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[Jon Neu]

I think she does feel remorse, it just isn't told outright.

The reason why she returns to help the scar kids is because of the guilt she feels from killing Joel, who also helped her escape death in a similar way.

She's driven mad by the need for revenge (firstly for her dad, and secondly for Owen), same way as Ellie.

If she were a true psychopath, she would've killed Ellie and Tommy the first time. And then would've killed Ellie, Dina and Tommy in the theatre.

You talk like this characters make any sense. Of course Abby is a psychopath and in the next scene she is a good samaritan with a heart of gold. Why? Because the writters don’t care at all about having any shred of coherence, the only thing that matters are the twist, the edgy subverting of expectations and the exhibition of pornographic drama.

 

[Madflavor]

While the 0/10 review bombing looks bad, is it equally embarrassing seeing people give the story a 10/10, while using words like sublime, superlative, and profound to look smart?

 

[Raonak]

Right, and all those NPC's she slaughtered was for nothing right? Not to dig at you, but I think this is a key fundamental problem with the game and why this narrative doesn't work. You kill so many people in cold blood in this game. You are basically a mass murderer. But because you didn't kill the one girl, you suddenly keep your humanity?

This is the key fundamental problem between the narrative and the gameplay loop that this game has and why, in my opinion, it's a failure.

That's the point though. Killing all those NPCs were for nothing. All the killing was pointless. Both for Abby and Ellie, but in both their cases, It's never too late to change.

They both found their redemption through their own means.

 

[Raonak]

You talk like this characters make any sense. Of course Abby is a psychopath and in the next scene she is a good samaritan with a heart of gold. Why? Because the writters don’t care at all about having any shred of coherence, the only thing that matters are the twist, the edgy subverting of expectations and the exhibition of pornographic drama.

She's not a good person, but neither was Joel. They both do good things because they evolve as characters.

 

[Croatoan]

Cohh understands why people hate the game now... lol. His thoughts are mine exactly. This is a 5 out of 10 game.

I have never really seen Cohh be this negative on a game, he usually enjoys everything he plays unless it is a technical mess. "2 lost fingers out of 10" for the delivery of the story....lol.

 

[Jon Neu]

She's not a good person, but neither was Joel. They both do good things because they evolve as characters.

How did she evolved?

She tortured a man to death in front of his surrogate daughter. And she received no consequences for it. The surrogate daughter kills his friends who she already abandoned and supplanted with a little trans girl, so she couldn’t care less.

And not only that, but the daughter of the man she killed comes and rescues her and her friend, because revenge bad or something and here you have your expectations subverted.

She hasn’t repent at all, she is literally the same person.

 

[DanielMann861]

That's the point though. Killing all those NPCs were for nothing. All the killing was pointless. Both for Abby and Ellie, but in both their cases, It's never too late to change.

They both found their redemption through their own means.

What redemption? Abby doesn't become the saviour of those kids because of Joel. She does so because of Owen. What redemption is there? For Ellie, sure I might be able to see it at a stretch. But I failed to see any redemption with Abby. Hence my complete apathy for Abby. They didn't do anything to even convey she had guilt. She has her own personal reasons for doing it and they don't relate to Joel at all. And if they do then they didn't do a great job conveying it.

For Ellie, I can maybe see a bit of redemption even if I find it hard to believe. But for Abby? Didn't see it. She shot Tommy in the face, shot Jesse without remorse. Would have killed Dina if not for Saint Lev. Hell, she was ready to kill Dina even after finding out she was pregnant. At least Ellie had some guilt about killing the pregnant chick on the other side. Sorry, just didn't see any redemption ark there.

If there was one then it's not really well conveyed,

 

[Valonquar]

I was expecting Elle to find Abby to offer to come with her to see if there was any hope of the Fireflies finding another doctor capable of creating a cure, even if it meant she had to die. There's zero redemption for Elle at all. At least Abby decides to take care of Lev.

 

[scalman]

when you playing second time and in area where you need to find petrol , so first time i went from one side and cleaned all , now i thought ill go from other side , and one cool thing is when i reached place where in first play i found petrol , in this time there was no petrol there and Dina said we need to look in other place , well thats cool. so its like changing , you need to look for petrol in couple places first and just after you will find petrol in last place . thats pretty cool . i wonder is there like more those some kind of dynamic things that not happens in same place as before.

