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[Gordon Shumway]

But they don't though. That's the entire point. And the current case linked above that's likely to end up in the Supreme Court.

But they do tho..

When white people (not all of course) consider themselves the victim when they have every single option at their disposal unlike others, we are really fucked as a nation. But the mind blowing thing is if they self reflected and got on board, it would've been possible to actually move forward as a society and progress, but they gotta be on top.

Eta- Asians are always the goddamn stick used to hit the pinata.

Again, exactly..

Opponents of affirmative action often use Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders (AAPIs) as a racial wedge by selling the myth that affirmative action hurts Asian American students by placing quotas on their admissions into elite colleges in favor of African American and Latino students. Quotas, in fact, have been unconstitutional for decades and AAPIs have historically benefitted, and continue to benefit, from affirmative action policies. Defending affirmative action also means standing in solidarity with other communities of color, as we collectively fight and work against the reality of structural racism in our country.

And considering the dude behind the whole Harvard thing, yeah..he ain't looking for equality. Anyone that thinks so is an idiot..he's just looking for a win.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Blum_(litigant)

 

[Journeywalker]

But they don't though. That's the entire point. And the current case linked above that's likely to end up in the Supreme Court.

There is no "Asian Cap." That would be quotas, which were already ruled unconstitutional in 1978.

There are no "point systems." Those were ruled unconstitutional in 2003 (Gratz v. Bollinger).

In fact, there's already legal precedence for an allowable consideration of race in admissions (Grutter v. Bollinger, 2003).

And I apologize to Mr. Jia (from the nytimes piece), but I have a hard time feeling bad for him. He got into Duke. It may seem like the end of the world for him because it's not an Ivy, but there is so much more to life than getting into an Ivy League school.

 

[KiwiLannister]

And I apologize to Mr. Jia (from the nytimes piece), but I have a hard time feeling bad for him. He got into Duke. It may seem like the end of the world for him because it's not an Ivy, but there is so much more to life than getting into an Ivy League school.

I will never understand this logic. You don't get to dictate how high other people set their goals. There is nothing immature or irrational about a successful person trying to get into the highest ranked or most prestigious school. The data shows that doing so is usually worth it. Just look at the post mba average pay between HBS and a school ranked in the 20s.

 

[broz0rs]

LOL if this passes the best colleges will be 99% Asian American and then what.

Bonus points for those of European descent?

The best colleges are always going to be students from alumni and rich donors. They are going to be white, and Asians won't make that much of a dent.

Here's another NY Times article where this Asian American kid who attends Duke wants to sue Ivy Leagues for not accepting him.

Affirmative Action Battle Has a New Focus: Asian-Americans

 

[davepoobond]

El oh el

 

[Journeywalker]

I will never understand this logic. You don't get to dictate how high other people set their goals. There is nothing immature or irrational about a successful person trying to get into the highest ranked or most prestigious school. The data shows that doing so is usually worth it. Just look at the post mba average pay between HBS and a school ranked in the 20s.

This has nothing to do with goal-setting. People should aspire to get the best education they can get. It has to do with the law. Is the law written so that Mr. Jia is disadvantaged in the scope of the entire society? No.

 

[alexthekid]

So if quotas and point systems are unconstitutional, how does affirmative action work in the US?

 

[Journeywalker]

So if quotas and point systems are unconstitutional, how does affirmative action work in the US?

It's a kind of "plus factor." Given two roughly-equal protential students, the student that is a member of an underrepresented minority will be favored. I don't know how that actually works in practice.

But I see what they're doing now. Grutter v. Bollinger was 5-4 in favor of affirmative action. Sandra Day O'Connor was the swing vote and Anthony Kennedy voted against. Now Kennedy is the swing vote and it will be overturned.

Shit. This is going to accelerate income inequality and kill social mobility.

 

[kiunchbb]

Funny that this is an argument I always hear from my old conservative friends who could give a fuck about Asians, but use them for this argument..heh. I'll just answer with this link..

