JonnyMP3
Member
Kingdoms of Alamur is the one that is probably the best known off the top of my head as a single player flop.
And they're now doing a Rereckoning?? Madness!
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Jez Corden: Don't Expect Xbox to follow Playstation's Exclusive Style Next-Gen
- Thread starter xStoyax
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And they're now doing a Rereckoning?? Madness!
Bo_Hazem
Banned
GamePass and PS Now should include online MP. Both are shit quality for me, because I buy quality games mostly preordered, and I only play games that are worth my time not filler BS. Overall, I think there are enough free to play games that need no PS Plus on PS4/PS5 so that even further makes PS Now not that attractive. Xbox still charges over free games, so let's see that go away first before those pro consumer parades.
If PS Now/Gamepass have PS Plus/Gold at $10 with online MP included, and PS Plus and Gold cut down to $5, then I can see them as "ok" services. But all I can see now on Gamepass is that it's sabotaging AAA games quality.
If PS Now/Gamepass have PS Plus/Gold at $10 with online MP included, and PS Plus and Gold cut down to $5, then I can see them as "ok" services. But all I can see now on Gamepass is that it's sabotaging AAA games quality.
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Ass of Can Whooping
Member
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JonnyMP3
Member
But the risk is expenditure and return.
You weigh up the pros and cons of each. Work out the budget of what you spend and then head in that direction.
If they don't share the same risks in the market... Then you work out the best bet to work on within the risks of 'how much is it going to cost' and 'how much can it make back'
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Exactly.
And after adding all that up, most developers and publishers fund and create single player experiences.
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JonnyMP3
Member
But like...
Most publishers have both!
EA have single and multiplayer games. Ubisoft has SP and MP games. Take Two has SP and MP. Activision/Blizzard has SP and MP.
Every single major publisher in the World has both Single Player and Multiplayer games.
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
For third party games to play best on their console.
They dont have to spend money to develop the game they can just reap the benefits of having the game on their console, get a cut of the sales and show off that it "plays best on xbox" whatever the hell that means.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Sigh...
Me: Most projects are single player games because they're generally safer than multiplayer.
You: But most publishers make both single and multiplayer games!
Just because a publisher makes 9 single player titles for every 1 multiplayer title doesn't mean they're equal.
More and more investment will be placed on multiplayer projects (relative to past investment) because the multiplayer, sandbox boom is upon us.
RCU005
Member
I think Microsoft is craving for the GaaS money. They want to make a Fortnite. They believe it’s a better business model than Sony’s AAA single player, cinematic games.
Microsoft would make Angry Birds, Overwatch, Fortnite, and those kind of games that make so much money out of micro-transactions and subscriptions. They want Xbox to be that.
Microsoft would make Angry Birds, Overwatch, Fortnite, and those kind of games that make so much money out of micro-transactions and subscriptions. They want Xbox to be that.
PharaoTutAnchAmun
Member
Yeah its not a game theyr is no story in any form the "game" has no endgoal you fly around and thats it. Its a pure Simulator game, just like trainsimulator and so on
JonnyMP3
Member
So EA, who make Battlefield, Battlefront, Titanfall, Apex Legends, Anthem, Need for Speed and all their licenced sports games are mostly Single player are they?
No, it means that EA are already on the multiplayer bandwagon, not the single player on you claim and have been on that multiplayer bandwagon since the 90s. Fifa and Madden say Hi.
Raekwon26
Member
JonnyMP3
Member
Well when you have to make the narrative fit into your delusional outlook in life... It's probably easier to try and delete history from memory rather than accept reality.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
I guess I will just going on playing the games that I want, regardless on which platform they exist.
JTCx
Member
No need for an xbox for the best multiplayer games. The ones developed by MS are mediocre and blends with the oversaturated market.
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Yes that is why they have 3 rpg studios to have them make angry birds and fortnight clones. The FUD in this thread with the GAAS boogie man makes the so called xbox discord look like amateurs.
