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[GlockSaint]

From what I've seen this software makes games run at 4k or almost that resolution without the performance hit of native 4k and now with the 3090 nvidia is boasting it can hit 8k 60fps with dlss.

So my question, is it really as good as the hype? If more games adopt it will 4k be more feasible for everyone? And if no why not?

Another separate thing. If the 3090 is "50% more than the titan", it isn't really all that much better than the 3080 is it? (Besides the ram). I mean I've seen a lot of comparisons between the ti and the titan and the later only offers something like 10% performance boost and from what we've seen the 3080 might be 40-50% better than the ti. So what do you all think about that?

 

[Dr_Salt]

Dlss is not only software you need special tensor cores that work some of that AI wizardry and as of now you can only get it on rtx cards. Unless amd works on something similar(which I think they are) you won't be getting dlss on amd cards or consoles.
Dlss is a big deal to me and its one of the reasons I'm going with these new rtx cards. Shit seems to good to be true but from what I have seen its amazing.

 

[azertydu91]

Yep it works really well, but checkerboard rendering and temporal injection are not to be forgotten either.Those solutions allows to get a near pixel perfect match with native 4K beside a few little downside.

But imagine that dlss alows to have an almost perfet 1080p visiuals from a 540p source which mean that if you managed to run a game at a native 1080p 30 fps you can reduce the resolution, double the framerate and get really similar visuals.

 

[KyoZz]

I hope it is the future. DLSS 2.0 was such a BIG upgrade over 1.0, the image quality is better than native and you really get a boost in term of performance. It's pretty crazy.

 

[V4skunk]

4k dlss to 8k will not look any where near as good as native 8k.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

Dlss is not only software you need special tensor cores that work some of that AI wizardry and as of now you can only get it on rtx cards. Unless amd works on something similar(which I think they are) you won't be getting dlss on amd cards or consoles.
Dlss is a big deal to me and its one of the reasons I'm going with these new rtx cards. Shit seems to good to be true but from what I have seen its amazing.

Apparently there is already an alternative by AMD.

 

[Angry Fork]

DLSS is insane. On max settings at 1080p (including RTX settings) in Control I got like 40-45fps initially, but with DLSS enabled it's 60 all the time, and at 4k res it's 40-45fps (which without DLSS would probably be 20-25fps).

I took screenshots comparing with and without it enabled and somehow DLSS looks better as well. I want it to be on every game, it gives you a ton of FPS without any downside, if only it was on Red Dead 2!

 

[Wandering Leopard]

It's basically up to AMD, MS, Sony and others to show they've started closing the gap (to Nvidia) with their own alternatives to reconstruction.

Of course it doesn't mean Nvidia will stand still, but competition makes everyone better.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Yes, it is the future. DLSS 2.0 is already really, really good, but not perfect. If they can improve it further (they probably can) and make it available on more games, or ideally every game that supports TAA, then it's gonna be a new standard.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

It's basically up to AMD, MS, Sony and others to show they've started closing the gap (to Nvidia) with their own alternatives to reconstruction techniques.

Of course it doesn't mean Nvidia will stand still, but competition makes everyone better.

AMD FidelityFX?

 

[ColonialRaptor]

I personally think this is the greatest feature the next gen consoles are missing. I really hope they can achieve a similar effect in software or using portions of the new hardware layouts.

 

[Mister Wolf]

Yes it is. It was mocked when it first released but no one is laughing now. Sharpening filters from AMD isn't an answer neither.

 

[Bryank75]

 

[metareferential]

4k dlss to 8k will not look any where near as good as native 8k.

1080p or 1440p to 4k with dlss 2.0 already looks on par or better (meaning that you get more information and detail) than native 4k.

Further iterations will only get better and better.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

Why isn't anyone talking about AMD's FidelityFX?

 

[GlockSaint]

DLSS is insane. On max settings at 1080p (including RTX settings) in Control I got like 40-45fps initially, but with DLSS enabled it's 60 all the time, and at 4k res it's 40-45fps (which without DLSS would probably be 20-25fps).

