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[Warm Machine]

It is not working as good as you think it is

I played a ton of it in October. It was fine besides the ridiculously long loads. It just made me realize Halo 2 MP is really not good and based on tight corridors.

As much as I'm enjoying Halo 5 I'd personally I'd like them to simplify the storyline. Say that there were 7-9 Halos and X number of them have been destroyed and now the race is on to locate and occupy the remaining ones for galactic strategic advantage.

Go open world and build an environment the equivalent size of something like Far Cry 4 or Just Cause 3, See what the ring looks like at that scale with ocean separating the land masses. Then rejig the mission structure to accommodate the open ended world. Halo is effectively already doing the work as it seems to leverages vehicles, AI, and combat in every way but the free roaming.

 

[Joe T.]

I've been with Halo since day 1 and it wasn't long before it became one of my favorite franchises in games, even though I'm the furthest thing from an FPS junkie. Some of my thoughts on it all:

+ The game plays well and just feels right, in large part to the rock steady 60fps. It might be interesting to take the engine running it all and use it to put out a multiplayer version of one map from each of the older games in the series, their abilities and all, to see how the community reacts.

+ New weapons/abilities, whether I like them or not, are always a good thing.

+ Warzone was a great addition. Mixing competing teams of players with enemies brings in a new dynamic that can continue to grow alongside the campaign and standard multiplayer modes.

- Balancing said new weapons/abilities doesn't always have to be done in the obvious manner of introducing counterparts. Having an overpowered weapon, ability, vehicle or even area of the map can sometimes lead to frustration if the player(s) using it is running everyone else over, but the game should have a wealth of maybe not-so-obvious options to tackling it, in much the same way Grand Theft Auto allows you to approach a mission/problem (the PS2 games more so than IV and V, sadly, but you get the idea).

- Req packs are terrible. There are easier/simpler/more intuitive ways of rewarding players without resorting to cards.

- Storytelling. Halo 4 seemed to emphasize story above all else, but Halo 5 went in the opposite direction, to a detrimental degree, maybe relying a bit too much on outside sources or the player's personal experiences within the world. The characters and settings of these games have captured the attention of millions of fans and turned both Master Chief and Cortana into icons. It would be a mistake to continue down this path. Gameplay is king, but in Halo's case I would argue that story is just as important if not more so. More needs to be done to flesh out these characters in the games. Finally giving us Blue Team with barely any character development to be seen was criminal.

- Boss battles. They are a standout sore point that needs to be addressed.

Again, even though I was disappointed by the campaign, I think the game feels just right, so now it's a question of how they'll build on it. Would be nice to see more attention to detail given to the mechanics of the game, like limb-specific damage resulting in hobbling/crawling enemies seeking cover/assistance or vehicles with multiple moving parts taking progressive damage, weakening or impairing weapons/wheels/aiming systems, damaging enemy visors/lights so they struggle to locate you and so on. The mind goes wild thinking up various ways tiny changes can have on the game world as a whole, but now I'm just dreaming like a kid again.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

I've been with Halo since day 1 and it wasn't long before it became one of my favorite franchises in games, even though I'm the furthest thing from an FPS junkie. Some of my thoughts on it all:

+ The game plays well and just feels right, in large part to the rock steady 60fps. It might be interesting to take the engine running it all and use it to put out a multiplayer version of one map from each of the older games in the series, their abilities and all, to see how the community reacts.

+ New weapons/abilities, whether I like them or not, are always a good thing.

+ Warzone was a great addition. Mixing competing teams of players with enemies brings in a new dynamic that can continue to grow alongside the campaign and standard multiplayer modes.

- Balancing said new weapons/abilities doesn't always have to be done in the obvious manner of introducing counterparts. Having an overpowered weapon, ability, vehicle or even area of the map can sometimes lead to frustration if the player(s) using it is running everyone else over, but the game should have a wealth of maybe not-so-obvious options to tackling it, in much the same way Grand Theft Auto allows you to approach a mission/problem (the PS2 games more so than IV and V, sadly, but you get the idea).

- Req packs are terrible. There are easier/simpler/more intuitive ways of rewarding players without resorting to cards.

- Storytelling. Halo 4 seemed to emphasize story above all else, but Halo 5 went in the opposite direction, to a detrimental degree, maybe relying a bit too much on outside sources or the player's personal experiences within the world. The characters and settings of these games have captured the attention of millions of fans and turned both Master Chief and Cortana into icons. It would be a mistake to continue down this path. Gameplay is king, but in Halo's case I would argue that story is just as important if not more so. More needs to be done to flesh out these characters in the games. Finally giving us Blue Team with barely any character development to be seen was criminal.