Gamernyc78
Banned
They all have their mp games and niches. Sony has as many mp games as Xbox in uncharted, tlou, MLB show, dreams, killzone mp, drive club, GT, etcccc BTW mp focused games like Little Big Planet initially made alot of money for Sony in dlc.
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
But make most of their money from the Multiplayer experiences that they also make.
Every major publishers main meal is MP games.
EA - BF, Apex, FIFA, Battlefront
Epic - Fortnite
Ubisoft - R6, For Honor
Take-Two - GTAO, RDRO
Activision - Overwatch, COD
Microsoft - Roblox(dont @ me)
Tencent - FUCKING EVERYTHING!
Effectively Multiplayer games actually fund those single player experiences and experimental games.
A publisher who exclusively funded and published Large Single Player Experiences would release like 1 or 2 games a year and wouldnt even be in the top 10 of publishers......taking a chance on SP games is so scary that big publishers actually rarely do it unless they have some fall back.
If you know you can take a chance on game x, because game y made so much money itll offset the potential loses from game x, you go for it.
Sony can afford to do a bunch of SP games because they are the frikken platform holder....the actual Sony Studios games arent their biggest earners, the platform itself is raking in the money.
A third party publisher? If you want to be in the big leagues you aint doing nothing but SP experiences.
*Major publisher. Dont come at me if you aint smelling a billion dollars, so SquareEnix aint in the race....Sorry.
Amory
Member
I haven't been following the next-gen news very closely, but from what I've seen/heard XSX could be a flop of epic proportions. It's a huge underdog.
Seems MS isn't even going to try to convince you to buy their console over a PS5, they just want you to sign up for gamepass. And without a steady drip of exclusive titles, idk how many people are going to do that.
Seems MS isn't even going to try to convince you to buy their console over a PS5, they just want you to sign up for gamepass. And without a steady drip of exclusive titles, idk how many people are going to do that.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Gold Member
Well I'm sorry you feel that way, but that's how I feel about it. TLOU2 in particular, I just don't think it's a very good story. Maybe I exaggerated saying "most"; I should've said some. But TLOU2 is definitely one of the ones on my list.
There's a lot of reasons, and most of them don't involve what happens to Joel, because I'm not particularly hung up over that. It is what it is; I still think the game is gorgeous, still has some of the best animations in the industry, and the core gameplay mechanics are very solid (if not necessarily innovative). The dialog itself might be good and some of the newcomers are pretty cool like Jesse, but the actual story itself? It's a mess of execution, in many different ways.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
What's wrong with playing a single player game for 20 hours and having a great time? That used to be the goal.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
The exception that proves the rule.
Do you take issue with me saying the wider industry produces more single player games than multiplayer games?
Perhaps this is a better angle. In an attempt to bring it back to Jez Cordens quote.
Starting with the launch of the PS4, how many multiplayer projects did Sony greenlight?
Killzone Shadow Fall, Gran Turismo Sport, MLB The Show, and a smattering of smaller budget indie multiplayer titles. Maybe I'm missing a few.
I think over the next 7 years, Sony will invest much more heavily into multiplayer than they did over the last 7 years. I don't think Sony can afford to follow the script that got them here. Not with XBox becoming a more viable threat in that space.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Alot of well done single player games i play more than 20 hrs Ghost of T, Days Gone, Souls, Bloodborne, tlou 2, etc there can be longevity in sp games especially with replays and diff difficulties.
JonnyMP3
Member
Ubisoft: For Honor, R6S, The Division, AC multiplayer, The Crew, Watch Dogs, Anno 1800.
Activision/Blizzard: Every single COD, Destiny, Overwatch, HOTS, Heathstone, WOW.
EA are not the exception just because you would like them to be.
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Aion002
Member
Do you think that it is riskier for Sony to keep pushing single player games that are acclaimed and sell well, while being almost the solo triple A story driven big published/maker out there, which now is Playstation biggest moving force with the hardcore gamers, than Xbox to dabble in an extreme competitive and saturated market that they have little consolidation?