Sorry, I don't believe in study and survey paid and done by the organization that had an agenda, and with no peer review cited. And no, that website does not speak for all of us.

Please don't cherry pick your source just to support your argument on why it is okay to treat me different based on my skin color

 

[Journeywalker]

Sorry, I don't believe in study and survey paid and done by the organization that had an agenda, and with no peer review cited. And no, that website does not speak for all of us.

Please don't cherry pick your source just to support your argument on why it is okay to treat me different based on my skin color

Every agency has an agenda, hence the shared root. It's not nefarious.

Choosing sources to support a claim is inherently cherry picking. It's not nefarious. This isn't a compendium, it's a forum.

Are diversity, social mobility, and income proportionality compelling state interests? If so, you can't be color blind. On a base human level we are more comfortable with people that are "like us." The nature of groups in power is that they work to maintain power. They can lobby congress. They can pay consultants to manipulate people with dog whistles. They can prepare better for standardized testing. The people in their social circle also have power, so they can exploit those contacts. So you end up with stratification based on race, and our melting pot is killed. Something needs to be done to counteract these forces. Affirmative action is an imperfect means to this end.

For an illustrative example, please see Israel.

 

[Gordon Shumway]

Sorry, I don't believe in study and survey paid and done by the organization that had an agenda, and with no peer review cited. And no, that website does not speak for all of us.

Please don't cherry pick your source just to support your argument on why it is okay to treat me different based on my skin color

Who made such a claim? Don't wanna acknowledge the source? Cool. And I picked a source I read up on. Not once did I claimed it was ok to treat you differently..I said affirmative action also benefits Asians. Relax a little..

Every agency has an agenda, hence the shared root. It's not nefarious.

Choosing sources to support a claim is inherently cherry picking. It's not nefarious. This isn't a compendium, it's a forum.

Thanks..

 

[Renegade Frost]

Ditto. I am sure this will work its way up to SCOTUS. Better go out and vote during midterms.

I'm tired of white folks on GAF co-opting my voice to argue with other leftists for no damn good reason. As an African American who voted for Clinton Imma have to sincerely ask you guys to drop this shit. You're falling for that divide and conquer bs hook line and sinker.

Y'all dont have any right. Stop it right now.

I know this is going to sound like a conspiracy theory but I truly feel/think that the old boys club saw the Obama Admin as a threat to their establishment. This (Trump in general) is a way to turn the tide and reclaim what ever they think they may have lost be it social, financial, or political. Just a thought.

Its the average every day americans who are dumb as hell who push this mess through.

Donald trump is just them personified. These people lie to your face every day.


same 60 percent of white people giving it to the republicans like they have for the last 70 years

 

[BobNewbert31]

I'm tired of white folks on GAF co-opting my voice to argue with other leftists for no damn good reason. As an African American who voted for Clinton Imma have to sincerely ask you guys to drop this shit. You're falling for that divide and conquer bs hook line and sinker.

Y'all dont have any right. Stop it right now.

???

 

[Yoshi]

What they're bitching about now is that some applicant with little to no challenges throughout their lives, with a high test score, and mediocre GPA gets passed over another candidate that went through some shit with less resources with a lower test score and GPA in the same ballpark.

Shouldn't it be the other way around? Similar test result, but worse GPA? The test result (I assume university entry test) should be largely independent of prejudice, whereas the GPA is dependent on several teachers, making it more likely one suffers from discrimination, I think?

I am personally conflicted on this matter. I do not think that affirmative action is a fair way to tackle structural discrimination, but I do not know a good way to tackle it (when no immediate legal discrimination of one group exists [anymore], of course).

 

[Renegade Frost]

I think the point is more that it's meant to work in opposition to existing discrimination in the opposite direction.

I tend to think of it this way:

You have two candidates with a similar GPA
One - with a slightly higher one - has a privileged background.
Which candidate is the better at learning? Because that's the one the college should want.

Colleges dont actually care about people learning though. they care about people who perform well and make them look good.

