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[tommib]

Exactly. You don't see blm or ukraine flags in Dark Souls or Elden Ring. Nothing like that to pull you out.

This is beyond absurd, man. Are we comparing a medieval fantasy context to the current fucking city of New York, a multicultural liberal city with 20 million people from everywhere in the world?

 

[tinear]

It's an account made 3 years ago with only 8 messages...

Safe to assume it's an undercover account for a purple person or an alt of someone else who likes to troll

If you bothered to look through my posts you’d see that I got banned from Reset for disagreeing with some of the BLM stuff. So don’t go accusing me of being some undercover Reset weirdo because I don’t agree that gay characters are killing gaming.

 

[Gerdav]

The whole thing is Marxism, there is no point burying your heads in the sand on this fact, this is a interview recorded in 1984 by a KGB defector Yuri Bezmenov and is a video everybody needs to watch and share, it’s bone chilling because he is describing what is happening in the modern day western world in perfect detail.

 

[LazyParrot]

Wokeness holds the seeds of our destruction. No civilzation that sees its past as a sin has a future.

But what if a civilization does something that's like... actually bad? People have already brought up Germany and the holocaust, but you could easily extend this to something more subjective.

Take your own views, for example. As far as I can tell, you're convinced that Western civilization is currently in the process of destroying itself with wokeness. Currently, as in right now, i.e. the present. That's gotta be a sin in your eyes, right? If working to destroy civilization isn't a sin, then what is?

But what's going to happen once the present inevitably becomes the past? Are you going to change your mind about wokeness in order to avoid viewing the past as a sin?

 

[FunkMiller]

FromSoft, CDPR, Larian, Nintendo. That’s mainly what I go with.

The one thing this thread seems to be doing more than anything is highlighting how narrow a lot of gamers horizons are when it comes to the games they choose to play.

Here's a tip: if a game has politics or ideology you don't like chaps - don't buy it.

There are many games out there that don't have any of that in.

 

[FunkMiller]

This is beyond absurd, man. Are we comparing a medieval fantasy context to the current fucking city of New York, a multicultural liberal city with 20 million people from everywhere in the world?

Complaining about flags in Spider-man 2 comes from exactly the same place as complaining about a chick with a dick poster in Cyberpunk 2077.

I'm so sick of the whining from both camps.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

I'm going to the only place that hasn't been corrupted by American wokeism...

 

[tommib]

If you bothered to look through my posts you’d see that I got banned from Reset for disagreeing with some of the BLM stuff. So don’t go accusing me of being some undercover Reset weirdo because I don’t agree that gay characters are killing gaming.

See, this is fucked up. You got banned at Era for thinking that BLM can be an extreme organisation and the moment you say, hey, it's ok to have gay characters in New York of all places, you're a ResetEra infiltrator propagating the woke agenda.

I understand what OP is talking about with the authorial aspect of writing being undermined by external parties but that's the nature of these mega-budget productions that have massive global appeal intentions. They play it as safe as possible.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Yes, gaming is fucked. But that won't change until the whole culture/society around it changes, too. Waste less time in front of a screen and actually get up and do something for your country.

 

[BbMajor7th]

Well, politics in games is nothing new. Go back to the early 2000s and the majority of games featured a naked avatar for US military might defending his country (very often characterized as the entire Earth) against 'alien' invaders of one kind or another. It was much the same in movies (and still is, quite often).

It might not sit well with some to hear it, but Halo and Call of Duty are much more overt forms of political propaganda - I mean, just try to think of a game from that period where Western political establishments were painted as 'the bad guys'; where military force wasn't taken as the only obvious solution to any problem; where typical western values weren't those that needed 'defending'. The closest you get is cyberpunk corporate dystopias, but no-one ever regards them as serious political commentary (it's normally massive corporations selling them to us, ffs).

