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[ACESHIGH]

I remember a thread on retard era "Would games be better under comunism" so I am not surprised.

And around 70 per cent agreed the industry would be better. Bunch of delusional fucks. Nothing it's better under comunism. It's always quite pathetic seeing folks from 1st world countries championing comunism. They wouldn't last a month under a comunist regime

 

[spawn]

Don't like it then don't buy it

 

[alabtrosMyster]

Ok, she didnt want to kill the deer... then why did you kill 300 dudes without remorse during the rest of the game?

Because they wanted to sell copies to PETA members

 

[Krappadizzle]

I don't give a shit as long as it doesn't come to pandering.

Like if they start making every main protagonist a Half-Black/Half-Chinese Gay Republican Jewish Transgender Paraplegic to hit as many demographics as possible, than yeah, I'll be annoyed. But at the end of the day, my main concern is always whether it's a good game or not.

 

[sol_bad]

On the topic of TLOU, how come people never whinged about Bill being gay in the first game and people never whinged or complained about the buff/muscly people in the first game?

Why are people now whinging about gay and buff characters? Right, because the first game released before all this woke/anti-woke shit came about.

 

[alabtrosMyster]

I remember a thread on retard era "Would games be better under comunism" so I am not surprised.

And around 70 per cent agreed the industry would be better. Bunch of delusional fucks. Nothing it's better under comunism. It's always quite pathetic seeing folks from 1st world countries championing comunism. They wouldn't last a month under a comunist regime

What, you are completely erasing the history of great video games unser the Russian communist party!

 

[alabtrosMyster]

I don't give a shit as long as it doesn't come to pandering.

Like if they start making every main protagonist a Half-Black/Half-Chinese Gay Republican Jewish Transgender Paraplegic to hit as many demographics as possible, than yeah, I'll be annoyed. But at the end of the day, my main concern is always whether it's a good game or not.

You're half breed, nobody likes you. (Joke, we like you).

 

[PanzerAzel]

On the topic of TLOU, how come people never whinged about Bill being gay in the first game and people never whinged or complained about the buff/muscly people in the first game?

Why are people now whinging about gay and buff characters? Right, because the first game released before all this woke/anti-woke shit came about.

No, it’s because the execution of it was very well done.

 

[LeVictorien]

Reading through this thread I wish next gen gets more woke and we end up with all sorts of character designs just to piss people off.

 

[Krappadizzle]

No, it’s because the execution of it was very well done.

Super well done. Bill wasn't a cool character BECAUSE he was gay. He was a cool character that happened to be Gay. He was just a normal person in a shitty situation and his sexuality never made a difference. Also, having Al Swearengen's right hand man be the voice actor doesn't hurt either.

 

[sol_bad]

No, it’s because the execution of it was very well done.

And you know how it's done in TLOU2? In the actual game itself? You have played and finished it?
Is Ellie saying to the camera that she is a lesbian every 5 minutes or something?
No spoilers please.

Super well done. Bill wasn't a cool character BECAUSE he was gay. He was a cool character that happened to be Gay. He was just a normal person in a shitty situation and his sexuality never made a difference. Also, having Al Swearengen's right hand man be the voice actor doesn't hurt either.

I didn't realise that Ellie was a shit character in the first game. OK.

 

[EDMIX]

I hope next God of War has Kratos in a wheelchair.

lol! LOLz aside, I'd love for a character in a wheelchair that has some power and them being in a wheelchair makes them seem more passive, weak, unassuming etc

Just buy the games you want (to support).
Sooner or later the gaming industry will learn.

What if they want to support fun games regardless? What will the industry learn? I mean...have you not considered people buying some of theses games are gamers too? So not too sure what you mean. This is like the funny whole "gamers will vote with their wallets", well....sure.....they have been, its why they are buying games like this in the first place. So this whole "sooner or later" stuff or "just buy" this or that sounds silly when you consider you are not talking about us having the ability for the FIRST TIME to do this.

You are technically talking about something I'd argue most are already doing as to why such games exist.

VOTE WITH YOUR WALLET.

Facts. I 100% will....I will buy most of the games shown at the reveal as they look fun. This call to action is kind of moot if you consider its not as if we didn't have the ability to do that before. That being said, Spiderman, Goodbye Volcano High and Ratchet and HDZ2 are day 1s.

Definition of woke on GAF = A woman or a minority in the lead role.

lol basically.

Be like "Listen here Anita, games like Fear Effect exist so diversity in gaming EXISTED YOU LIARZ"

Fear Effect 3 comes out and character is clearly still gay.

Also them "WOW, looks like Square is WOKE and went the Anita route PANDERING to da woke exteremez, not buying this agenda, why can't they make day own game doe"

Anita makes her own game.

Also them "WOOOOOOW not like that, now we have theses agendas shoved down our throat"

So if it existed before, it was proof she was a liar and clearly gaming had many diverse characters....
if it existed after her, well its clear its a agenda and no one really wants to honestly make that and they are only making it to push agenda and they need to make their own game instead of killing ours, but if they do make their own games, that shouldn't be in games cause we play games to escape da reality and politics shouldn't be in games.

In a nut shell...

 

[namekuseijin]

let me get back to sleep

 

[PanzerAzel]

And you know how it's done in TLOU2? In the actual game itself? You have played and finished it?
Is Ellie saying to the camera that she is a lesbian every 5 minutes or something?
No spoilers please.

I don't need to see the whole game. It wasn't my decision to toss in and make predominant Ellie's sexuality in two trailers, of which the entire agenda narrative has been predicated, and of which the leaks further poured fuel on the fire. Had Neil been able to hold his ideological wad until the game actually released I doubt this entire agenda debate would be in issue, because Ellie's sexuality would be seen and validated in full context of the narrative instead of her being stripped into nothing but a superficial LGBT husk to be able to further ideological capital in scoring representation points. Bill and Ellie's orientation in the original were happenstance, they were incidental, they were equal to every other trait they held as characters, and they were in full context of any over-arching story. Ellie's orientation, absent ANY, was highlighted, repeatedly, in two trailers encompassing minutes, for nothing more than to make an ideological point stemming from outside the work itself.