- Boss battles. They are a standout sore point that needs to be addressed.

Again, even though I was disappointed by the campaign, I think the game feels just right, so now it's a question of how they'll build on it. Would be nice to see more attention to detail given to the mechanics of the game, like limb-specific damage resulting in hobbling/crawling enemies seeking cover/assistance or vehicles with multiple moving parts taking progressive damage, weakening or impairing weapons/wheels/aiming systems, damaging enemy visors/lights so they struggle to locate you and so on. The mind goes wild thinking up various ways tiny changes can have on the game world as a whole, but now I'm just dreaming like a kid again.

me personally not worried about 60fps especially in single player. I'd rather have a much better IQ so I can see things better


If weapons aren't good can't agree they would always be good. The shotguns seem a bit too powerful in a lot of instances, combined with sprint and dashes at least.

 

[el_Nikolinho]

I just want sprint and these other things out

New mobility features are one of the main reasons the game has the best multiplayer in the series. If they get rid of sprint, halo just won't be able to compete with any other console shooter.

When every other shooter is getting faster and adding more mobility options why would they just release a rehash of the halo 3 multiplayer (and I loved halo 3, but it came out nearly ten years ago)

 

[jelly]

I played a ton of it in October. It was fine besides the ridiculously long loads. It just made me realize Halo 2 MP is really not good and based on tight corridors.

As much as I'm enjoying Halo 5 I'd personally I'd like them to simplify the storyline. Say that there were 7-9 Halos and X number of them have been destroyed and now the race is on to locate and occupy the remaining ones for galactic strategic advantage.

Go open world and build an environment the equivalent size of something like Far Cry 4 or Just Cause 3, See what the ring looks like at that scale with ocean separating the land masses. Then rejig the mission structure to accommodate the open ended world. Halo is effectively already doing the work as it seems to leverages vehicles, AI, and combat in every way but the free roaming.

I like the sound of that but less Ubi template. Wish Halo 4 took a risk like that, Cortana and Chief crash on a new world, lets explore....

 

[Jack The Nipper]

New mobility features are one of the main reasons the game has the best multiplayer in the series. If they get rid of sprint, halo just won't be able to compete with any other console shooter.

When every other shooter is getting faster and adding more mobility options why would they just release a rehash of the halo 3 multiplayer (and I loved halo 3, but it came out nearly ten years ago)

The only thing I see sprint doing is making maps and jumps longer. You aren't wating to sprint a lot to get kills and shots anyways. Pros can easily tell anyone that you have to cut down on sprint to play top tier anyways. That's the thing, with maps designed without sprint, you just really don't need it.

 

[EGM1966]

It's an interesting situation. Mpersonally I think the SP needs a reboot. The EU and directionH4 and H5 took just wasn't what the majority who only play the games wanted I think.

When H3 showed you in deep space approaching "something" I believe many felt the stage was set for all new adventures far from Earth with a whole new situation leaving everything "solved" back home.

Instead it's a mess now and I believe only of interest to a too small hardcore that can't carry the franchise at previous levels.

The SP and setting always served as the cool backdrop to the MP and really served as a draw.

MP wise I feel the franchise has been too uncertain of what Halo MP is since H4. H5 MP feels smooth and is pretty good but doesn't feel like Halo somehow.

I dunno. Felled like in the end they broke something that didn't need fixing trying to reinvent what didn't need touching.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

It's an interesting situation. Mpersonally I think the SP needs a reboot. The EU and directionH4 and H5 took just wasn't what the majority who only play the games wanted I think.

When H3 showed you in deep space approaching "something" I believe many felt the stage was set for all new adventures far from Earth with a whole new situation leaving everything "solved" back home.

Instead it's a mess now and I believe only of interest to a too small hardcore that can't carry the franchise at previous levels.

The SP and setting always served as the cool backdrop to the MP and really served as a draw.

MP wise I feel the franchise has been too uncertain of what Halo MP is since H4. H5 MP feels smooth and is pretty good but doesn't feel like Halo somehow.

I dunno. Felled like in the end they broke something that didn't need fixing trying to reinvent what didn't need touching.

I give 343 credit for fixing the movement but it would take a while to list all the basic issues from vehicle controls and such.

