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Axios: Microsoft's Phil Spencer: Activision deal "well beyond anything I’ve ever done"

kingfey

Banned
I dont think it will work, but their intent is clear. I personally enjoy it. I like watching all this shit go down. It forces Sony to focus on Playstation heavily too. Nintendo will be perfectly fine, no that they discovered the mobile market. Even if they end up pulling a Switch U(Pro home console version of the switch) and it ends up bombing hard.
There intent is much different, than it was during xbox one era.
I would like competition now. It forces both companies to come up with new stuff. X360 gave Sony their Ps4 library succeful formula. Ps4 gave xbox gamepass. That is kind of thing that I would like to see. Nintendo on other hand, is its worst enemy.
 

kingfey

Banned
I'm confused. Why wouldn't Japan let Nintendo buy Sony but would let the opposite happen? That makes no sense.

Nintendo already has a monopoly in Japan. Adding PlayStation into the fold wouldn't change anything there.

And Nintendo IS expensive. Microsoft tried and failed to buy them. Microsoft with unlimited cash couldn't buy them. But you think Sony could?

Nah. The only thing I could see happening is Sony spinning off PlayStation and Nintendo acquiring that. PlayStation by itself would be pretty cheap.
$140+b vs $55+b. Plus Japan wont let that happen. That is monopoly in the eyes of the Japanese's government. They wont allow a single entity to own most of their medium.
 

Lognor

Banned
$140+b vs $55+b. Plus Japan wont let that happen. That is monopoly in the eyes of the Japanese's government. They wont allow a single entity to own most of their medium.
But in Japan Nintendo already has that monopoly. Nothing changes there.
 

N1tr0sOx1d3

Given another chance
What even is this list?

Two of them are remakes/remasters of games that are 10+ years old. Another was developed by a third party that Sony later bought. God of War was fresh, but now we are getting an iterative sequel (which was my initial point). Kena is not a Sony game. Astro Bot and Bloodborne I will give you. Bloodborne is seven years old though so the fact you gotta go back that far says something.
Let’s see yours…been waiting all afternoon…..
 

N1tr0sOx1d3

Given another chance
When you look at some of the posts people get banned for yet this goes untouched? How does that work?
All the first party games released by MS since the Series console launch have been 80+ games, some 90+
It might be a bitter pill to swallow for some but facts are facts.
All I’ve asked for is some quality games I can download later for my Xbox. Riky please list some games that I can enjoy AAA 1st party.
I have Gamepass…..
 
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RevGaming

Member
Same thing for MS in the future. Gaming has alot of variables. Xbox was the favorite during the x360/ps3. Then xbox one happened. Ps2 ahd much better position than OG xbox, then ps3 happened. Nintendo insane amount of hardware's with Wii, then come up with Wii U.

As long as these weird variables exist, nothing is guaranteed in the gaming industry. Even MS with trillion dollars of money, cant change those variables.

We also have now the VR market, which is trying to poke itself in to the gaming industry. The metaverse, which has huge backing from top corporations. If these medium are successful, the regular gaming medium will disappear, and everyone will play their games, through these mediums.
PS2 was technically a monopoly
 

yurinka

Member
Its odd you say Xbox aint going for the pinnacle of visuals, but then you list games where they are..?

Also starfield is not going to be a visual slouch the in game footage is showing higher geometric, detail and ray traced like reflections ( as noted by DF).

Also expect great visuals from Fable, avowed.

So thats

Gears 6
Perfect dark
Hellbalde 2
Fable
Starfield
Avowed

All going for state of the art visuals.

Thats more then sony has announced...
So the actual reality is that its sony are now behind on state of the art.
Spiderman 2 and wolverine are the only announced PS5 exclusives.
Out of these games pretty likely only Starfield will be released in the next year or two. Sony has a longer list of top tier exclusives than this one, but with games to be released mostly in a year or two. And in many cases we know how they really look because we have more than only a CG teaser or a name.

Sony will continue having a bigger output during at least a year or two. Sony focuses their marketing and announcements on a shorter term plan because they have more to market. And we also have tot remember that beyond acquisitions Sony also has been growing and will continue growing their all internal teams to make them work on more games at the same time on each studio, plus they recently spent record money on 2nd party games and also plan to have record number of 3rd party games.

