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[Fancyarcher]

What about the bad guy from MI4.

I'm drawing a blank. Was there even a villain?

At least MI3 had Phillip Seymour Hoffman.

MI2 also had Dougray Scott and MI1 had Jon Voight who will forever live in infamy among fans.

Honestly, I thought Sean Harris's Lane (yeah that's a great villain name) was a fine villain, I just think ever since Ghost Protocol, the emphasis of the series has gone more and more on Hunt's attempts to prove his innocence and not enough on Hunt and the actual mission of the film. The villain is basically more of an obstacle at this point.

 

[Vampirolol]

Ah yes, NukeDude.



MI1 is the only one I actually like. MI2 is shit and the other three are just okay.

MI2 is the best MI2 movie. It's the nu metal of movies.

I like MI4 a lot but MI5 was much closer to the tone of the older stuff. I definitely preferred it and 3 over 4. But it's close on all accounts.

Yes, 4 has that Bird style I love but 5 is more in line with the original tonally. It's very good.

 

[Shaanyboi]

What about the bad guy from MI4.

I'm drawing a blank. Was there even a villain?

At least MI3 had Phillip Seymour Hoffman.

I remember the garage sequence but can't for the life of me think of his face. I sorta remember the assassin lady that got kicked out the window.

 

[brandonh83]

I remember the garage sequence but can't for the life of me think of his face. I sorta remember the assassin lady that got kicked out the window.

It's easy to remember her.

 

[NipplesAndToes23]

Ooh, Collider got their review up, let's watch it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBrhBgzPObw

 

[Litan]

More screentime when there are 15 additional Avengers next to the 6 Villains that are also in these movies?

6? Who are you counting besides Loki?
Anyways, I expect Thanos to have some sort of army or something behind him, a villain team serving as something like his generals would be cool and with all the characters already in the movie, Malekith, Ronan, Ultron, Red Skull and whoever else would be easier than introducing new characters like The Black Order.

You gotta admit, the way the villains go out when Infinity Stones are involved is pretty fishy.

 

[Fancyarcher]

I'm hoping the 'villains are trapped in Infinity Stones and will be back for IW/A4 alongside Thanos' theory turns out to be correct. Ultron and Red Skull would really benefit from more screentime and being in the hands of the Russos.

Red Skull's supposed demise is one of the few cliffhangers that Marvel has never really finished. When we last saw the character, he was blasted off by the cube, and presumed dead, but it's pretty clear that they were intending to bring the character back, so they left his demise open.

Unfortunately, if they do decide to bring the character back, they'll likely have to recast the role, as Weaving has expressed zero interest in playing Red Skull, since putting on the prosthetic / makeup took a lot out of him, and he doesn't want to repeat it again, although nowadays I imagine they can CGI the character up, so it won't be as difficult.

 

[see5harp]

I like Tilda Swinton but at this point I feel as though it's easier to cast a white woman in do gender reversal than it would have been to just cast an Asian male. I don't see how that shit is corageous at all.

 

[Litan]

Red Skull's supposed demise is one of the few cliffhangers that Marvel has never really finished. When we last saw the character, he was blasted off by the cube, and presumed dead, but it's pretty clear that they were intending to bring the character back, so they left his demise open.

Unfortunately, if they do decide to bring the character back, they'll likely have to recast the role, as Weaving has expressed zero interest in playing Red Skull, since putting on the prosthetic / makeup took a lot out of him, and he doesn't want to repeat it again, although nowadays I imagine they can CGI the character up, so it won't be as difficult.

He actually said he'd be interested in taking up the role again a month or so back.

 

[wispsmoke]

I like Tilda Swinton but at this point I feel as though it's easier to cast a white woman in do gender reversal than it would have been to just cast an Asian male. I don't see how that shit is corageous at all.

Even if it is good casting, the way the director has spoken about it makes him sound like a gaping asshole.

 

[Fancyarcher]

He actually said he'd be interested in taking up the role again a month or so back.

Huh, guess he changed his mind. Now it's just a matter of whether or not Fiege and co are interested in bringing Red Skull back at this point.

 

[LionPride]

I like Tilda Swinton but at this point I feel as though it's easier to cast a white woman in do gender reversal than it would have been to just cast an Asian male. I don't see how that shit is corageous at all.

