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The Last of Us 2 Is Targeting the Base PS4 Model, Not the Pro

Romulus

Member
Is that so? I have absolutely faith Pro and X can do way better than 1080p60fps if they target them.


Hell no. 60fps in an open world with a tablet CPU with lots of physics and effects? You do realize the CPU in these consoles is worse than an I3? You can't just brute force performance with the GPU, and not to mention the X and Pro GPUs are nothing to brag about in 2019 either. I'm surprised they even got a stable 60fps at 1080p. Even then it's not completely locked 60fps, which speaks to my point.
 
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DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
Why would this be the case anyway, and what does "target" mean? It isn't as though the Pro needs an overhaul to get the game running on the thing, so it makes sense to target the base model and then tune up to the Pro in the areas they deem worthy.
 

Majukun

Member
they literally cannot target the pro..it would be ridicolous

"oh yeah guys, the game is gonna run like shit if you didn't upgrade to the more expensive model of our console, guess you should have waited before buying our console in the first two years of its lifecycle...thanks for the money though"
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
they literally cannot target the pro..it would be ridicolous

"oh yeah guys, the game is gonna run like shit if you didn't upgrade to the more expensive model of our console, guess you should have waited before buying our console in the first two years of its lifecycle...thanks for the money though"
I am actually interested to see how the OG Xbox One does in modern games... when people benchmark Xbox One they normally use the S revision which got a modest but not at all insignificant clock speed boost over the launch console. Yet when DF tester they found that the gap between Xbox One S and bass PS4 has been widening not shortening and that is not even the original Xbox One model either...
 

T_LVPL

Member
Would say this though wouldn't they. They don’t want millions of people to cancel their preorder. It’s simple enough; the game will play on the PS4, and it’ll play varying degrees of better on the Pro. Same as every other game.
 
Why is this a suprise to anybody? Sony has a clause that all games must run on and be objectively playable on both the base and the pro. In other words...you're literally not allowed to target the pro.
 

dirthead

Banned
I don't understand, is this even news worthy?
PS4 games run on PS4 hardware. It is insane to build for Pro when it is a smaller market.

The base hardware is ALWAYS the goal. That's why base hardware exists.

This is also why incremental upgrades like the Pro are stupid for consoles. Defeats the whole point of them.
 

Pallas

Member
I’ll probably wait until a PS5 version happens, whether it’s patched or they try to sell a remaster.

coukd we expect a downgrade though in the final product, for the PS4?
 

Shifty

Member
There's no way they could have justified using the Pro as the hardware baseline, end of gen or otherwise.
 

Codes 208

Member
“ill wait for the ps5 version”

but what if, and hear me out out on this one...rather than remastering, they just make it BC and make a next gen patch similar to what we already have with xbox one x enhancements.
 
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GreatnessRD

Member
My question is why can't a billion dollar Publisher optimize the game for both consoles? It's a 1st party title... it should get 1st party love for both the base PS4 and Pro edition.
 
My question is why can't a billion dollar Publisher optimize the game for both consoles? It's a 1st party title... it should get 1st party love for both the base PS4 and Pro edition.
Because Sony litterally cared more about PS4 than the Pro. PS4 base is cheaper, easier to make profits for, has bigger install base and will still be relevant when PS5 comes out. The PS4 Pro would be literally obsolete by the end of next year, and I would not be surprised if Sony had already ceased making any more of it.
 

Kagey K

Banned
You are free to call games mediocre, but you often attack individuals as well. Just make your point.

This game is overblown on the hype machine and will likely disappoint more people then it excites.
 
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This game is overblown on the hype machine and will likely disappoint more people then it excites.
Note that you didn't actually say the game is bad; you said that you think the game deserve to have less fans than it had. Essentially, the "over-rated" argument, which is only ever used on products that are good.

You are free to dislike anything, no one is telling you what to like. But on the other hand, you don't get to tell anyone else that they shouldn't like something.
 

