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[Thirty7ven]

I’m floored by the play times some of you have posted on this game. Three hundred hours, four hundred hours, like what the fuck. In three months for a game that plays as crappy as this, with so many limitations, and terrible exploration. I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a mediocre game carried so hard by a segment of console fanboys. It’s crazy, absolutely crazy.

 

[kyussman]

Nice of them to let everyone know there are still in the process of developing the game they already released and charged full price for......great stuff!

 

[FinalBossWithTheMostPower]

 

[Giallo Corsa]

Nice of them to let everyone know there are still in the process of developing the game they already released and charged full price for......great stuff!

To be fair , isn't that what CDPR has been doing for...3 whole years with Cyberpunk 2077 ?
And yet, after all the furore, people are back singing praises at CDPR...

Having said that, you're right

It is what it is (unfortunately)

 

[gaming_again]

Cyberpunk had brilliant writing and characters from the start. As well as a compelling setting and overall creative vision. These lie at the heart of single player RPGs. It just needed smoothing out. No redemption for Starfield exists because it lacks all of those elements.

 

[kyussman]

To be fair , isn't that what CDPR has been doing for...3 whole years with Cyberpunk 2077 ?
And yet, after all the furore, people are back singing praises at CDPR...

Having said that, you're right

It is what it is (unfortunately)

Of course,I'm not accusing them of being the only devs to do this,it's pretty common these days.I was once looking forward to playing Cyberpunk,I think what they did with the PS4 version of that game was criminal.....they will not be getting my money again any time soon.I think people love video games so much it's easy for them to overlook this stuff,especially younger gamers.....I've entered the 'Clint Eastwood in Gran Torino' part of my life and I simply won't put up with this,lol.

 

[mayham2199]

Thank you.



I'm sure you had a great time.

The PC version of the game was also a known dumpster fire when it launched. Less than the PS4/XBO versions but a fire nonetheless.

For some people maybe. Me and a coworker played and beat it on pc without issue. We had some bugs don’t get me wrong but nothing to crazy and far from a dumpster fire.

 

[Spyxos]

I don’t get the Cyberpunk 2077 comparisons.

Cyberpunk had a very strong foundation at launch despite the unfinished and missing features as well as all the bugs.

This really doesn’t, it’s an extremely outdated game design wise in almost every way, I don’t think there’s any saving this. Those who like the game will probably enjoy these updates but I can’t see it attracting others.

As you say, Cyberpunk was an interesting but unfinished game. There is no interesting story or characters in Starfield. They could remove all the loading times and improve the gameplay itself. But I don't think it will help the game this late in the process. You won't be able to rewrite and improve the boring quests so easily.

 

[Hugare]

To be fair , isn't that what CDPR has been doing for...3 whole years with Cyberpunk 2077 ?
And yet, after all the furore, people are back singing praises at CDPR...

Having said that, you're right

It is what it is (unfortunately)

Cyberpunk's problems were mostly bugs related.

It didnt have many of the gameplay features that it has today, but like ... it had a map

Starfield problems arent technical, they are design related. Which is much more worrisome.

They made exploration worse than it was more than 10 years ago

This is a really good video about it, imo

 

[Metnut]

Are they fixing the randomly generated empty planets/dungeons?

 

[Dane]

If people are willing to give a pass to Cyberpunk who couldn't even ship with a police system for three years, then definetely Starfield has a chance

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Cyberpunk's problems were mostly bugs related.

It didnt have many of the gameplay features that it has today, but like ... it had a map

Starfield problems arent technical, they are design related. Which is much more worrisome.

They made exploration worse than it was more than 10 years ago

This is a really good video about it, imo

I don't understand this.

Does Cyberpunk has a sophisticated game design where it encourages you to go out and explore till you fall into a rabbit hole of quests?

From what I have played it feels like old Farcry games, every new objective pops up on game map whenever you clear a quest.