So no, as of now Sony isn't behind, won't be behind in the next one or two years and we'll have to see in the future.
 
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N1tr0sOx1d3

Given another chance
No you didn't.

You said " all the games are garbage"

Scores say otherwise so you're trolling, looking at your tag it isn't the first time.
I’m sorry. Then what am I missing? What games are AAA 1st party from XBox that are critically acclaimed? Over the past 5 years? BTW we have 2 x Gamepass ultimate subscriptions 2 x XBSS for the kids and 1 x XBSX for me.

I’ve spent over £1000 on XBox, over the last year. I am annoyed as much as anyone with their output. Even bought those cute memory 1TB Cards because we envisioned component shortages.
 
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Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Out of these games pretty likely only Starfield will be released in the next year or two. Sony has a longer list of top tier exclusives than this one, but with games to be released mostly in a year or two. And in many cases we know how they really look because we have more than only a CG teaser or a name.

Sony will continue having a bigger output during at least a year or two.

The release dates of these games have not been confirmed but expect hellblade 2 in 2023, it was revealed in 2019. Also 2023 will be 4yrs on from the outer worlds and gears 4. Doom eternal was released in 2020, so there is a chance they have something in 2023.

But if you read the convo u would realise we are talking about state of the art current gen only games.

Sony has 3 cross gens for 2022 and forsaken. We dont know what sony will have in 2023,24, they have only announced spiderman 2 and wolverine as ps5 only, so we might see one of those in 2023.
 
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yurinka

Member
We also have now the VR market, which is trying to poke itself in to the gaming industry. The metaverse, which has huge backing from top corporations. If these medium are successful, the regular gaming medium will disappear, and everyone will play their games, through these mediums.
Regarding VR and the metaverse, we have to remember Sony's work with, PS Home, PSVR & PSVR2. But as happens with subscriptions or cloud gaming, all these markets may grow but prettty likely it won't mean that it would hurt traditional games, in fact can make it grow.

Remember whatt happened with mobile: it's a bigger market than consoles and pc combined, but even if grew a ton consoles and PC kept growing. Same happened with the casual push from Singstar, Eyetoy & similar or relatetd Sony suff, Wii, DS or Kinect. It did grow the userbase and tradititonal games stayed there.
 

kingfey

Banned
Could have fooled me. You look at the weekly top thirty best selling games on a regular basis?
Here is life time hardware sales in japan.
  1. Switch OLED Model – 36,534 (1,030,341)
  2. Switch – 27,609 (17,894,965)
  3. Switch Lite – 13,076 (4,510,554)
  4. PlayStation 5 – 15,729 (1,106,719)
  5. PlayStation 5 Digital Edition – 3,128 (207,280)
  6. Xbox Series X – 1,620 (75,885)
  7. Xbox Series S – 1,007 (58,453)
  8. New 2DS LL (including 2DS) – 325 (1,181,039)
  9. PlayStation 4 – 14 (7,819,291)
Switch has total of 23.4m hardware's in japan. Sony cant hit number 1 against those numbers.

Contents otherwise, Playstation is the dominant one. It has more games, and more contents compared to switch. Switch japan doesn't even have call of duty.

Sales wise, switch sells alot, due to numbers. its like ps4 vs xbox one 3rd party game sales.
 

kingfey

Banned
Regarding VR and the metaverse, we have to remember Sony's work with, PS Home, PSVR & PSVR2. But as happens with subscriptions or cloud gaming, all these markets may grow but prettty likely it won't mean that it would hurt traditional games, in fact can make it grow.

Remember whatt happened with mobile: it's a bigger market than consoles and pc combined, but even if grew a ton consoles and PC kept growing. Same happened with the casual push from Singstar, Eyetoy & similar or relatetd Sony suff, Wii, DS or Kinect. It did grow the userbase and tradititonal games stayed there.
How long do you think, mobile would need to have the same graphics as consoles?
Mobile market saw insane jump in quality in just few years. They are about to rival pc's in the upcoming future.

VR got its big game from Valve. Half-life 2 is impressive VR game. It wont take too long for VR to get games likes these.