I took screenshots comparing with and without it enabled and somehow DLSS looks better as well. I want it to be on every game, it gives you a ton of FPS without any downside, if only it was on Red Dead 2!

Wow that's insane man. Gotta get me of those new rtx 30 cards

 

[ScaryBrandon]

AMD FidelityFX?

Nvidia also has something similar called Freestyle Sharpening. DLSS is a different kind of monster.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

Nvidia also has something similar called Freestyle Sharpening. DLSS is a different kind of monster.

The video that I embedded in an earlier post demonstrates that AMD FidelityFX produces similar image quality to DLSS when upscaling to 4K.

 

[Wandering Leopard]

AMD FidelityFX?

Who knows, it's possible AMD will announce FidelityFX 2.00 when they unveil RDNA2, or maybe they'll have a new solution.

I also think a competitor doesn't need to match or beat Nvidia's DLSS 2 right now, something half as effective could be seen as a win if the performance cost is very low.

 

[ScaryBrandon]

The video that I embedded in an earlier post demonstrates that AMD FidelityFX produces similar image quality to DLSS when upscaling to 4K.

It doesn't I can see the difference even through youtube compression especially the aliasing. Adaptive sharpening like fidelityFX and the nvidia equivalent can get you down to 1800p from 2160p after that image quality suffers too much.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

It doesn't I can see the difference even through youtube compression especially the aliasing. Adaptive sharpening like fidelityFX and the nvidia equivalent can get you down to 1800p from 2160p after that image quality suffers too much.

I watched that video on a 55" 4K TV. I saw no difference.

 

[CrustyBritches]

DF went into DLSS 2.0 vs FidelityFX in their Death Stranding video. DLSS does a much better job. In addition, as mentioned above, DLSS can produce a decent image quality at 1080p or 1440p from a 540p or 720p base; something CAS/FidelityFX can’t do.

 

[ScaryBrandon]

I watched that video on a 55" 4K TV. I saw no difference.

Dont know what to tell you man I can see the difference on my 4k IPS monitor. Youtube compression also plays a big role, difference is much bigger in real life. Don't get me wrong adaptive sharpening is great but it can only get you so far.

 

[TonyK]

The question is how many games will use it from now on? Because the number (and importance) of games that has used it until now has been very disappointing.

 

[Mister Wolf]

The video that I embedded in an earlier post demonstrates that AMD FidelityFX produces similar image quality to DLSS when upscaling to 4K.

Timestamped

 

[SF Kosmo]

It's definitely the future of 4K/8K for high end games. It has its limits. It needs at least a 1080p base with TAA to get there or it starts to show its limitations. I have used it with a 720p base and it doesn't look bad but you can see the difference.

But AI image reconstruction is absolutely an important part of graphics going forward, especially as RT becomes a bigger and bigger part of graphics.

 

[00_Zer0]

Edit-OT to the subject at hand.

 

[Papacheeks]

I hope it is the future. DLSS 2.0 was such a BIG upgrade over 1.0, the image quality is better than native and you really get a boost in term of performance. It's pretty crazy.

it's better for some games like death stranding where it's 4k native render showed a lot of jaggies and inconsistancy's.

Go look at Doom Eternal on ultra 4k vulkan api, it does not need DLSS. Look at Gears 5 ultra 4k does not need DLSS.

People seriously need to read up on some of the caveats of DLSS and bugs it has.

Is it cool tech? yes.

Is it the future for gaming?

No.

New engines will have optimizations in how assets are being rendered used, and how ray tracing is done on new hardware.

People need to understand why DLSS is a thing, and why on game engines that were engineered to target specific hardware sets dont always scale well or look as good as they could in 4k.

 

[SF Kosmo]

it's better for some games like death stranding where it's 4k native render showed a lot of jaggies and inconsistancy's.

Go look at Doom Eternal on ultra 4k vulkan api, it does not need DLSS. Look at Gears 5 ultra 4k does not need DLSS.