Geki-D

Banned
No surprise here, you have to cater to the lowest common denominator. You can't target a 2080 Ti on PC when 99.9% has the equivalent of a 1050 Ti.
Yeah, base is the majority version. Obviously games are going to be made with that one in mind with bells & whistles being added for the pro.
 
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mejin

Member
So is Halo, but I respect other people's tastes.

We can always put subjectiveness aside and focus on facts.

TLoU is the most awarded exclusive game ever seen. ND has 3 gotys in their bags (U2, TLoU, U4). So, chances of TLoU2 flop is really low and is more like a wishful thinking.
 
Yeah, base is the majority version. Obviously games are going to be made with that one in mind with bells & whistles being added for the pro.
The weird thing is the PC gaming community is used to this. But Console gamers, not used to more than one SKU at one time, sometimes had the misconception that game studios would make games for the most powerful hardware.

Obviously they are not going to deliberately make games for the weakest hardware; but they are going to make games for the best selling hardware. That is actually why it is so important that consoles have a large install base. Those who repeately say "it doesn't matter that our console don't sell so many, as long as we have theoretically more power" is sadly mistaken. Install base is what determines the games that get made for it.

VR is arguably one of the best ways to game these days, but no one is going to invest AAA game money into it right now. Because until the install base is large enough, you can't make your money back. Engagement is not important, install base is.
 

Geki-D

Banned
We can always put subjectiveness aside and focus on facts.

TLoU is the most awarded exclusive game ever seen. ND has 3 gotys in their bags (U2, TLoU, U4). So, chances of TLoU2 flop is really low and is more like a wishful thinking.
I mean, you have to keep in mind that this all span from a Kagey K post. Our console warring, Sony thread shitposter extraordinaire. Guy literally can't help himself.
 

Astral Dog

Member
The only recent game i can think of thats unplayable on base hardware is CONTROL, everything else its running and looks well considering we are on the last years of the gen, compared to 360/PS3 the current systems hold up pretty well, mostly the PS4
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Every game should. If a game is 30fps on base and 60 on pro, I feel ripped off with my slim...
Sure do 1080p on slim one and 1440p checkerboarded to 4k on pro.
As a slim owner, I am worried for Death Stranding...
 

emmerrei

Member
Every game should. If a game is 30fps on base and 60 on pro, I feel ripped off with my slim...
Sure do 1080p on slim one and 1440p checkerboarded to 4k on pro.
As a slim owner, I am worried for Death Stranding...
60fps it involves that the CPU isn't a low-tier 2012 laptop cpu, and guess what, the PS4Pro has the same CPU of the base model, with a little overclock.
Anyway, every sony first party game, is made in this way. The only advantages the Pro version get is a boost in the resolution, usually 1440p, nothing else.
 

TimFL

Member
Doesn't matter. I'm playing this on the PS5. Why waste my time on these pleb consoles anymore when the new one is just around the corner.

This goes for every other Sony Exclusive starting next year for me.

P.S. I have patience. I get to play the Definitive Edition. Payless money and buy it on a sale. Perhaps has 60 FPS option.
Win-Win.
I hope you're wrong and the "remaster" scam ends, would rather play the PS4 copy with a "5 enhanced" patch instead of having to buy it full price again.
 

HeresJohnny

Member
The Pro makes up a tiny fraction of the overall PS4 base, they'd have to be retarded to focus on the Pro. Literally retarded.
 

Digity

Member
you don't say! only stupid people with more money than sense would buy a Pro.

most people have a standard PS4 and that's where the lettuce is.
It was $60 out of my own pocket to upgrade to a pro when they came out. If you consider that too much money you may need a new hobby.
 

Portugeezer

Gold Member
I opened up my PS4 and used a powerful air blower to clean (so much so I was afraid it could break components).

Launch PS4 is running whisper quiet now. TLOU2 ain't shit for my PS4, come at me Druckman.

I expect solid performance on base models.
 