It amazes me that people are so bewildered as to why many held no issue with the first, yet the second they just can't understand. Maybe they should think a bit on it. It is not the audience's fault, they've not changed.....the developer has in placing priority in one character's traits to mark off a check list to score agenda points......BEFORE the game even releases. Because if those trailers hadn't made a concerted effort to place such a highlight upon it, I wouldn't be making this argument, and I doubt so many others would be either.

 

[sol_bad]

I don't need to see the whole game. It wasn't my decision to toss in and make predominant Ellie's sexuality in two trailers, of which the entire agenda narrative has been predicated, and of which the leaks further poured fuel on the fire. Had Neil been able to hold his ideological wad until the game actually released I doubt this entire agenda debate would be in issue, because Ellie's sexuality would be seen and validated in full context of the narrative instead of her being stripped into nothing but a superficial LGBT husk to be able to further ideological capital in scoring representation points. Bill and Ellie's orientation in the original were happenstance, they were incidental, they were equal to every other trait they held as characters, and they were in full context of any over-arching story. Ellie's orientation, absent ANY, was highlighted, repeatedly, in two trailers encompassing minutes, for nothing more than to make an ideological point stemming from outside the work itself.

It amazes me that people are so bewildered as to why many held no issue with the first, yet the second they just can't understand. Maybe they should think a bit on it. It is not the audience's fault, they've not changed.....the developer has in placing priority in one character's traits to mark off a check list to score agenda points......BEFORE the game even releases. Because if those trailers hadn't made a concerted effort to place such a highlight upon it, I wouldn't be making this argument, and I doubt so many others would be either.

So if the game had Ellie kissing a guy in that trailer you'd avoid buying it as well and complain that she kissed a guy?

 

[Doom85]

So if the game had Ellie kissing a guy in that trailer you'd avoid buying it as well and complain that she kissed a guy?

Seriously, Panzer, did a noteworthy amount of people (so I'm asking for more than a few crazies I can count on one or two hands) bitch about the above? Pretty sure they didn't. Especially based on the 99% like ratio. It's almost like a romantic partner/SO can be a major element of a character's life or something.....

TLOU is a story-driven game series. 2 has a good focus on Ellie's relationship because heaven forbid the 19 year old want to hook up with someone. It's still clearly going to feature a fuck ton of dark shit and violence like the first one. Christ, the trailer that first showed Dinah has her saying, "Ellie, they should be terrified of you" and while she meant they should be terrified of her as a romantic rival, we see her for several minutes killing the shit out of people. We don't even know the full narrative (at least for thus of us who avoided the leaks, and again a reminder a specific thread has been made for those who did look) so how is it anything but presumptuous to just assume the romance won't fit the context of the narrative?

The ACTUAL first trailer showed Ellie as a broken person wanting revenge no matter the cost for unknown reasons. So claiming Ellie's orientation (because heaven forbid we just call it romance) is the priority is just flat out inaccurate considering we've seen her out for blood in just as many if not more of the previews. Christ, the 2nd trailer didn't even feature Ellie at all, but three unknown characters facing off against some crazy people. Seriously, fucking hell, Ellie got a girlfriend, heaven forbid said girlfriend be in the story for more than 5% of it.

 

[PanzerAzel]

So if the game had Ellie kissing a guy in that trailer you'd avoid buying it as well and complain that she kissed a guy?

If it had Ellie kissing a guy, I'd be a bit confused considering how Left Behind left things, but yes, I'd be left equally bewildered as to how it was relevant in ANY sense given the context the trailer afforded. Hetero or homo, it doesn't matter, it is out of place. Who is this person? Is there a relationship here? What is this moment attempting to establish that's important to the rest of the trailer (other than carnal lust and an allusion to orientation?). Hooray, Ellie's a lesbian. Hooray, Ellie's straight. Either way, who gives a fuck? Leave that shit for the main game where it will actually be meaningful because it has the context to actually afford it.

I'm not going to refuse to buy it, this is TLoU II, but it would certainly raise my brow. I don't know why it doesn't yours.

 

[Klayzer]

lol! LOLz aside, I'd love for a character in a wheelchair that has some power and them being in a wheelchair makes them seem more passive, weak, unassuming etc



What if they want to support fun games regardless? What will the industry learn? I mean...have you not considered people buying some of theses games are gamers too? So not too sure what you mean. This is like the funny whole "gamers will vote with their wallets", well....sure.....they have been, its why they are buying games like this in the first place. So this whole "sooner or later" stuff or "just buy" this or that sounds silly when you consider you are not talking about us having the ability for the FIRST TIME to do this.

You are technically talking about something I'd argue most are already doing as to why such games exist.



Facts. I 100% will....I will buy most of the games shown at the reveal as they look fun. This call to action is kind of moot if you consider its not as if we didn't have the ability to do that before. That being said, Spiderman, Goodbye Volcano High and Ratchet and HDZ2 are day 1s.



lol basically.

Be like "Listen here Anita, games like Fear Effect exist so diversity in gaming EXISTED YOU LIARZ"

Fear Effect 3 comes out and character is clearly still gay.

Also them "WOW, looks like Square is WOKE and went the Anita route PANDERING to da woke exteremez, not buying this agenda, why can't they make day own game doe"

Anita makes her own game.

Also them "WOOOOOOW not like that, now we have theses agendas shoved down our throat"

So if it existed before, it was proof she was a liar and clearly gaming had many diverse characters....
if it existed after her, well its clear its a agenda and no one really wants to honestly make that and they are only making it to push agenda and they need to make their own game instead of killing ours, but if they do make their own games, that shouldn't be in games cause we play games to escape da reality and politics shouldn't be in games.

In a nut shell...

Dude you are literally typing my thoughts verbatim. Good luck shaking off your new stalker.