Console have the limitation of software's. You are stuck with screen and controller. In VR you can feel like you are in the game. That is the potential part about VR, that makes it exciting tech. Also, publishers these days make VR games. Skyrim, doom, hitman 3.
 

Swift_Star

Banned
What even is this list?

Two of them are remakes/remasters of games that are 10+ years old. Another was developed by a third party that Sony later bought. God of War was fresh, but now we are getting an iterative sequel (which was my initial point). Kena is not a Sony game. Astro Bot and Bloodborne I will give you. Bloodborne is seven years old though so the fact you gotta go back that far says something.
This must be the most damage control post I’ve seen in this board, nothing you said deny the quality of those titles. And they’re available/funded by Sony.
 

yurinka

Member
The release dates of these games have not been confirmed but expect hellblade 2 in 2023, it was revealed in 2019.
What it was confirmed about Hellblade 2 is that in summer they were in preproduction starting to work in the vertical slice. I highly doubt it may be ready for 2023.

But if you read the convo u would realise we are talking about state of the art current gen only games.

Sony has 3 cross gens for 2022 and forsaken.
Even if crossgen, Horizon 2 and GoWR pretty likely will look better than anything on the market. Their previous entries look great even today.

We dont know what sony will have know 2023,24, they have only announced spiderman 2 and wolverine as ps5 only, so we might see one of those in 2023.
Spider-Man 2 is announced for 2023, Wolverine is TBA.

For the last 20 years Insomniac released at least a game per year with the exceptions of 2010, 2017 and 2022 and they have been growing lot recently. I assume they originally had planned to release Spider-Man 2 in 2022 and Wolverine in 2023 but due to covid impacting them or maybe other games from the Sony roadmap they pushed them back a year or so. I expect them to release Spider-Man 2 in 2023 and Wolverine in 2024.
 

ManaByte

Gold Member
Switch has total of 23.4m hardware's in japan. Sony cant hit number 1 against those numbers.

Contents otherwise, Playstation is the dominant one. It has more games, and more contents compared to switch. Switch japan doesn't even have call of duty.

Sales wise, switch sells alot, due to numbers. its like ps4 vs xbox one 3rd party game sales.

Wait, Switch is selling more hardware and the Switch completely dominates the sells charts in Japan, but Sony is dominating? How does that logic work out?
 

Swift_Star

Banned
are we really parroting this crap again?
You might not like it but it’s true, Spencer even said that a few years ago, that the future is MP and that gamers weren’t interested in single player games:

https://gamingbolt.com/story-based-...me-impact-they-used-to-have-says-phil-Spencer

So yeah, Spencer’s words, they just changed tune (a little but not really) because they saw that it’s actually not the case, but buying A/B for 70B is pretty telling. MS focus is live service gaming. It is player engagement and player count. That’s all that matters to them. It’s also how they present their status, player count, engagement and whatnot.
Why else would they make infinite f2p filled with battle passes? Why else FH5 would be so focused on MP? What about SoT? It’s clear that this is MS’s vision: live games services.
 
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kingfey

Banned
Wait, Switch is selling more hardware and the Switch completely dominates the sells charts in Japan, but Sony is dominating? How does that logic work out?
Content is where they are dominating.

Switch doesnt have alot of 3rd party games, like PlayStation. The hardware cant handle games like battlefield, cyberpunk, resident evil village.

In that sense, PlayStation is the dominant one.
 
Here is life time hardware sales in japan.
  1. Switch OLED Model – 36,534 (1,030,341)
  2. Switch – 27,609 (17,894,965)
  3. Switch Lite – 13,076 (4,510,554)
  4. PlayStation 5 – 15,729 (1,106,719)
  5. PlayStation 5 Digital Edition – 3,128 (207,280)
  6. Xbox Series X – 1,620 (75,885)
  7. Xbox Series S – 1,007 (58,453)
  8. New 2DS LL (including 2DS) – 325 (1,181,039)
  9. PlayStation 4 – 14 (7,819,291)
Switch has total of 23.4m hardware's in japan. Sony cant hit number 1 against those numbers.

Contents otherwise, Playstation is the dominant one. It has more games, and more contents compared to switch. Switch japan doesn't even have call of duty.

