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The PS5 3D Audio Design & Headset Gamers

FrankWza

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You absolutely get better position determining with surround sound than with headphones.
Yeah, when the sound being pumped into your headphones is a stereo source. If you have 5.1 or better going into your headphones you get virtual surround sound. Far better positional audio for competitive gaming.

edited to add you can get surround sound from headphones. I think that’s what your misunderstanding that I’m trying to say
 
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FrankWza

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Don’t believe the marketing hype....they love selling the accessories and always have

I agree. But the easiest way to get wireless surround audio for the ps5 is with these Sony’s. Unless they announce that the dual sense offered 3d audio for any headphones plugged in. I assume it will have that tech built in but I’m not sure I’ve seen anything official on this
 

MrFunSocks

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Virtual surround sound != actual surround sound. Actual surround sound will give you better positional audio than virtual surround sound does in a headset.
 

FrankWza

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Virtual surround sound != actual surround sound. Actual surround sound will give you better positional audio than virtual surround sound does in a headset.


it has nothing to do with physical over virtual. Virtual can simulate POSITIONAL audio better. If you’re in a house on a shooter like cod, you will be able to footsteps above and below and position much easier. You would have to have down firing speakers and possibly up firing as well to be able to have that type of accuracy. So yes,I guess you could say physical would be better but it would takesomething like a 11.2.4 setup or something crazy like that. Virtual surround “cheats” and does it WELL
 

MrFunSocks

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it has nothing to do with physical over virtual. Virtual can simulate POSITIONAL audio better. If you’re in a house on a shooter like cod, you will be able to footsteps above and below and position much easier. You would have to have down firing speakers and possibly up firing as well to be able to have that type of accuracy. So yes,I guess you could say physical would be better but it would takesomething like a 11.2.4 setup or something crazy like that. Virtual surround “cheats” and does it WELL
Up and Down is extremely hard to differentiate when its coming from headphones though, same with slight differences of directions between left and right in front or behind.
 

Rolla

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Don’t believe the marketing hype....they love selling the accessories and always have
I have Astro A40+Mixer, but preorder the Pulse 3D. Astro A40 has bad bass, pretty flat. I want punchy bass.

BTW, you only need 2.0 stereo for true 3D on PS5 if it's HRTF-based, other fakery needs 5.1/7.1 channel to simulate 3D audio.

No disrespect intended but it's insane to see very basic facts completely overlooked.

It doesn't matter what headset you have whether it be Corsair to Turtle beach and everything in between, The audio fidelity you enjoy now will be reduced to basic stereo sound on PS5.

It doesn't matter if you have a custom built, gold plated, diamond encrusted, headset gifted by Yoshida himself. It will only play stereo sound at launch.

The incoming updates for your > Insert manufacturer and model here < headsetonly allows the unit to access the PS5 OS. All other audio features, except for basic stereo sound, will be inaccessible.
 
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captainraincoat

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These bad boys had the best surround and bass



shame when the battery crapped out you were shit out of luck ordering a new one as the company that made the spares at the time went bust
 

Bo_Hazem

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No disrespect intended but it's insane to see very basic facts completely overlooked.

It doesn't matter what headset you have whether it be Corsair to Turtle beach and everything in between, The audio fidelity you enjoy now will be reduced to basic stereo sound on PS5.

It doesn't matter if you have a custom built, gold plated, diamond encrusted, headset gifted by Yoshida himself. It will only play stereo sound at launch.

The incoming updates for your > Insert manufacturer and model here < only allows the unit to run on OS. All other audio features will be removed.

WTF are you saying, mate? HRTF-based 3D doesn't need 5.1 nor 7.1, and it's extremely accurate. And yes, you can enjoy it even with cheap ass, basic stereo, and that's the great thing about it. It's superior to any kind of audio solution you ever experience in your life in gaming.

So I can still enjoy my A40 using 2.0 stereo to take full advantage of true 3D. If it can't go 2.0 stereo then that simulation shit of 5.1/7.1 will ruin the sound quality/accuracy. I think the best headset might be Sony's classic professional ones, extremely strong for low frequency sounds and still used until now by many musicians and producers.