 

[sol_bad]

If it had Ellie kissing a guy, I'd be a bit confused considering how Left Behind left things, but yes, I'd be left equally bewildered as to how it was relevant in ANY sense given the context the trailer afforded. Hetero or homo, it doesn't matter, it is out of place. Who is this person? Is there a relationship here? What is this moment attempting to establish that's important to the rest of the trailer (other than carnal lust and an allusion to orientation?). Hooray, Ellie's a lesbian. Hooray, Ellie's straight. Either way, who gives a fuck? Leave that shit for the main game where it will actually be meaningful because it has the context to actually afford it.

I'm not going to refuse to buy it, this is TLoU II, but it would certainly raise my brow. I don't know why it doesn't yours.

What is there to be bewildered about? Is someone finding happiness in the shit hole world of TLOU not an important thing? Should everyone keep on keeping on while feeling miserable and having no hope? Why would something like finding happiness and having a meaningful relationship be out of place? As for who the person is and what their relationship is, isn't that the point of the trailer, to pique your interest into who it is and what their relationship is?
Are you saying trailers should just be about the game play? How do you present a story trailer without showing what the basic story is?

I would raise a brow if the trailer had Ellie talking about and questioning her sexuality, being confused and trying to find what her sexuality actually is. Like I raised a brow in season 2 of Supergirl, where season 1 her sister was a character, then in season 2 her sisters sexuality was her character, I stopped watching that show after 6 episodes in season 2. But the trailer for TLOU2 is not that. Ellie knows what her sexuality is and she is happy and comfortable with it, it's just a part of who she is and I don't think the game is going to dwindle on that topic any longer than it needs to. Obviously you will need to care about Ellie's partner so of course you are going to see them on-screen together and you are going to see that relationship play out.

I'm glad to hear that you are still buying it though and I hope you (and I) love what Naughty Dog give us.

 

[10000]

welcome to salty spitoon

 

[PanzerAzel]

What is there to be bewildered about? Is someone finding happiness in the shit hole world of TLOU not an important thing? Should everyone keep on keeping on while feeling miserable and having no hope? Why would something like finding happiness and having a meaningful relationship be out of place? As for who the person is and what their relationship is, isn't that the point of the trailer, to pique your interest into who it is and what their relationship is?
Are you saying trailers should just be about the game play? How do you present a story trailer without showing what the basic story is?

The point of a trailer is to grant overall gist to the main narrative that will take place. That being, a tale of revenge, a story about hate and the unending cycle of vengeance it creates. I can't go much further into this without treading on spoiler territory.

Aside, we don't know that any relationship shown is meaningful which is my point. They frame it as superficially as possible: a very flirtatious tease dancing with guys before picking Ellie as if she's her new taste test. That didn't say anything meaningful to me about their relationship, all it did was place focus on infatuation and sexual orientation, which I believe was the intent. And again, if it were a hetero couple I'd see it as equally misplaced. People have argued ND's attempting to contrast a happy time with Ellie to be able to segue into a scene of brutal violence to demonstrate extreme dichotomy, and I might be willing to buy that, had the next trailer not arrived and within 15 seconds made an allusion to the first kiss, absent any context granting it significant meaning. What gives you any reason to think Dina is meaningful to Ellie and not just a one night stand? Because that's all the trailer granted, and that apparently was enough for Druckmann to accomplish his goal.

What further raises my suspicion is looking at ND as a studio. Their statements, actions, and affiliations. I don't have a problem with agendas or diversity. I only make this an issue because people immediately jump to the conclusion I'm a bigot and prejudiced because I'm calling out one in what I believe has evidence to back it. And in this instance, I believe Neil's hamfisted and premature handling of his ideology in promotional material of his work prior to its release has created an unnecessary backlash against the very cause he's attempting to further, and that I'd like to see improved as well. It bothers me a bit.

And yeah, I'm hugely looking forward to this. From what I've seen in the trailers and the leaks the quality of the writing has me a bit skeptical, but if the gameplay and world building is there and iterated upon well (as it looks to be), I'm one happy camper.

 

[Jubenhimer]

I mean, so long as its not preachy or exclusionary, then I don't think anybody has a problem with Black, Female, or non-white characters in games. Problems arise when developers make a big deal about it to cover up a lack of quality or creativity, and then call us bigots for rightly calling out their incompetent writing or directing.

It's why so many people are annoyed by "Diversity" in games, because there's almost always an ulterior motive behind it. If this was actually about Diversity, nobody would be making a big deal about how there are "too many white male characters in games". Designers and Developers need to just make characters first, and worry about race and gender last.

 

[apotema]

u guys bashing on resetera and in the same time wishing companies to go broke if they are woke and planning a strike when the time is right.

such an irony, you guys and era is just the opposite side of mirror, there's no neutrality or in between

We are not the same, for sure you and I won't be banned because of this disagreement.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

This is honestly one of my largest concerns with next generation. The pandering, agendas and politics is already bad enough now, but it seems like things will get even worst next generation.

Pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience. If you want to insert your political views or ideologies into a game, then that’s your prerogative, but I don’t like it when they tamper with beloved or well known franchises.

 

[alabtrosMyster]

They wouldn't last a month under a comunist regime

They would fall in line and believe everything the dictator tells them, they would tell on you if you didn't applaud long enough, and they would question themselves if they were sent to the gulags.

 

[EDMIX]

I'd be left equally bewildered as to how it was relevant in ANY sense given the context the trailer afforded.

? Its relevant because she is human and its normal for humans to behave as such. The Last Of Us is a series about humans vs monsters and yes....humans vs humans trying to get to a "normal" and that involves relationships too. It would be like trying to question why Glenn marries Maggie in the Walking Dead, be like "I'd be left equally bewildered as to how it was relevant in ANY sense" ....

it doesn't matter, it is out of place.

I disagree. You've not played the game to argue what is or isn't out of place. Thats like looking at a trailer for Breaking Bad before it releases and seeing a opening cryptic scene is "out of place".....as if you actually saw the entire show to KNOW what is or isn't relevant to the actual story. So that shows openings do that often where they take something that looks irrelevant and later in the episode or another episode you find out why its actually relevant.

