• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Bucking FDA, Peter Thiel funds “patently unethical” herpes vaccine trial

https://arstechnica.com/science/201...unds-patently-unethical-herpes-vaccine-trial/

Heavyweight tech investor and FDA-critic Peter Thiel is among conservative funders and American researchers backing an offshore herpes vaccine trial that blatantly flouts US safety regulations, according to a Monday report by Kaiser Health News.

The vaccine—a live but weakened herpes virus—was first tested in a 17-person trial on the Caribbean Island of St. Kitts without federal oversight or the standard human safety requirement of an institutional review board (IRB) approval. Biomedical researchers and experts have sharply rebuked the lack of safety oversight and slammed the poor quality of the data collected, which has been rejected from scientific publication. However, investors and those running the trial say it is a direct challenge to what they see as innovation-stifling regulations by the Food and Drug Administration.

”This is a test case," Bartley Madden told KHN. Madden is another investor of the vaccine as well as a retired Credit Suisse banker and policy adviser to the conservative Heartland Institute. ”The FDA is standing in the way, and Americans are going to hear about this and demand action."

Madden, Thiel, and other investors have invested $7 million into the vaccine's development, according to Rational Vaccines, the company orchestrating the trial. Though Thiel could not be reached for comment, he has been openly critical of the FDA's review process. At one point, he claimed that the agency's processes were so overbearing that ”you would not be able to invent the polio vaccine today."
The lead researcher behind the vaccine, William Halford, formerly of Southern Illinois University, made similar claims. In a positive university press release, Halford was quoted as saying: ”Many of the virus vaccines we currently put in our kids—chickenpox, mumps, measles, and rubella—were developed using live-attenuated viruses in the '50s, '60s and '70s when the regulatory landscape was more relaxed... and they have worked remarkably well."

He went on to suggest that the FDA has made ”barriers too high" and that countries with less regulation were better for vaccine and drug development. ”There are governments around the world that the WHO [World Health Organization] has approved for vaccine development," he said. ”We're talking to those types of governments."

I am so shocked that a scumbag like Peter Thiel has contempt for things like ethics and safety regulations.
 
What's the end goal here ?
They want to sell the product ?
If scientists and agencies are saying the trial wasn't well done, they will have a hard time selling the drug .
 
Techno-Libertarians...

Like a video game villain come to life.

I found the logo for Thiel's next start-up.

SPECTRE_Logo.png
 
The FDA is known to cater to applicants who throw some fetty their way.

He may have a point, I don't know much about this guy but I know the FDA has a history of pay for play and isnt the shining beacon of standards one would hope....
 
The FDA is known to cater to applicants who throw some fetty their way.

He may have a point, I don't know much about this guy but I know the FDA has a history of pay for play and isnt the shining beacon of standards one would hope....

They have better standards than Peter Thiel.

It wasn't just the FDA who said no.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
The FDA is known to cater to applicants who throw some fetty their way.

He may have a point, I don't know much about this guy but I know the FDA has a history of pay for play and isnt the shining beacon of standards one would hope....

The dude is scummy as all hell. Of course he's good buddies with Donald Trump.
 

Ri'Orius

Member
They flew 17 patients with pre-existing genital herpes cases there to get three shots of the vaccine. Halford reported that they experienced on average a three-fold reduction in days with symptoms on followup at four to six months after vaccination.

Wait, what? I thought vaccines only prevented you from catching a disease that you didn't already have. This one apparently reduces the symptoms of those already infected?
 
Technofascists have no time for laws (or human decency). Thiel knows if he gets too much flak his pal Trump will pardon him, anyway.
 
What's the end goal here ?
They want to sell the product ?
If scientists and agencies are saying the trial wasn't well done, they will have a hard time selling the drug .

My opinion, I feel like the end game for Peter Thiel is unregulated research into anything that extends life. He is obsessed with it.
 

Teh Lurv

Member
Reading the linked article:

For the initial trial, Halford and Rational Vaccines co-founder Fernández were unable to get federal funding or IRB approval, which oversees human safety. After testing out the vaccine on themselves for safety, they moved the trial to the Caribbean island.

Holy crap! That's super-villain origin story recklessness right there!
 