So yeah, nothing new there. What's changed in the last ten years is the hyper-fixation on social politics ('woke', I think the kids call it). Personally, I think it's a red herring: good old divide and conquer. I think the idea is to stop a whole vast swathe of people from talking about material things they absolutely agree on (like decent jobs, affordable housing, healthcare provisions, well-maintained local infrastructure, clean waterways, etc) and have them focus on things they will never agree on (like sex, gender, race, etc.). And for the middle classes who are pushing all this stuff into our media, it's a nice moral fig leaf. They are the beneficiaries of a system that doesn't benefit most people, so to assuage that guilt, they've shifted the focus to areas where they can feel like moral superiors (an ironically colonialist view that gaming and movies are backward and savage cultures that need civilising by better-educated people - and like all good colonialists they've wrecked the joint by presuming to know better than the locals).

But on the grander scale, woke is all smoke and mirrors - a dead cat, a distraction: most people on either side of the argument are facing the same escalating cost of living, stagnating wages, impenetrable housing markets and the complete erosion of a way of life that a century of their labour paid for, but instead of holding those in charge to account, we're going to war over dumb shit we'll never agree on.

What a time to be alive.

 

[Neo_GAF]

haha, i havent read this level of brain fart in a long time. bro, time to get some fresh air and leave your basement for longer than 5min.
you dont read the bible only to say: holy shit, this is about religion and something is trying to brainwash me.
its there to do exactly those things.

those are stories and if you are interested, get carried away.
dont take them too serious.
those are games and i find it good that vidya devs are actively seeking out for help, since western writers seem to be dumb to not write inclusive. mostly white cis men being the heroes, and women or POC being mostly side characters with mostly no lore at all.

another thing which absolutely boggles my mind is people playing COD or expecting photorealistic graphics also expecting "nO pOliTiCs" in their games...? can someone explain this to me?
if i play mario, i dont expect politics, even if (such as sunshine) i see it as goofing around.

how old are you not to have spotted "political views" in games until now?
mgs already had that shit in 1998.

it is sad to see right wingers hop on board to spot this. and even kids (my nephew is 12 and tells me that fortnite has radical left ideas in it. i dont discuss with a 12 year old about politics) try to blabber something about politics from their peers.
wtf man...
try to have fun and engulf yourself in the games, reflect on those ideas...?

 

[Windom Earle]

Good thread. I am mostly sticking to some Japanese games (like Resident Evil) and Nintendo from now on, Alan Wake 2 was the last straw for me. Story driven western games are unbearable these days, absolutely disgusting stuff. Playing Mario Wonder can heal a lot though.

 

[Lethal01]

Who cares, Voldemort-nosed yellow woman acted like a bitch so she goes buuuurn

I know nothing about her, have only seen screenshtos, mind just letting me know what she did, I'm curious.

 

[gaming_again]

But what if a civilization does something that's like... actually bad? People have already brought up Germany and the holocaust, but you could easily extend this to something more subjective.

Take your own views, for example. As far as I can tell, you're convinced that Western civilization is currently in the process of destroying itself with wokeness. Currently, as in right now, i.e. the present. That's gotta be a sin in your eyes, right? If working to destroy civilization isn't a sin, then what is?

But what's going to happen once the present inevitably becomes the past? Are you going to change your mind about wokeness in order to avoid viewing the past as a sin?

I don't think the west is tearing itself apart currently, but that it will if the brakes aren't put on wokeness.

You misunderstand my views on the past. It is full of sin. I just don't see that sin as more potent than our successes, or as the main driver of the lifestyles we enjoy today. And I don't think many historical actions can be placed into either category easily. Or that it is our responsibility, or right, to bend history to suit today's morals.

If we snap out of wokeness and regain our seriousness as a culture, I want every moment of wokeness to stay in the historical record.

 

[JohnnyTropics]

(Warning: PLEASE BEHAVE! this is not a homophobic or racist thread. It's not about that but effects of forced politics on our games)

Welp, there's your answer--in the first sentence you wrote.
If every conversation you start begins with bolded, all caps proclomations about what words can be said, and mandate a baseline acceptance that certain words have the power to alter emotional states to such a degree that you need anonymous conversation partners to alter speech patterns to protect you, then you deserve all the fucking trash that this society specializes in producing.
You are the boots on the ground for these people.