 

[scalman]

For Ellie, I can maybe see a bit of redemption even if I find it hard to believe. But for Abby? Didn't see it. She shot Tommy in the face, shot Jesse without remorse. Would have killed Dina if not for Saint Lev. Hell, she was ready to kill Dina even after finding out she was pregnant. At least Ellie had some guilt about killing the pregnant chick on the other side. Sorry, just didn't see any redemption ark there.

If there was one then it's not really well conveyed,

im sorry but ellie would kill anyone in her path and she did , no matter who that was, abby left alive ellie and tommy first time , and same second time tommy and ellie was left alive, and even last time in the end abby said i dont wanna fight you just go. Ellie in the other hand killed everyone in her path, so who ellie didint killed then , like showed mercy ? i dont remember anyone is alive after meeting ellie , so yes they very different persons in that way.
if ellie would meet those kids , she would just saved them in moment maybe but then she would go her own way for revenge.

 

[Jtibh]

Just want to say to all the ones who told me off here in the past that i was right and you guys were fools to believe the lies naughty dog told you.

I wish i could go back and send each a message and for them to try now to defend this pile of shit.

Every but every review that came out after the launch is very negative about the story.

Everything the leaks told you were the truth.

I told some of you how abby is who you play in the second half of the game. You guys were comming at me like idiots.
And now look.

I deleted the game once i got to that part and wont ever continue.
This games story is fan fiction its a joke and a big fuck you to fans of the first one.

When i was lied to in mgs2 i could work with what was presented to me.
Here its nearly impossible.

Its a shame how many got in trouble and got almost or fully banned from here only to warn everyone about this game.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Seriously dude, just give up. Your obssession in defending every aspect of the game in every thread possible is becoming not only embarassing but depressing at this point.

The people who should give up are the people who go personal when they no longer have a cogent argument.

 

[MisterBrimstone]

The saddest thing about the story is that the world they set with the 2 factions and their war and also the possible resurgence of the fireflies makes for some great stories but you get this shitty dual revenge plot with no actual twists and stale gameplay.

The game is a solid 6 just because of the incredible world design and graphics. Those two carry this whole fucking 20+ hours.

 

[OmegaSpear]

I just beat the game. I got to say, gameplay wise this game is a 10/10. Story wise a 9/10. Hardest moment was Rat King, most intense moment, when you fight/meet Scars in the park. Scariest is when you go down all the way down in that building crawling with infected. I got to say that Abby's story is way better then Ellie's. The issue with Ellie's story is that she shows almost no remorse killing 100's of men in the name of Joel even though she knows what Joel did to those Fireflies and at the end she doesn't kill Abby which doesn't make sense. She's shown to be ruthless the whole game and goes on the hunt for Abby the whole time slaughtering anyone in her path. She even leaves Dina and baby(don't remember his name) to go kill Abby and ends up losing 2 fingers and seems to change her mind close to killing Abby. But why though?

Now I want to know, why people hate the game. Was it the ending? The killing of Joel? Lesbian Ellie? Tell me guys, what is stopping people from enjoying this masterpiece of a game?

 

[Nikana]

The people who should give up are the people who go personal when they no longer have a cogent argument.

 

[xrnzaaas]

I just beat the game. I got to say, gameplay wise this game is a 10/10. Story wise a 9/10. Hardest moment was Rat King, most intense moment, when you fight/meet Scars in the park. Scariest is when you go down all the way down in that building crawling with infected. I got to say that Abby's story is way better then Ellie's. The issue with Ellie's story is that she shows almost no remorse killing 100's of men in the name of Joel even though she knows what Joel did to those Fireflies and at the end she doesn't kill Abby which doesn't make sense. She's shown to be ruthless the whole game and goes on the hunt for Abby the whole time slaughtering anyone in her path. She even leaves Dina and baby(don't remember his name) to go kill Abby and ends up losing 2 fingers and seems to change her mind close to killing Abby. But why though?

Now I want to know, why people hate the game. Was it the ending? The killing of Joel? Lesbian Ellie? Tell me guys, what is stopping people from enjoying this masterpiece of a game?