Go ask any musician or audiophile about HRTF-based 3D audio. To take full advantage of it, you probably need to measure yours as well but they'll have 5 presets at launch.
 

FrankWza

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Up and Down is extremely hard to differentiate when its coming from headphones though, same with slight differences of directions between left and right in front or behind.

it’s not hard to differentiate.And I’m not condescending here but you should try it and compare. Try an Astro mix amp and some good headphones and you’ll see howgood it can sound and perform. If Sony is able to put that chip in the dual sense or whatever tech they need to have the audio jack on the controller output 3D audio then you won’t even need the mix amp unless you need to mix your chat volume. Just a nice pair of over the ear. I’m not saying I don’t love physical speaker setup. I’m running an atmos 5.1.2 setup and it’s great. But virtual/3D audio is pretty great for gaming.
 
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The PS5 surround audio is nothing like normal surround sound. You just need any pair of shitty headphones really. The entire approach uses physics and biology to trick your ears into using the biological ability humans have to tell where sound is coming from around us despite only having two ears. That is why Cerny went on and on about ears and mapping each person's head - the more precise your personal ear is mapped out, the more precise the sound can be generated..

Listen to this with headphones. This is what the PS5 will output, except calculated and "rendered" in real time:

 

MrFunSocks

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it’s not hard to differentiate.And I’m not condescending here but you should try it and compare. Try an Astro mix amp and some good headphones and you’ll see howgood it can sound and perform. If Sony is able to put that chip in the dual sense or whatever tech they need to have the audio jack on the controller output 3D audio then you won’t even need the mix amp unless you need to mix your chat volume. Just a nice pair of over the ear. I’m not saying I don’t love physical speaker setup. I’m running an atmos 5.1.2 setup and it’s great. But virtual/3D audio is pretty great for gaming.
I've got an Xbox One X and Dolby Atmos and use headphones for PUBG and used it for Warzone. PUBG probably doesn't support it, which is why it's pretty much impossible on headphones to pinpoint up and down, but Warzone I'm pretty sure does.
 

FrankWza

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I've got an Xbox One X and Dolby Atmos and use headphones for PUBG and used it for Warzone. PUBG probably doesn't support it, which is why it's pretty much impossible on headphones to pinpoint up and down, but Warzone I'm pretty sure does.

I don’t have an Xbox but on ps4 when I played pubg I was able to hear footsteps and positional audio. I’m not that familiar with how the atmos app works on xbox1 but on ps4 when you have an amp you have to output through optical from ps4 and make sure you enable Dolby 5.1. Otherwise it’s not surround and just passes through stereo. Maybe there’s a setting that needs to be enabled or try warzone? Even though I was able to position on pubg it’s not exactly the best technical experience on either console.
 
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Skifi28

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The PS5 surround audio is nothing like normal surround sound. You just need any pair of shitty headphones really. The entire approach uses physics and biology to trick your ears into using the biological ability humans have to tell where sound is coming from around us despite only having two ears.

That was my understanding as well.
 
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Danjin44

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I hope this new PS5 headset are much better build than this.....


They break so easily.
 
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Skifi28

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so the Dual sense controller acts as an adapter? Because the dualshock4 only output stereo.

I don't think anyone can answer 100% without official confirmation, but from what we've been told it's a software rather than a hardware solution so all that matters is the processing done inside the console. I don't see any reason why you can't get that output from the controller.
 
S

SLoWMoTIoN

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The PS5 surround audio is nothing like normal surround sound. You just need any pair of shitty headphones really. The entire approach uses physics and biology to trick your ears into using the biological ability humans have to tell where sound is coming from around us despite only having two ears. That is why Cerny went on and on about ears and mapping each person's head - the more precise your personal ear is mapped out, the more precise the sound can be generated..