 

[StueyDuck]

If you bothered to look through my posts you’d see that I got banned from Reset for disagreeing with some of the BLM stuff. So don’t go accusing me of being some undercover Reset weirdo because I don’t agree that gay characters are killing gaming.

I have yet to see anyone say gay characters are killing gaming.

I've seen people point out forced diversity instead of actual good characters, which is a fair assessment. And that's only part of the problem, go watch the millennial writing video I posted and you'll see it's more than just the diversity angle, it's a bunch of English first years from San Francisco all writing about one thing thinking it makes them super diverse and interesting.

 

[StueyDuck]

The one thing this thread seems to be doing more than anything is highlighting how narrow a lot of gamers horizons are when it comes to the games they choose to play.

Here's a tip: if a game has politics or ideology you don't like chaps - don't buy it.

There are many games out there that don't have any of that in.

That is fair but nowhere in Spiderman 2s marketing or reviews did it say it's the worst written most panderstone tripe of 2023.

So how do you know not to buy it?

(I know now that insomniac has been infiltrated and am not buying wolverine till well after reviews, but the point is if you don't know these things how do you preemptively ignore it)

 

[Lethal01]

For my taste in find realism and stimulation very boring, I play games for out of the world experience, this is mostly why I always prefer fanatical setting over realistic one any day.

I'm someone who enjoyed AW2 but I HATE how boooooring the enemy design are in that game and people argue its more realistic that way but Alan is in Dark Place which they could have easily gone same route as Silent Hill and Evil Within and give us interesting enemies like this...

but instead in AW2 this only type of enemies we fight with....

Totally agree with this, I'm totally fine with games talking about real world politics and current issues, honestly they always have, I think peeps just don't like the current issues they tackle. Even 13 Sentinels had a focus on gay relationships.

I just want no amount of sexy or crazy to be off the table, I'm all up for more diversity in skin tones and nationalities in games, just creates more opportunity for interesting character design, seeing other races in the 13 sentinels style would be neat. But instead of telling devs how cool they think it would be we got people telling japanese devs their assholes for not doing it.

 

[DevilMayFlyForAWhiteGuy]

I’ve just been mostly avoiding western games in general for a while. But all the western series I liked (BioWare games, Dead Space, etc.) have been ruined/gotten worse sometime between the end of the 360 era to mid PS4 era anyways, like even before all the political messaging started becoming the norm.
Like seriously Arkham Knight to Suicide squad is a huge downgrade of a once great studio and a lot of western devs have just chased that GAAS model to their own ruin.

The most fun I had this year was Metroid Prime Remastered and RE4make; so basically redos of the two best GC games. You know why? Because they’re fun games.

As far as I’m concerned the industry has really stagnated, and wokeness is just a cherry on top of a shit sundae. Probably not going to be buying any games day one for a while after this year.

 

[Lethal01]

No civilzation that sees its past as a sin has a future.

If we didn't see some of the past as a sin we'd still be considering a whole lot of people who aren't white inhuman so I wouldn't go that far.

 

[tommib]

I can only speak for myself but it's been Selene Vassos of Returnal for me. That game put a middle-aged woman front and center and nobody made a peep because she's an incredibly fleshed-out, interesting character that isn't simply an avatar for corny political grandstanding.

As a minority myself, I want those types of characters, not fucking avatars for fake-ass political rants done simply to appease.

I didn’t even read your post and could only think of Selene. Yes, that game pushes all the right gameplay buttons for me, but I randomly think of that character and how she’s trapped forever in her remorse hell, bullet-fighting as a badass middle-age mother with no escape.

It’s a well-fleshed out character with who you sympathise because of outstanding voice-acting, writing and a personal hell that she (apparently) designed and fell into.