Who is this person? Is there a relationship here?

If you have eyes that work, that is clearly a very easy thing to understand with that trailer.

Leave that shit for the main game where it will actually be meaningful because it has the context to actually afford it.

Nah bud, they are free to make the trailer how they feel just. If this person is significant to the character, they are 100% allowed to make that the focal point of a trailer. So because you are confused that humans kiss we need to not have it in the trailer? smh.

it would certainly raise my brow. I don't know why it doesn't yours.

Nah bud, a lot of us don't judge so damn harshly on such things. People kiss....thats it. They are establishing a relationship exist, they are free to show that point any way they feel like it either sudden, subtile, in your face etc. The issue you have is you fail to realize people are different, there is not this rule book on how every acts or should act and anything against must mean secret agenda and should raise "brow" or something.

Look at people yourself and you'll see.

Some hold hands, some don't.
Some kiss in public like a peck on the cheek, some MAKE OUT LOUDLY.
Some hug, SOME DAMN NEAR TURN INTO XXX FILM.
Some quietly talk about their relationship, some are loud and proud and want the WORLD TO KNOW THEY ARE IN LOVE.

So my friend....does that fucking sound like 1 way to do something and any other way must raise your brow? Have you not considered for the character they made, such a scene makes sense to them no different then any of the above listed actions might make sense for someone else character in another game, film etc?

You know what my rule of thumb is regarding this? Does it happen in real life? Oh it does...

Fair game. Thats it.

For a narrative regarding revenge, it seems odd to then question WHY show footage of the great times they had of a person that literally might be the focal point of said revenge...

My god, thats like trying to say you um " it would certainly raise my brow. I don't know why it doesn't yours." with a Punisher Trailer to a show or film where Frank is with his family and hugging, kissing and enjoy life. Yup, this is out of place showing him actually enjoy what will be taken from him in a fucking NARRATIVE ABOUT REVENGE, must be dat pesky family agenda with Hallmark trying to sell more of dem cards doe lol

Doom85 10000% Agreed. I didn't go into Days Gone like "hmmmm must be a alt right agenda to me to join biker gain and marry womenz as its clear that trailer was out of place and forced, who actually marries people?" lol

Rhazer Fusion "This is honestly one of my largest concerns with next generation. The pandering, agendas and politics is already bad enough now" ???? I mean...did you think such a thing was not able to happen before? Next generation? Sir....the same people making games now, are some of the same people that made games before and are clearly going to be some of the same people making games in the future. (Take Fear Effect, many used that as an example to show Anita that diversity existed in gaming, yet for FUCK SAKES, many of you TODAY RIGHT NOW would attack the shit out of that game if was made today and say its "WOKE" and "AGENDA" and "POLITICALZ") So those same people that existed before, exist NOW. You are not talking about something they couldn't do before bud. Thats like crying about a book being made about religious and then ignore many books have been made about it for hundreds of years or something. Be like "it seems like things will get even worst next BOOK generation". As in what? Folks will get to continue to create what they feel like it? What are you going to do? Did they break a law? What is your solution? Only have games made that you approve or something?

It would be like saying that about a fucking book as if the ability for someone to actually write a book based on such a topic was some new thing....

"Pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience. " How do you 100% factually know though? I hear this stated many times, yet you don't really know what the writer, producer, team is all thinking to really make that argument. No one does.

Do you really think when a writer makes a game and the character is gay, or religious or some crap that the programmers are like "ok I see what you wrote, I better not come up with great ideas for gameplay as it sounds like I can not do my job because character gay" I mean, it doesn't make sense.

A. The majority of the team isn't actually fucking writing the game.
B. The part of the team that is in charge of many gameplay elements don't just get limited by what they can make fun based on GAY or straight or right or left, it makes no sense. ie Lets not make any cool stealth segments cause the character is gay, that is good enough. /s
C. A game can be bad in gameplay because its just BAD IN GAMEPLAY, not everything is a fucking conspiracy. The Order 1886 is a mixed bag, a very questionable game that lacks many gameplay ideas that could have helped it. ......lts say the main character is gay...you telling me that um "Pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience" is why such a thing would make it suck? Not simply because it just sucked? lol Could you imagine a fucking SJW saying "The Order 1886 fails because of course the Alt Right have to keep pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience. Him being STRAIGHT was their only focus as to why The Order 1886 failed"

"If you want to insert your political views or ideologies into a game, then that’s your prerogative, but I don’t like it when they tamper with beloved or well known franchises" Tamper? Nah bud, that makes even less sense as they are the authority on the matter as its THEIR GAME. So I don't know how they can "tamper" when they are the default authority. They decide what is or isn't in their games. Not you or me.

My opinion next gen, stop getting so caught up in what other folks do with their games, it makes little sense to out right assume "agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience" , its doesn't make sense to assume a game with a gay character was SOLELY made for that no different then it doesn't make sense to seriously assume a game with a STRAIGHT character was solely made for that.

 

[adamosmaki]

Is that even possible?

 

[D.Final]

Well...

 

[Danjin44]

Well...

 

[009EspadaSageJay]

What the fuck am I seeing that last slide??

I always laugh at people champion communism and Marxism maybe these people should ask how well game developement is going in China under the CCP control. Im sure all these people would be unemployed and working in some sweatshops and not in a 4 by 3 cubical desk chugging down star bucks while surfing twitter.

https://www.engadget.com/2019-08-02-china-censorship-video-games-tencent-mobile-pc.html

 

[M1chl]

I always laugh at people champion communism and Marxism maybe these people should ask how well game developement is going in China under the CCP control. Im sure all these people would be unemployed and working in some sweatshops and not in a 4 by 3 cubical desk chugging down star bucks while surfing twitter.

https://www.engadget.com/2019-08-02-china-censorship-video-games-tencent-mobile-pc.html

I am not sure, if you hover over my profile name, but I am from post-communist country. So like, most of people don't really know how shitty it is.