I have basically said everything I can say and just hope to see some changes in the near future.

I honestly agree that 343 should work on a new IP and make whatever MP they want without any restrictions. Maybe giving Halo to a different team or letting the 343 work on it as a bit of fan service that captures the things we are looking for in a Halo title.

 

[schwabdizzle]

I think 343 did a great job as far as gameplay is concerned. The campaign was fun but forgettable. The MP though is absolutely amazing.

 

[travisbickle]

Purely from a perspective of selling it as a single-player game, I think they should drop the number. And I'd give that advice to most games that have lasted as long as Halo.

 

[Crimson Kopite]

Give it to a studio other than 343 for starters.

 

[The Real Napsta]

I personally think the gameplay is the best it's been since 2/3.

Same.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

for those of you that like it

Why do you like the cluttered or stretched out maps?

 

[Lord Panda]

Give it to a studio other than 343 for starters.

Which one do you have in mind?

I think 343i really need to look at their writing team - the story and character development really needs improvement. Actually, the writing since Halo CE has been average.

 

[watdaeff4]

Campaign faults:

1) As stated before 343 retconning who the forerunners truly were ruined a lot the lore for me. A lot. They so easily could have had this Saga be a separate branch of Humans/Forerunners that left before the Halos fired, then came back and pisssd at what we evolved to or something like that.

Or the Precursors returning

Or anything ancient faction who were exiled by the Forerunners coming back for revenge against our relatively weakened race.


2) More specific to 4 and 5. I do t want to have to read a lot of books to try to figure out the story of the campaign. 4 was bad about this. 5 is better.

3) this is Halo. I don't want to have to collect >100 thinks to get backstory (Intel pieces)

MP faults:

1) I've only played ~4 hours so far but am already tired of the same maps

2) lack of choice in Arena

3) in Warzone a tad too much victory points attributed to bosses. Once my team controlled 2 of the bases the entire game but lost because the killed the legendary bosses.

Pros:

1) the gameplay is great both SP and MP. The Prometheans are a much better enemy now.

2) grunt talk returning

3) MP gameplay IMO has CoD BLOPS3 beat hands down

 

[Ivory Samoan]

I've played every Halo since the beginning, love the additions 343i have made with boost/clamber and such; I couldn't go back to OG Halo now without missing these additions.

I think 343i have the franchise heading in the right direction: the MP is fantastic this time around, can't wait for BTB and the other free content too: already gone back to Halo after a few days with Black Ops, see the same happening with Battlefront too unless the final version is much better than the beta.

 

[anothertech]

I feel like there is too much sentiment that the new games in the series have to be slower and 'same' as the old. I am actually ok with evolution and changes for the better or faster in Halo.

But there are some things I feel should be left alone as well. Sprinting for instance. I would rather the game just upped the running speed for everyone instead of using a sprinting mechanic.

The gameplay in general is great though. Rocket boost and slam feel like great additions, and the gun play as always is great and has its Halo esque feel. The maps in general do their job, though I would have preferred a higher jump in graphic quality like Halo always was. 60 fps is great, but I'm used to playing at 30 as it was in the past. I feel like there was too much sacrifice in this regard.

As for the story, it was pretty ruined when 343 took over so I don't expect much there anyhow unfortunately.

 

[Deputy Moonman]

Pros:

1) the gameplay is great both SP and MP. The Prometheans are a much better enemy now.

2) grunt talk returning

3) MP gameplay IMO has CoD BLOPS3 beat hands down

I love the grunts talking again! Makes me feel like

 

[ArchedThunder]

What they did with the gameplay is fine, but they really need a new writer for campaign, new designers for multiplayer and campaign and they really need to look back at previous games for the art direction.

Honestly if it was my choice I'd just go back to basics. Halo 2 Anniversary multiplayer feels so much better.

It really bothers me that they said the play spaces were the biggest in the franchise and that you don't need to read the expanded universe stuff when both of those things aren't true, there aren't any wide open vehicle encounters and most vehicle spaces are really tight and a lot of the story relies heavily on novels and comic books.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

What they did with the gameplay is fine, but they really need a new writer for campaign, new designers for multiplayer and campaign and they really need to look back at previous games for the art direction. It really bothers me that they said the play spaces were the biggest in the franchise and that you don't need to read the expanded universe stuff when both of those things aren't true, there aren't any wide open vehicle encounters and most vehicle spaces are really tight and a lot of the story relies heavily on novels and comic books.