 

[FireFly]

Welp, there's your answer--in the first sentence you wrote.
If every conversation you start begins with bolded, all caps proclomations about what words can be said, and mandate a baseline acceptance that certain words have the power to alter emotional states to such a degree that you need anonymous conversation partners to alter speech patterns to protect you, then you deserve all the fucking trash that this society specializes in producing.
You are the boots on the ground for these people.

I took "please behave!" to be instructing people to stick to the specific topic the thread is about and to conduct themselves civilly.

(Words do have the power to alter emotional states in ways that can be productive or unproductive).

 

[Hudo]

Is that...Stuttering Craig?

 

[Lethal01]

Selene Vassos of Returnal for me. That game put a middle-aged woman front and center and nobody made a peep because

That's just totally untrue, you had TONS of people complaing about the woke agenda when they saw her face, the game just isn't Horizon level so you got less of it but she was absolutely stuck in screenshtos together with others to show the "problem with western design"

 

[Lokaum D+]

yes, thats why eastern games are on top right now.

 

[FunkMiller]

That is fair but nowhere in Spiderman 2s marketing or reviews did it say it's the worst written most panderstone tripe of 2023.

So how do you know not to buy it?

(I know now that insomniac has been infiltrated and am not buying wolverine till well after reviews, but the point is if you don't know these things how do you preemptively ignore it)

Well, the alternative is that you just ignore stuff like that, the same way the Era crowd should just ignore posters with chicks with dicks on it. Or just sell the game on eBay and play something else. Or (and this is the best option) don't fall for FOMO, and just wait to purchase a game for a few weeks, until you know more about it.

 

[Zathalus]

Personally I find the accusation that Alan Wake 2 is woke quite bizarre. Saga says one thing towards the end of the game that might get some people's panties in a twist, but it's fully explainable by the events leading up to it.

But let's be real, change Saga to a white male and the amount of complaints would have been far less. I doubt this thread would even have existed.

Not to say that some games are fucking cringe, some of Spider-Man 2 just makes my eyes roll.

 

[rofif]

This is beyond absurd, man. Are we comparing a medieval fantasy context to the current fucking city of New York, a multicultural liberal city with 20 million people from everywhere in the world?

It’s not a current modern world city. It’s spider Man City.

 

[rofif]

Welp, there's your answer--in the first sentence you wrote.
If every conversation you start begins with bolded, all caps proclomations about what words can be said, and mandate a baseline acceptance that certain words have the power to alter emotional states to such a degree that you need anonymous conversation partners to alter speech patterns to protect you, then you deserve all the fucking trash that this society specializes in producing.
You are the boots on the ground for these people.

You are right. I would be afraid of consequences otherwise if I didn’t give the warning.
But I do feel inclined because these weirdos are everywhere

 

[IAmRei]

90% of the games I play are Japanese games so to me "escapism" hasn't died yet.......THANK GOD for Japanese games.

It wasn't for them I would have quit gaming long time ago.

Same here, mostly i only play japanese games, serves me right for my escapism.

 

[StueyDuck]

Well, the alternative is that you just ignore stuff like that, the same way the Era crowd should just ignore posters with chicks with dicks on it. Or just sell the game on eBay and play something else. Or (and this is the best option) don't fall for FOMO, and just wait to purchase a game for a few weeks, until you know more about it.

but see with threads like these and people voicing their opinions, that is how you learn to ignore these pander games.

someone has to play it first to tell others. It's easy to just say ignore it, but they'll just keep doing it otherwise, they'll keep paying the baby fiddlers and it'll just grow and get bigger and bigger.

it's very easy to pretend there's a simple solution to all this but there really isn't, the fact is we need better games media/journalism, we need games to be less secretive and we need these companies to figure out who their audiences are, it's not all just "woke is bad" , Spiderman 2 is genuinely one of the worst written games this year, yet bam! reviewed in the 90s and is sitting there on a pedestal in the GOTY nominations for all to see..

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Wokeness holds the seeds of our destruction. No civilzation that sees its past as a sin has a future.

Yeah dude, fuck Lincoln for the Emancipation Proclamation, Truman for desegregating the military, LBJ for the Civil Rights Act, and Reagan for the Civil Liberties Act. Those assholes seeing our past as having sins has ruined this great nation!