 

[009EspadaSageJay]

On the topic of TLOU, how come people never whinged about Bill being gay in the first game and people never whinged or complained about the buff/muscly people in the first game?

Why are people now whinging about gay and buff characters? Right, because the first game released before all this woke/anti-woke shit came about.

probably because he was executed well

 

[LordKasual]

Yep, It's all about WOKENESS and DIVERSITY and ANTI-WEEB shit from Japan

And guess what

Nobody outside of NeoGAF and the fringe corners of 4Chan actually care


just a reality check lol


Companies supporting pride month, or having a black (or Woman apparently) protagonist, or standing up for Civil Rights is a passing nod for most people and a really cool thing for those it's targeting

only in places where people get ~TRIGGERED~ over literally anything "Not white Guy" does anyone actually complain

nobody gives a shit

 

[IntentionalPun]

Really don’t give a shit.

I play games to play games not watch stories.

Cutscene skippers unit!

 

[PleaseWaitStation4]

I posted this in the politics forum, but since Gen Z skipped history class, this sums it up...

 

[D.Final]

It's just the beginning

 

[JLB]

+1000. As always.

 

[LordKasual]

? Its relevant because she is human and its normal for humans to behave as such. The Last Of Us is a series about humans vs monsters and yes....humans vs humans trying to get to a "normal" and that involves relationships too. It would be like trying to question why Glenn marries Maggie in the Walking Dead, be like "I'd be left equally bewildered as to how it was relevant in ANY sense" ....




I disagree. You've not played the game to argue what is or isn't out of place. Thats like looking at a trailer for Breaking Bad before it releases and seeing a opening cryptic scene is "out of place".....as if you actually saw the entire show to KNOW what is or isn't relevant to the actual story. So that shows openings do that often where they take something that looks irrelevant and later in the episode or another episode you find out why its actually relevant.



If you have eyes that work, that is clearly a very easy thing to understand with that trailer.





Nah bud, they are free to make the trailer how they feel just. If this person is significant to the character, they are 100% allowed to make that the focal point of a trailer. So because you are confused that humans kiss we need to not have it in the trailer? smh.



Nah bud, a lot of us don't judge so damn harshly on such things. People kiss....thats it. They are establishing a relationship exist, they are free to show that point any way they feel like it either sudden, subtile, in your face etc. The issue you have is you fail to realize people are different, there is not this rule book on how every acts or should act and anything against must mean secret agenda and should raise "brow" or something.

Look at people yourself and you'll see.

Some hold hands, some don't.
Some kiss in public like a peck on the cheek, some MAKE OUT LOUDLY.
Some hug, SOME DAMN NEAR TURN INTO XXX FILM.
Some quietly talk about their relationship, some are loud and proud and want the WORLD TO KNOW THEY ARE IN LOVE.

So my friend....does that fucking sound like 1 way to do something and any other way must raise your brow? Have you not considered for the character they made, such a scene makes sense to them no different then any of the above listed actions might make sense for someone else character in another game, film etc?

You know what my rule of thumb is regarding this? Does it happen in real life? Oh it does...

Fair game. Thats it.

For a narrative regarding revenge, it seems odd to then question WHY show footage of the great times they had of a person that literally might be the focal point of said revenge...

My god, thats like trying to say you um " it would certainly raise my brow. I don't know why it doesn't yours." with a Punisher Trailer to a show or film where Frank is with his family and hugging, kissing and enjoy life. Yup, this is out of place showing him actually enjoy what will be taken from him in a fucking NARRATIVE ABOUT REVENGE, must be dat pesky family agenda with Hallmark trying to sell more of dem cards doe lol

Doom85 10000% Agreed. I didn't go into Days Gone like "hmmmm must be a alt right agenda to me to join biker gain and marry womenz as its clear that trailer was out of place and forced, who actually marries people?" lol

Rhazer Fusion "This is honestly one of my largest concerns with next generation. The pandering, agendas and politics is already bad enough now" ???? I mean...did you think such a thing was not able to happen before? Next generation? Sir....the same people making games now, are some of the same people that made games before and are clearly going to be some of the same people making games in the future. (Take Fear Effect, many used that as an example to show Anita that diversity existed in gaming, yet for FUCK SAKES, many of you TODAY RIGHT NOW would attack the shit out of that game if was made today and say its "WOKE" and "AGENDA" and "POLITICALZ") So those same people that existed before, exist NOW. You are not talking about something they couldn't do before bud. Thats like crying about a book being made about religious and then ignore many books have been made about it for hundreds of years or something. Be like "it seems like things will get even worst next BOOK generation". As in what? Folks will get to continue to create what they feel like it? What are you going to do? Did they break a law? What is your solution? Only have games made that you approve or something?

It would be like saying that about a fucking book as if the ability for someone to actually write a book based on such a topic was some new thing....

"Pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience. " How do you 100% factually know though? I hear this stated many times, yet you don't really know what the writer, producer, team is all thinking to really make that argument. No one does.

Do you really think when a writer makes a game and the character is gay, or religious or some crap that the programmers are like "ok I see what you wrote, I better not come up with great ideas for gameplay as it sounds like I can not do my job because character gay" I mean, it doesn't make sense.

A. The majority of the team isn't actually fucking writing the game.
B. The part of the team that is in charge of many gameplay elements don't just get limited by what they can make fun based on GAY or straight or right or left, it makes no sense. ie Lets not make any cool stealth segments cause the character is gay, that is good enough. /s
C. A game can be bad in gameplay because its just BAD IN GAMEPLAY, not everything is a fucking conspiracy. The Order 1886 is a mixed bag, a very questionable game that lacks many gameplay ideas that could have helped it. ......lts say the main character is gay...you telling me that um "Pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience" is why such a thing would make it suck? Not simply because it just sucked? lol Could you imagine a fucking SJW saying "The Order 1886 fails because of course the Alt Right have to keep pushing your agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience. Him being STRAIGHT was their only focus as to why The Order 1886 failed"

"If you want to insert your political views or ideologies into a game, then that’s your prerogative, but I don’t like it when they tamper with beloved or well known franchises" Tamper? Nah bud, that makes even less sense as they are the authority on the matter as its THEIR GAME. So I don't know how they can "tamper" when they are the default authority. They decide what is or isn't in their games. Not you or me.