Listen to this with headphones. This is what the PS5 will output, except calculated and "rendered" in real time:

That sounds exactly like virtual surround. Sticking to my 2.1 system :)
 
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FrankWza

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You don't need anything more than stereo for 3D audio to work.
Not physically. But you need something to transmit the audio. The dualshock4’s audio jack output Estero sound to headphones. I was asking if the dual sense will output 3D audio so you can use your headphones without any additional adapter
 

MrFunSocks

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I don’t have an Xbox but on ps4 when I played pubg I was able to hear footsteps and positional audio. I’m not that familiar with how the atmos app works on xbox1 but on ps4 when you have an amp you have to output through optical from ps4 and make sure you enable Dolby 5.1. Otherwise it’s not surround and just passes through stereo. Maybe there’s a setting that needs to be enabled or try warzone? Even though I was able to position on pubg it’s not exactly the best technical experience on either console.
I can hear footsteps and positional audio in PUBG, but the devs keep changing/breaking things in it unfortunately. I don't think it supports Atmos is what I'm saying.
 

FrankWza

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I don't think anyone can answer 100% without official confirmation, but from what we've been told it's a software rather than a hardware solution so all that matters is the processing done inside the console. I don't see any reason why you can't get that output from the controller.
I don't think anyone can answer 100% without official confirmation, but from what we've been told it's a software rather than a hardware solution so all that matters is the processing done inside the console. I don't see any reason why you can't get that output from the controller.

yeah I guess that’s what I was asking. If it’s official. I assumed it would as well. That’s probably why the price is only $99 on the Sony headphones. It would be a tough sell to charge more for the tech even though the are truly wireless vsthe wire needing to be plugged into the controller.
 

theHFIC

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Weren‘t we supposed to submit pictures of our ears to Sony after that original Cerny tech talk? Did I miss out on this already??
 

Pimpbaa

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The PS5 surround audio is nothing like normal surround sound. You just need any pair of shitty headphones really.

Or a really good pair of stereo headphones. I just hope it works through your TV's headphone jack as the PS4 controller was REALLY not up to the task of driving my headphones (the PS5's headphone out might be better).
 
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Weren‘t we supposed to submit pictures of our ears to Sony after that original Cerny tech talk? Did I miss out on this already??
I have a feeling that was just some wishful thinking, or a way way future thing. The system out of the box has a set of profiles, as you pick which sounds "best," which theoretically would be the closest to your ear structure.
 
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Duellist

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Hopefully it's going to sound awesome through my Sennheiser HD 598sr headphones. Don't feel like buying something else lol
 
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Bartski

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I don't think people get it...

The update will allow your A50 to run on PS5's OS but the audio design will be reduced to stereo. There isn't a headset yet that will harness the PS5's audio to it's fullest.

People are in for a shock when they realize this. There was a recent thread on reddit but I don't have an account and can't find it in my history. Whatever headset you have, the best audio @ launch is going to be this.

Sorry man but that is totally not how it works. Please check for that reddit post I'll be happy to unpack it.
 

Axonometri

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I have had Sony headsets that broke from weak structural design. Also, on the new set, I have not found the actual technical specs for the pulse drivers and response.
 

Gabbar Singh

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If you want really good wireless headset with PS5 Tempest engine support then look at Audeze Penrose. They have a model each for PS5 and Xbox Series X.

 
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Bo_Hazem

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so the Dual sense controller acts as an adapter? Because the dualshock4 only output stereo.

Yes, and you only need basic stereo 2.0 channel for true 3D audio. Doesn't need fake 5.1/7.1 channel nor expensive shit like Dolby Atmos. That's why Cerny said it's great audio for everyone. It's the best gaming audio solution every, can't really go beyond that. You would be able to hear every freaking rain droplet as each makes its own sound, hundreds of raytraced sounds through that GPU-based Tempest engine.

 
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Yes, and you only need basic stereo 2.0 channel for true 3D audio. Doesn't need fake 5.1/7.1 channel nor expensive shit like Dolby Atmos. That's why Cerny said it's great audio for everyone. It's the best gaming audio solution every, can't really go beyond that. You would be able to hear every freaking rain droplet as each makes its own sound, hundreds of raytraced sounds through that GPU-based Tempest engine.