For me The Rat King encounter was very underwhelming from a gameplay standpoint. The chase scene is heavy on qte's and the bloater fight doesn't surprise you with any new moves. You just use your best guns and bombs and avoid the projectiles. At least the second part with the stalker is more engaging because you have to (perfectly) dodge more often.

I will agree that the first encounter with the Scars is very surprising and I enjoyed completing encounters with them. Once or twice they managed to sneak close to my character despite me using listen mode from time to time.

 

[Saber]

The people who should give up are the people who go personal when they no longer have a cogent argument.

Just read and re-read again. Those people posted a well though and formulated answer to counter you and instead you go low bait winning without anything to counter.
You're the one who is perhaps way too invested and personal since long ago when you keep the caps lock about Joel hundreds of pages ago in this very thread. You didn't changed since that time. Seriously dude, take a time off...this thing you're doing is not good for your health.

 

[LaughingStock]

I despise this game but still i want to play it. It's like a car crash. You don't want to look at the mangled bodies but you just can't help it. Kind of regret having canceled my pre-order.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Just read and re-read again. Those people posted a well though and formulated answer to counter you and instead you go low bait winning without anything to counter.
You're the one who is perhaps way too invested and personal since long ago when you keep the caps lock about Joel hundreds of pages ago in this very thread. You didn't changed since that time. Seriously dude, take a time off...this thing you're doing is not good for your health.

I'm referring to you this is strictly personal what you are doing none of it is arguing the argument. Trying to bring up something that happened a hundred pages and months ago reeks of desperation by the way.

 

[trikster40]

Just had to come in here and say Holy Crap after watching the Joel scene. Wow. Holy crap.

 

[V2Tommy]

I dunno. The game is amazing and better than anything Rockstar could ever do in a million years. It's a technical marvel and the narrative has balls. You haters need a hug from your shitty games.

 

[Saber]

I'm referring to you this is strictly personal what you are doing none of it is arguing the argument. Trying to bring up something that happened a hundred pages and months ago reeks of desperation by the way.

The only thing I will say is take a breath of fresh air. Peace, be well.

Just had to come in here and say Holy Crap after watching the Joel scene. Wow. Holy crap.

Don't worry, it won't get any worse than that.

 

[Dabaus]

I said from the beginning it is going to sell well but i do think there will be a backlash. For the sake of argument lets say TLOU's 1 final sales number is 20 million, discount sales and all, astounding result. I think the second ones sales will be alot lower. Id be shocked if it reached 10 million. Maybe im wrong, who knows.

 

[JMZ555]

Completed the game on survivor ( around 30 hours)

I actually really enjoyed it. I think Last of us part 1 is much easier to digest and has easier pacing.

I avoided all leaks and only watched 1st two trailers before going dark.

The game def went in directions i didn't think it would.

The story is a real downer and very dark.

Reactions Remind me of the Last Jedi back lash. (I hated Last jedi)

Anyway all the matters is your own opinion. Sad to hear some didn't like/hated it or didnt meet there expectations, especially if they was big fans of the first. I'm just happy to have loved the journey. Look forward to replaying it next on PS5 hopefully at 60fps

 

[Piku_Ringo]

 

[T_LVPL]

Finished the game, played on Hard to start with. Absolutely brilliant but mentally exhausting by the end. The only part I don’t like is, once again, a game where I don’t like the ending. I don’t think I’ve enjoyed an ending in a game for about 15 years. Why can’t they just do the thing I wanted and have Ellie kill Abby? all that hard work & incredible strife I expect to see the thing I expect to see not nothing happening and letting her walk off.

Liked after that though and Dina having left the house. Leaves the story there for a potential sequel, but I don’t think there will be at least not with Ellie in it. Think that’s the end of these characters and gutted because I wanted 1 final story with the proper characters like Ellie, Joel, Tommy, etc.

The narrative choices didn’t bother me. I don’t think the bits people complained about were even that prominent in the end.

Going to give my brain a rest then do Survivor+ as Hard was too easy. but the game is definitely much harder than Part 1, which was quite easy even on Grounded mode.

Overall I really hope there’s a Part 3 but think that’s the story wrapped up now. People said that after the first game, which was nonsense. But definitely this time around it’s over. Everyone is either dead or crippled. It would need an entire new story and set of characters, I just don’t know if they’ll be bothered sitting down and making it or if I can go through another 7 year wait for the story.