My opinion next gen, stop getting so caught up in what other folks do with their games, it makes little sense to out right assume "agenda or politics seems to be more important than making an imaginative or enjoyable experience" , its doesn't make sense to assume a game with a gay character was SOLELY made for that no different then it doesn't make sense to seriously assume a game with a STRAIGHT character was solely made for that.

some people just wanna bitch and moan about having to look at natural Black hairstyles or having to play as a woman/gay person man

the Woke Agenda™ is undeniable, don't try to fight it with common sense

there's no possible way that a game company would just "greenlight" having a gay person or a black protagonist from conception to writing to storyboarding to revision to testing to finish in a 2-3 year development cycle


It is clearly the Woke Police™ kidnapping literally every head of design and brainwashing them with Wokeness in order to corrupt every AAA (and indie) game on earth into forcing last-minute SJW pandering decisions into launch

it's so cancer, gaming is ruined foreverrr

 

[xpresstuning]

I remember a thread on retard era "Would games be better under comunism" so I am not surprised.

And around 70 per cent agreed the industry would be better. Bunch of delusional fucks. Nothing it's better under comunism. It's always quite pathetic seeing folks from 1st world countries championing comunism. They wouldn't last a month under a comunist regime

I'll be painfully frank here concerning communist supporters. They can go suck down Stalin's and Mao's dick and after that read "The Gulag Archipelago" by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

 

[Woopah]

As gaming grows and establishes itself in new markets the characters portrayed in games will get more diverse. There's no need for anything to be "forced"

 

[PanzerAzel]

? Its relevant because she is human and its normal for humans to behave as such. The Last Of Us is a series about humans vs monsters and yes....humans vs humans trying to get to a "normal" and that involves relationships too. It would be like trying to question why Glenn marries Maggie in the Walking Dead, be like "I'd be left equally bewildered as to how it was relevant in ANY sense" ....

Trailers exist to serve a purpose. That purpose isn't to show that humans "behave as such", that they are trying to achieve "normal", that it "involves relationships too", or anything that requires a grander context to address and validate. They exist to convey what is to come respective to the material of which they are designed to promote in overall gist, in micro context where brevity doesn't afford elaboration, thus enforcing a strict focus on priority of narrative. Trailers are mere minutes long trying to encapsulate dozens and dozens of hours of player experience. That binds it; it enforces relevance in its production. Leave the specific shit for the full game.

I disagree. You've not played the game to argue what is or isn't out of place. Thats like looking at a trailer for Breaking Bad before it releases and seeing a opening cryptic scene is "out of place".....as if you actually saw the entire show to KNOW what is or isn't relevant to the actual story. So that shows openings do that often where they take something that looks irrelevant and later in the episode or another episode you find out why its actually relevant.

I don't need to play the game to understand that what the trailer established was the most superficial of relations that appeared to be nothing but carnal in nature. If it's not out of place it is entirely unsubstantiated and pointless, because even if the final game shows that their relation is significant, the trailer did absolutely nothing to indicate it. It was useless, because it just as well conveyed the superficial. I know their relation ultimately isn't, but ND painted it as nothing much more than infatuation.

If you have eyes that work, that is clearly a very easy thing to understand with that trailer.

And if you have a brain that works, you'd understand that there's two possibilities that intimacy is indicative of: 1), that it is borne simply of infatuation and lust, or 2) that there is a significant relationship underneath. Explain to me what type of relationship you believe the trailers implied between Ellie and Dina, and why? Again, I think it was very intentional they framed it in such a way to draw attention to the orientation to score representation points.

Nah bud, they are free to make the trailer how they feel just. If this person is significant to the character, they are 100% allowed to make that the focal point of a trailer. So because you are confused that humans kiss we need to not have it in the trailer? smh.

If this character is so important to Ellie, what does it serve to have a meaningless kiss that fails to establish and distinguish that significance? Because, as I keep saying, a kiss can also indicate the most superficial of intent that ISN'T significant. It doesn't prove anything past surface affection without greater context, so again, on what basis are you automatically granting it this benefit?

Nah bud, a lot of us don't judge so damn harshly on such things. People kiss....thats it. They are establishing a relationship exist, they are free to show that point any way they feel like it either sudden, subtile, in your face etc. The issue you have is you fail to realize people are different, there is not this rule book on how every acts or should act and anything against must mean secret agenda and should raise "brow" or something.

They can show it any way they want, sure, and I'm free to call it out as an agenda, which it is, backed by evidence outside of the trailers and from the studio itself, which you guys conveniently ignore and continually dismiss. I mean ffs, the game has a lesbian, bi, trans, and makes an appeal to the androgynous in one of its main character designs, all in one game. Yet I'm the loony tune bigot for suspecting an agenda's at play? Right. And just to note, I've no problem with any of the aforementioned, with diversity (I'm bi myself), what I do have problems with are agendas when they become detrimental, which I believe Neil has caused by his sloppy, premature, and hamfisted execution.

You know what my rule of thumb is regarding this? Does it happen in real life? Oh it does...

Fair game. Thats it.

Things are far more nuanced and intricate than you perceive them to be. Everything is fair game, sure, that doesn't mean it can't be used to various effect, both beneficial and detrimental.

For a narrative regarding revenge, it seems odd to then question WHY show footage of the great times they had of a person that literally might be the focal point of said revenge...

My god, thats like trying to say you um " it would certainly raise my brow. I don't know why it doesn't yours." with a Punisher Trailer to a show or film where Frank is with his family and hugging, kissing and enjoy life. Yup, this is out of place showing him actually enjoy what will be taken from him in a fucking NARRATIVE ABOUT REVENGE, must be dat pesky family agenda with Hallmark trying to sell more of dem cards doe lol

I'll take this as a tacit admission that you're unfamiliar with the leaks (which I cannot discuss here), as you have to be to hold such a position. Cheers.