People seriously need to read up on some of the caveats of DLSS and bugs it has.

Is it cool tech? yes.

Is it the future for gaming?

No.

New engines will have optimizations in how assets are being rendered used, and how ray tracing is done on new hardware.

People need to understand why DLSS is a thing, and why on game engines that were engineered to target specific hardware sets dont always scale well or look as good as they could in 4k.

Regardless, demanding games will always have a use for more overhead, and the fact is that DLSS is able to get a 1080p image up to 4K at a quality that is more than good enough for 99% of use cases.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

Timestamped

I concede.

 

[wordslaughter]

Apparently there is already an alternative by AMD.

What is this? This isn't a comparison. It's like the person who made this video doesn't even understand what they were comparing.

He doesn't mention the settings used or show the framerate.
What FidelityFX settings were used? Doesn't say.
What DLSS 2.0 settings were used? Doesn't say.
What extra performance was gained by using these features? Again, it doesn't show that either.

Completely useless.

 

[GymWolf]

Dlss is gonna be a big deal during next-gen, more than rtx.

Mostly because without dlss, you can only dream about rtx without a huge performance loss.

If consolles can get something similar it's gonna be huge, no more resources wasted for native4k.

 

[01011001]

short answer, YES ABSOLUTELY

long answer,
it not only upscales content extremely well and is very close to looking native res but also looks better than nativ res in some instances and is an extremely good form of Antialiasing, better than TAA for example.

 

[Self]

the image quality is better than native

You know what native means, right?

 

[wordslaughter]

You know what native means, right?

Watch the Digital Foundry video and you'll know what he's talking about.

 

[Papacheeks]

Regardless, demanding games will always have a use for more overhead, and the fact is that DLSS is able to get a 1080p image up to 4K at a quality that is more than good enough for 99% of use cases.

Out of the small hand of games it's available for, it really is only a couple of instances where the reconstructed image is better.

It's native rendered is the way to go issue is the engines the games are built on are not targeting ultra high end/ movie like quality assets. Which is why there are so many instances of games when scaled to 4k having a lot of rough edges.

Dlss is gonna be a big deal during next-gen, more than rtx.

Mostly because without dlss, you can only dream about rtx without a huge performance loss.

If consolles can get something similar it's gonna be huge, no more resources wasted for native4k.

Doom eternal says hi!

 

[geordiemp]

Dlss is gonna be a big deal during next-gen, more than rtx.

Mostly because without dlss, you can only dream about rtx without a huge performance loss.

If consolles can get something similar it's gonna be huge, no more resources wasted for native4k.

Temporal is absolutely fine, posters have short memories.

No need for ML. And we are done here.

 

[INC]

It slows moores law

 

[Mister Wolf]

Temporal is absolutely fine, posters have short memories.

No need for ML. And we are done here.

Got any games to show that is actually using it?

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

Got any games to show that is actually using it?

I was literally typing that! It was just a matter of time before that tech demo was posted in a DLSS, RTX IO, 30XX series gpu, anything Nvidia, or anything pc related at that. It's posted just as much as the Craig meme.

Can't wait for the demo to release on PC so fanboys will finally pipe down.

 

[KyoZz]

it's better for some games like death stranding where it's 4k native render showed a lot of jaggies and inconsistancy's.

Go look at Doom Eternal on ultra 4k vulkan api, it does not need DLSS. Look at Gears 5 ultra 4k does not need DLSS.

People seriously need to read up on some of the caveats of DLSS and bugs it has.

Is it cool tech? yes.

Is it the future for gaming?

No.

New engines will have optimizations in how assets are being rendered used, and how ray tracing is done on new hardware.

People need to understand why DLSS is a thing, and why on game engines that were engineered to target specific hardware sets dont always scale well or look as good as they could in 4k.

I'm not agreeing here. Maybe Doom and Gears 5 don't need it but implemented the right way, it make the FPS a lot higher with a better image quality witch is just win-win.
For the scaling p^roblem you mention, i'm sure Nvidia is working on it and we will see those very little problems disappear soon. Just look at how big of an improvement DLSS2.0 was over 1.0

You know what native means, right?