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

I'm guessing they will have the M class ship parts to build carriers and add in the buildable space station (that a mod has unlocked). I doubt they will change the on foot travel for a "motorized" travel.

 

[Punished Miku]

There is no interesting story or characters in Starfield.

I can think of at least half a dozen things I hope they explore in future expansions. At a minimum, I'm assuming we're getting a full new Va'ruun city full of quests. We literally haven't even seen 1 of the big 3 core political factions, on par with UC and Freestar.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Must be sad to hold such negativity against a game and the company that developed it.

Too bad you didn't bring your Kumbaya CD when you were taking shots at Spider-Man 2's relatively minor bugs.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Too bad you didn't bring your Kumbaya CD when you were taking shots at Spider-Man 2's relatively minor bugs.

I played Spider-Man 2 got the platinum and thoroughly enjoyed it. There's a difference about a buggy launch and repeatedly attempting to belittle people that are enjoying a game or shitting on a game without playing it. I played FFXVI and thought it was dog shit. I made it clear how bad I thought it was and moved on.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

I played Spider-Man 2 got the platinum and thoroughly enjoyed it. There's a difference about a buggy launch and repeatedly attempting to belittle people that are enjoying a game or shitting on a game without playing it. I played FFXVI and thought it was dog shit. I made it clear how bad I thought it was and moved on.

Cool, so that energy will be kept up then!

Btw, who's shitting on a game in here without playing it?

 

[DaGwaphics]

Starfield is an amazing, fun game to get lost in as it launched.

Some kind of buggy that could be used on planets or something would be a nice addition if it is possible. They seem to have a lot of plans for it regarding updates and expansions, will be interesting to see how much better they can make it.

 

[avin]

It's not on their list, but I hope they get around to reworking the space combat to have a higher skill ceiling. Maybe talk to "real" flight sim types, give this another think. Give the player more SA, let them have some advance knowledge of enemy ships before engagement, let them plan. Maybe rework the boost and energy depletion mechanics. What they have now feels more than a little random. The shipbuilding is hands down the absolute best part of this game, but it could matter much more than it currently does.

avin

 

[Lucifers Beard]

The core game is just a bit shit though. They should have gone with planet landings and making it all just a bit more immersive. They said they were also going for NASA punk but then added fucking space magic to the game which is rubbish.

Fell off this game in around 10 hours and won't go back. I've got Cyberpunk 2077 for my Sci-fi RPG needs and that game at this point is legendary and easily a 10/10 in my opinion.

 

[adamsapple]

Starfield is an amazing, fun game to get lost in as it launched.

Some kind of buggy that could be used on planets or something would be a nice addition if it is possible. They seem to have a lot of plans for it regarding updates and expansions, will be interesting to see how much better they can make it.

Different mode of transportation for SP games generally mean like a booster pack, SF already has that so maybe we'll see more variations of that and/or definitely some plenatary exploration things to move about faster.

Cause you know when the official mod tools come out, that's one of the first thing people are gonna mod in as well.

I’m floored by the play times some of you have posted on this game. Three hundred hours, four hundred hours, like what the fuck. In three months for a game that plays as crappy as this, with so many limitations, and terrible exploration. I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a mediocre game carried so hard by a segment of console fanboys. It’s crazy, absolutely crazy.

"Why do people like the thing I don't like".

 

[Hugare]

I don't understand this.

Does Cyberpunk has a sophisticated game design where it encourages you to go out and explore till you fall into a rabbit hole of quests?

From what I have played it feels like old Farcry games, every new objective pops up on game map whenever you clear a quest.

It does what it was meant to do pretty well. That's what I meant.

Can't say the same about Starfield. It promissed to be an space exploration game, but you have to face sometimes 5 different loading screens to get to another planet.

If you cant do an space exploration game, if your tech is not there yet, then dont.