 

[EDMIX]

As gaming grows and establishes itself in new markets the characters portrayed in games will get more diverse. There's no need for anything to be "forced"

I don't disagree with you, but good luck getting anyone else to see it that way. Anything different is "woke" and or "forced" to them.

 

[Faenrir]

Meh i don't care as long as the game is good...
Also, some devs might not go with minorities because they feel they'd make a stereotyped character.

 

[Lunk]

If anything Next Gen is going to be the backlash against all the crap the social consensus is increasingly tired of, and a voice for the anti-woke crowd. And I don't want it to be this us vs them thing, but there's an aspect of that, and I think with extremes comes a return of moderation, and I expect to see that in the future. I think even lefties will inevitably go "Hey aren't we a bit too serious?" and that will become some meta thing in game marketing. You have to remember a lot of snarky teenagers are currently growing up with adults screaming and acting like babies around them. Once their creation generation comes about they're going to make fun of it.

 

[EDMIX]

Trailers exist to serve a purpose. That purpose isn't to show that humans "behave as such"

The point you are making is invalid, as the trailers point very much can be that as thats based on the developer.

Explain to me what type of relationship you believe the trailers implied between Ellie and Dina, and why? Again, I think it was very intentional they framed it in such a way to draw attention to the orientation to score representation points.

They are in a romantic relationship as to why they danced, were close to each other and clearly kissed. To even argue it MUST be to "to score representation points." is like trying to say the Days Gone trailer is by the alt right "to score representation points" You telling me nothing can fucking exist in a game or any work that is made by creative choice and it MUST BE for agendaz? Nothing else? smh.

If this character is so important to Ellie, what does it serve to have a meaningless kiss

Nah bud, in the context of the game, that is not "meaningless" to her....

You are just too stuck on everything must be agenda man. Might as well argue guys in Call Of Duty is alt right agenda as its just done "to score representation points".

Drake kisses girl "to score representation points."
Decon kisses girl "to score representation points."
Sly kisses that Fox be like "to score FURRY agenda representation points"
Spyro and Elora "to score bestiality agenda representation points.

and on and on and on.

This is where we have to put you on that ignore list friend. You seem to be stuck on this whole "it must be a agenda if it upsets me" thing that many sjw seem to be stuck on.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

You do have some good and interesting points EDMIX. I just feel there has been a gradual shift that the entertainment industry has adopted and is now embracing. It’s probably worst in the movie industry though honestly. Have you heard about the rumors of them making Star Trek’s Captain Kirk bisexual? Batman’s butler Alfred sexual orientation changes rumors? Have you seen the black Wonder Woman? Why not just create a new black female superhero instead of changing an popular character’s race? Gender swapping popular movies. That’s what I mean by tampering with established characters? Are you sure there’s nothing going on?

I think what people are saying with the TLOU2 trailer, is the very first thing we see above all else was Ellie’s sexual orientation in a well known gritty action game as if that serves any importance to the game’s first impressions.

The climate in the game industry has irrefutably changed, especially in the West where the eccentric beehives will relentlessly attack you if you don’t conform to certain viewpoints. Why did DOA6 feel the need to tone down the sexiness? To satiate the people in the West. Why are Japanese developers now having to censor or change certain games right when Sony relocated to California? Remember the Persona 5 Royal incident? Saw what happened with Iroha in Samurai Shodown on Twitter recently? Mortal Kombat 11? The Battlefield 5 controversy when one of the stories were rewritten? What’s with the masculinization of so many female characters now? Why can’t we get more Bayonettas and Ivys? I think we know the answer to that.

The video game industry is supposed to be a form of creative expression and art with freedom. Again, developers can make the games they want and put in the ideologies they choose, but they shouldn’t have to restrict their creativity in fear of backlash. Put in a black, Asian character, female or whatever because you want, not to fill some political checklist or to score brownie points with certain groups and demographics. Maybe I am jumping to conclusions somewhat, but I got a feeling we are going to see things only get worst. We’ll see what happens.

 

[PanzerAzel]

They are in a romantic relationship as to why they danced, were close to each other and clearly kissed. To even argue it MUST be to "to score representation points." is like trying to say the Days Gone trailer is by the alt right "to score representation points" You telling me nothing can fucking exist in a game or any work that is made by creative choice and it MUST BE for agendaz? Nothing else? smh.

Not in the game, in the trailer. This is a very important distinction, and I've nothing to say in context of the full work. My argument doesn't apply in that framework.

Nah bud, in the context of the game, that is not "meaningless" to her....

Not in THE GAME. In the TRAILER. Make this distinction ffs, it shouldn't be that difficult. You really come off as someone who doesn't give anything any real consideration and is exceptionally simplistic in your thinking.

This is where we have to put you on that ignore list friend. You seem to be stuck on this whole "it must be a agenda if it upsets me" thing that many sjw seem to be stuck on.

Seriously? If you've honestly placed me on ignore for simply of a variance of respectful opinion, then really.......all I can say is to go crawl back to ERA where you belong so you can go report me to the mods to have me banned simply for disagreement. If such an exchange makes you ignore, then I'm sorry for you.

 

[EDMIX]

Good and interesting points EDMIX. I just feel there has been a gradual shift that the entertainment industry has adopted and is now embracing. It’s probably worst in the movie industry though honestly.

For example, when the first thing we see in the TLOU2 trailer was Ellie’s sexual orientation, imho that shows me that this is the primary focus of the game at the time or first impression and they wanted the audience to know above all else.

The climate in the game industry has irrefutably changed, especially in the West where the eccentric beehives will relentlessly attack you if you don’t conform to certain viewpoints. Why did DOA6 feel the need to tone down the sexiness? To satiate the people in the West. Why are Japanese developers now having to censor certain games right when Sony relocated to a California? Remember the Persona 5 Royal incident? Saw what happened with Iroha in Samurai Shodown on Twitter recently? The Battlefield 5 controversy when one of the stories were rewritten? What’s with the masculinization of so many female characters now? Why can’t we get more Bayonettas and Ivys? Oh, that’s right....because they will offend people who will never even play the games in the first place.