So, Marvel had a couple of options. Make an Asian the stereotypical Mystic higher being role and face backlash for that. OR, cast anyone else in that role and possibly face backlash depending on the race of that person. They went with someone white and faced backlash like they should have. But it was somewhat of a lose lose situation.

 

[Litan]

Even if it is good casting, the way the director has spoken about it makes him sound like a gaping asshole.

Don't know what Derrickson said, but Cargill's (writer) comments were so dumb and annoying. Something about social justice warriors and wondering why people complained about making the ancient one white but not about casting a woman. Dumbass.

 

[yunbuns]

Tobey still sucks tho.

Spoiler

Leave Tobey alone.

 

[StoopKid]

Oh, and quick and dirty chart to note what has come before:

IM, Avengers, Guardians and Civil War were the only >90 RT scores, and the 7.0 average rating seems pretty solid.

Wow hulk is that low?

I actually enjoyed it.

 

[BriGuy]

Sounds good to me, but if it turns out to be another "guy comes across super powers, adjusts to using said powers, pulls off win against similarly super-powered bad guy" movie, I'm done. Or at least done watching first entries in a new series. I can' take any more cookie cutter origin stories.

 

[dancingphlower]

So, Marvel had a couple of options. Make an Asian the stereotypical Mystic higher being role and face backlash for that. OR, cast anyone else in that role and possibly face backlash depending on the race of that person. They went with someone white and faced backlash like they should have. But it was somewhat of a lose lose situation.

Or...make the character Asian but not make them a stereotype. A wise Asian mentor doesn't have to be defined by a stereotype if they are more than the stereotype, if they are written well. It just feels like an excuse to NOT cast an Asian, really.

 

[Sblargh]

Sounds good to me, but if it turns out to be another "guy comes across super powers, adjusts to using said powers, pulls off win against similarly super-powered bad guy" movie, I'm done. Or at least done watching first entries in a new series. I can' take any more cookie cutter origin stories.

"guy comes across mind altering drugs"

 

[LionPride]

Or...make the character Asian but not make them a stereotype. A wise Asian mentor doesn't have to be defined by a stereotype if they are more than the stereotype, if they are written well. It just feels like an excuse to NOT cast an Asian, really.

I disagree, people would see the Ancient mentor as a stereotypical role regardless of how it was written if portrayed by someone who was Asian

 

[NipplesAndToes23]

Or...make the character Asian but not make them a stereotype. A wise Asian mentor doesn't have to be defined by a stereotype if they are more than the stereotype, if they are written well. It just feels like an excuse to NOT cast an Asian, really.

Yeah, the director and screenwriter said that same shit and it doesn't fly with me. He said it was the safest choice, but when he someone non-white ever been the safest choice?

 

[Oersted]

"hurr durr raimi's movies are too camp
tobey cries a lot derrr
peter's not a dork
not muh webshooters
you people just have nostalgia derka derr"

Everytime. I'll see y'all in 2045 when Spider-Man 2 gets inducted into the National Film Registry for being the defining superhero movie of the 21st century.

Would argue that the defining superhero movie is from the 90ties and is called Matrix.

The white saviour, the sidekick, the mentor, the origin story, the disappointing third act, the comic book/anime visuals, the villain... its all there.

 

[GAMEPROFF]

Sounds good to me, but if it turns out to be another "guy comes across super powers, adjusts to using said powers, pulls off win against similarly super-powered bad guy" movie, I'm done. Or at least done watching first entries in a new series. I can' take any more cookie cutter origin stories.

See you when the Sequel releases

 

[Gambit61]

DC:

Teach me

This has been my most hyped film since the start of the year.

Yep, same here. I normally skip out on IMAX showings but I'm dying to see this in 3D.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

I really wish the villain could win one for once in some fashion. The only one that seems to come close is Bucky but he's not really a villain.

 

[Sblargh]

I really wish the villain could win one for once in some fashion. The only one that seems to come close is Bucky but he's not really a villain.

Civil war.
Also, probably infinity war part 1.

 

[GAMEPROFF]

Civil war.
Also, probably infinity war part 1.

He will say that you are wrong unless you are not.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Civil war.
Also, probably infinity war part 1.

villain lost doe
the accords aren't the villain

 

[brandonh83]

I've been excited to see this, but the hype has just really kicked in the last few days especially after listening through Giacchino's score and now the reviews.