I would rather have 1 planet with (almost) seamless exploration like past Bethesda games than 1000 procedural generated planets separated by many loading screens

 

[Punished Miku]

you have to face sometimes 5 different loading screens to get to another planet.

If you're not encumbered you can fast travel to any planet in one screen, and you don't even have to be on your ship.

If you are encumbered then you need to get on your ship manually (1), and then even if you manually take off just for fun to get in orbit which is entirely optional (1), then warp (1) that's only 3 at the max. At all times you can go pretty much anywhere in the universe in 1 or 2 screens. It's fine to not like the game, but why exaggerate?

 

[BigLee74]

Also, just look at Redfall and then Halo Infinite. These games are also Xbox 1st party games Day 1 on Gamepass and both has not been improved much.

Please don’t speak shite, especially with regards to Halo which has been significantly improved and is being actively improved.

 

[Flutta]

Hey cyber punk made a good game from trash…. What’s the chances happens again?

The core of CP77 was not trash. Game was just broken during release on console. I played on PC and it was mostly fine.

Starfield has a different issue it’s core gameplay loop + story is mid/trash. For Beth to fix that they need to rework the whole thing.

 

[Outlier]

"New ways to travel"? Whatcha mean? Ground vehicles? Why bother?

Fast traveling is the most efficient form of travel. Should've got it right the first time and made normal travel engaging!

 

[Hugare]

If you're not encumbered you can fast travel to any planet in one screen, and you don't even have to be on your ship.

If you are encumbered then you need to get on your ship manually (1), and then even if you manually take off just for fun to get in orbit which is entirely optional (1), then warp (1) that's only 3 at the max. At all times you can go pretty much anywhere in the universe in 1 or 2 screens. It's fine to not like the game, but why exaggerate?

You can

But if you actually want to not skip gameplay in an space exploration game, including using your ship to get around, then yeah, you'll face some loading screens

As shown in the video that I've posted, if you want to go to another planet by not skipping gameplay: there will be a loading screen to get into your ship, then another one to take off, then pick your destination from space to fast travel to in another loading screen, then click into a planet to land in another loading screen. So 4 loading screens instead of 5, my bad.

If you need to fast travel, entirely making your ship useless in order to have fun in a space exploration game, then you have a problem

Can you say the same about any other open world game? Imagine fast travelling around in RDR 2, GTA V, or heck, other Bethesda open world games. How much stuff from the experience you would miss on.

But in Starfield, fast travel is a necessity, oherwise you'll just loose your time.

It's ridiculous that you have to rely on fast travel to have fun in a game where you should be enticed to explore

 

[Punished Miku]

in Starfield, fast travel is a necessity, oherwise you'll just loose your time

In space fast travel is kind of a necessity. That's literally what a warp drive is. Mass Effect had nothing but fast travel too. If you travel between planets without a warp drive it would take longer than you would be alive. I don't get it honestly. It plays out like any space TV show I've watched like Battlestar Galactica, Star Trek, etc. You jump to planets. You can get ambushed and fly and fight, or power up the drives and jump out.

 

[FingerBang]

I don’t get the Cyberpunk 2077 comparisons.

Cyberpunk had a very strong foundation at launch despite the unfinished and missing features as well as all the bugs.

This really doesn’t, it’s an extremely outdated game design wise in almost every way, I don’t think there’s any saving this. Those who like the game will probably enjoy these updates but I can’t see it attracting others.

There is nothing to get. Those people either haven't played Cyberpunk at launch or are simply fanboys trying to defend their product.

Cyberpunk had technical issues, it was an unfinished product, but reviewed great on PC because of all the good things it had.

Starfield is a polished game for Bethesda standards, but it has a crappy gameplay loop and boring characters and story. They can absolutely improve it, but the situations are far from the same unless they revamp the game.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

You can

But if you actually want to not skip gameplay in an space exploration game, including using your ship to get around, then yeah, you'll face some loading screens

As shown in the video that I've posted, if you want to go to another planet by not skipping gameplay: there will be a loading screen to get into your ship, then another one to take off, then pick your destination from space to fast travel to in another loading screen, then click into a planet to land in another loading screen. So 4 loading screens instead of 5, my bad.