/s in case it's not fucking obvious.

 

[FunkMiller]

but see with threads like these and people voicing their opinions, that is how you learn to ignore these pander games.

someone has to play it first to tell others. It's easy to just say ignore it, but they'll just keep doing it otherwise,

They won't keep doing it if people stop buying it.

I'm willing to bet a majority of people whining about Spider-man 2 will also be buying Wolverine on the day it comes out.

ALL of the worst aspects of the games industry are allowed to continue because gamers are idiots who still pre-order, fall for hype and can't resist FOMO.

 

[Guilty_AI]

I know nothing about her, have only seen screenshtos, mind just letting me know what she did, I'm curious.

Tried to order me around. Found her in a cage being confronted by some tieflings and first thing she does is give me orders.

Off to the reaper she goes.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Art is also a reflection of the times. As a business, that which is repeatedly rejected by the audience will either stop being made or turn niche.

We are political creatures, and art is political. People who say “keep political views out of my games/movies/art” are looking for stories with no humans in it.

 

[Zathalus]

Tried to order me around. Found her in a cage being confronted by some tieflings and first thing she does is give me orders.

Off to the reaper she goes.

Ah, so roleplaying an evil character then. Fair enough.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Ah, so roleplaying an evil character then. Fair enough.

I'm not evil, Joseh is the fairest of them all, hero of the people. Githyanki are trash anyway, all they deserve is the pointy end of a sword on their necks

 

[Hypereides]

Art is also a reflection of the times. As a business, that which is repeatedly rejected by the audience will either stop being made or turn niche.

We are political creatures, and art is political. People who say “keep political views out of my games/movies/art” are looking for stories with no humans in it.

So wait, are you insinuating that you think about politics 24/7 because otherwise it wouldn't make you human or something? Your daily trail of thought must be super stressful.

Also, I strongly disagree. Not all art is political and on that account art should not be required to apply or debate some political issue. If you really are that inclined, go join a local political organization to inspire and advocate for good causes there.

 

[StueyDuck]

They won't keep doing it if people stop buying it.

I'm willing to bet a majority of people whining about Spider-man 2 will also be buying Wolverine on the day it comes out.

ALL of the worst aspects of the games industry are allowed to continue because gamers are idiots who still pre-order, fall for hype and can't resist FOMO.

but again, how do you know if no one then buys it and tells other people about these things?

We need a better solution than never play a video game ever again.

yes preorders are dumb, but again with Spiderman 2 the first game didn't have any of the nonsense and had a great story (relatively speaking) so why should i have known or expected that they were going to drop the ball so hard with the sequel.

going by Insomniacs previous works, which i was a fan of it all, Spyro Ratchet SO SM, they gave me no reason to think that we were going to get anything but more of that quality.

 

[FunkMiller]

yes preorders are dumb, but again with Spiderman 2 the first game didn't have any of the nonsense and had a great story (relatively speaking) so why should i have known or expected that they were going to drop the ball so hard with the sequel.

going by Insomniacs previous works, which i was a fan of it all, Spyro Ratchet SO SM, they gave me no reason to think that we were going to get anything but more of that quality.

You literally had Spider-man Miles Morales right there. By the same company, the same team, featuring the same characters. And Spider-man 2 reviews talked about the messaging in the game. Your fault if you chose to ignore these things and buy the game anyway, or not wait a while to see what the game had in it.

But the truth is, you were always going to buy the game anyway, regardless of what you saw or read previously, because Insomniac make generally very high quality games.

 

[Thirty7ven]

So, are you insinuating that you think about politics 24/7 because otherwise it wouldn't make you human or something? Your daily trail of thought must be super stressful.

Also, I strongly disagree. Not all art is political and on that account art should not be required to apply or debate some political issue. If you really are that inclined, join a local political organization to inspire and advocate for good causes there.

No I didn’t mean that I think about which political party is doing what where why in my daily life.