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The Pro makes up a tiny fraction of the overall PS4 base, they'd have to be retarded to focus on the Pro. Literally retarded.
What a strange concept it is that both can be focused on equally. Microsoft's own studios don't seem to have these issues, their games offer real and unique advantages on the X beyond just a simple increase in resolution.
 

HeresJohnny

Member
What a strange concept it is that both can be focused on equally. Microsoft's own studios don't seem to have these issues, their games offer real and unique advantages on the X beyond just a simple increase in resolution.
Microsoft doesn't care about selling games anymore though, Sony does. Different models entirely.

Sony has this huge base of buyers out on the PS4, it makes no sense for them to divert assets to focus on a tiny sliver of the market. They want that 95 percentile buying as many copies of the game.
 
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Microsoft doesn't care about selling games anymore though, Sony does. Different models entirely.
This also makes no sense because the former isn't at all true, and the latter makes more sense to show the beneficial differences of your hardware via the software.

It's like you're making excuses to gloss over the glaring holes in Sony's own support of their platform.
 

HeresJohnny

Member
This also makes no sense because the former isn't at all true, and the latter makes more sense to show the beneficial differences of your hardware via the software.

It's like you're making excuses to gloss over the glaring holes in Sony's own support of their platform.
The former IS true. They've gone on record saying the future isn't in how many consoles a company sells, which directly affects the number of copies of a game are sold. Consoles sold, copies sold. See the correlation? They're in the game rental business now, everything they're doing speaks to this.
 
What a strange concept it is that both can be focused on equally. Microsoft's own studios don't seem to have these issues, their games offer real and unique advantages on the X beyond just a simple increase in resolution.
If rumors are true and that there wouldn't be any Scarlet exclusives for the first few years of release, that everything would also run on Xbox1s... You will understand what we mean.
 
The former IS true. They've gone on record saying the future isn't in how many consoles a company sells, which directly affects the number of copies of a game are sold. Consoles sold, copies sold. See the correlation? They're in the game rental business now, everything they're doing speaks to this.
The former is not true, a shift in focus doesn't negate the importance of software sales and they're still a huge part of their business, but now not the only focus.

They have not gone on record saying THAT, you're confusing Phil Spencer's message because I know exactly what you're talking about. He said that he doesn't need you to go out and buy an additional piece of hardware to engage their software, software which you can already access via existing hardware. Software is where the money is made, not hardware, hardware is the necessary access point but not the profit generator.

That's not the same as what you're trying to incorrectly infer.

If rumors are true and that there wouldn't be any Scarlet exclusives for the first few years of release, that everything would also run on Xbox1s... You will understand what we mean.
No I don't at all understand what you mean because you guys don't seem to understand that a delineation in hardware will exist which shows stark and contrast differences in each subsequent build of a game. Stark differences which exist right now within the Xbox One family via the base and the X, a delineation which Microsoft has exploited but Sony has been rather complacent with.

Yes Sony has done checkerboard rendering or simple field increases in resolution but they've done virtually nothing beyond that with their games. Microsoft on the other hand has ventured into 60 FPS builds while the base is 30 FPS and higher graphical setting builds etc. Regardless of the number of devices sold or their split they still exploit every possible avenue to take proper advantage of their scaled hardware tiers.

Sony created a console which is 129% more powerful than the PS4 yet we're getting a game like The Last of Us 2 which for all intents and purposes appears to be another Uncharted 4 situation. The base version of the game with a 77% increase in resolution, same framerate, same graphical settings with what in numerical value amounts to 52% of that 129% GPU compute increase being unused.

Now I know they have a memory bottleneck in that system, they built in a flaw, but that doesn't mean they can't at least try to make the builds actually unique, but they don't.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
Yes Sony has done checkerboard rendering or simple field increases in resolution but they've done virtually nothing beyond that with their games. Microsoft on the other hand has ventured into 60 FPS builds while the base is 30 FPS and higher graphical setting builds etc. Regardless of the number of devices sold or their split they still exploit every possible avenue to take proper advantage of their scaled hardware tiers.