If you need to fast travel, entirely making your ship useless in order to have fun in a space exploration game, then you have a problem

Can you say the same about any other open world game? Imagine fast travelling around in RDR 2, GTA V, or heck, other Bethesda open world games. How much stuff from the experience you would miss on.

But in Starfield, fast travel is a necessity, oherwise you'll just loose your time.

It's ridiculous that you have to rely on fast travel to have fun in a game where you should be enticed to explore

Have you played No Mans Sky?

How much difference does seamless travel make? What exactly will you explore in space? It's supposed to be empty.

To it's credit, lifting off from a planet in NMS does feel cool every time. But it doesn't make game more interesting.

 

[damidu]

In space fast travel is kind of a necessity. That's literally what a warp drive is. Mass Effect had nothing but fast travel too. If you travel between planets without a warp drive it would take longer than you would be alive. I don't get it honestly. It plays out like any space TV show I've watched like Battlestar Galactica, Star Trek, etc. You jump to planets. You can get ambushed and fly and fight, or power up the drives and jump out.

must be nice in the alternate universe where stuff like nms, elite etc. don't exist. it's a solved problem.
they hyped a space exploration game, where space consists of loading screens and planet.pngs. get over it.
not even going into the stuff happening once you are on those planets, thats where the bigger problems begin.

 

[Hugare]

In space fast travel is kind of a necessity. That's literally what a warp drive is. Mass Effect had nothing but fast travel too. If you travel between planets without a warp drive it would take longer than you would be alive. I don't get it honestly. It plays out like any space TV show I've watched like Battlestar Galactica, Star Trek, etc. You jump to planets. You can get ambushed and fly and fight, or power up the drives and jump out.

So the loadings are there for lore reasons? Oh man ...

It should be obvious, but an exploration game is different from a TV show. In a game like this you'll be going back and forth between planets. You'll experience those same loading screen cutscenes over, and over, and over again. I cant imagine how much time someone that had played the game for more than 200h wasted with loading screens if he didnt abuse the fast travel system.

Mass Effect (you are comparing it to a game from 2007, btw) also has 1 loading screen from your ship to any planet on the galaxy. So Starfield is the same as a 16 years old game .. yay? I doubt that the next Mass Effect will have as many loading screens as Starfield. Probably none.

Loading screens are bad for immersion. Thats why every open world game has minimal loading screens compared to Starfield for more than a decade.

Bethesda would ditch all these loading screens if their ancient tech allowed them to.

 

[Punished Miku]

must be nice in the alternate universe where stuff like nms, elite etc. don't exist. it's a solved problem.

I mean yeah, that's cool in No Man's Sky. I just don't think every single game must be exactly the same. Mass Effect is one of the most loved space RPGs of all time, and it doesn't do that. I can still play Mass Effect in 2023 and just because No Man's Sky did something cool, it doesn't retroactively make me hate the other way its done. I just don't think we look at gaming the same at all. I can't even imagine the mindset of someone that is fine playing a space game in 2017, and then No Man's Sky comes out in 2018 and suddenly everything is trash that doesn't do that one thing from. I'm fine with a variety of approaches. Starfield was in development for longer than 2018, so even if they literally wanted to copy their game it was probably too late, and we all know their engine has never done this. Just seems like you would rather this game not even exist since it was never going to even attempt to do what you're bringing up.

Bethesda would ditch all these loading screens if their ancient tech allowed them to.

Obviously.

 

[Atrus]

The game’s core issues lie in its outdated gameplay and its lazy, disinterested development. If they did add faster overland travel, you’d still have the same set procedurally generated points of interests to kill enemies for loot that doesn’t really matter.