The whole premisse of Sony being left out on the GAAS market is flawed.... Because GAAS are made by third party, and Playstation will get those. Also, GAAS have to be on various platforms, for example: Apex is the biggest one for EA, you can play on everything (Switch is coming), so is Fortnite from Epic, LOL running on potato pc's and coming to mobile and consoles, Free Fire on mobiles running on anything.... GAAS needs to be everywhere to stay relevant these days, they need a shit ton of players playing every day.
Halo Infinite as GAAS has a flaw, that is glaring, Halo Infinite will not be able to compete with Fortnite and Apex, because one of the most important things that all gaas needs is player retention, they need lot's and lot's of people buying skins, characters and playing so the comunity can grow... Halo Infinite is a high end game locked on PC and Xbox, so potato pc players, nintendo and playstation players won't have access... Which means, if some players have to invest on a GAAS, they will rather do on things with more players and probably friends playing it.
Maybe I am wrong, Halo Infinite and others Xbox gaas will be a success, but if they reach Sea of Thieves levels... That would be expected.
Killer Sakoman
Member
What RPGs? Can you list the exclusive rpgs made by xbox since 2013?
Iced Arcade
Member
Read.
I didn't say anything was wrong with them, in fact I said I loved them. Also said 5 hour tacked on campaign is BS.
Said I can understand "I can understand not focusing on standalone SP games" from a business aspect.
Wasn't shitty on your preferred toy so cool your barrels.
thismeinteil
Member
Since when is halo, fable, gears, forza, and not to mention stuff in the pipeline NOT “Marquee AAA titles”.hillarious post.
Halo sure as hell didn't look AAA. I'll reserve judgement until I see the sequels to the others running on actual XSX HW.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Xbox problem is thy want to be in everything but don't excel in nothing. Gamepass is the string holding them somewhat together but thts a problem because your making a good, financially pro consumer service but what really draws ppl to it? They don't have a Fortnite, alot of games are fluff and the few exclusive gd games like ori are short lived. If Halo looked better than what we saw as Gaas tht definitely might have got me to renew my gamepass but right now I do not feel the urge.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Here's a realistic worst case scenario for Sony.
Halo Infinite becomes the next big multiplayer frenzy.
Spider Man Morales sells 4 million copies.
I'm not saying that will definitely happen, but it's possible.
If games like Halo, EverWild, State of Decay III, Perfect Dark etc become the next big thing in multiplayer, Sony won't be in a favorable position with their expensive, limited AAA single player games.
Neff
Member
Sony's mandate is great console, great games, and that's more or less it outside of numerous proprietary trojan horse enterprises like Blu Ray and PS Plus. It's their bread and butter, they rely on it, and they always deliver when it counts.
Microsoft seems keener on competing by thinking outside the box, almost cynically so at times, but there's only so much of a box to think outside of with the technology we have. There's been times when it's worked for them, and times when it hasn't.
Gamers will always be enticed by great consoles and great games. But I think Sony understands better than MS does that it really is just this simple at the end of the day.
Microsoft seems keener on competing by thinking outside the box, almost cynically so at times, but there's only so much of a box to think outside of with the technology we have. There's been times when it's worked for them, and times when it hasn't.
Gamers will always be enticed by great consoles and great games. But I think Sony understands better than MS does that it really is just this simple at the end of the day.
MasterCornholio
Member
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Clearly we are miscommunicating. I wasn't attacking you per-say. I was attacking the "idea" that from a business perspective it even makes sense to not focus on single-player games. Look at Sony and Nintendo. They both focus on single player games and they are thriving like never before. Only 1 of the big 3 have went away from it and they are losing mindshare.
Aion002
Member
But that's not realistic at all... If Halo Infinite is a success (everybody should hope so), it doesn't mean that Spider Man will sell less or that Sony will be in a unfavorable position, you are projecting your wishes, rather than making a realistic scenario.
You are removing from the equation all the third party studios and Sony's massive success on the single player side of things.
Xbox is not creating GAAS, they are trying to compete on the GAAS market and that's risky, because it can go both ways, while Sony is just betting on the sure horse.