 

[BLACKLAC]

I've been excited to see this, but the hype has just really kicked in the last few days especially after listening through Giacchino's score and now the reviews.

I've had the last 2 minutes of track 9 on loop.

 

[brandonh83]

I've had the last 2 minutes of track 9 on loop.

He delivers every time. Track 2 is one of my favorites.

 

[Donos]

ah, i see we are right on track with the spiderman talk. Not long now and we are going to successfully summon Thor 2.

 

[guek]

Civil war.
Also, probably infinity war part 1.

Civil War was too deep for Subpar

 

[brandonh83]

I didn't think Zemo was bad tbh

There is definitely a problem with these movies though not having even stronger villains considering they're fucking comic book movies. They shouldn't be "not too bad" but absolutely superb.

And this is where Spider-man runs circles effortlessly around most things. Spider-man 3 is shit but Sandman was fantastic and still better than most recent villains.

 

[SpaceWolf]

I really wish the villain could win one for once in some fashion. The only one that seems to come close is Bucky but he's not really a villain.

What kind of Doctor Strange movie would you want to see, exactly?

 

[Maximo]

Ooh, Collider got their review up, let's watch it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBrhBgzPObw

Jesus 24 minutes are his reviews normally this big? That length is not a review its a in-depth plot analysis.

 

[LumpOfCole]

I usually don't watch 3D films anymore but this looks pretty trippy so I might have to do it in 3D this time.

 

[guek]

I didn't think Zemo was bad tbh

There is definitely a problem with these movies though not having even stronger villains considering they're fucking comic book movies. They shouldn't be "not too bad" but absolutely superb.

The issue with the villains is a Marvel's resistance to having antagonists develop over multiple movies. Basically, they've moved away from each hero representing their own franchise and more towards each hero being a cog in the overarching MCU machine. Not all villains die in every movie but they don't ever seem to come back, which is a mistake. This isn't absolutely required to have a good villain but it can definitely help. The biggest hurdle is the general lack of screen time these villains are getting which could be mitigated by giving them a larger overarching presence. It's one of the reasons Loki is considered a better MCU villain. He's had time to develop over 3 movies already instead of just one.

People like Abomination, Professor Sterns, Red Skull, Justin Hammer, etc., all should come back. Hell, I'd love if Aldrich Killian came back as a disembodied head mutated by extremis into becoming M.O.D.O.K. The fact that they've said Zemo will return gives me some hope.

 

[kswiston]

What kind of Doctor Strange movie would you want to see, exactly?

There's a reason Doom destroyed the Ultimate universe.

 

[Blader]

There is only one type of person in the world that doesn't like the Raindrops montage.

And it is not a person, but a monster.

Anyway I think you guys are kneejerking a bit over the Spider-man 2 mention, they didn't say it was better just that for them this was the most satisfying Marvel movie since.

Can't let a little thing like reading get in the way of a good MCU thread.

 

[Sibersk Esto]

The issue with the villains is a Marvel's resistance to having antagonists develop over multiple movies. Basically, they've moved away from each hero representing their own franchise and more towards each hero being a cog in the overarching MCU machine. Not all villains die in every movie but they don't ever seem to come back, which is a mistake. This isn't absolutely required to have a good villain but it can definitely help. The biggest hurdle is the general lack of screen time these villains are getting which could be mitigated by giving them a larger overarching presence. It's one of the reasons Loki is considered a better MCU villain. He's had time to develop over 3 movies already instead of just one.

People like Abomination, Professor Sterns, Red Skull, Justin Hammer, etc., all should come back. Hell, I'd love if Aldrich Killian came back as a disembodied head mutated by extremis into becoming M.O.D.O.K. The fact that they've said Zemo will return gives me some hope.

Considering how most of the top superhero movie villains got it done in one movie and didn't come back, I have to disagree.

 

[Blader]

The issue with the villains is a Marvel's resistance to having antagonists develop over multiple movies. Basically, they've moved away from each hero representing their own franchise and more towards each hero being a cog in the overarching MCU machine. Not all villains die in every movie but they don't ever seem to come back, which is a mistake. This isn't absolutely required to have a good villain but it can definitely help. The biggest hurdle is the general lack of screen time these villains are getting which could be mitigated by giving them a larger overarching presence. It's one of the reasons Loki is considered a better MCU villain. He's had time to develop over 3 movies already instead of just one.