Honestly if it was my choice I'd just go back to basics. Halo 2 Anniversary multiplayer feels so much better.

At style isn't good. I snapped some photos to compare butt hat will have to wait as my cloud from x1 seems not to be working ...

Anywhere i can see my xone photos online?

 

[jelly]

What they did with the gameplay is fine, but they really need a new writer for campaign, new designers for multiplayer and campaign and they really need to look back at previous games for the art direction.

Honestly if it was my choice I'd just go back to basics. Halo 2 Anniversary multiplayer feels so much better.

It really bothers me that they said the play spaces were the biggest in the franchise and that you don't need to read the expanded universe stuff when both of those things aren't true, there aren't any wide open vehicle encounters and most vehicle spaces are really tight and a lot of the story relies heavily on novels and comic books.

I wouldn't say it relies on the expanded universe, they explain enough with the chatter during the game but to actually follow, enjoy and understand it there and then, not good at all. Bad story and poorly told.

 

[ArchedThunder]

At style isn't good. I snapped some photos to compare butt hat will have to wait as my cloud from x1 seems not to be working ...

Anywhere i can see my xone photos online?

Your profile on the Xbox website.

 

[samurai1226]

Having a lot of fun with Warzone MP. But next time please don't advertise a story you will not deliver in Halo 6. Having nothing of the whole Chief vs Locke Traitor thing is the biggest letdown ever in the Halo franchise to me.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

Your profile on the Xbox website.

Thanks, seems to work

 

[gollumsluvslave]

I made my thoughts after completing the campaign here

Halo 5 thoughts

like every Halo since CE, my thoughts were mixed, but I very much enjoyed it and think it's a great game. I'm going to go through it again on Legendary very soon!

One thing I really can't fathom from people (like the OP) is the "it's not Halo" accusations, these always mystify me.

What is this thing called "Halo"? Is it CE? Is it Halo 2? ODST?

EVERY Halo game plays different, has a different balance and a different mix of flaws/issues. None are perfect (although CE get's closest IMO).

ALL of them are still Halo IMO, and that includes 4 and 5.

Is there fatigue in the series? Yes most definitely, it also has a ridiculous amount of competition these days.

343i definitely have issues with narative execution IMO, but Bungie did as well (Halo 2 was a mess narative-wise), but I think in terms of the raw gameplay mechaics, Halo 5 is as good as Halo has been.

In terms of the sandbox and level design, I think Halo 5 is a big step up from Halo 4. Halo CE is still the king of the sandbox IMO, although a couple of missions in Halo 3 are competetive.

Swords of Sanghelios I though was fantastic, but it was the obvious high spot in Halo 5. Level/ sandbox wise I don't think Halo 5 had many low-spots (e.g. Cortana in Halo 3), it was consistent.

I do agree that the encounter design for the boss battles needs a lot of work. The Warden Eternal IMO was better than the QTE approach in Halo 4, but it was still lazy and uninspired, a lot more could have been done with the character and the encounters.

Promethean's in Halo 5 were MUCH better than in Halo 4, but I agree that fatigue is starting to form, and Halo 6 definitely needs new (or old) MAIN enemies. (Brutes got old very quickly for me too FWIW)

Execution aside, I actually like where 343 have gone in terms of the overall plot, and I'm more interested in Halo 6 plot wise than I was in Halo 5 to be honest.

My 2c

 

[mhi]

The greatest tragedy to the franchise was the botching of MCC.

Absolutely, they stretched themselves too far trying to include 3 and 4 in that game.

Regarding the studio in general, they just lack direction. Not sure if that's on leadership or the talent.

For example, I wouldn't be surprised if the clamber, ads, reqs, or warzone was missing from the next game. Much like infinity and spartan ops (new watercooler talk anyone?) are history.

 

[Diablohead]

I want to see Halo 6 take the concept art of the chief in a cape against waves of elites and make it a game, the original halo has a survival feeling to it with only the chief and a handful of marines against the covenant on an isolated and mysterious (ring) planet, that was lost with halo 2 and onwards. ODST was one of the better halo games because like Halo 1 you were a survivor against tough enemies, limited resources and most importantly you were alone quite often.

Give me chief going up against all odds with minimal backup, I don't want to see a war of 20+ spartans against the prometheans with a cookie cut love story ending.

As for multi, Arena hit's the nail on the head for halo 4 v 4 and I love it, warzone needs some tweaks, bring back firefight for some of that co-op survival gameplay.