I do:
native / DLSS
native / DLSS
native / DLSS
native / DLSS

So yeah maybe it's not perfect in all games (I havent tried them all) but just those examples show how much of an improvement it can be.

 

[Mister Wolf]

I was literally typing that! It was just a matter of time before that tech demo was posted in a DLSS, RTX IO, 30XX series gpu, anything Nvidia, or anything pc related at that. It's posted just as much as the Craig meme.

Can't wait for the demo to release on PC so fanboys will finally pipe down.

Yeah you know its a reach when people using stuff that's not even out yet and can't be compared or even scrutinized as a rebuttal.

 

[geordiemp]

Got any games to show that is actually using it?

Its a temporal upscaling technique. The thread is about future upscaling techniques, they exaist and are just as good and dont need ML.

I suppose in your view every game has DLSS, and none have advanced temporal ?

I was literally typing that! It was just a matter of time before that tech demo was posted in a DLSS, RTX IO, 30XX series gpu, anything Nvidia, or anything pc related at that. It's posted just as much as the Craig meme.

Can't wait for the demo to release on PC so fanboys will finally pipe down.

Yes this technique will be availabe to all hardware. Your point is exactly ?

The thread is entitled DLSS is the way of the future ? Is it ?

 

[Mister Wolf]

Its a temporal upscaling technique. The thread is about future upscaling techniques, they exaist and are just as good and dont need ML.

I suppose in your view every game has DLSS, and none have advanced temporal ?

Upscaling is not a feature of one company, even though some fans like to think that.

So show me a game that uses it comparable to DLSS. I've seen temporal reconstruction used in Quantum Break and I don't like it and can even see it in motion.

 

[thelastword]

4k dlss to 8k will not look any where near as good as native 8k.

Digital foundry, Nvidia et al are already saying that DLSS 2.0 looks better than 4K native......Then I watch their screens and they have TAA up the wazoo on the native screens and they say, you see DLSS is sharper....

Remember when the Metro guys had a subpar DLSS release, very blurry, full of aliasing. What did they do, they sharpened the image something fierce. So DLSS is reconstructing from 1080p, blowing it up to 4-8K. The results look good but are not automatic or something done just on the card itself. The guesstimate will always have setbacks and native will always be better. It's just that DF has no bones with the company doing DLSS. I mean the fellating videos over raytracing would have been clue enough. Now on the flip they had a bone to pick with checkerboard rendering, because of who was pushing that technology. They always had to remind us that CB was not as good as native..... So no, CB was not perfect or as good as native, but boy did the first thing they do when a CB game debuted was zooming into a leaf 5 miles away to show some artefacting.......

 

[geordiemp]

So show me a game that uses it comparable to DLSS. I've seen temporal reconstruction used in Quantum Break and I don't like it and can even see it in motion.

DLSS is magic, and every other technique is upscaling. We worship thee.

There you go, happy now.

 

[Mister Wolf]

DLSS is magic, and every other technique is upscaling. We worship thee.

There you go, happy now.

Very happy. I appreciate your honesty.

 

[geordiemp]

Very happy. I appreciate your honesty.

There you go, sweet dreams, Nvidia have all the power and everyone else is not worthy of your greatness

DLSS love ins are worse than Nintendo love ins. Carry on.

 

[nemiroff]

- Yes it's the future.
- Yes it's as good as the hype.

It's also good because it drives certain people crazy; it's entertaining.

 

[Lethal01]

Go look at Doom Eternal on ultra 4k vulkan api, it does not need DLSS. Look at Gears 5 ultra 4k does not need DLSS.

"doesn't need" that's like saying they don't "need 4k". It's not about what it needs it's about the fact that any game with it give you the option of a small decrease to image quality in exchange for higher frame rates and higher graphical setting.

No matter how much the hardware advances you will always be able to boost other things by lowering the resolution.