Even the folks who did the Together multiplayer mods for Skyrim abandoned their Starfield version due to lack of interest and the fact the game isn’t worth the time or effort (“fucking trash” to use their words).

It’s been 4 months and they’ve done very little overall to update the game and people are just going to move on.

 

[Hugare]

I mean yeah, that's cool in No Man's Sky. I just don't think every single game must be exactly the same. Mass Effect is one of the most loved space RPGs of all time, and it doesn't do that. I can still play Mass Effect in 2023 and just because No Man's Sky did something cool, it doesn't retroactively make me hate the other way its done. I just don't think we look at gaming the same at all. I can't even imagine the mindset of someone that is fine playing a space game in 2017, and then No Man's Sky comes out in 2018 and suddenly everything is trash that doesn't do that one thing from. I'm fine with a variety of approaches. Starfield was in development for longer than 2018, so even if they literally wanted to copy their game it was probably too late, and we all know their engine has never done this. Just seems like you would rather this game not even exist since it was never going to even attempt to do what you're bringing up.


Obviously.

I've replayed ME Trilogy recently, and again, they are very different games with very different proposals compared to Starfield

ME (specially 2 and 3) are very linear games. When you go to a planet, you usually get shit done. With the exception of those procedural generated ones in ME with nothing to see, when you land on a planet you usually get some meaty story progression with cutscenes and etc., you spend hours there and there alone.

In Starfield, in most missions you gotta jump to a planet, talk to person A, then jump to planet B, talk to person B, then go back to planet A to finish the mission with person A. It's tiresome.

And again, it's all about what the game intentions were. ME is a linear game, while Starfield was meant to be an exploration game. So the presence of loading screens in both games have different weight.

An open world game should be as seamless as possible, so the player feels compeled to explore and find stuff. Thats why you rarely fast traveled in Bethesda or Rockstar games, 'cause you may get some sidequest while going to your objective, a cave that you have never seen before, or a new NPC.

There's none of that if you are jumping around to finish missions. And even if you dont, there's also none of that, so you might as well jump around to save your time.

 

[StereoVsn]

People really don't understand that some people love starfield.

Some people love and adore death Stranding, others think its a steaming pile of rancid poo but I don't think ive ever seen a game get so much energy as Starfield gets applied to it.

We all know games aren't for everyone but somehow, some people can't accept that to millions of people, starfield is a good game.

Must be sad to hold such negativity against a game and the company that developed it.

The issue is that Starfield is Bethesda’s worst game since Daggerfall if we don’t count Fallout 76.

I have been playing their games since Arena days and i have 0 interest in Starfield after seeing the issues. I am not motivated enough to grab a free month of GamePass to even try.

There are boring characters, iffy dialogues, completely hobbled “exploration” (having to take off and land on same planet after just a relatively short run is something), no quests or really much of anything at all interesting outside cities and much, much more.

In Morrowind, Oblivion, Fallout 3 and NV, Skyrim and even Fallout 4 there was always something on the horizon. With Starfield there are only some fully copy/paste (with enemy placement even) outposts.

You have fans of Bethesda’s games fans(despite jank) who have been first disappointed with Fallout 4, then got a shit show of Fallout 76 and now got Starfield.

It’s a very weak showing and it’s very unfortunate. This isn’t some bashing of Xbox, this is yet another letdown by Bethesda A-team.

 

[b0uncyfr0]

No amount of content can make me endure the loading screens. Until that's fixed, i dont see the point.

 

[Havoc2049]

Good for Bethesda. I'm sure there will be several rounds of DLC released, so it's only natural that they have quality of life updates as well.

The city map thing was a little weird, but not that big of a deal to me and only Atlantis was a mild challenge to navigate at first and figure out where everything was at. Several runs through the city and I had it down.

 

[KyoZz]

For some people maybe. Me and a coworker played and beat it on pc without issue. We had some bugs don’t get me wrong but nothing to crazy and far from a dumpster fire.