Self directed learners dont really operate in the same structure that schools are known for ( and why we have a shit load of finance majors these days)

???

Its been like this since 2014 lol

No race has any set spots. There is nothing that entitles that Asian, white, woman, etc. student for a spot.

Personally I would argue that more schools need to take a look at the Affirmative action as a toolset to bring people from a wide variety of experiences, backgrounds, and beliefs to improve the quality of the education in the schools. Classrooms benefit from that kind of diversity I think.

Still form what I see Yoshi, people dont actually get how Affirmative Action works

Most cries of "Distraction!" are bullshit, but this is absolutely a distraction movie (albeit one the admin. does believe in), both for his base and against his opponents.

Considering that most people still havent heard Bill Browder's Senate Testimony I'm going to say the distraction game is very real.

Its all about using chaos to divide and conquer. There's too much shit to cover.

 

[BlueDevil]

It still boggles my mind that people actually believe AA is simply a way to admit unqualified minorities. They simply cannot understand the struggles many minorities go through every day of their live growing up in this racist country. So if a black applications SAT score is a little lower than a affluent white applicant because he grew up in a poor household with little resources or guidance, AA is there to even the playing field.

I'm a Mexican immigrant and I grew up in this country without documentation. Every single day, the odds were against me. Universities seek students who are resilient and able to overcome life's challenges. That is precisely why I attend a top 10 university today, and why I have peers who come from similar backgrounds as me. But this looks like simply another day in Trumpland. I truly hope this doesn't go anywhere.

 

[Renegade Frost]

I hated to default to this because it sounds like such a stereotypical answer, but I think that's what the people at the top who are majority privileged want

Blacks and Asians both getting played and then hateful towards each other is another American tradition

Smh this happens quite a bit in corporate america too. We got minorities trying to bring down other folks because they personally feel they havent "suffered enough" when they dont know the first thing about another persons life lol.

It us especially disheartening when I see managers doing it to other women of all people.

 

[Renegade Frost]

It still boggles my mind that people actually believe AA is simply a way to admit unqualified minorities. They simply cannot understand the struggles many minorities go through every day of their live growing up in this racist country. So if a black applications SAT score is a little lower than a affluent white applicant because he grew up in a poor household with little resources or guidance, AA is there to even the playing field.

I'm a Mexican immigrant and I grew up in this country without documentation. Every single day, the odds were against me. Universities seek students who are resilient and able to overcome life's challenges. That is precisely why I attend a top 10 university today, and why I have peers who come from similar backgrounds as me. But this looks like simply another day in Trumpland. I truly hope this doesn't go anywhere.

It really isnt surprising since some people believe black folks go to college for free.

https://www.facebook.com/MarierreB/posts/10154956302928215?pnref=story

I certainly do not. My school had a 66k tuition per year fee lmao.

 

[B33]

Trump's administration is aggressively dumb.

 

[Nerazar]

That phrasing. Are you from the UK? Just asking.

You seem to know next to nothing about what kind of immense challenges and adversity black people in America face for their entire lives.

The system has been built to work against them. Affirmative Action is one of the very few things we have that attempts to balance things.

I'm not from the US, that's true. And I do know how minorities have to fight an upward battle. All the time. That's my personal experience.

But I don't think that you can balance one bad thing with another "bad" thing, even with the nicest intentions. Systems like AA will always be unfair in a lot of cases and they exclude many, many factors. I have to admit that I don't know how each and every college handles it or whether there is a mandate from the DoJ or whatever institution on how to handle it in all states...

... but *if* you want to use AA, the color of your skin (AA is not just for black people, right?) should not be the only factor. We would have to take a hard look at any field of study and put in systems to equalize the chances for migrants, latinos, men, women, age, low-income people and every perspective there is. The goal should be a thorough representation of the whole society. And as long as this is not handled this way, I'm against AA or at least its current form, because it's not doing its job. You either support everyone or basically no one. One of the reasons Trump is playing the "unfair!"-card is because enough people feel that same way within their hearts. And from what I know, AA does not withstand the final test of total representation within the program. But then again, I'm willing to learn more about the topic and maybe the system works better than I remember it.