Politics affect everything you know. Even fantasy stories like game of thrones or lord of the rings are deeply political. Even when the writer doesn’t want to be political, his work is still affected by it, his world view.

You can’t escape it. You are just trying to narrow it down to where it means “I don’t want this type of political world view in the games I want to play” but that’s not how it works. I’m sorry.

The only this works like you want is if you are very careful about about what you read, watch, play. Curate. But will still be only deciding what kind of politics you want to see and hear.

 

[StueyDuck]

You literally had Spider-man Miles Morales right there. By the same company, the same team, featuring the same characters. And Spider-man 2 reviews talked about the messaging in the game. Your fault if you chose to ignore these things and buy the game anyway, or not wait a while to see what the game had in it.

But the truth is, you were always going to buy the game anyway, regardless of what you saw or read previously, because Insomniac make generally very high quality games.

the story in Miles wasn't bad though, yeah it had some pandering but no worse than any other game.

anyone whose played all 3 of these games will know the difference and the vast decline in quality SM2 is to the rest of Insomniacs work.

if I had heard how genuinely bad the writing was i would've waited for a sale, there are many games i have done that for, and instead i would have put that money towards AW2

maybe the answer is gamepass (subscription models)? without gamepass i wouldn't of known how shit starfields writing is either.

 

[Fake]

Art is also a reflection of the times. As a business, that which is repeatedly rejected by the audience will either stop being made or turn niche.

We are political creatures, and art is political. People who say “keep political views out of my games/movies/art” are looking for stories with no humans in it.

You are out of your mind. You don't know a thing about politics. They always had two sides, but only one side here is paiting the picture.

And games have been out of politics a long time ago, so IDK from what are you coming. If you doing this to defend a game you like is better to you to just admit.

 

[Thirty7ven]

You are out of your mind. You don't know a thing about politics. They always had two sides, but only one side here is paiting the picture.

And games have been out of politics a long time ago, so IDK from what are you coming. If you doing this to defend a game is better to you to just admit.

Which game am I defending?

 

[FunkMiller]

the story in Miles wasn't bad though, yeah it had some pandering but no worse than any other game.

anyone whose played all 3 of these games will know the difference and the vast decline in quality SM2 is to the rest of Insomniacs work.

if I had heard how genuinely bad the writing was i would've waited for a sale, there are many games i have done that for, and instead i would have put that money towards AW2

maybe the answer is gamepass (subscription models)? without gamepass i wouldn't of known how shit starfields writing is either.

I still maintain the answer is to wait a while to buy a game. The whole gaming community needs to get out of the attitude that games need to be bought day one - which I'm betting is what you did?

All of your issues with the game were highlighted after its release.

And GamePass meant I only dropped £8 on Starfield before realising it was dull, formulaic trash. I'm not enjoying Spider-man 2 much (and have swapped to AW2) but that's not because of politics, but because it's also a dull game, with a formulaic story I've seen time and time again already. But I bought it day one, so that's on me... not the game. At least I bought physical so it can go on ebay!

 

[Fake]

Which game am I defending?

You say to me, instead of posting that politics is a form of art. Just because I'm 'left' thats not mean I'm blind. I can see when just one side of the political spectrum is been listenning.

Is a form of art the director of the Spider-Man 2 saying that MJ sections are good and don't give a fucked about what people think about?
Is a form of art removing the police from games?
Is a form of art putting the Ukranie flag inside games?


Fanboys can act as blind as they wish, but not only Spider-Man 2 is a full of politics, but also have a version without politics. Quite ironic.

 

[Hypereides]

No I didn’t mean that I think about which political party is doing what where why in my daily life.

Politics affect everything you know. Even fantasy stories like game of thrones or lord of the rings are deeply political. Even when the writer doesn’t want to be political, his work is still affected by it, his world view.

You can’t escape it. You are just trying to narrow it down to where it means “I don’t want this type of political world view in the games I want to play” but that’s not how it works. I’m sorry.

The only this works like you want is if you are very careful about about what you read, watch, play. Curate. But will still be only deciding what kind of politics you want to see and hear.