 

[gollumsluvslave]

One other thing I'd note is that Halo 6 I would like a mix up of missions in terms of squad vs lone wolf.

I missed the feeling of being alone that Halo CE excelled at. The squads in Halo 5 did not work as well as 343 hoped IMO, the AI was not good enough and the commands were too limited.

 

[inoperativ]

I made my thoughts after completing the campaign here

Halo 5 thoughts

like every Halo since CE, my thoughts were mixed, but I very much enjoyed it and think it's a great game. I'm going to go through it again on Legendary very soon!

One thing I really can't fathom from people (like the OP) is the "it's not Halo" accusations, these always mystify me.

What is this thing called "Halo"? Is it CE? Is it Halo 2? ODST?

EVERY Halo game plays different, has a different balance and a different mix of flaws/issues. None are perfect (although CE get's closest IMO).

ALL of them are still Halo IMO, and that includes 4 and 5.

Is there fatigue in the series? Yes most definitely, it also has a ridiculous amount of competition these days.

343i definitely have issues with narative execution IMO, but Bungie did as well (Halo 2 was a mess narative-wise), but I think in terms of the raw gameplay mechaics, Halo 5 is as good as Halo has been.

In terms of the sandbox and level design, I think Halo 5 is a big step up from Halo 4. Halo CE is still the king of the sandbox IMO, although a couple of missions in Halo 3 are competetive.

Swords of Sanghelios I though was fantastic, but it was the obvious high spot in Halo 5. Level/ sandbox wise I don't think Halo 5 had many low-spots (e.g. Cortana in Halo 3), it was consistent.

I do agree that the encounter design for the boss battles needs a lot of work. The Warden Eternal IMO was better than the QTE approach in Halo 4, but it was still lazy and uninspired, a lot more could have been done with the character and the encounters.

Promethean's in Halo 5 were MUCH better than in Halo 4, but I agree that fatigue is starting to form, and Halo 6 definitely needs new (or old) MAIN enemies. (Brutes got old very quickly for me too FWIW)

Execution aside, I actually like where 343 have gone in terms of the overall plot, and I'm more interested in Halo 6 plot wise than I was in Halo 5 to be honest.

My 2c

I agree with almost all of this! I thought Reunion and Genesis also were excellent levels, the two Warden fight at the end of Genesis is the most fun one IMO, I actually really enjoyed it on legendary since you're not stuck inside the arena.

I wonder if we might fight a combination of all of the races in Halo 6 -- it seems like

Spoiler

Cortana

will effectively take control over most of the universe and some will definitely join out of free will. I'd also like to see the Flood return (maybe set free by someone on purpose?) for some classic three-way battles.

 

[Juanfp]

I want double campaign for Halo 6. Love the concept of a squad and want that again, but also want Master Chief with a cape in the scenarios of the acheivement arts.

One thing about the squad I didn't like its that a lot of the time I feel that I was kinda overpower even on legendary (not that it is easy, but the feeling that I am on disadvantage). To feel that I am in a fireteam of spartans and I am on an imposible mision. Like the books, or the live action trailers.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

alright here we go, here are some of the biggest issues that really , hopefully get addressed for their next game.

Fist of all

I made this comparison for the sake of showing I care about halo and the franchise. These comparisons have nothing to do with bungie or 343 blah whatever. I didn't try to choose favorites or things to make either game look better than the other. Just in my mind, halo 5 and 4 just end up looking bad and it's with art style, effects, texture use and especially lighting.

First up

Design - map design and the halo feel

I tried to use a map that was similar design of the bad city like levels in halo 5. So I used this halo 3 dlc map which sort of has a similar feel but the big difference is the actual choke points.

On the halo 3 map, it has places that are much easier to control or lose control in. It also has less tiers in "most" of the map and is overall less cluttered and makes for a lot better sight lines.

In the last set of images you can especially see how the lighting and fog effects make things hard to see, this is a mp portion of a game, these things just simply arent needed. You can also see how there are so many open areas and no choke points in the shot at all , especially when you are on top of things.

I'm not even saying the halo 3 map is a great map, but it is quite playable, one flag, ball, doubles, 4 v 4, territories etc

next up is lighting

Lighting is something I had a huge problem with in Halo 4 and saw most of the same issues coming over into Halo 5.