Stop with the every rain droplet stuff. It's really a terrible example. It's too much information with only the closest/loudest sounds actually coming thru the noise.
 

Bo_Hazem

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Stop with the every rain droplet stuff. It's really a terrible example. It's too much information with only the closest/loudest sounds actually coming thru the noise.

Stop reading if your brain is too tight to consume it. Here is how low quality 3D Audio made, placing soundtracks on some locations:

 
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Stop reading if your brain is too tight to consume it. Here is how low quality 3D Audio made, placing soundtracks on some locations:

You are not understanding. Humans can really only hear around 8 different sounds at once before the ones you are not focused on become background noise. So rain is a bad example because only the loudest closest drops won't just sound like rain noise in the background. This is true for actual rain as well.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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You are not understanding. Humans can really only hear around 8 different sounds at once before the ones you are not focused on become background noise. So rain is a bad example because only the loudest closest drops won't just sound like rain noise in the background. This is true for actual rain as well.

Where is this BS coming from? Sounds like the same BS that 4K can't be seen, or 8K is wasteful. Ok enjoy playing games at 25fps if that's your logic.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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dudes brain isn't too tight it's just too damn smooth

Let's cut the crap with theories and all of you would try that by yourselves on PS5. You don't need Pulse 3D though, but I bought it anyway because I want punchy bass compared to the flat Astro A40. If you happen to know any musician, try ask them about HRTF-based 3D audio.
 
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Where is this BS coming from? Sounds like the same BS that 4K can't be seen, or 8K is wasteful. Ok enjoy playing games at 25fps if that's your logic.
It comes from medical studies on hearing. Wait are you the fabled one of legend who will guide us to the new world with their magical sense of hearing?
 
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Medical studies said that we can't see beyond 25fps as well. Good luck.
Holy shit are you ever a Warrior. This has nothing to do with PlayStation. Go outside when it's raining. You can't hear every sound at once. You can listen to a few and the rest will be noise. You can shift your focus but that will cause the others to now become background noise. Hell just try and listen to 2 people taking at the same time, then add a third and a fourth and so on. It becomes noise.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Holy shit are you ever a Warrior. This has nothing to do with PlayStation. Go outside when it's raining. You can't hear every sound at once. You can listen to a few and the rest will be noise. You can shift your focus but that will cause the others to now become background noise. Hell just try and listen to 2 people taking at the same time, then add a third and a fourth and so on. It becomes noise.

Yeah, that same noise help you out recognize if rain is getting lighter/heavier? And the same noise is used as a fake soundtrack in other solutions? And happens to be some droplets falling on metal/wood or other material that helps you recognize "something". You're wasting my time.
 

GymWolf

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I've got a pair of Platinums, which can also do 3D audio, so hopefully these features don't get paywalled behind the new edition.
Of course it's gonna get paywalled.

Also like other people said, a good surround with 6-7 speaker around you is obviously superior to any headset lol, never been impressed by 3d audio with these things.
 
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FrankWza

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Yeah, that same noise help you out recognize if rain is getting lighter/heavier? And the same noise is used as a fake soundtrack in other solutions? And happens to be some droplets falling on metal/wood or other material that helps you recognize "something". You're wasting my time.

I think maybe a new dedicated thread or the OP in this one needs updating. There are some that still thing that headphones/headset is stereo because it has 2 channels. Or that virtual surround is lacking from any source and a full home theater setup is the only way to get surround sound. I think what you and I and others are saying is, when it comes to virtual surround sound, the best way to experience it is with headphones/headset. Sound bar or 2 speaker setups or even tv speakers using virtual surround will be at a huge disadvantage compared to a 5.1 or better HT setup. But virtual surround ON HEADPHONES/HEADSET gives you comparable or sometimes better positional audio and true surround because you would need to have a full atmos setup to be able to get the full over under audio that virtual surround can add. And since it’s so close to your ears, if you have over the ear style headphones the simulation and 3D aspect is more pronounced
Yes, and you only need basic stereo 2.0 channel for true 3D audio. Doesn't need fake 5.1/7.1 channel nor expensive shit like Dolby Atmos. That's why Cerny said it's great audio for everyone. It's the best gaming audio solution every, can't really go beyond that. You would be able to hear every freaking rain droplet as each makes its own sound, hundreds of raytraced sounds through that GPU-based Tempest engine.