Little bit of light reading about the "good ole days" that Thiel pines for.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States

Thiel is rich, and a borderline sociopath. He sincerely doesn't have any problem with any of that most likely. This is the dude who said giving women and minorities the right to vote was a mistake. In his Objectivist fantasyland he'd never be the victim, because he's wealthy enough to escape any consequence.
 
Little bit of light reading about the "good ole days" that Thiel pines for.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States

This isn't random torture or medical experimentation on people without their consent. There are plenty of well-aired criticisms (that I agree with!) of the approach Halford & co. are taking, but imo the bigger concern is that the research on the science side appears to be motivated more out of a belief in the profit potential of such a vaccine rather than a genuine desire to advance medicine. The two often go hand-in-hand - something that frustrates critics of "big pharma" - but when research results are being exaggerated it's a big red flag.

Even Southern Illinois University doesn't give a fuck:
A spokesperson for Southern Illinois University, one of the vaccine’s patent holders, said that the university has no legal responsibility to ensure proper safety protocols for the trial. However, after questions about the lack of IRB approval (a federal requirement), the spokesperson said that the university would “take this opportunity to review our internal processes to ensure we are following best practices.”

It is always quite interesting to see how critics of the FDA's practices can quickly become doe-eyed fans based on who is positioned opposite them, though.
 
First he destroys Gawker, and now he's making herpes Enemy Number One? Peter Thiel doing God's work.

This should be bannable.

This isn't random torture or medical experimentation on people without their consent. There are plenty of well-aired criticisms (that I agree with!) of the approach Halford & co. are taking, but imo the bigger concern is that the research on the science side appears to be motivated more out of a belief in the profit potential of such a vaccine rather than a genuine desire to advance medicine. The two often go hand-in-hand - something that frustrates critics of "big pharma" - but when research results are being exaggerated it's a big red flag.

Even Southern Illinois University doesn't give a fuck:


It is always quite interesting to see how critics of the FDA's practices can quickly become doe-eyed fans based on who is positioned opposite them, though.

The things in that article mostly weren't random torture, either. They were just the way things were under the more relaxed rules "libertarian" Thiel would like to go back to.
 
Biomedical researchers and experts have sharply rebuked the lack of safety oversight and slammed the poor quality of the data collected, which has been rejected from scientific publication.

This makes me think it was more a publicity stunt than trial.

Also, I do not have herpes.
 

AnAnole

Member
Good. FDA regulations are way too stringent. The polio vaccine would have never came to fruition if you had to jump through the same hoops you have to jump through today to get things approved.
 
9 in 10 people have been exposed to oral herpes with 50-80% having it. Depending on the region 20ish% have genital herpes.

http://www.webmd.com/genital-herpes/news/20100309/cdc-genital-herpes-rates-still-high

https://www.google.com/amp/www.hopk...nfectious_diseases/Oral_Herpes_22,OralHerpes/

And that's why saying "everyone has herpes" is such bullshit. When people worry about getting herpes, they do not worry about a cold sore. Everyone does not have genital herpes. It honestly sounds like something people with genital herpes like to say to feel better about it.
 
LOL this is not unethical. This article is some ignorant bullshit. Its unethical for the FDA to keep blocking vaccines they know can cure or greatly alleviate a deadly disease for some.

This herpes vaccine is made by one of the single most well respected and knowledgeable person in the field, Dr. Halford.

Halford went around the FDA because they have been playing a game of only allowing HSV vaccines that will fail, dna vaccines. While, Halfords vaccine, a live attenuated version of HSV, has been proven to work in labs and on humans themselves. It's the difference between a vaccine that attacks 1% of a virus, or a one that attacks over 99% of it. You don't need to be an immunologist, to know which one will work, and which one won't.

Many other doctors and scientists have also made HSV vaccines work with live attenuated vaccines. If you've been reading about this and following it, you will know Halford knows what he is doing and this article is kinda reactionary bullshit. Halford even injected his vaccine into himself, his family, and other HSV sufferers. Its proved to be safe and effective.

This vaccine, funded by many people, not just Thiel, is here now, and it works. Or we can keep allowing FDA and scamming scientists to keep defrauding the people to keep testing dna vaccines everyone knows is not going to work.

They could've made this Halford vaccine decades ago. This vaccines is probably going to consign herpes to other STD diseases, where we don't think its a big idea anymore.
 
Top Bottom