Sales wise, switch sells alot, due to numbers. its like ps4 vs xbox one 3rd party game sales.

What??? are you saying PlayStation selling more softwares in Japan? ....receipt please. Week after week we saw Switch dominated Famitsu ranking, recently we even see more and more ALL Switch games in Top-30
 

kingfey

Banned
You might not like it but it’s true, Spencer even said that a few years ago, that the future is MP and that gamers weren’t interested in single player games:

https://gamingbolt.com/story-based-...me-impact-they-used-to-have-says-phil-Spencer

So yeah, Spencer’s words, they just changed tune (a little but not really) because they saw that it’s actually not the case, but buying A/B for 70B is pretty telling. MS focus is live service gaming. It is player engagement and player count. That’s all that matters to them. It’s also how they present their status, player count, engagement and whatnot.
Why else would they make infinite f2p filled with battle passes? Why else FH5 would be so focused on MP? What about SoT? It’s clear that this is MS’s vision: live games services.
They clearly care about prestige and making good games, doesn’t mean they can’t chase GAAS. Unlike MS whose only focus is that.
That is what you said. How does MS not focus on good games?

They have hellblade 2, fable, and avowed in the making now. not to mention perfect dark reboot.

Are those not games at all?
 
What??? are you saying PlayStation selling more softwares in Japan? ....receipt please. Week after week we saw Switch dominated Famitsu ranking, recently we even see more and more ALL Switch games in Top-30
PlayStation is barely even a presence in Japan anymore. Just check out Japanese gaming forums, they call it the Trash Station.
 

kingfey

Banned
What??? are you saying PlayStation selling more softwares in Japan? ....receipt please. Week after week we saw Switch dominated Famitsu ranking, recently we even see more and more ALL Switch games in Top-30
more contents, means more sale. Not single content sale.

PlayStation has tons of contents, which switch doesnt have. Switch doesnt get any money from these games. Not to mention, playstation has some Switch contents on their platform too.

Difference is, some titles sell better on switch. That is what you are seeing. You arent seeing all other games, which are PlayStation exclusive.
 

zaanan

Banned
YpnP92j.jpg
Ugh, for some reason this looks like Leatherface without the mask. Put it back on!
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Even if crossgen, Horizon 2 and GoWR pretty likely will look better than anything on the market. Their previous entries look great even today.

This does not diminish my point.
Xbox is competitive with visuals now and will be in the future and they will be ahead at some points during this gen.
 

Swift_Star

Banned
That is what you said. How does MS not focus on good games?

They have hellblade 2, fable, and avowed in the making now. not to mention perfect dark reboot.

Are those not games at all?
Those games are not their main focus. That’s all I said. You can’t prove me wrong. Just look at their past record. They’ll release more and more live service games and some SP games along the way. It is what it is.
 

yurinka

Member
How long do you think, mobile would need to have the same graphics as consoles?
Mobile market saw insane jump in quality in just few years. They are about to rival pc's in the upcoming future.

VR got its big game from Valve. Half-life 2 is impressive VR game. It wont take too long for VR to get games likes these.

Console have the limitation of software's. You are stuck with screen and controller. In VR you can feel like you are in the game. That is the potential part about VR, that makes it exciting tech. Also, publishers these days make VR games. Skyrim, doom, hitman 3.
I've been worked on mobile games for 11 years. The tech, game engines, tech, busines models and visuals of mobile have been converging with consoles and PC. In a year or so we'll see high end phones and tablets with higher specs than SteamDeck, somewhat similar to Series S. And they will keep evolving, and reducing the pricing of older models.

Phone and tablets get replaced by more powerful devices on quicker cycles, so this generation we'll see phones, tablets and PC handhelds reaching the horsepower and visuals of a PS5 and Series X. With some obvious differences due to battery, we'll see PC, consoles and mobile sharing the same hardware, aprox. the same horsepower, the same engines and games (some of them, other ones will be specific taking advantage of each market or type of player).

I think Apple and Android will start betting harder on using game controllers (think joycons attachable to any smartphone or tablet) for smartphones and tablets and play those games optionally on a tv, and also on premium AAA games. They will get the support from major console/PC publishers and indies with a bigger amount of pad based games.