I know. I’m just trying to find out where the processing is coming from if you don’t get the pulse 3D. I guess the system can send it via Bluetooth to the dualsense and then through 3.5 jack. But Sony has not said anything official yet. On the last few console generations if you wanted to use your own headphones you needed a mixamp or USB adapter to process the audio into surround. Either usb or optical. They also have to account for a mic when using a headset
 
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Axonometri

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Am I reading that some of you believe the Pulse 3d Headset has some kind of decoder built into it for the 3d audio? I was under the assumption that all the positioning was being done by processor in the PS5 and the signal being sent to the headphones by conventional method. Am I wrong?
 
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Bo_Hazem

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I think maybe a new dedicated thread or the OP in this one needs updating. There are some that still thing that headphones/headset is stereo because it has 2 channels. Or that virtual surround is lacking from any source and a full home theater setup is the only way to get surround sound. I think what you and I and others are saying is, when it comes to virtual surround sound, the best way to experience it is with headphones/headset. Sound bar or 2 speaker setups or even tv speakers using virtual surround will be at a huge disadvantage compared to a 5.1 or better HT setup. But virtual surround ON HEADPHONES/HEADSET gives you comparable or sometimes better positional audio and true surround because you would need to have a full atmos setup to be able to get the full over under audio that virtual surround can add. And since it’s so close to your ears, if you have over the ear style headphones the simulation and 3D aspect is more pronounced


I know. I’m just trying to find out where the processing is coming from if you don’t get the pulse 3D. I guess the system can send it via Bluetooth to the dualsense and then through 3.5 jack. But Sony has not said anything official yet. On the last few console generations if you wanted to use your own headphones you needed a mixamp or USB adapter to process the audio into surround. Either usb or optical. They also have to account for a mic when using a headset

You're post is thoughtful, indeed. It's beyond me how it's processed, but it's been addressed by other friends here in neogaf who have their HRTF measured and musicians, like thurnishaleygw thurnishaleygw . Hope he can give us more insight.

Am I reading that some of you believe the Pulse 3d Headset has some kind of decoder built into it for the 3d audio? I was under the assumption that all the positioning was being done by processor in the PS5 and the signal being sent to the headphones by conventional method. Am I wrong?

You don't need Pulse 3D, you only need a good 2.0 channel stereo headset.
 
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John2290

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VR sold me on this audio but I'll be damned if I'm going to play every game with a headset or even earphones to avail fully of this.
 
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Axonometri

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You're post is thoughtful, indeed. It's beyond me how it's processed, but it's been addressed by other friends here in neogaf who have their HRTF measured and musicians, like thurnishaleygw thurnishaleygw . Hope he can give us more insight.



You don't need Pulse 3D, you only need a good 2.0 channel stereo headset.
That what I thought. I don't know why some people believe you have to have a specific headphone set made specifically for 3d audio.
 

Bo_Hazem

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That what I thought. I don't know why some people believe you have to have a specific headphone set made specifically for 3d audio.

I would say that Sony's 1990's old professional headsets might be the best. I might buy them for productivity proposes and try them out. By release, it's good to share ideas and feedback about each headset. I'll cover Astro A40 and Pulse 3D for a starter.
 

Axonometri

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I have been using headphones a lot more especially while I am working. When I watch a movie im using my Atmos system. I would like to be able to use it for gaming on the projector sometimes. I hope they bring that soon. I plan to upgrade my phones, but I'm going to get a higher end set.
 
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