 

[HisImperialMajesty]

There is no "Asian Cap." That would be quotas, which were already ruled unconstitutional in 1978.

There are no "point systems." Those were ruled unconstitutional in 2003 (Gratz v. Bollinger).

In fact, there's already legal precedence for an allowable consideration of race in admissions (Grutter v. Bollinger, 2003).

And I apologize to Mr. Jia (from the nytimes piece), but I have a hard time feeling bad for him. He got into Duke. It may seem like the end of the world for him because it's not an Ivy, but there is so much more to life than getting into an Ivy League school.

This is simply not true though. There are most certainly quotas at top schools against Asian Americans. For the past two decades, the Asian American percentage of the student bodies at Ivy League and other elite schools have remained stable at around 20%, while the population of Asian Americans have nearly doubled during that time.

https://www.nytimes.com/roomfordeba...statistics-indicate-an-ivy-league-asian-quota

And why you may not feel bad for Mr. Jia, well, I think it's less that he's unsatisfied with Duke than that he felt that it was unfair that people in his school that were less accomplished than him were accepted to more selective colleges. When you feel that the system is rigged against you, you might not be so happy with a consolation prize.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

Shouldn't it be the other way around? Similar test result, but worse GPA? The test result (I assume university entry test) should be largely independent of prejudice, whereas the GPA is dependent on several teachers, making it more likely one suffers from discrimination, I think?

In general, test scores are correlated directly to income. Basically, it shows who has more access to test preparation. Performance in school over time in high school is a separate thing. That's more about how they are doing among their peers at a given school and/or versus what resources are available at a given school.

Personally I would argue that more schools need to take a look at the Affirmative action as a toolset to bring people from a wide variety of experiences, backgrounds, and beliefs to improve the quality of the education in the schools. Classrooms benefit from that kind of diversity I think.

That's exactly what it does. It allows schools/employers to pull from a more diverse set of applicants. And yeah in some situations allow the school to use race/ethnicity as part of the overall process, but it is never a primary consideration.

Are there some schools that mess it up or abuse it? Maybe. But that is likely in the extreme minority versus higher education as a whole in the US. Again, it seems people are upset over the schools that are fiercely competitive, can pull from a global applicant pool, and make up less than a percent of overall yearly admissions spots in the US.

 

[Journeywalker]

This is simply not true though. There are most certainly quotas at top schools against Asian Americans. For the past two decades, the Asian American percentage of the student bodies at Ivy League and other elite schools have remained stable at around 20%, while the population of Asian Americans have nearly doubled during that time.

https://www.nytimes.com/roomfordeba...statistics-indicate-an-ivy-league-asian-quota

And why you may not feel bad for Mr. Jia, well, I think it's less that he's unsatisfied with Duke than that he felt that it was unfair that people in his school that were less accomplished than him were accepted to more selective colleges. When you feel that the system is rigged against you, you might not be so happy with a consolation prize.

I'm sympathetic to the statistical argument that there must be hidden quotas, or that the current system acts as a de facto quota. However, what you're arguing for is a quota that adjusts itself based on the demographics of the college-age population. That's no better.

Also, relying on an opinion piece written by the publisher of The American Conservative? Do you know what their top story is?

The Origins of Trump's Immigration Policy--The president is following the lead of civil rights icon Barbara Jordan.

You're promoting the opinion of a person that lives in backward world. It follows that the opinion piece isn't about fairness at all. It's about using Asians as a wedge to remove one of the few systemic forces that attempt to fight for underprivileged minorities.

Privilege is real. It is the convenience of not having to think about things. You don't need to think about them, so they don't exist to you. When you pass a cop at night, do you have to worry about dying? That's privilege.