I'm fully aware of how real life politics encompasses and impacts my, your and our daily lives. I believe me, I get enough of a dose of it each day. Does that mean I want to be exposed to it in a medium meant for entertainment and recreation? Fuck no.

Again, you can flavor or color it however you want, but believing all video games or art "must" be drenched in politics and ideologies is false and a misrepresentation. It seems like a really shallow perception of range of art. Its almost like saying Salvador Dali's abstract, surreal paintings clearly were birthed in and connected to politics. Honestly, it just illustrates how you perceive artistry and believe everything must be entangled in politics to some degree.

Of course, if you're that kind of person that combs through and dissects every piece of some classic creative work deeply in order to deduce or find any minor detail(s) that bares some vague inclination to modern real life politics then I'm sure you'll find something to validate the argument that "all art is political".

 

[VenomousCoffee]

You're never going to get some "origin point" of non-political art. Plato said that art should support the state. Dostoevsky was a bootlicker. Huck Finn is a (pretty explicit) criticism of segregation. Etc, etc, etc. The list of political art is endless.

Now, having said that, I do find that mainstream left-of-center art tends to have more moralizing (lecturing) of a sort that really gets on my nerves. I'm definitely left-of-center, esp. on civil rights issues, but man, I do not need to be lectured about what I'm supposed to think. Let's take Spider-Man 2 for example. Pride flags in NYC don't bother me at all; neither does having a deaf girlfriend. That's just authentic to the real world--disabled people, LGBT people, non-white people, they all exist, and if you have a problem with their existing, get over yourself. What grates on me is the scene where Peter tells MJ she's "so much stronger" than he is because she holds down a regular job (the same as most people who can afford the $2000-3000 or whatever it costs to play that game on a PS5 on a 4K TV). So, Peter is mentally weaker than all middle class women? It's just the creators' patting themselves on the back for having the correct politics. Or the scene where you work with the graffiti artist to make her graffiti better. Somehow I doubt that Bryan Intihar would like if it I came to his house and spray painted my "art" on the side and then told him he had to like it because I'm expressing myself. Or the the fact that game's only Jewish character is an evil music producer looking to steal from Black musicians. But, it's not exactly a secret that antisemitism is alive and well on the left right now.

The world is diverse--it just is. Burying your head in the sand won't change that. But that doesn't excuse this 'holier than thou' streak in the writing in contemporary games.

 

[Hypereides]

You're never going to get some "origin point" of non-political art. Plato said that art should support the state. Dostoevsky was a bootlicker. Huck Finn is a (pretty explicit) criticism of segregation. Etc, etc, etc. The list of political art is endless.

(...)

I bet, but does that make Plato an authority to dictate how people/artists should make art? - Or any of the other figures? - Should everyone follow their path? Absolutely not. You might choose to perceive Plato's philosophy as the de facto right approach to art, but its equally fair for artists to diverge.

 

[StueyDuck]

I still maintain the answer is to wait a while to buy a game. The whole gaming community needs to get out of the attitude that games need to be bought day one - which I'm betting is what you did?

All of your issues with the game were highlighted after its release.

And GamePass meant I only dropped £8 on Starfield before realising it was dull, formulaic trash. I'm not enjoying Spider-man 2 much (and have swapped to AW2) but that's not because of politics, but because it's also a dull game, with a formulaic story I've seen time and time again already. But I bought it day one, so that's on me... not the game. At least I bought physical so it can go on ebay!

But again without us buying the game. You wouldn't know these issues exist. Games media laud and ignore bad writing and pandering in games. So unless someone is buying the game day one and telling us about it, the problem isn't solved.

It's very modern thing that people do where they blame everyone else except the guilty parties fault.

Gamers buying a gaming shouldn't be seen as the one in the wrong here. It's just weird gaslighting when people say it gamers fault or just ignore it and stop caring etc.

A small group of people were able to be so vocal that they've essentially changed modern writing into something terrible, imagine what the majority of people can do now with their voice.