As you can see, the bloom lighting effects just make a lot of the sight areas really hard to see. Again, this being a multiplayer game, the halo 3 engine seems to account for visibility. Bloom lighting and smoke just isn't needed in the MP portion of the game. There is not a lot of sense in making the game harder to see imo

Other issues include muddy or haze like look in the background in pics 2 when there isn't even any lights getting in the way.

You'll see more of this in the next set of images.

Truth/Midship

This is where we are getting into some questionable texture looks as well as the common fog/light issues that have already been detailed.


In the first pic you can see how it's hard to actually see across top mid and into the other team's base, get's quite foggy.

Pic 2 you can see how the foggy lighting takes away from seeing.

Pic 3 you can see questionable texture styles as well as things that distract your vision again.

Pic 4 is getting so blurry and foggy in the distance you can't make it out at all anymore

Pic 5- again the fogging issue

Basically the issue is, I simply don't need the atmosphere and harder to see areas in the MP portion of the game. I just want wht I'm seeing on H3. Sure, it's technically worse in Halo 3 but i like being able to see more than I like distractions and fog everywhere.

I feel Bungie could have went with a foggy lighting system, but why take away from vision in the mp portion?

Bonus Halo 4


I have to admit when I read on gaf how people felt halo 4 looked next gen and blew halo 3 away, I was completely dumbfounded and here's why

Pic 1- you can see how the blurry backgrounds and extreme lights and shadows just make it all look confusing and bit ugly

Pic 2- again the harsh lighting and colors just make it harder to see and gives a very different and negative mood

Pic 3- I think this one speaks for itself.

Pic 4- again, overly saturated lighting just makes it too busy and unfocused

pic 5- again this is probably technically worse, but it just ends up being a lot more soothing to me and I can;t enjoy the halo 5 version


So, there we go. I think 343 has a ton of engine issues that simply hurt the halo experience.

The level design just feels off and that is also easy to see in the pics withot much to say for it.

Other than that, I hope these things can finally be changed for Halo 6 or future Halo 5 dlc, Hoping.....

 

[jelly]

More detail is fine but something has been lost in the art style. Busy is a problem but the material design and parts are off. Bungie did some horrible stuff as well but at least it was clear. 343 seem to build maps with lots of bits, although premium ones but the level look gets muddied. It's hard to explain, simplicity is needed perhaps. I don't think they are awful just different and a little unclear. I think they need to just build cool levels, locations and tone back structures. Maybe easier said than done with clamber and stuff.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

More detail is fine but something has been lost in the art style. Busy is a problem but the material design and parts are off. Bungie did some horrible stuff as well but at least it was clear. 343 seem to build maps with lots of bits, although premium ones but the level look gets muddied. It's hard to explain, simplicity is needed perhaps. I don't think they are awful just different and a little unclear. I think they need to just build cool levels, locations and tone back structures. Maybe easier said than done with clamber and stuff.

It's the lighting, colors and just a lot of issues. Not only that, also issues in actual shaders used.

And yes, the flow and map design just feels off, even compared to a map cosidered to be a little bad in halo 3. I'd rather play that one though than the 4 city maps in Halo 5.

Their sight lies, sizes and lengths of walls are also not very halo like.

As well as the entry and exit points of certain areas or rooms.

If I had a complain about bugnie's midship remake it would be that they needed another color pallet to mix in that the deep purple and texture to break up that rich purple. If they had a much darker purple and different texture design to fit around and in different areas of that one bright purple tone, it would have helped make it stand out more and easier to see different areas of the map.

 

[Herbs]

well, at least you did a "good" job comparing two completely different things

 

[JumPeRJumPzZ]

Snip

Man Halo 3 still looks great at this day and age. Not as amazing as newer titles. But the simple look and natural lighting still looks veeery nice.

 

[Princess Carl]

well, at least you did a "good" job comparing two completely different things

Nah, I wouldn't say that at all.

Good post Jack, you really helped me articulate certain feelings I had about the clarity of gameplay post halo 3.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

well, at least you did a "good" job comparing two completely different things

One is halo 3 and another is halo 5. Comparing lighting, textures, use of fog and bloom. Not sure what you mean, but that's ok.

Not like I'm comparing wave race and halo 5.

Nah, I wouldn't say that at all.

Good post Jack, you really helped me articulate certain feelings I had about the clarity of gameplay post halo 3.

Thanks, the bloom lighting, textures and fog was the thing that struck out to me as soon as I saw the fist reveal. Well, not sure if it was first reveal but the first video i saw of Halo 5 had truth in it back before the beta hit and my first reaction was no no no not this again. But, I'm glad to finally be able to point it out very carefully and clearly.