People will buy God of War 2, Spiderman 2 and whatever other big budget game Sony releases and Playstation will still get Fortnite, Call of Duty, Apex and many other GAAS games and probably with exclusive stuff.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
This is literally IMPOSSIBLE! There's only about 5 games that become the "next big multiplayer" thing per generation. You have MS owning ALL of them lol.
Hayabusabruh
Member
That's messed up cause I hear Sony is buying all the 3rd party too. Lol
anothertech
Member
Its a hard thing to hear your fearless leaders say "buy the other console" due to game quality disparity.
Demon2blades
Member
The thing is though has any online game been bigger than Fortnite /cod etc without being on every platform including ps?
Off the top of my head I don't know the player numbers for Fortnite but I'm betting ps crowd is a large part of it so in theory nothing ms could make mp wise would be as big as those titans.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
It's viewed all in terms of marketshare.
If Halo Infinite becomes the next big thing, guess what that does for XBox, GamePass, and Microsoft? It shifts buzz away from the PS5 and places it on Sony's direct competitor. A big multiplayer hit is exponentially more impactful than a big single player hit.
Raekwon26
Member
Seriously, what is this garbage?
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
That sounds like a good idea for the industry.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Nope.
Expensive multiplayer projects are merely an attempt to swing for the fences. Microsoft may strike out on all four games. Sony may keep hitting singles and doubles with their linear AAA games. If MS makes contact though, watch out.
Aion002
Member
They get a successful service.... Sony and the rest of the world keeps doing what they are doing.
It's not because Justin Bieber got millions saying "baby, baby".... That every other musician stopped selling their music.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
So with this analogy, you consider Sony's output this gen as singles and doubles? Have you watched 9 innings of baseball before?
NullZ3r0
Banned
Why are you listing 3rd party games as if they're relevant?
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Right. Jazz music is still being played in small pockets around the country, but pop/hip hop is everywhere. Kinda of like my horse vs cars analogy. Horses are still doing their horse thing, they're just not as prevalent as they were in the 1800s.
Demon2blades
Member
I wouldn't have though you could make an MP bigger than what we have now in terms of Fortnite and stuff because they are on all platforms not just on Xbox though , surely to take the world by storm it would have to be literally on everything including ps like Fortnite is .
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Actually, I do.
Sony hit a lot of singles and doubles last season.
Now it looks like XBox is shopping for a bunch of home run hitters in the off-season.
Let's not pretend that Microsoft and XBox weren't woefully outgunned this generation. They had inferior marketshare, and a stable of paltry first party studios.
MS looks to have corrected both weaknesses in the off-season in preparation for next gen.
In other words, a lack of talent decided the outcome of this generation, not a superior or inferior strategy.
Aion002
Member
As long as both are getting money... You see, Sony gets a shit ton of money from third party gaas games:
PlayStation Makes More Money from DLC, Microtransactions Than Anything Else.
Thought it was BS the first time I heard about it, but... I guess 30% of DLC/Microtransactions from Fortnite, Call of Duty, etc, is a lot of money. https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2020/08/playstation_makes_more_money_from_dlc_microtransactions_than_anything_else
They also sell a lot of exclusives single player games and have the mindshare right now... They won 3 generations.
Your argument can be used on the mobile games market, for example, Aniplex (which is owned by Sony) has a little game called Fate/Grand Order, that is one the most profitables games ever and it problably costed less than 10% of Horizon ZD to make:
Fate/Grand Order Surpasses $4 Billion After Becoming Japan’s Top Grossing Mobile Game of 2019
Fate/Grand Order hits $4 billion in lifetime gross revenue, Sensor Tower data shows.
Should Sony drop Playstation and invest only in Aniplex? Well, it's cheaper and quite profitable... See? Things are not so simples as you pretend it is.... MS releasing 10 successful gaas games, wouldn't affect Playstation as much as you, apparently, wish.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
yeah but they’re going to have all that talent just poop out GamePass filler to sell cheap subs because that’s what I read on GAF. It makes less than 0 business sense but I trust GAF.