And yes, AA is unfair. So is progressive taxation. But these unfair policies are necessary because of the natural drift toward consolidation of wealth/power, declining social mobility, and stratification based on many factors including race.

tl;dr: Don't parrot conservatives from bizarro world. Privilege is real. AA is unfair, but necessary.

 

[kiunchbb]

Who made such a claim? Don't wanna acknowledge the source? Cool. And I picked a source I read up on. Not once did I claimed it was ok to treat you differently..I said affirmative action also benefits Asians. Relax a little..

My original post was crying about how AA solely based on race and is unfair against Asian American.

You reply with a link that support AA, which I believe is harmful toward Asian American, it is fair for me to believe you are supporting a cause that is against Asian American. If that's not that case, I apologize, and next time may be you should quote the article and provide your own comment instead of just leaving a link so I can understand your intend.

And it may not be a good idea to tell people to "relax", I know this is not your intention, but on an internet post it sounded like you implying I am angry or cannot control my emotion.

Every agency has an agenda, hence the shared root. It's not nefarious.

Choosing sources to support a claim is inherently cherry picking. It's not nefarious. This isn't a compendium, it's a forum.

Are diversity, social mobility, and income proportionality compelling state interests? If so, you can't be color blind. On a base human level we are more comfortable with people that are "like us." The nature of groups in power is that they work to maintain power. They can lobby congress. They can pay consultants to manipulate people with dog whistles. They can prepare better for standardized testing. The people in their social circle also have power, so they can exploit those contacts. So you end up with stratification based on race, and our melting pot is killed. Something needs to be done to counteract these forces. Affirmative action is an imperfect means to this end.

For an illustrative example, please see Israel.

Social mobility is never color blind, it is as racist as it used to be. Asian American is still being oppressed as a minority, while our situation is not as bad as black people, we do not need another level of oppression.

Your power argument does not applied to Asian American, in no way Asian American have more control of USA government, rather it is the lobbying group, congress, fortune 500 CEO, media etcetc. Asian American is the minority of the minority.

Asian is not smarter, more hardworking, or have more connection. The reason Asian American have better mobility is because they cherry pick the fuck out of us in immigration office. The unsuitable are denied entry, if we misbehaved our green card get revoked, some of us are forced to find a job because we need to company to sponsor us just to stay in the country. I doubt we will ever be in equal footing as White American, so stop treating us like them.

And yes, AA is unfair. So is progressive taxation. But these unfair policies are necessary because of the natural drift toward consolidation of wealth/power, declining social mobility, and stratification based on many factors including race.

tl;dr: Don't parrot conservatives from bizarro world. Privilege is real. AA is unfair, but necessary.

I am sorry, progressive taxation is based on your individual income, not your race. Using your tax example, this is like adding 5% flat tax to all Asian American, regardless if you are a millionaire or on food-stamp.

 

[Africanus]

How far have we come that Duke is a consolation prize...

Every time I hear one of "those" stories, of some Asian American or white person complaining that they were surely more qualified than all their peers and yet had to settle with *insert college of slightly lower rankng here*, it makes me wonder how they reflected their oh so superior being in their essays and interview. You know, a part of the holistic method colleges use to accept students.

Duke is ranked 8th in the nation, and yet it's somehow degrading?

Asian Americans don't apply to college on hard-mode or any poppy cock like that. Somehow, Harvard is still 25% Asian American, Emory is still 18.7% Asian American, Northwestern is still 21% Asian American, and Stanford is still 20% Asian American despite Asian Americans being only 5% of the population.

I didn't get into Harvard despite my 3.9 and 34 ACT. I'm not blaming some 3.8 GPA and 32 ACT student from orange county for me not getting in. They probably had some talent over me.

 

[Goofalo]

There was a time in history when Asian-Americans stood with Malcolm X and the Black Panther Party.

But now, there's a bunch of yellow Carlton Banks chuckleheads running around.

