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Square Enix: PlayStation offered a better deal than Xbox for Final Fantasy 16 (windowscentral.com)

They’ve conditioned their userbase into expecting it. It’s a huge problem for them, really.

Sony on the other hand allow the publisher to make their $70 windfall, then negotiate deals for PS+. It’s very publisher friendly and it’s why PS+ is gonna start feeling pretty powerful.
I don't think its a problem for them. It's their business model. I just think it makes it much more expensive to do the traditional money hat like in the past.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
So... MS tried doing what they and their most fanatical claim they don't like.

SHOCKER!

#JustDoublespeakThings



Michael Jordan Lol GIF



#MasksAllTheWayOff
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
What mask? I always called Phil Spencer a doublespeak king. Sorry that hurts your feelings.

Homeboy goes on record talking shit about these types a deals, while he is trying for them behind the scenes.

I don't know how but somehow you've managed to turn a statement or article that has nothing to do with Phil Spencer, into a dig on Phil Spencer.

I tip my hat to you, *slow clap*

Btw. If we're dismissing that MS slide because it mentions BB (a game that is developed by a third party, mind you), Jez erroneously mentions DQ12 as a game from Square on Xbox, a game that hasn't even been formally shown or any listed platforms. He doesn't know shit about what exclusivity agreements and terms are active at the moment.
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
I don't know how but somehow you've managed to turn a statement or article that has nothing to do with Phil Spencer, into a dig on Phil Spencer.

I tip my hat to you, *slow clap*

Btw. If we're dismissing that MS slide because it mentions BB (a game that is developed by a third party, mind you), Jez erroneously mentions DQ12 as a game from Square on Xbox, a game that hasn't even been formally shown or any listed platforms. He doesn't know shit about what exclusivity agreements and terms are active at the moment.
Phil Spencer claimed he was against this sort of thing. Even his lawyers whined about it in the CMA filings you tried sharing.

Keep going though, the dude is gaming's politician.

*pats ass*
 
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What mask? I always called Phil Spencer a doublespeak king. Sorry that hurts your feelings.

Homeboy goes on record talking shit about these types a deals, while he is trying for them behind the scenes.
What exactly did he say about these kinds of deals? I think I remember him saying he didn't want to do them very often (understandable given the double standard reaction to Rise of the Tomb Raider compared to FF7 Remake and SFV which weren't even timed exclusives). Personally, I don't hate money hats, as they often result in better games. What I hate is the double standard reactions to them.
 
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PeteBull

Member
If install base was the real leverage then it wouldve been multiplatform. SE didnt care about sales, they just wanted cold hard cash up front. They are greedy fucks who have done this before with Ryse sending that game to die on a platform not known for action adventure games.
Its not so simple, say if ps5 has 2x bigger instal base from xbox, and on top most of the sales are on playstation anyways(and i remember especially japanese games can reach 75-85% on playstation, vs 15-25% on xbox ) then ofc sony basically has to fork up cash for that lost 15-25% of sales xbox owners would provide, microsoft on the other hand would have to fork up cash equivalent to losses from 75-85% of sales that playstation gamers are responsible for.

In other words moneyhats are always much cheaper/better deal for market leader =D
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
I don't know how but somehow you've managed to turn a statement or article that has nothing to do with Phil Spencer, into a dig on Phil Spencer.
What? Phil is the head of xbox, he decides what to spend money on.

We know he has the money. He spent $2.5 billion on Minecraft. $8 billion on zenimax and $76 billion on Activision. Of course, this is on him. This has everything to do with him.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
From the article:

"Square Enix also noted that the deal also offers them high-level platform support with PlayStation engineers, to the implication that Xbox does not. Square Enix also emphasized the benefits of focusing optimization on a single platform."
"Square Enix would have to invest in a heavily optimized version for the Xbox Series S too, which requires its own version as part of Microsoft's licensing agreement. PlayStation has no such weaker hardware SKU to account for."
boom smile GIF
 

BennyBlanco

aka IMurRIVAL69
Sexy Blush GIF

Just lovely, and you?

I’m good, thanks. maybe you should read the article before you spaz out. SE approached MS, and who knows if they even offered a deal.
"Final Fantasy [is one] of Square Enix's [most] important franchises up there with Dragon Quest and the Kingdom Hearts series. When we do begin development, we do approach multiple platforms, multiple companies, about releasing the game. And when you approach them, they're going to come back to us with their offers."
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
What exactly did he say about these kinds of deals? I think I remember him saying he didn't want to do them very often (understandable given the double standard reaction to Rise of the Tomb Raider compared to FF7 Remake and SFV which weren't even timed exclusives). Personally, I don't hate money hats, as they often result in better games. What I hate is the double standard reactions to them.