 

[Final Verdict]

OP, what do you think is exactly wrong with Halo 5. I understand that you do not like clamber and sprint and stuff, but just what do you propose they do new?
Do you just want them to make a new halo with Halo 2/3 combat?

They have already gone back to a lot of the old Halo concepts such as weapon and map control for their arena mode....and BTB and Team Doubles will probably come back as content updates (BTB should be out soonish).

I respect how you feel about the game, but just don't quite understand what you are looking for from Halo.

EDIT: I get some of your qualms with lighting, and somewhat agree with you.
Lighting is a very difficult thing to do, and I have high respect for people who specialize in that as I have some limited experience fooling with it myself.
The main difference in Halo 2/3 and Halo 4/5 is that Halo 4/5 looks a lot more realistic because of their lighting systems. However, I do agree with you in that it can detract greatly from visibility.
It is something that I really had to adapt to in Halo 4, and continues in Halo 5, however, there are certain maps in Halo 5 that have better/worse lighting. I think that Truth is an example of one of the maps with the worst (at least for visibility) lighting systems in the game, and for that reason, I enjoy regret much better. I will say though that the maps are much prettier to look at, and in an industry where graphics are often touted as king, I understand why they are trying to dress up the maps to look as good as possible.

I just pick this up earlier this week. While I do enjoy the game, this game is lacking in content when compare to other shooters in the market... I don't know how long before they start dropping those free contents, but if I have to pay for them they can fuck right off.

I do agree with you.
I have enjoyed what they have available, but do think that it feels more barebones with no Infection mode, no forge, no BTB....though I'm sure they will be adding a lot in future updates.

 

[Trup1aya]

for those of you that like it

Why do you like the cluttered or stretched out maps?

I don't feel like the maps are overly cluttered, or stretched out.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

I don't feel like the maps are overly cluttered, or stretched out.

Stretched mostly means there is a lot more running room and that has to do with sprint, means you have to go a further distance to get to sight lines to see players. This is very noticeable on regret.

Will probably do a picture idea of this with regret and guardian. There is a much higher percentage of full wall room/area in a lot of the maps in halo 5. And this creates clutter as well.

 

[Detective]

Stretched mostly means there is a lot more running room and that has to do with sprint, means you have to go a further distance to get to sight lines to see players. This is very noticeable on regret.

Will probably do a picture idea of this with regret and guardian. There is a much higher percentage of full wall room/area in a lot of the maps in halo 5. And this creates clutter as well.

Thanks for the pictures.
I feel like halo 3 have more natural colors. Better looking.

Where is 343 have this ugly blue taint or something.

The purple color is so much better in Halo 3. And other colors as well.

I don't know what 343 trying to do here, They just want to print their name in everything , even if it's a bad choice.

 

[Trup1aya]

Stretched mostly means there is a lot more running room and that has to do with sprint, means you have to go a further distance to get to sight lines to see players. This is very noticeable on regret.

Will probably do a picture idea of this with regret and guardian. There is a much higher percentage of full wall room/area in a lot of the maps in halo 5. And this creates clutter as well.

I know what you mean by stretched, but I don't feel like it negatively effects the gameplay... I think regret is on the lower end of map quality.

Truth is stretched, but I think it plays well... I don't find my self sprinting much on any of the maps (because of the disadvantages), yet I still feel I get into the action quickly enough...

Like all of the Spartan abilities... There are times when sprinting is useful. But I don't feel like the maps were designed for people to be sprinting continuously, if that's what you are getting at.

 

[The Antitype]

The underlying shooting mechanics are pretty well done. Not Bungie level, but still strong.

Unfortunately, literally every single thing built around those fundamentals is terrible.

Between Halo 4, Halo: MCC and Halo 5, it's hard to imagine how 343i could have done more to bury the Halo legacy.

The fact that significant leadership change at 343i has not already occurred hints at some pretty gross politics and cronyism at Microsoft.

 

[mhi]

The fact that significant leadership change at 343i has not already occurred hints at some pretty gross politics and cronyism at Microsoft.

I think its much closer to indifference than those two.

 

[Trup1aya]

The only thing I see sprint doing is making maps and jumps longer. You aren't wating to sprint a lot to get kills and shots anyways. Pros can easily tell anyone that you have to cut down on sprint to play top tier anyways. That's the thing, with maps designed without sprint, you just really don't need it.