I think VR has a lot of potential but still has to improve in many areas, like pricing while providing high end visuals, better controls, gameplay and game concepts more tailored to the specific things of this platform, a bigger amount of awesome games and top IPs to bring more people there, to fix stuff like making people wanting to puke after using it etc. I think PSVR2 will be a great step in many of these areas but will still need a step or two more before reaching the mainstream audience.
 

kingfey

Banned
This does not diminish my point.
Xbox is competitive with visuals now and will be in the future and they will be ahead at some points during this gen.
They wont. Sony has decades of experience in this section. not to mention, their studios share ideas together. Now add Bungie in to mix, and you are getting more experience.

MS is late to this party. They still have Azura, which can shorten the experience, but that is it.
 

kingfey

Banned
Those games are not their main focus. That’s all I said. You can’t prove me wrong. Just look at their past record. They’ll release more and more live service games and some SP games along the way. It is what it is.
Past record is due to the studio count. Its not what they focused on. Sony had more studios, compared to Xbox. Its why they had these crazy outputs.

Its easy for you to make that assumption, when you see the output level.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
They wont. Sony has decades of experience in this section. not to mention, their studios share ideas together. Now add Bungie in to mix, and you are getting more experience.

MS is late to this party. They still have Azura, which can shorten the experience, but that is it.


Well we just have to agree to disagree then.

James Franco Flirt GIF
 

Swift_Star

Banned
Past record is due to the studio count. Its not what they focused on. Sony had more studios, compared to Xbox. Its why they had these crazy outputs.

Its easy for you to make that assumption, when you see the output level.
I said what I said.
 
more contents, means more sale. Not single content sale.

PlayStation has tons of contents, which switch doesnt have. Switch doesnt get any money from these games. Not to mention, playstation has some Switch contents on their platform too.

Difference is, some titles sell better on switch. That is what you are seeing. You arent seeing all other games, which are PlayStation exclusive.

So you're saying PS has vast library but no one is buying in Japan......then use the word 'dominate' then, their market don't care about Sony's software
 

kingfey

Banned
I've been worked on mobile games for 11 years. The tech, game engines, tech, busines models and visuals of mobile have been converging with consoles and PC. In a year or so we'll see high end phones and tablets with higher specs than SteamDeck, somewhat similar to Series S. And they will keep evolving, and reducing the pricing of older models.

Phone and tablets get replaced by more powerful devices on quicker cycles, so this generation we'll see phones, tablets and PC handhelds reaching the horsepower and visuals of a PS5 and Series X. With some obvious differences due to battery, we'll see PC, consoles and mobile sharing the same hardware, aprox. the same horsepower, the same engines and games (some of them, other ones will be specific taking advantage of each market or type of player).

I think Apple and Android will start betting harder on using game controllers (think joycons attachable to any smartphone or tablet) for smartphones and tablets and play those games optionally on a tv, and also on premium AAA games. They will get the support from major console/PC publishers and indies with a bigger amount of pad based games.
This what people dont see alot. Apple and Samsung are competing very hard in this section. Its why mobile section is getting powerful every year.

I think VR has a lot of potential but still has to improve in many areas, like pricing while providing high end visuals, better controls, gameplay and game concepts more tailored to the specific things of this platform, a bigger amount of awesome games and top IPs to bring more people there, to fix stuff like making people wanting to puke after using it etc. I think PSVR2 will be a great step in many of these areas but will still need a step or two more before reaching the mainstream audience.
It will take time, just like how console had to take time, to hit where they are now.
PSVR 2 would definitely improve VR. It brings new ideas, new ways, which we have never seen before. The support it will get from 3rd party games, will accelerate VR games alot. Thus giving chance for quest 2 to have more games on their service.
 

kingfey

Banned
So you're saying PS has vast library but no one is buying in Japan......then use the word 'dominate' then, their market don't care about Sony's software
I said content. Not sales. As long as that one exist, Nintendo is not in the monopoly in japan market.

Their weak hardware blocks that option of getting these new games. FF7R wont be able to run on switch. Same for the new resident evil games. As long as those type of games exist on PlayStation, Switch wont be the dominant console.