 

[HisImperialMajesty]

I'm sympathetic to the statistical argument that there must be hidden quotas, or that the current system acts as a de facto quota. However, what you're arguing for is a quota that adjusts itself based on the demographics of the college-age population. That's no better.

tl;dr: Don't parrot conservatives from bizarro world. Privilege is real. AA is unfair, but necessary.

I don't need to be lectured on my use of sources or about privilege, thanks. I quoted the article mostly for the good statistics it has. Look, I absolutely agree that AA needs to exist, but I also want to draw attention to the fact that AA seems to be utilized by elite schools to limit the number of Asians they admit. That's not fair to Asians, even though it benefits other minorities. I'm not advocating for any kind of quota; I just want to point out that any system where Asians have to score 140 more points on the SAT than fucking white people for the same chances of admission is a system that is stacked against Asians.

Asians are not a privileged group. If anyone wants to argue that they are, well, I'll be happy to take down your arguments.

How far have we come that Duke is a consolation prize...

Every time I hear one of "those" stories, of some Asian American or white person complaining that they were surely more qualified than all their peers and yet had to settle with *insert college of slightly lower rankng here*, it makes me wonder how they reflected their oh so superior being in their essays and interview. You know, a part of the holistic method colleges use to accept students.

Duke is ranked 8th in the nation, and yet it's somehow degrading?

Do you think Asians are just all so bad at interviews and 'holistically' lacking that we have to score 140 points higher than white people? Man, I wish my skin was white so I could be a holistically better person.

Discrimination is discrimination. While Duke vs Harvard might seem like a trivial difference to the lay person, when you're talking about the best and brightest students in the country, there is a big difference in the opportunities these different schools offer. All minorities know how much is sucks to have to work harder to receive less in return. Asians are simply experiencing that at a higher socioeconomic level, mostly due to selective patterns of immigration than put us there.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

If a student struggles to get opportunities at a school like Duke, UT Austin, UNC, Northwestern, etc., then it shows quite clearly why they didn't get into an Ivy/Ivy equivalent.

"Layperson" lol

 

[HisImperialMajesty]

If a student struggles to get opportunities at a school like Duke, UT Austin, UNC, Northwestern, etc., then it shows quite clearly why they didn't get into an Ivy/Ivy equivalent.

"Layperson" lol

If you honestly think the opportunities at UT Austin are the same as the opportunities you get from going to Harvard, then I guess you're a 'layperson'. ; )

 

[JKRMA]

I ain't never taught how to calculate 20*0 as a child due to lack of school funding in my area and my fucked up neighbourhood
My competition was taught how to calculate M=MC2 while your hand was held by a doctorate while growing up with 2 supportive parents, overfunded school with a football stadium and a neighbourhood I can walk in without the fear of getting shot by cops
My competition gets 86% in SATs
I got 84% in SATs
Which one is more impressive?

Sorry as I am a Canadian and not 100% sure how AA works, however as I understand it in this case the person who got 84% would be more likely to get into college/university compared to the individual who got 86%, correct?

This is what the DoJ is suing colleges for?

 

[GoldenEye 007]

If you honestly think the opportunities at UT Austin are the same as the opportunities you get from going to Harvard, then I guess you're a 'layperson'. ; )

Nowhere did I say they were the same. I said if someone struggles to get opportunities at a school like that, then the limiting factor is them as a student. Which in part shows why Harvard said no.

I ain't never taught how to calculate 20*0 as a child due to lack of school funding in my area and my fucked up neighbourhood
My competition was taught how to calculate M=MC2 while your hand was held by a doctorate while growing up with 2 supportive parents, overfunded school with a football stadium and a neighbourhood I can walk in without the fear of getting shot by cops
My competition gets 86% in SATs
I got 84% in SATs
Which one is more impressive?

Sorry as I am a Canadian and not 100% sure how AA works, however as I understand it in this case the person who got 84% would be more likely to get into college/university compared to the individual who got 86%, correct?

This is what the DoJ is suing colleges for?

Yes, basically.

And you're spot on what modern AA mostly is used for.