People like Abomination, Professor Sterns, Red Skull, Justin Hammer, etc., all should come back. Hell, I'd love if Aldrich Killian came back as a disembodied head mutated by extremis into becoming M.O.D.O.K. The fact that they've said Zemo will return gives me some hope.

I don't know if this is really a problem since there have been other superhero movies with strong villains that were just one and done. And I don't know if I agree that letting a villain develop over more than one movie makes them better, because I think Loki's character has declined and gotten less interesting with each movie he's in.

 

[guek]

Considering how most of the top superhero movie villains got it done in one movie and didn't come back, I have to disagree.

I get the counterpoint but I think it'd be a smart move to extend the presence of these villains given the nature of these films. The MCU's Netflix villains are superior than their movie counterparts and I think that's largely due to the serialized nature of those series. The MCU has become increasingly serialized in its film installments as well which is why I think a similar approach should be adopted.

 

[User 479360]

I'm kind of surprised. Then again, it is sitting at a 6.7 as described in the OT. That's nothing special.

I'm not sure of what to think of the movie. Previews make it look very boring.

 

[SpaceWolf]

Can't let a little thing like reading get in the way of a good MCU thread.

Yes, because people acting smug and disdainful really make them so much more fun.

 

[Koodo]

Edit: wrong thread l o l.

 

[guek]

I'm kind of surprised. Then again, it is sitting at a 6.7 as described in the OT. That's nothing special.

I'm not sure of what to think of the movie. Previews make it look very boring.

It's only got 14 reviews so far (and it's at a 6.9 atm)

 

[torre_avenue]

I'm kind of surprised. Then again, it is sitting at a 6.7 as described in the OT. That's nothing special.

I'm not sure of what to think of the movie. Previews make it look very boring.

What the hell kind of trailers are you seeing?

Fractal New Yorks, magic, and trippy visuals are boring?

 

[brandonh83]

The issue with the villains is a Marvel's resistance to having antagonists develop over multiple movies. Basically, they've moved away from each hero representing their own franchise and more towards each hero being a cog in the overarching MCU machine. Not all villains die in every movie but they don't ever seem to come back, which is a mistake. This isn't absolutely required to have a good villain but it can definitely help. The biggest hurdle is the general lack of screen time these villains are getting which could be mitigated by giving them a larger overarching presence. It's one of the reasons Loki is considered a better MCU villain. He's had time to develop over 3 movies already instead of just one.

Agreed. With better scripts you could get stuff like Doc Ock where they have a solid arc and are just great characters as well as villains. But, it's also fine to develop them across several films especially given the nature of the cinematic universe. The problem is that they keep switching villains-- apart from Loki, who IMO has been written very clumsily. Thor 2 where he was bad good bad good bad sorta good bad sorta bad but drove me up. The. Fucking. Wall.

They need to develop core villains parallel alongside the heroes. Look at how Thanos has been developed. Exactly. It's shit. It doesn't have to be anything complex, just make the villains fun and memorable. These movies have been pretty good and have just kept getting better, but the soundtracks and villains need work. However, Giacchino was an instant remedy on the soundtrack side. I hope he does more. And stop changing the fucking themes every time. The themes are kinda like the villains, they work but then are kinda just forgotten. It's especially bad when you get sequels with different composers that just bring in new themes.

 

[dancingphlower]

I disagree, people would see the Ancient mentor as a stereotypical role regardless of how it was written if portrayed by someone who was Asian

Honestly, Asian representation in Hollywood is bad enough that I'm pretty sure a lot of people would be okay with a stereotype (assuming it ends up being written as a stereotype, anyway) as long as it meant an Asian would get cast.

Yeah, the director and screenwriter said that same shit and it doesn't fly with me. He said it was the safest choice, but when he someone non-white ever been the safest choice?

Yeah, I'm pretty sick of white being the default option for any role, really.

 

[SpaceWolf]

Do people think it would be wise to opt into seeing this in 3D over 2D then? I haven't actively chosen to see a film in 3D over 2D in years.