Now, its different talk, when games that works with switch hardware is released. That is where the switch will have more power than PlayStation.
 

yurinka

Member
This does not diminish my point.
Xbox is competitive with visuals now and will be in the future and they will be ahead at some points during this gen.
Sony has teams like Naughty Dog, Insomniac, Sony Santa Monica or Guerrilla (+Quantic Dream, who went multi or RAD who went VR) who have been delivering really top tier visuals in games that looked better than anything in the market, with maybe only Rockstar at the same or better level. They have been nurturing other ones to reach that level but still pretty behind like Sucker Punch, Kojipro or Bend.

Microsoft, Activision and Zenimax haven't been known for tha level top tier visuals other an maybe Forza and now maybe Ninja Theory. Other than than them you only have CG teasers and your own hopes to think MS will be ahead of Sony in visuals.

So you're saying PS has vast library but no one is buying in Japan......then use the word 'dominate' then, their market don't care about Sony's software
Well, remember you only know the sales of some retail top sellers. Remember that Sony's digital sales are way higher than retail ones, a percentage that isn't like that on Switch. So you don't really know if they care or not.

Basically all Japanese 3rd party devs keep releasing their Japanese focused games (even if most are migrating to a more global appeal instead of being that Japanese only focused, or increased their focus on mobile) on PS, sometimes (at least once for PS4) as exclusive. I think something must be there outside that top 20 retail games, I think Jimbo can moneyhat some of them but not every single Japanese dev and 3rd pary publisher.
 
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Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Sony has teams like Naughty Dog, Insomniac, Sony Santa Monica or Guerrilla (+Quantic Dream, who went multi or RAD who went VR) who have been delivering really top tier visuals in games that looked better than anything in the market, with maybe only Rockstar at the same or better level. They have been nurturing other ones to reach that level but still pretty behind like Sucker Punch, Kojipro or Bend.

Microsoft, Activision and Zenimax haven't been known for tha level top tier visuals other an maybe Forza and now maybe Ninja Theory. Other than than them you only have CG teasers and your own hopes to think MS will be ahead of Sony in visuals.

I would say only ND look better overall, there other games dont. And on a technical level they are all using the same technologies (ssr, cube maps, baked Gi etc)
 

DaGwaphics

Member
Would Nintendo let Playstation rot and give Xbox the majority of that gaming space?

Anything MS does has almost a net zero effect on Nintendo. Nintendo has what they want right now, a platform that people buy into in order to play Nintendo software. Nintendo lives and dies by its own hand.
 
Their weak hardware blocks that option of getting these new games. FF7R wont be able to run on switch. Same for the new resident evil games. As long as those type of games exist on PlayStation, Switch wont be the dominant console.
What? Switch is dominating console without those games. They literally don't need them. RE and FF these days sell more on the west though.

Which live service games?
Psychonauts 2 :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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RevGaming

Member
Anything MS does has almost a net zero effect on Nintendo. Nintendo has what they want right now, a platform that people buy into in order to play Nintendo software. Nintendo lives and dies by its own hand.
I would think so too, but what if MS decided to make a handheld and games similar to Nintendo but with better graphics with all the money they have after Sony is out?

This is all hypothetical. Sony will be just fine. If they buy Capcom or Square or both, people will stop fear mongering. It's not like being second is a bad thing. It will still be hard because Sony is a more global brand. Even with screw ups like ps3, they managed (they were worth 11B in 2012).
 

DaGwaphics

Member
I would think so too, but what if MS decided to make a handheld and games similar to Nintendo but with better graphics with all the money they have after Sony is out?

This is all hypothetical. Sony will be just fine. If they buy Capcom or Square or both, people will stop fear mongering. It's not like being second is a bad thing. It will still be hard because Sony is a more global brand. Even with screw ups like ps3, they managed (they were worth 11B in 2012).

That's quite the hypothetical. I don't think Sony is ever "out" and I don't think MS ever does a handheld with handheld specific software. It wouldn't surprise me if we see a portable Xbox before the end of the generation, if tech advances enough to get the XSS profile inside a portable package or maybe a portable streaming device, but both of those options would be more of a twist on the Steamdeck than a direct competitor for Nintendo.
 
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