 

[Journeywalker]

Social mobility is never color blind, it is as racist as it used to be. Asian American is still being oppressed as a minority, while our situation is not as bad as black people, we do not need another level of oppression.

Your power argument does not applied to Asian American, in no way Asian American have more control of USA government, rather it is the lobbying group, congress, fortune 500 CEO, media etcetc. Asian American is the minority of the minority.

Asian is not smarter, more hardworking, or have more connection. The reason Asian American have better mobility is because they cherry pick the fuck out of us in immigration office. The unsuitable are denied entry, if we misbehaved our green card get revoked, some of us are forced to find a job because we need to company to sponsor us just to stay in the country. I doubt we will ever be in equal footing as White American, so stop treating us like them.

Asians are not the first model minority. Jews faced similar "unfair" treatment. And yet here we are, in a world where Jews have been successful enough for many people to believe in a worldwide Jewish conspiracy. It took about 50 years for Jews to get here. Considering the correlation between elite education and income, Asian Americans will acheive that level of disproportionate success faster. And then the right can have delusions of a joint Judeo-Asian conspiracy.

But along the way, the right wants to use you to shit on brown people.

The issue with admission to elite universities is that it is a zero-sum game. Any shift results in winners and losers. A color-blind process disproportionately hurts non-Eastern-Asian minorities. Yoi're getting fairness and the least-privileged minorities get further shut out from these schools. You're also going to piss off white people, but that's more of a political problem.

Is there a solution? Maybe, but it's a hard lift. You're going to have to convince a small contingent of white voters to vote against their self-interest, to the benefit of Asian Americans and Jews. The "Asian Tax" will predominantly shift to white people. This political task will become easier over time as whites become a plurality instead of a majority,

But if you kill AA now, we'll never get to that point. You'll be cutting off air to the people that are already suffocating.

But you'll have your fairness. Yay?

 

[Goofalo]

And then the right can have delusions of a joint Judeo-Asian conspiracy.

They do. They call it Facebook.

 

[HisImperialMajesty]

Is there a solution? Maybe, but it's a hard lift. You're going to have to convince a small contingent of white voters to vote against their self-interest, to the benefit of Asian Americans and Jews. The "Asian Tax" will predominantly shift to white people. This political task will become easier over time as whites become a plurality instead of a majority,

But if you kill AA now, we'll never get to that point. You'll be cutting off air to the people that are already suffocating.

But you'll have your fairness. Yay?

This is why I absolutely don't support dismantling AA. However, I will continue to speak up and point out the ways the current status quo is unfair to Asian Americans and advocate finding ways to change that.

 

[Journeywalker]

I think we pretty much agree upon AA as a necessity that needs improvement. I'm just frightened that if this case goes to the supreme court, AA is ruled unconstitutional, and then the Democratic party has a civil war.

I don't need to be lectured on my use of sources or about privilege, thanks. I quoted the article mostly for the good statistics it has.

Asians are not a privileged group. If anyone wants to argue that they are, well, I'll be happy to take down your arguments.

You deserved some shit for making me click on The American Conservative. I had to use 3 disinfectant wipes on my phone. Couldn't you have quoted the Economist?

But the fact that you don't want to acknowledge that Asians have some basic level of privilege is baffling. Asians are the most successful minority group per the Economist, even moreso if you isolate East Asians.

Remember, privilege is the convenience of NOT having to think about things. Did you have to worry about getting kicked out by your parents if you told them about who YOU are? No? That's privilege. Can your parents afford to get you tutors and test prep? That's privilege. If you get caught with drugs and they send you to a hospital instead of prison, that's privilege. If you think Duke is a consolation prize, you've got a shit ton of privilege.

P.S. I've enjoyed this discussion.

There was a time in history when Asian-Americans stood with Malcolm X and the Black Panther Party.

But now, there's a bunch of yellow Carlton Banks chuckleheads running around.

It's not as bad as it seems, only a quarter of Asians oppose AA.