Sony created a console which is 129% more powerful than the PS4 yet we're getting a game like The Last of Us 2 which for all intents and purposes appears to be another Uncharted 4 situation. The base version of the game with a 77% increase in resolution, same framerate, same graphical settings with what in numerical value amounts to 52% of that 129% GPU compute increase being unused.

They're not even the aame.


Microsoft cut a lot of corners to achieve 60fps in single play in a game like Gears 5.

Last of Us Part II is heavily gameplay focused and that's where a lot of CPU resources are going with the physics, AI etc.
 
They're not even the aame.


Microsoft cut a lot of corners to achieve 60fps in single play in a game like Gears 5.

Last of Us Part II is heavily gameplay focused and that's where a lot of CPU resources are going with the physics, AI etc.
They really didn't though, if you look at Gears 4 and 5 not only visually but in function they're virtually identical bar resolution differences while one is 30 FPS and the other is 60 FPS. Even then The Coalitions scaling method is extremely effective, the game never gets soft surprisingly.

The point is Sony doesn't try different ways of capitalizing on their more powerful hardware, they don't create real deliniable differences in their software. The Pro's whole run has been mismanaged if I'm speaking frankly, Sony not even building a list of supported games speaks volumes on its own.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
They really didn't though, if you look at Gears 4 and 5 not only visually but in function they're virtually identical bar resolution differences while one is 30 FPS and the other is 60 FPS. Even then The Coalitions scaling method is extremely effective, the game never gets soft surprisingly.

The point is Sony doesn't try different ways of capitalizing on their more powerful hardware, they don't create real deliniable differences in their software. The Pro's whole run has been mismanaged if I'm speaking frankly, Sony not even building a list of supported games speaks volumes on its own.

Yes, AI, physics within the game take CPU power. It has way more in TLOU 2 and Uncharted in comparison to Gears 4 and 5.
 
Yes, AI, physics within the game take CPU power. It has way more in TLOU 2 and Uncharted in comparison to Gears 4 and 5.
You're building kind of a false equivalency here, how does this in any way explain away great underutilization of the GPU?

It's almost literally a value edit, it's lazy.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
You're building kind of a false equivalency here, how does this in any way explain away great underutilization of the GPU?

It's almost literally a value edit, it's lazy.

Well, you mentioned 60fps. I told you why the game like TLOU would be more demanding on the CPU compared to a game like Gears. If they wanted to make TLOU 2 60fps during single player, then they could, but the environment, AI and physics would be totally reduced.


The PS4 Pro GPU is good for 1440p gaming, and that's exactly within the range of what they're doing. So it's not underutilized.
 
Well, you mentioned 60fps. I told you why the game like TLOU would be more demanding on the CPU compared to a game like Gears. If they wanted to make TLOU 2 60fps during single player, then they could, but the environment, AI and physics would be totally reduced.


The PS4 Pro GPU is good for 1440p gaming, and that's exactly within the range of what they're doing. So it's not underutilized.
That was an example relating to delineated ways in which Microsoft's developers are making expressed differences in their hardware known via development divergences.

Forza Horizon 4 is a great example, a game which has huge landscapes, has AI everywhere and is extremely physics bound. They have a native 4K mode with graphical settings pushed up beyond the base system, and they have a 60 FPS mode with graphical settings more comparable to the base system.

The point is they are leveraging the compute differences in this hardware properly in ways which separate the software from the builds seen on the base system, Sony is not doing this. This isn't about 60 FPS, it's about the difference in respective builds, it's not just resolution changes.

The Last of Us 2 is just an increase in resolution on the Pro.

Where is this 31% uptick in CPU headroom being used? Where is this 24% uptick in memory bandwidth being used? Where is that missing 52% in GPU resources from the 129% uptick in compute?

Do you see what I'm talking about, it should make sense but it doesn't. They're being lazy.
 
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