It's true that people do a lot less sprinting as there skill increases. But I'm perfectly fine with some jumps requiring sprint. It creates an element of risk/reward for taking a particular route, just like crouch jumping does. It's really no different than designing a map around crouch jumps...

Jumps in general is one area where I think 343i improved the formula. At the base, clamber has made it easier for casual players to get around the map. But to compensate for that, mastery of all the Spartan abilities and crouch jumping will open up routes and opportunities for higher skilled players.

In all, I dont think things are worse. Just different, and deeper.

 

[krang]

I want to float a thought, but I want to preface that I'm a big fan of 343's work, including 4, and I think Halo 5 in many ways is the best of the series so far.

But I was just wondering, if (comparatively) low sales might have a knock on effect on budget for Halo 6, which might then lead to a much smaller-scale and intimate instalment of the franchise. Main line Halo is following a predictable trend of bigger, more epic scale with each new game in an attempt to outdo themselves. But I'm wondering, broadly speaking, whether being forced to rein this in might actually be beneficial for the campaign and the franchise.

 

[Solidsoul]

I have a lot of respect for 343 and it's employees, I want them to succeed. My dissapointment in the direction they took Halo is unfortunate but I beleive these people are passionate and trying their best.

Having said that, I'm not really sure what they could do at this point. For me, Halo 5 made me lose interest in playing Halo games anymore. I've been playing since Halo CE and have been a huge fan but I play for the story and its not there anymore.

They would have to start over back to before they retconned forerunners being humans, disregard all the new halo novels since 2011 and build new games that take place before the end of Halo 3 to make me care again. I mean, they could games that take place after Halo 3 but there can't be any prometheans. Halo is about marines fighting covies.

This vision 343 has for Halo would have been much better suited as a new IP. As it stands now it feels like they are trying to change everything about Halo to make it their own, to the point where it's only Halo in name. I was talking to a friend the other day, and told him that the forerunner trilogy of books actually prepares you for the story of Halo 4 and 5 more than playing Halo 1-3, reach and ODDT does. That's actually true, and there is something wrong with that. But, scrapping all the work 343 has done over the last 5 years will never happen. We're going to be stuck with this plot direction until Halo is unsuccessful enough to be rebooted into a story worth caring about again.

The gameplay and multiplayer is good, but all the soul that once was in Halo is gone. I don't know what it would take to get it back. Bungie wouldn't have it either, two of the biggest assets to Halos success was Joe Staten's writing and Marty O' Donnel's music, and neither of them are with Bungie anymore. I think at this point I'll just take the fond memories I have of Bungies Halo games and accept that Halos story is done, and has been since I finished Halo: Reach.

 

[JumPeRJumPzZ]

The gameplay and multiplayer is good, but all the soul that once was in Halo is gone. I don't know what it would take to get it back. Bungie wouldn't have it either, two of the biggest assets to Halos success was Joe Staten's writing and Marty O' Donnel's music, and neither of them are with Bungie anymore. I think at this point I'll just take the fond memories I have of Bungies Halo games and accept that Halos story is done, and has been since I finished Halo: Reach.

Joe is with Microsoft now and 343 tried to get Marty for some H5 Music.

 

[gollumsluvslave]

I want to float a thought, but I want to preface that I'm a big fan of 343's work, including 4, and I think Halo 5 in many ways is the best of the series so far.

But I was just wondering, if (comparatively) low sales might have a knock on effect on budget for Halo 6, which might then lead to a much smaller-scale and intimate instalment of the franchise. Main line Halo is following a predictable trend of bigger, more epic scale with each new game in an attempt to outdo themselves. But I'm wondering, broadly speaking, whether being forced to rein this in might actually be beneficial for the campaign and the franchise.

I very much think it would. The trend for games constantly having to one-up on the spectacle side is not a good one IMO. ODST is a great example of what can be done on a smaller scale, and there is plenty of more scope for stuff like ODST IMO.

Not everything has to be saving the galaxy!

 

[Solidsoul]

Joe is with Microsoft now and 343 tried to get Marty for some H5 Music.

With microsoft, not 343. He has had no part in Halos game development since reach. Just a voice over for a grunt in 5 and an upcoming book that looks to have nothing to do with any of the lore 343 established.

I don't remember reading anywhere that 343 tried to get marty? Not saying your wrong but I'd like to see the article about that cause I can't beleive I missed it.

Even of they did. He still ain't there and neither is Joes writing.