The video game industry is supposed to be a form of creative expression and art with freedom. Again, developers can make the games they want and put in the ideologies they choose, but they shouldn’t have to restrict their creativity in fear of backlash. Put in a black, Asian character, female or whatever because you want, not to fill some political checklist or to score brownie points with certain groups and demographics. Maybe I am jumping to conclusions somewhat, but I got a feeling we are going to see things only get worst. We’ll see what happens.

I disagree greatly. I think you are just seeing the freedom from some creators to create that have been creating content for a long time.

"For example, when the first thing we see in the TLOU2 trailer was Ellie’s sexual orientation" I mean...look at how you are even phrasing it. You are not saying you are seeing 2 characters kiss to establish a plot point, its first thing you see is da "sexual orientation"

So we saying the same thing about Days Gone?


Is that solely just to establish the sexual orientation of Decon?

So the issue is that folks are trying to fucking take EVERY LAST ACTION as a sign of "must be wokez agendaz". If you can't apply that fairly to all kisses in all games or in all works, it makes no sense to then argue it must be for some agenda and nothing else, as you might as well argue Anita is right and the "agendaz" exist as that is her entire argument. White guy in game, must be agenda cause why else would white guy be in game etc /s

Arguing it about a different demographic doesn't make the argument make any more sense.

So all I see is people using Fear Effect as an example, but ignoring those same people would just argue Fear Effect if released TODAY is da "agendaz" as if you can read anyone's mind to even fucking know WHY they put something in a game or not. To argue this is to say all games using this logic are agendaz.

If Ghost In The Shell released TODAY you'd argue it was some agenda...

? What’s with the masculinization of so many female characters now?

?Now? Some rule existed that stated we couldn't do it before? So you are simply arguing happenchance. You not knowing it existed before doesn't mean it was based on some agenda to do it NOW, it simply means you may not know such a thing wasn't banned or off limits before or something.

Why can’t we get more Bayonettas and Ivys?

Can't? What law was made that you can't? No limit exist on something like that to make some strange argument about it...

Oh, that’s right....because they will offend people who will never even play the games in the first place.

Like you? I mean...read your own post. Think about what you yourself are saying...

I got a feeling we are going to see things only get worst.

and

I don’t like it when they tamper with beloved or well known franchises.

and

my largest concerns with next generation

You know what my concerns are? If the game is fucking fun....thats it. I don't care what they believe, who they pray to, who they vote for etc. I see no reason to get mad over such a thing and then be like " will offend people who will never even play the games in the first place." only to also say stuff like "I don’t like it when they tamper with beloved or well known franchises"

So you know folks will be offended while you are doing the same "concern" with the same thing simply with different demographics?

Whats your solution? We only make games you like? The way you like? come on man. You have to see how weird any of this is to get mad at folks getting offended, only to be offended by the inclusion of something cause it could be an agenda when you were JUST mad about folks that might be offended by the lack of something as a agenda...

You are simply disputing that you'd be the other side of the coin in that respect.

Put it in and its an agenda to you. Thus you get "concerned" about it being "tampered"
Take it out and its an agenda to them and "will offend people"

THIS my friend is why I only play games for fun and fully allow the developer to openly and freely create what the fuck they feel like.

developers can make the games they want and put in the ideologies they choose, but they shouldn’t have to restrict their creativity in fear of backlash.

This 1000%, but no "but", keep that same energy. Stop pretending you really mean that only to then attack developers with this whole "I don’t like it when they tamper with beloved or well known franchises".

They should not be attacked and always bothered with this whole accusation that them including something MUST be to

fill some political checklist or to score brownie points with certain groups and demographics.

So some of those Ubisoft Assassins Creed titles could have 3 teams involved with over 1000 developers, you telling me you going to make sure all of them are not doing something to do some deep dive on all their social media to ensure they don't "fill some political checklist or to score brownie points with certain groups and demographics"? smh.

Come on man. You don't know why they put in what they put in unless they legit openly say so, but relax with alllllllll those assumptions simply based on a fucking demographic in a game. Last time I checked, that was the entire SJW argument btw. Whiteguy in game, must be agenda to score points etc.

 

[Tiamat2san]

I don’t mind if they want to pass their view of the world in a game.
If it’s displease me , I won’t buy another game from the same guys.
But People change, opinions too.
Some people loved Druckman and now hates him.
Are they wrong ? Is he wrong?

It’s like a movie.
I love John carpenter’s movies.
I love rob zombie’s movies.
I loved both version of Halloween.

If Michael bay makes an Halloween remake, I won’t see it unless there’s some tangible proof that is different than the usual movies he has done.

I will never watch another fast and furious movie in my life because it is not for me.
And I will see some indépendant horror stuff because it’s my thing.

So I’ll give druckman a chance because I loved the previous one.
If this one is bad , I won’t buy the next one.

I love sexy women with big boobs in a game but sometimes it is not mandatory.

To finish I am against censorship unless it is a content designed arm others.
(Pedophiles stuff, terrorist propaganda...)

Édit: i said random things , not sure if it’s comprehensible

 

[Danjin44]

I'm sorry some of you guys making thing way more complicated than it actually is. Yoko Taro said the reason he design 2B the way she is because he simply likes sexy designs, you can make stupid political argument that he is try to shove "sexy design" down our throat but the fact is he just like put that in his game.

Same story with Last of Us part 2, like it or not thats story he wants tell and no one is "forcing" anybody to play it if they don't want to.....its really that simple.

AGAIN I will use this quote:

Yoko Taro: “You’re all free to expect whatever you want. And we’re also free to betray those expectations, however we want. Everything is free… long live freedom…”

So some of you guys can stress over whats "woke" and whats not and rest of us will just simply enjoy the game.