Sorry but no, I can't let you say this. Maybe you did not see those bugs but let me tell you something: 90% of the bugs were tied to the engine and how it was coded, which mean EVERYONE had the same type of bugs and most likely on the same frequency (minus those related to hardware and lower FPS) So when you are saying "my experience was really nice with just a few bugs", I know you are either lying OR blind.

 

[Nitty_Grimes]

Most people have probably finished it and now they bring out a map?

Fix the rock stuck to your ship first but fuck the quality of life fix till next year.

 

[R3TRODYCE]

Sorry but no, I can't let you say this. Maybe you did not see those bugs but let me tell you something: 90% of the bugs were tied to the engine and how it was coded, which mean EVERYONE had the same type of bugs and most likely on the same frequency (minus those related to hardware and lower FPS) So when you are saying "my experience was really nice with just a few bugs", I know you are either lying OR blind.

Lmao so because they had a different experience than you then they are lying or blind. I love the internet

 

[CatLady]

Bring on the expansions.

I was sad when I finished the game at 250 hours and started to play it again but then I decided to wait until; the expansion that came with early access released and I wishing it would hurry up and release so I can play more Starfield.

 

[Solidus_T]

Whatever good will they intend to signal, they've ruined it by going to war with their customer base over steamdb and then killing mods for Skyrim to monetize further mods.

 

[Paltheos]

Just from a glance through the topic there's allot of cope in here. Cyberpunk is a game which was clearly unfinished at launch (which I can speak on from personal experience of playing it pre- and post-patch) and from everything I've heard about Starfield the game's a mess, not even interesting in that way Bethesda games can be fun despite the obvious drawbacks of being a Bethesda game.

Shit needed more time in the oven, and in Bethesda's case they probably need to also get past the year 2006 or demonstrate that they really understand the appeal of their own games.

 

[Raven117]

Cyberpunk was fundamentally in better shape from a design perspective than Starfield.

But hey...maybe they can get it together...but damn....There is alot of very promising stuff coming out...way more competition.

 

[KyoZz]

Lmao so because they had a different experience than you then they are lying or blind. I love the internet

As I said, 90% of bugs were tied to the engine so everyone got them, no matter what.

 

[Denton]

The numbers of chills for CP2077 is amazing. It's like they launched a great game in 2020. Spoiler: it was NOT.
I played on PC day one, maxed out with a very good PC and it was (still is) a buggy mess. I saw someone said "I had only 2 bugs and I played at launch" and I'm like WTF, just open your eyes dude.

Your experience is not universal. I played 30 minutes after it unlocked. I had few glitches, sure. Made fun of a levitating guy right at the start of Nomad path. But I had no significant bugs, only these cosmetic, mostly NPC driven glitches. Sure game would have been better without them, but pretty much every open world game has stuff like that. C77 at launch on PC was still perfectly good enough to be my GOTY.

And guess what? I am not dismissing your experience. But it would be nice if you stopped being arrogant asshole who calls other people blind just because they had a different one.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Game that keeps on giving. 280+ hours in and nowhere near done.

280 hours and no where near done?? Show us the receipts.

 

[Ansphn]

Please don’t speak shite, especially with regards to Halo which has been significantly improved and is being actively improved.

is the improvement on the same level as Cyberpunk? That's my argument.

 

[KyoZz]

Your experience is not universal. I played 30 minutes after it unlocked. I had few glitches, sure. Made fun of a levitating guy right at the start of Nomad path. But I had no significant bugs, only these cosmetic, mostly NPC driven glitches. Sure game would have been better without them, but pretty much every open world game has stuff like that. C77 at launch on PC was still perfectly good enough to be my GOTY.

And guess what? I am not dismissing your experience. But it would be nice if you stopped being arrogant asshole who calls other people blind just because they had a different one.

I guess we have different standards.