 

[insanexer]

Rev is the absolute GOAT. Too bad he left twitter because he couldn't really say all what he wanted to say. His videos are a treat.

 

[ZZZZ]

Taiwan meme: PTSD from TLOU pt.2
The game got universally hate and got bashed all around on Taiwan video game forum.

Spoiler: NSFW

I can't....

 

[Piku_Ringo]

Rev is the absolute GOAT. Too bad he left twitter because he couldn't really say all what he wanted to say. His videos are a treat.

Rev is good people, with some good insight at times. But considering Social media (twitter above all) is fucking cancer as we've seen time and again. I'm glad he walked away from it.

 

[Piku_Ringo]

 

[Saber]

I can't....

Bit of topic, but dude you save me. I aways wanted that gif, thank you.

 

[Swadedtx]

"Guys, there's zombie ants, so zombie humans like bloaters and clickers is not a stretch, that said real women having Abby's physique does not justify Abby's physique" - this is some wild logic

Abby's chest is clearly a man's chest when you watch the sex scene.

 

[Umbral]

Seraphites: It’s the apostate. It’s Lilly!

*gunfight ensues*

Lev: Did you hear what they called me?
Abby: Yeah.
Lev: Do you want to ask me about it?
Abby: Do you want me to ask you about it?
Lev: No.

The writing goes from great, to alright, to laughably bad throughout the game.

 

[Dynasty8]

Seraphites: It’s the apostate. It’s Lilly!

*gunfight ensues*

Lev: Did you hear what they called me?
Abby: Yeah.
Lev: Do you want to ask me about it?
Abby: Do you want me to ask you about it?
Lev: No.

The writing goes from great, to alright, to laughably bad throughout the game.

I rolled my eyes at that point.

We went from Joel and Ellie to that.

 

[Humdinger]

Good, thorough review.

 

[Heylon]

I dunno. The game is amazing and better than anything Rockstar could ever do in a million years. It's a technical marvel and the narrative has balls. You haters need a hug from your shitty games.

Nah, you just have bad tastes in games.

 

[SushiReese]

A Korean animator posted her video review the last of us pt 2 on her vlog,which basically covered the main criticisms/opinions I saw from Korean forum. (with English sub). She was a big fan for TLOU 1.



The game got bashed pretty hard on Korean forum, similar situation in Taiwan,Hongkong and mainland China. I am curious Japanese audience reaction to this one.

 

[Audiophile]

Unfortunately any coherent, well-reasoned criticism will be lumped in with and assumed to be bigotry. Meanwhile -- despite betraying the core fanbase -- the head honchos at ND will be patting themselves on the back with excellent sales off the back of the first game, shallow reviews from mainstream media and a whole bunch industry people towing the line because its progressive, some sincerely, some not.

While folks such as Cory Barlog can be a bit grating in their public persona, I think God Of War was beautifully done, full of reservation and subtlety in the story. But if he thinks this is great storytelling, that puts a massive dent in my anticipation for whatever he does next. As for Druckman and Gross, I frankly have no interest in whatever they do next, though I'd love to be proven wrong. TLOU is probably dead to me now, especially if they're involved in any future iterations; and frankly, if this is a sign of things to come for Naughty Dog, I'm out.

The biggest, most glaring issue to me is that the Joel and Ellie in this game are in no way the Joel and Ellie from the first game. It's not even a case of them evolving into different characters, as the very events that set in motion this whole cycle weren't even in character. Joel is a careless wimp here and Ellie is just one dimensional.

Regarding the whole "woke" thing, I don't like to assume one way or the other (one part I actually really liked was Ellie<>Dina, at least to begin with), but there's an enormous correlation growing across all art and entertainment forms where whenever the creators signal that they're prioritising representation and social justice in their material, quality takes a backseat and nosedives, time and again. While I think some are far too vitriolic, it's fair for people to start growing wary. Unfortunately, as alluded to above, these things are convenient things to roll out as a defense mechanism, so that you can straw-man and avoid answering fairer criticism, especially when you have swaths of people on twitter and reee to shut down discussion.

 

[MrS]

Can't actually believe we have people saying the game is a 5/6 out of 10. Salty bastards.

