$ upgrade an anti-consumer is no different than calling Gamepass Ultimate additional fees an anti-consumer since you still pay for Xbox live Online
 

Kuranghi

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I do think the upgrade fee is strange when others companies did it for free but then also we don't know how much work the lip-sync and everything else was for them, the thing that makes it too much for me overall is the £25 total to go from PS4 OG version to PS5 DC version, that seems like too much unless the new island adds substantial new features and different content thats not just a palette swap, even if it has a really large new area to explore if its just the same content with a different wrapper I don't know if thats worth £25, £20 I think is fine but that extra £5 just pushes it above what seems reasonable.

Will need to see what it is though first, if its not a palette swap of old stuff then I'm happy to pay the £25, hopefully its a First Light style update, which I think made the combat a LOT more fun than SS, even though that was still fun.
 

Heisenberg007

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Where i said that it is anticonsumer?! We already had a free performance patch for tsushima on ps5 and i was already okay with that (since is free)

What i find disappointing is that the upgrade on ps5 is for stuff that i dont give a fuck about, if it was something like 4k textures and some other noticeable graphical features i could probably buy it, but i know that nobody is forcing me, i'm just disappointed about the upgrade per se and not the fact that is not free, if you know what i mean.
That's perfectly fair.
 
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Dr.Morris79

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Sony are so good, especially since their console is the best seller, can I not give them £60 for it?

They deserve it.
 

SlimySnake

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Just realized something. Youtube has been recommending me a lot of short videos of TLOU2's combat lately. It looks amazing and I would love to go back and play these combat encounters from the encounter menu just to experience the combat.

The only problem is due to a lack of a native PS5 port, the encounters and chapter select modes still take 40 seconds to load. Thats launch Bloodborne levels of bad. We know the PS5 is capable of literally 1-2 second load times but we haven't gotten it because Sony is planning on charging a full $70 for factions and the native TLOU2 port.

That to me is the worst part about this. We have a great fucking game with great combat running on a machine with a revolutionary SSD that we cant enjoy because of shitty corporate policies.

 
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Warablo

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Eh, you should be able to buy the expansion standalone and upgrades for the Ps5 version should be free.

$70 is quite steep too. I already beat the game but don't own it, I just want to play the dlc.

Just feels like a scammy way of re-selling a game that released a year ago for $70. Let players enjoy their new Ps5 without nickel and diming them.
 
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Tmack

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What? They did offer for free (60 fps better res)... This is a DLC/DC/whatever/shit game.
 

Razvedka

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You got a "PS5 aware" update, no PS5 version. You can easily check this fact, as you can start your current GoT version from an external drive, which is not possible for native PS5 games. Same as God of War patch.
And you're actually expecting something more than that patch with this DLC? I mean, you shouldn't. You're just getting rumble triggers and lip syncing.

That 'PS5 aware' update is the PS5 version in terms of graphics and performance. I feel like this is splitting hairs.
 
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Shmunter

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I guess people will vote with their wallets and we will see how this move pans out.

I for one have no issue dropping $10 for a true next gen upgrade and $30 when it includes DLC.



I do agree with you though certain next gen upgrades should be free though imo that should really only include when they unlock frame rates say.

True next gen upgrades should cost something
Yes. But they force you to buy the DLC even if you simply want to go next gen. Can a ps4 owner pay $10? Nope, $30 is the only way. The ultimate "would you like fires with that?"
 

yurinka

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I think the upgrade to a next gen native SKU with extra resolution, maybe lighting or RT, dual sense features, shorter loading times and 3D audio should be free.

I'd charge instead for a DLC separate from the next gen upgrade, that would include all the new content and features that games like GoT DC or DS DC add (new areas, extended story, new missions, new enemies, new weapons, character customization stuff, new gameplay mechanics etc).

So I'd have released a free PS4 to PS5 native version upgrade for the base GoT and DS vanilla versions, and then released a $30 GoT DC DLC and a $10 DS DC DLC both for PS4 and PS5.
 
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oagboghi2

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No point in trying to argue the point op Sony are clearly trying to make money of their userbase with their shitty pricing policies and many of them are happy to bend over and let Jim have another round

  • Yes the released free stuff and a pretty cool multiplayer mode for ghosts
  • Yes they released performance patches for not only ghosts but other first party games

But both the above things have been done either for free or less of a charge by third parties or first parties on other platforms
Enjoy that $70 ps5 edition new adopters
“enjoy playing a good video game you stupid fanboys”

Yeah, you really showed them 😂
 
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arvfab

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And you're actually expecting something more than that patch with this DLC? I mean, you shouldn't. You're just getting rumble triggers and lip syncing.

That 'PS5 aware' update is the PS5 version in terms of graphics and performance. I feel like this is splitting hairs.

I'm expecting good usage of the DualSense, implementation of the activity cards, faster loading times and better usage of the PS5 hardware. From the upgrade. You could have a look at the differences between Fallen Order PS5 "aware" update and native version, but probably more pronounced for a Sony first party game.

From the DLC I'm expecting additional game content.
 

Omeggos

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Ms proved that drastic upgrades like going form Xbox one to Xbox series x for gears 5 can be done without needing to charge extra. This was a very petty move on Sony’s part
 

Mr Moose

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I got the PS5 version for free via a patch. I owned the game on PS4. You do understand that the 60fps/fast load times/etc enhancements were patched months ago?

They've not said the $30 will get you better graphics, better performance, or better loading over the free stuff already implemented. That's pure supposition on your part. I hope you're right, but you shouldn't be using it as an argument point.
They did a 60fps patch and nothing else, it already loaded very fast on PS4.
 
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xrnzaaas

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They definitely lost some good pr with charging 10 bucks for the next-gen upgrade and setting a high price for the PS5 version. The reception would've been much better if they just focused on charging only for the expansion. I'm pretty sure people would be more open to paying for the new island if that meant they'd also play the upgraded version with no additional cost.

Right now I'm in no hurry to get the PS5 bump and I wouldn't want to play the DLC as a PS4 version.
 
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Aenima

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GoT did got a free performance upgrade for PS5.
Whats greedy is the 10$ tax to upgrade ur PS4 version to the native PS5 version.
 

Razvedka

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They did a 60fps patch and nothing else, it already loaded very fast on PS4.
Load times are way faster on PS5 man.

A arvfab I understand, so you're expecting a bunch of stuff with this on PS5. Again, I hope you're right but if this is the case where's their statements about it? Marketing?

There just doesn't seem to be anything
 
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Aenima

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Load times are way faster on PS5 man.
Lol back in the PS4 they were already super fast. About 8 seconds to fast travel to one point of the map to another. The PS4 version running on PS5 already has faster loadings than that. I know the native PS5 version has even faster loading, but loading times was never a problem in GoT.
 
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Samus Aran

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Your right how stupid of us to assume this of Sony because other companies aren't giving free next gen upgrades are they?
If you had read my previous replies you would have known that I agreed Sony could expect to charge for the dlc content and $20 was a reasonable amount but the extra $10 for PS5 is a joke. They could have provided all this under the $20 but no they had to be greedy as fuck and want an extra $10.
Maybe you should rage at the other companies giving free next gen upgrades for free and tell them they should charge for it.

$10 for a PS5 version is hell of a lot more affordable than $70. What is this?

I've read your replies, you don't like them charging money for the upgrade to PS5, hence the discussion no?

Why should I "rage" at the other companies? We are discussing Sony here. If Microsoft wants to give free next gen upgrades to games for the new consoles to people, then that is their business model, and it has fuck all to do with this discussion.