Exclusives Are ‘Completely Counter To What Gaming Is About,’ Xbox’s Phil Spencer Says​


“Gaming is about entertainment and community and diversion and learning new stories and new perspectives,” he said. “I find it completely counter to what gaming is about to say that part of that is to lock people away from being able to experience those games. Or to force someone to buy my specific device on the day that I want them to go buy it, in order to partake in what gaming is about. Gaming is bigger than any one device…”
This was 2 months before he went out and bought zenimax and made Elder Scrolls, Redfall and Starfield exclusive.
 

Dick Jones

Gold Member
Because it never expired ;)

We are quoting you fellow ambassador who wrote just now it's expired...so it's fucking expired.

MS mixed up Superman and Spider-Man and also thought Sony didn't own the Bloodborne IP. Have you anything else more credible?
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
I’m good, thanks. maybe you should read the article before you spaz out. SE approached MS, and who knows if they even offered a deal.
So, then Sony didn't moneyhat or take anything away, MS just didn't want it.

Can't have both arguments exist at the same time.

These are also both from the article, which shows they were offered something.
"Square Enix also noted that the deal also offers them high-level platform support with PlayStation engineers, to the implication that Xbox does not. Square Enix also emphasized the benefits of focusing optimization on a single platform."

and

"Square Enix would have to invest in a heavily optimized version for the Xbox Series S too, which requires its own version as part of Microsoft's licensing agreement. PlayStation has no such weaker hardware SKU to account for."
 
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What? Phil is the head of xbox, he decides what to spend money on.

We know he has the money. He spent $2.5 billion on Minecraft. $8 billion on zenimax and $76 billion on Activision. Of course, this is on him. This has everything to do with him.
Compare the things you mentioned to this FFXVI deal. What's the main difference? They got ownership of the other stuff. I really think the only thing financially feasible Xbox could have done was to get FFXVI to release day and date on Game Pass. I also think it's more than a financial issue because even a deal like that also strains the relationship between SE and Sony, and SE doesn't want to do that.
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Its not so simple, say if ps5 has 2x bigger instal base from xbox, and on top most of the sales are on playstation anyways(and i remember especially japanese games can reach 75-85% on playstation, vs 15-25% on xbox ) then ofc sony basically has to fork up cash for that lost 15-25% of sales xbox owners would provide, microsoft on the other hand would have to fork up cash equivalent to losses from 75-85% of sales that playstation gamers are responsible for.

In other words moneyhats are always much cheaper/better deal for market leader =D
Well, MS doesnt have to put up 2x more money than Sony (even though id argue they can easily afford to). they just have to match their offer to keep it from going full exclusive just like Peter Moore did with GTA4 and FF13.

If sony pulls back their support because MS is matching their offer than fine. It will be a great marketing exclusive that they can then maybe put on gamepass. Sony would never allow that so they will be back in the picture immediately.

All MS had to do here was make sure FF16 was not an exclusive. They fucked that up.
 

Exclusives Are ‘Completely Counter To What Gaming Is About,’ Xbox’s Phil Spencer Says​



This was 2 months before he went out and bought zenimax and made Elder Scrolls, Redfall and Starfield exclusive.
My guess is he's talking about true console exclusives and is referring to locking out of PC as well. Even if he's not, if you acquire a publisher like Zenimax, they are first party and no longer a money hat type situation.
 

BennyBlanco

aka IMurRIVAL69
So, then Sony didn't moneyhat or take anything away, MS just didn't want it.

Can't have both arguments exist at the same time.

These are also both from the article, which shows they were offered something.

What are you on about? Your first post was an emotional outburst about how MS is doublespeaking and approaching Square for exclusives because you didn’t read the article.


giphy.gif
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
What are you on about? Your first post was an emotional outburst about how MS is doublespeaking and approaching Square for exclusives because you didn’t read the article.


giphy.gif
I wasn't emotional at all. Stop projecting.

Isn't there a PC version? If so that makes their claim a bit embarrassing.
That's not embarrassing, this is embarrassing,
As expected from Arkane, top quality and a GOTY contender, it was really never in doubt.

On a more serious note, they already came on record saying the PC version will be a while past the 6 month exclusive period, due to those very things mentioned.
 
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Well, MS doesnt have to put up 2x more money than Sony (even though id argue they can easily afford to). they just have to match their offer to keep it from going full exclusive just like Peter Moore did with GTA4 and FF13.

If sony pulls back their support because MS is matching their offer than fine. It will be a great marketing exclusive that they can then maybe put on gamepass. Sony would never allow that so they will be back in the picture immediately.

All MS had to do here was make sure FF16 was not an exclusive. They fucked that up.
It's kind of a bad precedent to set, though. Suddenly all these publishers would start expecting checks from MS just for their games to be released on the console at all.
 
I don't think its a problem for them. It's their business model. I just think it makes it much more expensive to do the traditional money hat like in the past.
They can’t sit and whinge about Sony’s deals making it difficult to Xbox to be Xbox when their current model is what is partially hamstringing them.

Hearing Phil Spencer complain about that was ridiculous.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
It's kind of a bad precedent to set, though. Suddenly all these publishers would start expecting checks from MS just for their games to be released on the console at all.
They created it themselves with their devaluation/sub model, and the software splits growing wider and wider each month.