 

[rofif]

I have to admit... As much as I thought the first part was a bit boring, nonsense and badly paced with all the slowing down... The 2nd part is pace dmuch better and... As much as yesterday I was saying nothing can redeem Abby, I do have to say that her campaign is just better and her character is kinda awesome in some parts.
She is just Chris redfield lol and none of the trans leaks were true. She is just swole out of revenge. Even her part of the game resembles resident evil a bit more.
I mean... She punches zombies in the face with bare hands. Their (Abby group)whole story is kinda reminding me of starship troopers but more serious? Naive group of army friends etc.
Started her day 3 and it's interesting how my mind is changing from hating her and kinda disliking the game. I mean the writing in first part of the game is still overdone and Ellie is depicted as monster and the Abby monster as a good guy and it might not 100% work but it's achieving something and now I kind scared for both characters a bit. Just that Abby made more bad choices and Ellie found herself in bad situations...

 

[Roni]

Started her day 3 and it's interesting how my mind is changing from hating her and kinda disliking the game.

You're opening up to the game, that's beautiful, man!

 

[Gravemind]

Just watched that Abby sex scene and all I can say is... yikes. Was that ever an odd scene.

 

[LocoCocoPops]

Some of these comments are incredible. Who cares about any of this, are some people incapable of just putting things to the side and just experience a story? It doesn’t seem that way. None of this is important and people so so angry. It’s hilarious.

The only legitimate problem with this game is that is was just a tad too long.

 

[MiguelItUp]

Can't actually believe we have people saying the game is a 5/6 out of 10. Salty bastards.

I mean, I can. Personally I believe a 5/6/7 before I'd believe a 10 or a 0. TLOU was/is incredibly story driven. Some people really loved the gameplay, but a lot of the love (hell, majority of it) was because of the story, characters, writing, and direction. Joel and Ellie's relationship really was a treat. I feel like in a game where the gameplay is mediocre, if the story really grips you, then the entire experience immediately improves as a whole. It makes the game a masterpiece in the eyes of many.

With TLOU2, there ARE gameplay improvements and new mechanics from the previous game that people enjoy. But the same story, characters, writing, and direction isn't nearly as strong or memorable. Sure, there IS a story, but it's not NEARLY as impactful as the previous game, at least for the majority. If you were to ask me, I don't think the story is garbage whatsoever, but I'd agree that it is not NEARLY as effective as the previous game. Which is a shame because I feel as if things were a LITTLE bit different it would've made all the difference in the world for the majority.

In the end, if you enjoy it, you enjoy it. If you don't, you don't. No big deal. Here's to hoping Ghost of Tsushima is even better!

 

[Saber]

Some of these comments are incredible. Who cares about any of this, are some people incapable of just putting things to the side and just experience a story?

The main problem and cause of dislikes is the story/writting. Gonna guess you entered here blind in the hope of farming some positives with that take.

Can't say about the graphics though. The game has an impressive visuals.

 

[LocoCocoPops]

The main problem and cause of dislikes is the story/writting. Gonna guess you entered here blind in the hope of farming some positives with that take.

Can't say about the graphics though. The game has an impressive visuals.

Not expecting anything really. I do feel the game is too long. Just an observation of what other have been saying. All seems a little bit boohoo over nothing.

 

[Humdinger]

The main problem and cause of dislikes is the story/writing.

And given that the main reason people loved TLoU is its story, writing, and characters, that's a BIG problem. You take those away, and this is just another (well-produced) zombie survival game.

 

[tfur]

And given that the main reason people loved TLoU is its story, writing, and characters, that's a BIG problem. You take those away, and this is just another (well-produced) zombie survival game.

I was just thinking this.

TLOU1 = incredible writing, pacing, directing + incredible art and technology
TLOU2 = poor story and pacing + incredible art and technology

If Naughty Dog loses its art or technology talent, what do they really have left.

I never kept up with any leaks or any of the Naughty Dog crunch news at all, so I would not be spoiled. I would love to have a thread with a collective breakdown of the last years of the production of this game. I would especially like to see what the technology talent has to say about where the top management took TLOU.

 

[Saber]

Not expecting anything really. I do feel the game is too long. Just an observation of what other have been saying. All seems a little bit boohoo over nothing.

You mean a boohoo over the best aspect of LoU and what differ it from other zombie games? Sure thing, no big deal.

 

[ZZZZ]