But yes, I would not like a gaming world like that.
 
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adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
What? Phil is the head of xbox, he decides what to spend money on.

We know he has the money. He spent $2.5 billion on Minecraft. $8 billion on zenimax and $76 billion on Activision. Of course, this is on him. This has everything to do with him.

Why? No, seriously. Does any time Xbox get a timed exclusive third party game get counted as a Jim Ryan failure? or any time a third party game launches on GP day 1, do we say Jim Ryan fucked up
?

Square continuing their business arrangements with Sony for the last 2, 3 generations isn't Phil Spencer's doing lol.


We are quoting you fellow ambassador who wrote just now it's expired...so it's fucking expired.

So you think Jez has definitive knowledge that it's expired?

Microsoft scored some support from Square Enix a few years back, with Dragon Quest 12 and Kingdom Hearts

this guy? I hope you retain faith in his journalism for future articles as well.



I wasn't emotional at all. Stop projecting.

So... MS tried doing what they and their most fanatical claim they don't like.

SHOCKER!

#JustDoublespeakThings


kmt-yeah.gif
 
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PeteBull

Member
Well, MS doesnt have to put up 2x more money than Sony (even though id argue they can easily afford to). they just have to match their offer to keep it from going full exclusive just like Peter Moore did with GTA4 and FF13.

If sony pulls back their support because MS is matching their offer than fine. It will be a great marketing exclusive that they can then maybe put on gamepass. Sony would never allow that so they will be back in the picture immediately.

All MS had to do here was make sure FF16 was not an exclusive. They fucked that up.
I remember back in og xbox and early/mid days of x360 gen microsoft forked up plenty cash and got many timed or fully exclusive japanese games, that was valid reason to chose their console, not anymore ofc :p
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
It's kind of a bad precedent to set, though. Suddenly all these publishers would start expecting checks from MS just for their games to be released on the console at all.
Then that precedent was set in 2006 when Peter Moore went on stage and showed off GTA4 and FF13 tattoos.

Guess what? they went on to have their best gen. They managed to get two big GTA4 DLC exclusives that they spent $50 million funding. They went on and signed marketing deals with Activision and got timed DLC exclusives for all CODs for the rest of the gen which is basically writing checks for the most successful game of all time.

It's the cost of doing business. MS has literally billions to spend. They just spent it on the wrong things.
 
They can’t sit and whinge about Sony’s deals making it difficult to Xbox to be Xbox when their current model is what is partially hamstringing them.

Hearing Phil Spencer complain about that was ridiculous.
I imagine he's most upset about the deals to make the games exclusively not on Xbox or the ones that stop games from coming to Game Pass. I would be upset as well if that stuff was going on and my only option outside of building new teams (this is not exactly easy as Sony would do it too) was to acquire developers and publishers and suddenly the publisher I tried to acquire was considered anti-competitive to acquire. It's a tough situation to be in, and Sony is taking advantage of it in shrewd ways (I don't blame them at all. Jim Ryan is ruthless.).
 

Myths

Member
Microsoft just shot themselves in the foot.

I don't know how much the rest of you know about Japanese culture (I'm an expert), but honor and shame are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in America where you can become successful by being an asshole. If you screw someone over in Japan, you bring shame to yourself, and the only way to get rid of that shame is repentance.

What this means is the japanese public, after hearing about this, is not going to want to purchase FFXVI for either system, nor will they purchase any of Microsoft’s games. This is HUGE. You can laugh all you want, but Microsoft has alienated an entire market with this move.

Square, publicly apologize and cancel FFXVI for PS5 or you can kiss your business goodbye.
 

fallingdove

Member
You wouldnt say this, if MS were to acquire your favourite publisher. MS, Sony or nintendo, I dont care which company does it, I just hate it.

I dont want to derail this topic any more.
It doesn’t really matter to me because I own all three consoles, but these are timed deals and Xbox has never been the place to play Final Fantasy titles. If someone truly loves SquareEnix titles, they are buying into the wrong eco system by purchasing an Xbox.
 
Then that precedent was set in 2006 when Peter Moore went on stage and showed off GTA4 and FF13 tattoos.

Guess what? they went on to have their best gen. They managed to get two big GTA4 DLC exclusives that they spent $50 million funding. They went on and signed marketing deals with Activision and got timed DLC exclusives for all CODs for the rest of the gen which is basically writing checks for the most successful game of all time.

It's the cost of doing business. MS has literally billions to spend. They just spent it on the wrong things.
It's all a numbers game, I feel. That's a LOT of money to spend just to get a game released when that money can go into acquisitions that keep the Game Pass games coming.
 
It doesn’t really matter to me because I own all three consoles, but these are timed deals and Xbox has never been the place to play Final Fantasy titles. If someone truly loves SquareEnix titles, they are buying into the wrong eco system by purchasing an Xbox.
And this is why it's just not worth it for Xbox to pay up.
 
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